Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[PhaelixWW]

As a lifelong Floridian, you are underestimating.....

There's a joke here about "actual" vs. "confirmed"...

[Breccia]

So let's talk about Florida. Let's talk about how completely fucked they've chosen to make themselves.

1) DeSantis is considering letting out-of-state nurses come to help Florida because the state is overwhelmed.

The majority of hospitals in Tampa Bay currently report that they need immediate backup to handle the surge of COVID-19 patients and, according to the Florida Hospital Association, our facilities are on the brink of a critical staffing shortage.

Health care workers facing the fourth wave of the virus say they are wiped out. Nurses say increasing incentives aren’t enough to make up for the exhaustion being felt as hospitalizations surge.

“It’s just a vicious cycle of not having enough nurses and them quitting because they’re exhausted,” Polk County nurse Tiffany Mcmahan said.

At a news conference on the delta variant at Lykes Gaslight Park in Tampa on Aug. 13, leaders from three of the largest hospital systems all said they’re seeing an unprecedented number of COVID patients.

“We need clinical nurses, respiratory therapists,” Dr. Anand said.

At a news conference in Orlando on Aug. 16, Gov. Ron DeSantis told reporters hospitals have the staffing issue under control.

“I spoke with folks in Central Florida and beyond. They all say that this is their responsibility,” DeSantis said. “I know that they’re making whatever arrangements they need to do.”

2) Florida is running out of morgue spaces to put the people who died from COVID

AdventHealth said Thursday that its Central Division morgues are at full capacity and that the backup is likely due to a slowdown at funeral homes in the area, thus causing Advent Health to "hold decedents for a longer period of time," news station WFTV reported.

AdventHealth said that it is using portable coolers in the meantime, but those are also quickly filling up.

"We have begun utilizing rented, refrigerated coolers at 10 of our campuses throughout Orange, Osceola, Polk, Seminole and Volusia counties," they told WFTV. "These coolers are quickly becoming filled also."

WFTV reported that AdventHealth has asked for help from the Florida Hospital Association, but that they are unable to request aid from the Florida Emergency Mortuary Operations Response System because the state is not currently under a disaster declaration.

There are a bunch of related versions of this story that call out specific counties one by one. Not posting those. I'm already close to throwing up, I don't need to know how restaurants volunteered refridgerators to house dead people who decided eating out without a mask was worth dying for.

3) The pandemic is worst in Florida than it's ever been. Their cases have broken records. Their hospitalizations have broken records. Their deaths fucking shattered records. Their positivity is nearly 20%.

Their new cases are 30% higher than their previous peak.

Hey remember that time when Florida broke its death record four days in a row in late July of last year? The fourth record break was 257 deaths. Look at today.

4) And before some disingenuous poster comes here to shrill "But Illinois! But Massachusetts!" Florida is the only state that's breaking death records. Vaccines are readily available, masks are everywhere, and Florida's fourth wave is their highest ever ever.

“Vaccines are working to prevent deaths in many other countries that have seen post vaccine spike in cases, and most other states in the U.S. as well. Florida is different,” Dr. Vincent Rajkumar, a professor of medicine at the Mayo Clinic, recently explained on Twitter. “What’s different in Florida is that, relative to the vaccination rate (~50%), the relaxation of distancing and masking was disproportionately high. Leaders expressed disdain for masks and mask mandates. The total number of people unvaccinated is high. And hospitals got overwhelmed.”

DeSantis ordered everyone reopened. He is still fighting schools trying to impose mask mandates.

5) Oh, right, the mask thing is in court again. Yesterday Orange County's school district reported 400 cases and also that they were applying a mask mandate. They also ran out to shut that barn door while the horses were in the pasture. They are the most recent of nine school districts, if I'm reading this right, including the six largest in the state. And that doesn't count the Disney school that just shut down entirely for a whole week.

Deaths in Florida have a seven-day average of over 200 now. To put this in perspective, that's an Afghanistan bombing...fifteen times a day, every day for the last week.

We are the first state to start the treatment centers for monoclonal antibodies. We're having great success with that. That should have been a bigger plan, a bigger part of this whole response throughout the country from the beginning

-- DeSantis, the governor of the state with the most COVID cases, hospitalizations, and deaths

Even if DeSantis was right about monoclonal antibodies, how fucking bad would Florida be without those? And also, isn't bragging about the best treatment of people you forced to get infected a lot like bragging about having the best Jaws of Life for when you run a red light in a school zone at 120MPH and T-bone a minivan filled with kids?

I would say "Florida can fuck off and die" but it sounds like I don't need to. They're handling that just fine on their own. Hey, did you hear we have yet more evidence of the collapsing condo's state of disrepair? It's horrifying.

[Paranoid Android]

https://www.businessinsider.com/trum...one-hit-2021-8



Bin Laden? He's not so bad, he only did ONE THING and ONLY ONE THING!

PHAT Orang man so jealous of Obama. But more importantly this is his classic narcissisms. If a Dem Ex Prez woulda done this say Bush actually got Bin Laden. "Err, Derr, U hate our country"!

