Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Magical Mudcrab]

So the next question is, when will Trump resign so Pence can pardon him?

For what? Most of the issues he will face after he is removed from office are State and Civil cases, not Federal cases.

2. Federal convictions only

Under the Constitution, only federal criminal convictions, such as those adjudicated in the United States District Courts, may be pardoned by the President. In addition, the President's pardon power extends to convictions adjudicated in the Superior Court of the District of Columbia and military court-martial proceedings. However, the President cannot pardon a state criminal offense. Accordingly, if you are seeking clemency for a state criminal conviction, you should not complete and submit this petition. Instead, you should contact the Governor or other appropriate authorities of the state where you reside or where the conviction occurred (such as the state board of pardons and paroles) to determine whether any relief is available to you under state law. If you have a federal conviction, information about the conviction may be obtained from the clerk of the federal court where you were convicted.

- Source: Department of Justice

[Adam Jensen]

0 for 9 lawsuits today

306 electoral votes to Biden

All margins too large for any recount to have any effect on the outcome.

Donald can get fucked.

231 years of elections. 231 since the Constitution was ratified. And not once has the outgoing president thrown a fit, threatened the peaceful transfer of power and claimed fraud. Not once. This is disgraceful and all of you who voted for Trump, this year or in 2016, should be ashamed.

[Breccia]

For what? Most of the issues he will face after he is removed from office are State and Civil cases, not Federal cases.

Most. But not all.

After Jan. 20, Mr. Trump, who has refused to concede and is fighting to hold onto his office, will be more vulnerable than ever to a pending grand jury investigation by the Manhattan district attorney into the president’s family business and its practices, as well as his taxes.

The two-year inquiry, the only known active criminal investigation of Mr. Trump, has been stalled since last fall, when the president sued to block a subpoena for his tax returns and other records, a bitter dispute that for the second time is before the U.S. Supreme Court. A ruling is expected soon.

Mr. Trump has contended that the investigation by the district attorney, Cyrus R. Vance Jr., a Democrat, is a politically motivated fishing expedition. But if the Supreme Court rules that Mr. Vance is entitled to the records, and he uncovers possible crimes, Mr. Trump could face a reckoning with law enforcement — further inflaming political tensions and raising the startling specter of a criminal conviction, or even prison, for a former president.

Some legal experts said it would send the wrong message if Mr. Vance had evidence to justify charges but decided to walk away from a prosecution of Mr. Trump.

“That would put the president above the law,” said Anne Milgram, a former assistant district attorney in Manhattan and Democratic attorney general in New Jersey and a frequent critic of Mr. Trump.

And because Mr. Trump has repeatedly complained that the investigation was part of a broad partisan witch hunt, any decision to end it once the president left office could be seen as a tacit acknowledgment that such criticism was justified.

Few facts have been publicly disclosed about the course of the district attorney’s investigation or the people or potential crimes being examined because the inquiry is shielded by grand jury secrecy.

But during the legal battle over Mr. Vance’s subpoena, which sought eight years of Mr. Trump’s personal and corporate tax returns and other records from his accounting firm, prosecutors suggested in court papers that they were investigating a range of potential financial crimes. They include insurance fraud and criminal tax evasion, as well as grand larceny and scheming to defraud — which together are New York State’s equivalent of federal bank fraud charges.

And prosecutors argued in court that the documents they had demanded from the accounting firm, Mazars USA, represented “central evidence” for their investigation.

"Wait, this Vance guy, he's pursuing in court cases with basically no evidence known! That's--"

(points at Trump's election lawsuits) You were saying?

It's also worth noting that federal investigators might find what state ones don't -- and they'll share. Added to that, it's possible that federal investigators can ask for something, Trump could decline because 5th Amendment, and the federal investigator could say "well you've been pardoned, so, too bad".

[Antiganon]

I'll never understand this oath with intelligence agencies and psychologists. If you had some top-secret intel that could change the world for the better (supposedly), why not just spill it

Because revealing that intel now would do nothing to change the current situation, revealing it then wouldn't have changed the political reality that the GoP led Senate was never going to remove him from office, and burning their source would make it very difficult to continue future investigative work.

While the FBI can't really do anything now, they could on January 21. They could also turn over evidence to the SDNY, Manhattan DA, and NY AG to aid in their cases against Trump.

[Breccia]

While the FBI can't really do anything now, they could on January 21. They could also turn over evidence to the SDNY, Manhattan DA, and NY AG to aid in their cases against Trump.

