Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[beanman12345]

Because what started this was the putting of all the blame for all the deaths on one man, Trump.

No amount of copium will change reality, nor fix what ails ya.

[draynay]

Because what started this was the putting of all the blame for all the deaths on one man, Trump. It is all but certain he is responsible for an increase in the number of deaths by his actions, but the true impact is unknown.

Why is this distinction important to you?

[Felya]

Why is this distinction important to you?

Because we are just two days from Biden being blamed for everything...

[Kellhound]

Yes, all of the deaths are on Trump... not him individually killing them all... The impact of Trump defunding the pandemic response team and then lying about the virus... is immeasurable... it is so bad, that measuring it, wouldn’t be possible... fair enough?

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No shit you wouldn’t go that far... you are the one pulling the shit... What challenge? No one is arguing 0 people would die... no one is arguing that everyone listened to Trump... You argue in indefensible absolutes, because Trump is indefensible. It’s blatant...

You just said all the deaths are on Trump, and then complain that I am dealing in absolutes?

I said Trump would see it as a challenge if you told him he couldn't have done worse.

I am sad Felya, you used to have a more nuanced balanced approach.

[Breccia]

Why is this distinction important to you?

Honestly, a lot of Trump supporters are looking at thst distinction right now. They don't want to admit they voted for, and supported, the man who said everything was fine, that he was in complete control (even over state governments) and that the President was responsible for lethal outbreaks...and then watched 400,000 and rising awfully fast Americans die. They'd be saying things like "come on, I only voted for the guy that killed 200,000 Americans. 300,000 tops!"

"You can't blame Trump for all those deaths" is, by the way, one of the lamest-ass, limpest-dick defenses of IMPOTUS I've yet seen. Holy shit, some Trump supporters are crying into their single scoop of ice cream today, aren't they? It's way up there with "Your Honor, in all fairness, when the police were shooting back at my client they also shot someone. Surely my client isn't responsible for that death?"

(Yes he is)

Remember, Trump said he was responsible for saving millions of lives.

In every way the best economy in the history of the world. We were blowing away China. We were blowing away everybody. We were the envy of the world and then they came in and they explained it, and they said, sir, you have to turn it off. We have to close the country. And I said, say it again. They said, sir, you have to close the country. Nobody ever heard of a thing like this but they were right because if I didn't we would have lost two million, two and a half million, maybe more than that people, and we'll be at 100,000, 110,000, higher -- the lower level of what was projected if we did the shutdown, but still you're talking about -- I say two Yankee stadiums of people

Where was @Kellhound at any point past May 11 saying "Whoa whoa whoa! Trump wasn't responsible for saving all those lives!"

Actually I'll be fair. Hey @Kellhound if you can find the post where you contradicted Trump for saying he'd saved two million or more lives, then all of this goes away. Like, right now. Because you'd prove you weren't a hypocrite.

I'd suggest you start looking now -- the Shitshow thread has thousands of pages. Finding the post where you said this might take a while.

[beanman12345]

Oh, and let's not forget this bit: the COVID task force press conference of April 13.

1) "Everything we did was right" -- Trump said that, in public.

2) This part:



3) This part:



That's right: the famous "the authority is total" statement was made, by Trump, about COVID, about state governments.

It no longer matters what @Kellhound says about state goverments and whether people obeyed them or not. Trump refuted that point. And used the exact phrase "the authority is total" when talking about himself.

There is no sane way to continue defending Trump on this one. @Kellhound 's point is unwinnable, and only unwinnable because it was used to defend Trump, who personally and directly refuted the very argument @Kellhound is trying to make.

I still win.

Well, when it comes to trump, I think you will almost always win, because in 100 years, if climate hasn't royally fucked us hard enough and the only habital places left on earth are Canada and Siberia, Kids in US will be learning in social studies how Trump is responsible for all the covid deaths, and all the other horrible shit he's done. What certain specificic individuals claim they are not aware of now, doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things.

[Kellhound]

Why is this distinction important to you?

Because I don't blame one man for the failings of many. The President is not all powerful.