[PhaelixWW]

We're about to reach @Breccia's not-so-favorite milestone again.

Tomorrow, most likely, the 7-day average for deaths in the US will officially be back over 1000. As a reminder, it was down to under 250 less than two months ago, before delta started burning through the anti-vax community. Case counts are up 12.5x over the last two months, as well.

[Breccia]

We're about to reach @Breccia's not-so-favorite milestone again.

Yeah...1,000 deaths a day is gruesome. I'd be even more upset if we hadn't just learned Florida is responsible for 900 of them.

I really should do a red/blue state breakdown at some point.

[Huehuecoyotl]

So let's talk about Florida. Let's talk about how completely fucked they've chosen to make themselves.

1) DeSantis is considering letting out-of-state nurses come to help Florida because the state is overwhelmed.

Considering that all other states are under pressure (not as bad as Florida, but still bad enough that they don't have nurses to spare) where are these additional nurses going to come from? Are they going to use (gasp) foreign nurses?

The cognitive dissonance could be large enough to be seen from space.

[beanman12345]

4) And before some disingenuous poster comes here to shrill "But Illinois! But Massachusetts!" Florida is the only state that's breaking death records. Vaccines are readily available, masks are everywhere, and Florida's fourth wave is their highest ever ever.

I can actually speak for some of this. Illinois. Southern Illinois, Corn fields, a few college towns, well those college towns are likely where the majority of southern illinois hospitals are located in, are full. Deep red country, low vaccine rate, also low if not 0 ICU beds available. contrast to where almost everyone in Illinois lives, Chicago, we're at 85% ICU capacity. less then 10% of that is covid. Because you know, there is A LOT of medical issues that require an ICU, and people in states where they are FULL of Covid patients, are FUCKED. Don't even drive through any of these states, you get in a car accident, you are FUCKED.

[Omega10]

I can actually speak for some of this. Illinois. Southern Illinois, Corn fields, a few college towns, well those college towns are likely where the majority of southern illinois hospitals are located in, are full. Deep red country, low vaccine rate, also low if not 0 ICU beds available. contrast to where almost everyone in Illinois lives, Chicago, we're at 85% ICU capacity. less then 10% of that is covid. Because you know, there is A LOT of medical issues that require an ICU, and people in states where they are FULL of Covid patients, are FUCKED. Don't even drive through any of these states, you get in a car accident, you are FUCKED.

I never thought of this. But yeah.

[beanman12345]

I never thought of this. But yeah.

I was in one just two days ago, PACU, had to get my gallbladder removed. two other where there, no one with covid. When I was to the ER, nurse said it was one of the quietest she's ever seen it.

[Breccia]

where are these additional nurses going to come from?

There's also "why". Why would anyone come to Florida to work in medicine, now? Honestly, I'm looking for a dollar figure here. Medical professionals are front line workers and Florida is Normandy. What would you need to be paid to move there and work on the front lines? I'm a teacher, basically the second line in this context since Florida is doing in-person without a mask mandate. I can't imagine doing it for a price tag without "million" in it, and my family would question the move without an extra zero in there. Maybe I'm not the standard, but I also don't think Florida can afford seven or even six figures per nurse they want to relocate. I posted earlier they were down fifteen hundred medical personel. $100k each, that's $150 million dollars. To put that in perspective, that's Disneyland for a month.

Or, there could be nurses and such who have a lower price tag. I...hope they don't. The only thing worse than moving a nurse across the country to help people who are desperate to commit suicide, is when those people trying to commit suicide kill the nurse, and their families realize the nurse was killed for the price of a used car.

I suppose religious groups or the Red Cross or something could show up, but uh...they haven't yet. And for Florida to be saved by people used to treating the homeless, the helpless, the bottom of humanity's barrel? Yeah, DeSantis can put that on his 2024 posters.

there is A LOT of medical issues that require an ICU, and people in states where they are FULL of Covid patients, are FUCKED.

I think that's what that one Texas judge fighting Abbott said.

That means if your child's in a car wreck, if your child has a congenital heart defect or something and needs an ICU bed, or more likely if they have COVID and need an ICU bed, we don't have one. Your child will wait for another child to die.

[PhaelixWW]

Yeah...1,000 deaths a day is gruesome. I'd be even more upset if we hadn't just learned Florida is responsible for 900 of them.

Uh, no. That 900 stretches back much longer than a week ago. Florida is "only" about 20-25% of the US death toll.

[beanman12345]

Uh, no. That 900 stretches back much longer than a week ago. Florida is "only" about 20-25% of the US death toll.

900 that they are reporting...

[Breccia]

Uh, no. That 900 stretches back much longer than a week ago.

Oh, right, how did I confuse their death count rising 900 in one day to 900 people dying in one day? It's hard to keep track when they keep hiding their deaths behind time travel, like a kid shoving his vegetables under his napkin so he doesn't have to eat them.

That said, 20-25% of the US death count for a state under 10% of the population isn't a selling point, either.

[PhaelixWW]

That said, 20-25% of the US death count for a state under 10% of the population isn't a selling point, either.

