Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Benggaul]

California reports lowest COVID-19 case rate in the country

Very impressive especially considering the high transmission of delta and the high population density of cities like LA. Gosh, I wonder why California is doing so well and other states like Florida and Texas still suck ass? No, "warm temperatures" still don't fucking matter.

[draynay]

California reports lowest COVID-19 case rate in the country

Very impressive especially considering the high transmission of delta and the high population density of cities like LA. Gosh, I wonder why California is doing so well and other states like Florida and Texas still suck ass? No, "warm temperatures" still don't fucking matter.

I am relieved that we voted against dying. Only ~1/3 of the voters wanted to die.

It was closer here, nearly half chose death, I'll stick with cake, thank you.

[Breccia]

So CNN posted a story that --

"Whoa! You're citing CNN? Don't you know that triggers Certain People on these forums?"

*sips coffee* *grins* I do.

Anyhow the story begins with a Florida family that never got vaccinated and held a bunch of large family gatherings and, yep, exactly what you think happened, happened. One of them caught COVID and degenerated to death's door status.

However the family learned about a special treatment --

"Bleach? UV lights? Horse dewormer?"

An ECMO machine. Details on this amazing machine here, the Extra Corporeal Membrane Oxygenation machine basically takes the blood out of your body to put oxygen in it, and shove it back into your body. Until recently, its main use was organ transplants -- the heart can't do its job when it's out of the body. It's an amazing piece of tech, I only knew about it from watching an ER doctor watch Rick & Morty episodes.

And it's kind of "the new rage" for last-ditch survival chances for COVID. You give the, well, failing and dying heart and lungs a long rest to recover while the body doesn't die. So...yeah, you're in an ICU hooked up to a machine designed to keep people with missing vital organs alive. You ain't movin, you ain't talkin, you ain't doin shit for days.

But this time, the guy lived. And begged his wife to get the shot, by the way.

The family called 169 hospitals in Florida, let that number sink in, one-hundred sixty-nine hospitals in Florida. None of them could/would help.

*sips coffee* *grins*

And then!

The day after exhausting that list, Susan appeared on CNN -- fearing Robby might be out of options. But a doctor in Connecticut saw her interview and had an idea.

Dr. Robert Gallagher was checking his Facebook feed and saw a CNN post with a video clip of Susan's interview.

Yep. CNN showed an interview with, as listed before, a Florida family intent on committing suicide, showed it nationwide, and someone who could actually help took them, because of that interview.

It was painful. It was stressful. It was 22 days of not knowing if it would work. But it did. Florida Man lost 50 pounds (and not in a good way, he's in P.T.) but should make a full recovery in time.

It should be noted that ECMO is literally "you will die if not" level of care. Like, I would legit expect the Joe Rogan treatment to be tried first by real doctors. And due to the drastic measures involved, it has a 50/50 survival rate -- but it's basically being used when the current situation has a 0% survival rate, so any port in a storm. Plus there's the whole "we need these machines to do surgery on people who need surgery to live" aspects, which is where the 169 "no" votes came from I'm sure.

The family is getting vaccinated, and telling all their friends to get vaccinated. The horrifying month-long near-death experience has apparently broken the resolve of sixty or so anti-vaxxer friends and family members, so at least there's that.

All thanks to research...I mean, they did research eventually...the charitable doctor who stepped in, and of course, CNN.

*sips coffee* *grins*

[Benggaul]

The family called 169 hospitals in Florida, let that number sink in, one-hundred sixty-nine hospitals in Florida. None of them could/would help.

Not just Florida. They also tried Georgia, Louisiana, Alabama and Virginia. I mention that only to point out how dire the situation is in hospitals not just in Florida but pretty much all of the other nearby states as well.

[Breccia]

Not just Florida. They also tried Georgia, Louisiana, Alabama and Virginia.

Ah, yes, they did. I also left out the part that, during this ordeal, two lifelong friends of the family who were also anti-vaxxers caught COVID and died. There's no indication if they got it from each other, but at this point it hardly matters.

[Odinfrost]

So CNN posted a story that --

"Whoa! You're citing CNN? Don't you know that triggers Certain People on these forums?"