Indeed.

We don't need to see the evidence, especially if it's classified-level shit.

[Magical Mudcrab]

Most. But not all.

"Wait, this Vance guy, he's pursuing in court cases with basically no evidence known! That's--"

(points at Trump's election lawsuits) You were saying?

It's also worth noting that federal investigators might find what state ones don't -- and they'll share. Added to that, it's possible that federal investigators can ask for something, Trump could decline because 5th Amendment, and the federal investigator could say "well you've been pardoned, so, too bad".

That's fair. I was not aware of this case, though I'm aware of a number of the cases against him in places like New York alleging various kinds of fraud.

It's also a little strange that, apparently, a president may offer pre-emptive pardons, as they can be issued "either before legal proceedings are taken, or during their pendency, or after conviction and judgment". That said, I wouldn't be too sure that Trump would look to pardon himself or even have Pence pardon him. A presidential pardon requires the pardoned to admit guilt, as seen in the Joe Arpaio case, which means that Trump would have to admit wrongdoing in this instance. I'm unsure how well this would go down with the less radical members of his base, though I assume many would just point to the deep state.

[Xyonai]

0 for 9 lawsuits today

306 electoral votes to Biden

All margins too large for any recount to have any effect on the outcome.

Donald can get fucked.

231 years of elections. 231 since the Constitution was ratified. And not once has the outgoing president thrown a fit, threatened the peaceful transfer of power and claimed fraud. Not once. This is disgraceful and all of you who voted for Trump, this year or in 2016, should be ashamed.

One can only hope the non rabid Trump voters who voted for him this time around feel like fuckin' idiots after watching 'Their' president throw a weeks long temper tantrum and act like a sore loser.

[YUPPIE]

Do you people believe Trump as a president was worse than George W. Bush

[Breccia]

I was not aware of this case

Of course not, it just happened. You didn't miss anything.

[Orange Joe]

Does anyone find it depressing that 10 to 20 or so years from now, schools will ask kids with the ol' question of "favorite President" and Trump will be the black sheep. The option people will only assume you're trolling with.

No. I would find it depressing if people really thought Trump was a role model.

[Machismo]

Do you people believe Trump as a president was worse than George W. Bush

Bush wasn't a white supremacist.

[YUPPIE]

No. I would find it depressing if people really thought Trump was a role model.

Wasn't Trump seen as a role model during his younger years? For business anyways. Patrick Bateman was admitted to be based on Trump and idolizes the man by name in the novelization.

[Orange Joe]

Wasn't Trump seen as a role model during his younger years? For business anyways. Patrick Bateman was admitted to be based on Trump and idolizes the man by name in the novelization.

He is known for being rich that is about it. That and for bankrupting a casino.... a fucking casino.....

[Kaleredar]

Wasn't Trump seen as a role model during his younger years? For business anyways. Patrick Bateman was admitted to be based on Trump and idolizes the man by name in the novelization.

If you have a serial killer based on you maybe you aren't the best role model. Just a thought.

[Machismo]

Wasn't Trump seen as a role model during his younger years? For business anyways. Patrick Bateman was admitted to be based on Trump and idolizes the man by name in the novelization.

Nope, he was always racist trash.

[Eviscero]

Do you people believe Trump as a president was worse than George W. Bush

Absolutely without any question, eleventy-billion percent times infinity squared. Trump is the most dangerous, irresponsible, corrupt, and incompetent person to ever occupy the presidency by a solid margin.

[Kathranis]

Wasn't Trump seen as a role model during his younger years? For business anyways. Patrick Bateman was admitted to be based on Trump and idolizes the man by name in the novelization.

You know what American Psycho is about, right? It's literally a satire about how yuppies are racist, sexist, homophobic, materialistic psychopaths.

And the novel is the original work, not an adaptation.

[Draco-Onis]

You know what American Psycho is about, right? It's literally a satire about how yuppies are racist, sexist, homophobic, materialistic psychopaths.

And the novel is the original work, not an adaptation.

Trumpists are immune to sarcasm, satire and comedy.

[Polyxo]

Trumpists are immune to sarcasm, satire and comedy.

I mean, a lot of them see Rorschach as a big hero too, so are we surprised?

[Draco-Onis]

I mean, a lot of them see Rorschach as a big hero too, so are we surprised?

If you ever want to see one get mega triggered have them watch The Boys doesn't matter the season or even the episode.