[Breccia]

You just said all the deaths are on Trump, and then complain that I am dealing in absolutes?

Again, maybe this would have worked better if you were defending literally any other human being on Earth.

Trump refuted your points. Your opinion on the subject is therefore irrelevant, when defending Trump, because Trump personally and directly blocked your defense.

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The President is not all powerful.

You're defending the man who literally said "the authority is total". Your argument is invalid.

[Felya]

Because I don't blame one man for the failings of many. The President is not all powerful.

Who is more powerful in US? Can anyone else make manufacturing of masks mandatory and decree nationwide policy? Has any president used executive orders with the veracity of Trump?

[Breccia]

Who is more powerful in US?

Again, you're trying to bring logic into this when it's already been removed. Trump said this was his fault -- directly, and also indirectly when he blamed Obama and Biden for ebola, H1N1, and even COVID itself.

There is no logical argument left to be made. Trump personally took responsibility. The rest of the points would make a pretty good debate in any other context, but not when defending Trump.

[Felya]

You just said all the deaths are on Trump, and then complain that I am dealing in absolutes?

They are indirectly all his fault... because we have no clue who would live and who wouldn’t, if Trump didn’t lie, didn’t encourage “LIBERATE” and didn’t defund the pandemic response team. All we know is that lives would be saved... until you can separate the ones that would have been saved, if Trump didn’t kick them off ACA... then please go ahead and make a list... until then, he indirectly caused all of them...

I said Trump would see it as a challenge if you told him he couldn't have done worse.

That’s great... Trump could not have done better... Trump is the best president ever... did me saying that, change anything I have said for the last several pages? Is Twitter coming for me now? WTF?

I am sad Felya, you used to have a more nuanced balanced approach.

Yeah, I was never the Fox News version of balanced... that is life though... people don’t like it when you disagree...

[PhaelixWW]

I wasn't aware that Trump was responsible for all of the deaths.

Trump loves to blame Obama for all the US deaths from swine flu in 2009, so turnabout is fair play, yes?

And Obama's response to the swine flu pandemic was a thousand times better than the farce that is Trump's "coronavirus taskforce".

I mean, it's been almost exactly 300 days since this was posted ITT (I'll omit the author to save them the embarrassment):

Just felt like I had to post this here

"DeMs UsInG ThE CoRoNaViRuS to AttAcK TrUmP iS SiLly " ( Even tho thats all dems are talking about right now )

Heres some facts for you :

President Trump :
COVID-19 Coronavirus
US cases to date : 15,219
US deaths to date : 203
Panic level : Mass hysteria

President Obama
H1N1
US cases peak at time : 60.8 MILLION
US deaths peak at time : 12,469
Panic level : 0 panic/Nobody cares

Logic? Good ole left-wing controlled media never fails.

BTW thanks Dems for blocking stage 3 so millions of people in us cant pay anything. how do you people justify it I don't know...

Talk about the ultimate in not aging well.

[Felya]

Again, you're trying to bring logic into this when it's already been removed. Trump said this was his fault -- directly, and also indirectly when he blamed Obama and Biden for ebola, H1N1, and even COVID itself.

There is no logical argument left to be made. Trump personally took responsibility. The rest of the points would make a pretty good debate in any other context, but not when defending Trump.

Hey... if someone wants to hand me a soap box and ask me to repeat... Trump defunded pandemic response team, lied about the virus and encouraged “LIBERATE” riots... who am I not to oblige...

[Kellhound]

Where was @Kellhound at any point past May 11 saying "Whoa whoa whoa! Trump wasn't responsible for saving all those lives!"

Actually I'll be fair. Hey @Kellhound if you can find the post where you contradicted Trump for saying he'd saved two million or more lives, then all of this goes away. Like, right now. Because you'd prove you weren't a hypocrite.

I'd suggest you start looking now -- the Shitshow thread has thousands of pages. Finding the post where you said this might take a while.

I have pointed out that Trump is stupid on more than one occasion. I also have never claimed to support him, nor have I voted for him (not that it matters in my state).