*sips coffee* *grins* I do.

Anyhow the story begins with a Florida family that never got vaccinated and held a bunch of large family gatherings and, yep, exactly what you think happened, happened. One of them caught COVID and degenerated to death's door status.

However the family learned about a special treatment --

"Bleach? UV lights? Horse dewormer?"

An ECMO machine. Details on this amazing machine here, the Extra Corporeal Membrane Oxygenation machine basically takes the blood out of your body to put oxygen in it, and shove it back into your body. Until recently, its main use was organ transplants -- the heart can't do its job when it's out of the body. It's an amazing piece of tech, I only knew about it from watching an ER doctor watch Rick & Morty episodes.

And it's kind of "the new rage" for last-ditch survival chances for COVID. You give the, well, failing and dying heart and lungs a long rest to recover while the body doesn't die. So...yeah, you're in an ICU hooked up to a machine designed to keep people with missing vital organs alive. You ain't movin, you ain't talkin, you ain't doin shit for days.

But this time, the guy lived. And begged his wife to get the shot, by the way.

The family called 169 hospitals in Florida, let that number sink in, one-hundred sixty-nine hospitals in Florida. None of them could/would help.

*sips coffee* *grins*

And then!



Yep. CNN showed an interview with, as listed before, a Florida family intent on committing suicide, showed it nationwide, and someone who could actually help took them, because of that interview.

It was painful. It was stressful. It was 22 days of not knowing if it would work. But it did. Florida Man lost 50 pounds (and not in a good way, he's in P.T.) but should make a full recovery in time.

It should be noted that ECMO is literally "you will die if not" level of care. Like, I would legit expect the Joe Rogan treatment to be tried first by real doctors. And due to the drastic measures involved, it has a 50/50 survival rate -- but it's basically being used when the current situation has a 0% survival rate, so any port in a storm. Plus there's the whole "we need these machines to do surgery on people who need surgery to live" aspects, which is where the 169 "no" votes came from I'm sure.

The family is getting vaccinated, and telling all their friends to get vaccinated. The horrifying month-long near-death experience has apparently broken the resolve of sixty or so anti-vaxxer friends and family members, so at least there's that.

All thanks to research...I mean, they did research eventually...the charitable doctor who stepped in, and of course, CNN.

*sips coffee* *grins*

You know what, good for them, and the biggest of shoutouts to that doctor.
So, during 12th of September this year, National Geographic dedicated the entire day to 9/11 stuff, and the stories that were told, the people that were shown. I saw the documentaries and wondered how the country could go from a place with those kind of people into what we've seen in the past six-ish years. But I guess those people are still there, if harder to actually see.

Now to see if others hear about this story and will change their tune, or if they will call it fake news and go back to the strange parts of the internet where they read about a Mr. No-name from the swamps talk about how he have evidence that prove that Trump won 2020 but can't show it because the FBI will come and kill him.

[Benggaul]

Now to see if others hear about this story and will change their tune, or if they will call it fake news and go back to the strange parts of the internet where they read about a Mr. No-name from the swamps talk about how he have evidence that prove that Trump won 2020 but can't show it because the FBI will come and kill him.

I made the mistake of reading some of the comments on the story and there's a lot of "OMG PROPAGANDA" and such. There's no hope for most of those people.

[Breccia]

There's no hope for most of those people.

It seems they have to actually know someone who gets sick and (nearly) dies to change their mind. "On my deathbed, I beg you to get the vaccine" does seem to work...to them.

The story's an individual case, but, one person got sick and nearly died, 2 people did die, and 60 people got vaccinated. So that's a 20:1 saved/not saved ratio going on of people who knew the orignal inflicted person, including the original person.

Granted, saving 20 people for every one who dies isn't enough, but it's better than nothing. Problem is, Florida saving 20,000 people a day or whatever will take years to find everyone still holding out hope that injecting bleach, vitamin drips and Jesus will save them.