No, it absolutely is not.

You know what is, though?

CNN: President DeSantis? Florida voters say 'no.'

The voters who know Ron DeSantis best don't think he should run for president in 2024.

Six in 10 Florida voters said they would not like to see the state's Republican governor become a presidential candidate...

Oh, wait...

[Omega10]

There's also "why". Why would anyone come to Florida to work in medicine, now? Honestly, I'm looking for a dollar figure here. Medical professionals are front line workers and Florida is Normandy. What would you need to be paid to move there and work on the front lines? I'm a teacher, basically the second line in this context since Florida is doing in-person without a mask mandate. I can't imagine doing it for a price tag without "million" in it, and my family would question the move without an extra zero in there. Maybe I'm not the standard, but I also don't think Florida can afford seven or even six figures per nurse they want to relocate. I posted earlier they were down fifteen hundred medical personel. $100k each, that's $150 million dollars. To put that in perspective, that's Disneyland for a month.

Or, there could be nurses and such who have a lower price tag. I...hope they don't. The only thing worse than moving a nurse across the country to help people who are desperate to commit suicide, is when those people trying to commit suicide kill the nurse, and their families realize the nurse was killed for the price of a used car.

I suppose religious groups or the Red Cross or something could show up, but uh...they haven't yet. And for Florida to be saved by people used to treating the homeless, the helpless, the bottom of humanity's barrel? Yeah, DeSantis can put that on his 2024 posters.

You have about the right amount that would be needed. This is from Kansas, one of those "out-of-state" places that might have nurses willing to move to sunny Florida.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/covid-19-...122324046.html

Title: COVID-19 news: Hospitals in ‘bidding war’ over nurses, Kansas death may be 1st in U.S.

Relevant Excerpt:

Demand for travel nurses has skyrocketed as the COVID-19 case surge spawned by the delta variant is crushing hospitals across the U.S. And hospitals in Missouri and Kansas are angling to hire them as the number of nurses may determine how many patients can be treated at a given time.

The demand has driven the cost of hiring way up. Some jobs advertise pay of $5,600 per week; some nurses have heard they can make $10,000 or more.

$5.6k a week is... 5.6k x 52 = around $290k a year. Ok only a quarter million, but still in the right ball park. $10k a week is over a half a million a year.

The downside? Maintaining this level of intensity over 6 months or a year is very non-trivial.

[Poopymonster]

Considering that all other states are under pressure (not as bad as Florida, but still bad enough that they don't have nurses to spare) where are these additional nurses going to come from? Are they going to use (gasp) foreign nurses?

The cognitive dissonance could be large enough to be seen from space.

They'll ask those brave heroes to come together and do what is needed to help their fellow Americans.
I hope one gets asked and says "Oh, so we're going to administer the vaccine there? That's the best fucking thing we can do to help."
Then gets interviewed by the news.

[Breccia]

The downside? Maintaining this level of intensity over 6 months or a year is very non-trivial.

I've personally cited at least three articles about nurses and other staff quitting from sheer exhaustion. I've seen it with teachers -- the extra rules/changes/safeguards was a lot of work, more importantly a lot of new different work, and a fair number of teachers just decided they'd rather retire. And of course, it's not just me.

Nearly 30% of National Education Association members say the pandemic has led them to plan on leaving teaching earlier than expected. Almost all 50 states reported shortages for the 2020-2021 school year, according to the U.S. Department of Education.

[Dontrike]

I've personally cited at least three articles about nurses and other staff quitting from sheer exhaustion. I've seen it with teachers -- the extra rules/changes/safeguards was a lot of work, more importantly a lot of new different work, and a fair number of teachers just decided they'd rather retire. And of course, it's not just me.

My friend has his teaching license is glad he isn't working for any schools right now, though he has experience seeing other family deal with teaching elementary school. Don't blame him.

[Breccia]

Well, Abbott somehow found 2,500 medical personel willing to help Texas.

"You already posted that."

This is in addition to the 2800 from last week. He says the whole should arrive by Sept 30.

Abbott is also trying to open more monoclonal sites, get more equipment, and asked Texas to get the vaccine.

"Well, surely he asked for a mask mand--"

No. He's still fighting those.

"Why would he spend what must be hundreds of millions of taxpayer money to fight the pandemic, but oppose a mask mandate which is basically free?"

I still don't know. Generally speaking, people who are anti-mask would be anti-vaxxers and he's clearly pro-vaccine.

"Are Texas' actions going to yoink possible help from going to Florida?"

Almost certainly. There's only so many spare nurses (etc) to go around right now, and anyone willing to risk Florida's numbers will find Texas' numbers not as bad.

[swiftowner]

@Breccia nurses are in high demand everywhere. My wife recently got a raise, no need to argue for it, just hospitals throwing money out to help retain nurses. All the hospitals around here need nurses. They even bumped up her pay an additional $20/hr for when her contract renews (yes, in addition to the original raise she just got). She could still make more going out of state to the south where things are a lot worse… but she hasn’t decided to do that yet. Though if they are paying half a mil, I don’t think I could convince my wife not to go.