[Breccia]

Talk about the ultimate in not aging well.

Oh, fucking ouch. You deserve a high five and a milkshake. Or...however he's spelling it.

On topic that isn't Trump killing 400,000 Americans:

Guy Reffitt, one of those arrested for breaking into the House/Senate, told his own children he would shoot them if they told the police where he went.

To what little credit this person who's name is one auto-correct from "Reddit Guy" doesn't deserve, his wife -- who did tell police where he went -- said she didn't think he'd actually shoot his own children.

Wow, we're seeing the worst of the worst here. How about some Trump supporters, like @Kellhound for example, come out and say "that was wrong and I condemn it"? It's not even asking them to condemn the riots (they should, but not what I'm asking right now). I'm asking them to condemn threatening to murder their own offspring because they talked to law enforcement.

Oh, he also threatened to shoot his daughter's phone. I mean, he probably paid for it, I guess that's not as bad. Unless she was using it.

[Kellhound]

Again, maybe this would have worked better if you were defending literally any other human being on Earth.

Trump refuted your points. Your opinion on the subject is therefore irrelevant, when defending Trump, because Trump personally and directly blocked your defense.

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You're defending the man who literally said "the authority is total". Your argument is invalid.

Reality and the rhetoric of a delusional idiot are not the same just because they say it is.

[Breccia]

I also have never claimed to support him

a) You're defending him now, even when it's been objectively proven it's pointless, and
b) *ahem* (points two posts upwards)

By the way, I have no intention of lumping you in with the "I'm not a Trump supporter, but isn't Trump the best at everything and doesn't his dick taste like chocolate?" crowd. Why you're trying to enter that crowd now, of all times, is beyond me. Your defense of Trump was invalidated by Trump himself. If you don't support him, stop defending him, he asked you to stop defending him. Give it up. It's over. I still win.

If you'll excuse me, @Felya wanted a soapbox. I might literally have one in my garage. Cardboard okay?

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Reality and the rhetoric of a delusional idiot are not the same just because they say it is.

You're right.

Problem is, it's still irrelevant. Trump volunteered to take the blame. You might continue to insist he can't do that, but he already did. Too bad. I still win.

EDIT: Actually no, @PhaelixWW totally wins. That was brutal, dude.

[Felya]

I have pointed out that Trump is stupid on more than one occasion. I also have never claimed to support him, nor have I voted for him (not that it matters in my state).

The only reason this is even brought up, is because people are wondering why you can possibly come to the opinion that defending Trump’s responsibility, is worth any time at all. In reality, that’s a completely irrelevant question... you are under no obligation to say the truth and even if you did confirm the assertions... what the fuck does it change?

The reality is simple... Trump defunded the pandemic response team, encouraged the “LIBERATE” movement and constantly lied about the virus, while pushing bullshit remedies... trying to argue the fact that we can’t pin point which people would be saved, if Trump didn’t do this shot... is bullshit... he did this shit... people would have lived if he didn’t... the fact that we can’t satiate your need for individuals who would be saved, doesn’t change the fact that no one had the ability to help, as much as Trump... and he did the opposite at every step... to not blame him for a single life lost, requires deductive reasoning that none of posses... thus...

Edit: Would it make you feel better if we just round up, to claim it’s all of them? lol

[Kellhound]

Who is more powerful in US? Can anyone else make manufacturing of masks mandatory and decree nationwide policy? Has any president used executive orders with the veracity of Trump?

He has the most power of any single person, but that does not make him all powerful. The SCOTUS is more powerful than the President, for example, because they have the power to declare any action he takes as invalid. There are powers the States have that he does not.

[Breccia]

There are powers the States have that he does not.

Trump personally and directly refuted this point too. I quoted and linked where, when, and how he did so, and it was this very context. Your opinion is irrrelevant.

On topic:

Trump will be the first in over 150 years to skip the inauguration of his successor, barring those who died of course.

Trump won't get the military parade/fanfare he asked for, either. The military is too busy defending the nation's capital from Trump's supporters that he incited into a murderous insurrection.