There's a greater danger, too. Sarah Palin told Dr. Drew yes that Dr. Drew that she's not getting vaccinated, because she believes natural antibodies are stronger and work better. Based on a recent study, she has a point just strong enough to be fatal. Because you get those antibodies...how? By catching COVID. Which she did. My fear is that, like that fucking bit with vaccines and autism, people will latch onto that and say "I'd rather get COVID and then get antibodies to not catch COVID", catch COVID, and die.

- - - Updated - - -

Abbot's popularity is now underwater.

A whopping 54% of Texans surveyed think the state is on the wrong track. Just 45% approve of the governor’s job performance.

The poll on state and political issues was conducted Sept. 7-14. It surveyed 1,148 registered voters and has a margin of error of plus or minus 2.9 percentage points.

It would be easy to blame this drop on the lethal outbreak. Therefore, I'm going to blame this drop on the lethal outbreak. Abbott has been counterproductive and harmful. I suppose some moderates are not thrilled about the sudden change on abortion laws or allowing everyone to carry a concealed weapon without a permit. Regardless, it looks like Abbott is playing to the far right and losing the middle while doing so. Texas isn't far right enough for this to work, and of course, those in the far right are committing suicide by refusing to vaccinate -- @Benggaul has numbers that tell the rest of that story.

[Zan15]

So CNN posted a story that --

"Whoa! You're citing CNN? Don't you know that triggers Certain People on these forums?"

*sips coffee* *grins* I do.

Anyhow the story begins with a Florida family that never got vaccinated and held a bunch of large family gatherings and, yep, exactly what you think happened, happened. One of them caught COVID and degenerated to death's door status.

However the family learned about a special treatment --

"Bleach? UV lights? Horse dewormer?"

An ECMO machine. Details on this amazing machine here, the Extra Corporeal Membrane Oxygenation machine basically takes the blood out of your body to put oxygen in it, and shove it back into your body. Until recently, its main use was organ transplants -- the heart can't do its job when it's out of the body. It's an amazing piece of tech, I only knew about it from watching an ER doctor watch Rick & Morty episodes.

And it's kind of "the new rage" for last-ditch survival chances for COVID. You give the, well, failing and dying heart and lungs a long rest to recover while the body doesn't die. So...yeah, you're in an ICU hooked up to a machine designed to keep people with missing vital organs alive. You ain't movin, you ain't talkin, you ain't doin shit for days.

But this time, the guy lived. And begged his wife to get the shot, by the way.

The family called 169 hospitals in Florida, let that number sink in, one-hundred sixty-nine hospitals in Florida. None of them could/would help.

*sips coffee* *grins*

And then!



Yep. CNN showed an interview with, as listed before, a Florida family intent on committing suicide, showed it nationwide, and someone who could actually help took them, because of that interview.

It was painful. It was stressful. It was 22 days of not knowing if it would work. But it did. Florida Man lost 50 pounds (and not in a good way, he's in P.T.) but should make a full recovery in time.

It should be noted that ECMO is literally "you will die if not" level of care. Like, I would legit expect the Joe Rogan treatment to be tried first by real doctors. And due to the drastic measures involved, it has a 50/50 survival rate -- but it's basically being used when the current situation has a 0% survival rate, so any port in a storm. Plus there's the whole "we need these machines to do surgery on people who need surgery to live" aspects, which is where the 169 "no" votes came from I'm sure.

The family is getting vaccinated, and telling all their friends to get vaccinated. The horrifying month-long near-death experience has apparently broken the resolve of sixty or so anti-vaxxer friends and family members, so at least there's that.

All thanks to research...I mean, they did research eventually...the charitable doctor who stepped in, and of course, CNN.

*sips coffee* *grins*

Imagine that, using a therapy in an experimental way....because you didn't want an "experimental" vaxx. Seems to be an ironic trend with these Republican/MAGAts/Anti vaxxers.

[Breccia]

The WSJ reports--

"Paywall."

Business Insider reports that the WSJ reports that Trump has been shopping around for a replacement for McConnell. And isn't having any luck.

There appears to be little support for such a drastic move, according to the report, but the Trump's actions could potentially morph into a larger issue for the party, especially as the Kentucky Republican hopes to regain the Senate majority in the 2022 midterm elections and the former president continues to float a potential 2024 bid.

While Trump and McConnell worked together to fill scores of federal court vacancies with conservative jurists, along with passing the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act and other GOP priorities, Trump's intransigence in accepting his election loss to now-President Joe Biden and the Jan. 6 Capitol riot deeply strained the relationship between the two men.

As McConnell looks to the Senate map next year, he hopes to win in states like Arizona, Georgia, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania — which were all carried by President Joe Biden last fall — and a protracted fight with Trump could potentially dampen enthusiasm and hurt GOP candidates on the ground.

I would love to see the Republican Party have a good, long look at their results recently and ask "Was Trump worth it?" Oh, they'll still back him regardless. I would just rather they realize they're damaging themselves while doing so. Trump is already fundraising against other GOP members like Cheney. A split or a civil war would ruin them, and the GOP knows they can't survive without the increasingly horrifyingly insane rabid fanbase, who are still convinced Trump won and even convinced that, for example, the Justice for J6 rally was a false flag. They don't trust even themselves. And yet, without these people, the Republican Party would be lucky to crack 30% and that's being generous based on "do you think Trump won in 2020?" style polls we've seen.

Trump has routinely made his opinion that McConnell is a bad meanie poopoo head public. And McConnell, for his faults, does not turn on people with violence or anger if they don't support him 100% of the time, including a murderous insurrection, so McConnell won't take this direct, personal insult as a reason to cut Trump off. He knows Trump's voters, even the rabid fanbase, are a price he's chosen to accept. McConnell's practical reliability and results-driven actions are likely to keep enough support amongst the GOP Senate, and his own personal voters too, that ejecting him is unlikely. It's just funny to see Trump try from his couch in the living room.

[Forogil]

An ECMO machine. Details on this amazing machine here, the Extra Corporeal Membrane Oxygenation machine basically takes the blood out of your body to put oxygen in it, and shove it back into your body. Until recently, its main use was organ transplants -- the heart can't do its job when it's out of the body. It's an amazing piece of tech, I only knew about it from watching an ER doctor watch Rick & Morty episodes.

And it's kind of "the new rage" for last-ditch survival chances for COVID. You give the, well, failing and dying heart and lungs a long rest to recover while the body doesn't die. So...yeah, you're in an ICU hooked up to a machine designed to keep people with missing vital organs alive. You ain't movin, you ain't talkin, you ain't doin shit for days.

But this time, the guy lived. And begged his wife to get the shot, by the way.

The family called 169 hospitals in Florida, let that number sink in, one-hundred sixty-nine hospitals in Florida. None of them could/would help.

I would assume that most of the hospitals said no for the obvious reason that they don't have an ECMO machine.

In 2019 there were 264 hospitals equipped with ECMO in the entire US. (I don't know if all of them have adult ECMO-machines - as some of the early use was in children.) Miami herald reports the same https://www.miamiherald.com/news/cor...254289313.html - and adds that it's not only an advanced machine, but it also requires expertise to handle.

(Oh, and I have heard about them for Covid since more than a year, so it's not that new.)

[Breccia]

I would assume that most of the hospitals said no for the obvious reason that they don't have an ECMO machine.

Your assumption is incorrect because I didn't quote the entire article. The family tried calling hospitals with ECMO machines. Sorry for the confusion.

[Breccia]

The man in charge of the second highest per capita covid death rate in the world was on CNN.

...why? Why would he do that?

Watched the video, he did seem to ask for people to get vaccinated. But he also tried to deflect so hard.
1) Blamed the part-time legislature when he's in charge.
2) Claimed deaths are a lagging indicator, which it is, but that just means he was doing the worst job two weeks ago.
3) Pointed out that delta hit other states too...which doesn't mean he's doing a better job.
4) Flat-out admitted his state was more than its share of COVID cases, hospitalizations, and deaths.
5) Tried to suggest this wasn't his problem because Mississippi was small.

[Hollycakes]

half chose death, I'll stick with cake, thank you.

So funny you mention this.
I've been wanting to change my name to cake or death.
I too choose cake.
<3 Eddie

[Forogil]

Your assumption is incorrect because I didn't quote the entire article. The family tried calling hospitals with ECMO machines. Sorry for the confusion.

The article doesn't say that - it says they tried to search for ECMO hospitals (in several states) including googling for them, and that they called 169 hospitals.

You assumed that it meant that they found out in advance if the hospital had ECMO, and only called those, but that seems unlikely.

The Extracorporeal Life Support Organization count 7-8 hospitals in Florida with ECMO (one in the panhandle with limited capacity) - and clearly lack information for lots of hospitals, and 3 of those hospitals with ECMO are children's hospitals. If ELSO don't know which hospitals have ECMO (assuming there are more; otherwise there were less than 10 hospitals to call) - how would some googling persons know?

[Breccia]

If ELSO don't know which hospitals have ECMO - how would some googling persons know?

Fair enough. But yes, they weren't intentionally guessing blindly.

Begging for ECMO because your unvaccinated family had large gatherings and now someone's about to die is not a strategy. Hope is not a strategy. These people lucked out, and they lucked out in a big way.

[Gorsameth]

The WSJ reports--

"Paywall."

Business Insider reports that the WSJ reports that Trump has been shopping around for a replacement for McConnell. And isn't having any luck.



I would love to see the Republican Party have a good, long look at their results recently and ask "Was Trump worth it?" Oh, they'll still back him regardless. I would just rather they realize they're damaging themselves while doing so. Trump is already fundraising against other GOP members like Cheney. A split or a civil war would ruin them, and the GOP knows they can't survive without the increasingly horrifyingly insane rabid fanbase, who are still convinced Trump won and even convinced that, for example, the Justice for J6 rally was a false flag. They don't trust even themselves. And yet, without these people, the Republican Party would be lucky to crack 30% and that's being generous based on "do you think Trump won in 2020?" style polls we've seen.

Trump has routinely made his opinion that McConnell is a bad meanie poopoo head public. And McConnell, for his faults, does not turn on people with violence or anger if they don't support him 100% of the time, including a murderous insurrection, so McConnell won't take this direct, personal insult as a reason to cut Trump off. He knows Trump's voters, even the rabid fanbase, are a price he's chosen to accept. McConnell's practical reliability and results-driven actions are likely to keep enough support amongst the GOP Senate, and his own personal voters too, that ejecting him is unlikely. It's just funny to see Trump try from his couch in the living room.

As you concluded yourself, the GOP knows Trump is bad but they have no choice. They spend decades building up the crazies as their core demographic because they turn out to vote, if they dump Trump and lose them they will never win another election again.

[Rasulis]

California reports lowest COVID-19 case rate in the country

Very impressive especially considering the high transmission of delta and the high population density of cities like LA. Gosh, I wonder why California is doing so well and other states like Florida and Texas still suck ass? No, "warm temperatures" still don't fucking matter.

I can't speak for all of California. However, in Inner Sunset, San Francisco, there is a feeling in the community that we are all in this together. The community attitude is if the small inconvenience of wearing a mask could protect my neighbors, I will wear one with a smile. My neighbors won't see it, but I am smiling. If the science, my own self-interest and the protection of my neighbors all are promoted by getting a vaccine, then I’m happy to join my neighbors in line.

[Fugus]

As you concluded yourself, the GOP knows Trump is bad but they have no choice. They spend decades building up the crazies as their core demographic because they turn out to vote, if they dump Trump and lose them they will never win another election again.

And I doubt they will see this and change course to actually get more sane voters because the more sane they are, the less likely they are to vote Republican.

So, what do they hope to accomplish long term? Do they just hope to halt progress and damage the nation as much as possible to keep that power while halting progress till they lose power and just won't care anymore? Not like they will care about the mess they made, they will just blame others while pretending they did something good and even then, they won't be the ones stuck cleaning up that mess so they will be sharing Trump's mentality on that.

[Breccia]

So, what do they hope to accomplish long term?

We've discussed this before, and a common response was "there is no long-term, many Republicans are old and expect to die of old age". Makes it a lot easier to deal with the consequences of your actions.