Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[KayossZero]

No, Spectral was supporting the GOP decision to block the bill to help burn pit victims.

Let's call a duck a duck here.

Yeesh, I stand corrected. Hadn't looked at his latest posts.

[Edge-]

Mishandling of classified documents is one of the most clear examples of rampant prosecutorial discretion. If you disagree, tell me which you would apply to Hillary's alleged violations of the same exact statute at play in the Trump raid: "potentially malicious mishandling of top-secret government documents", "potentially endangering American interests around the world," "had [her] lie and shift [her] position at every possible step of this investigation."

Did they have to ask her for them? Did they then have to ask a second time with a legal subpoena? Did they then have to execute a legal search warrant signed off on by a judge to find even more classified documents?

Because it seems like it's more that you're upset that Hillary Clinton's mistakes here didn't rise to the level of criminality given the scope of what she did, whereas Trump's very much seems to be given the scope and consistent refusal to cooperate with the Archives, and later FBI/DoJ.

[Paranoid Android]

Let's stop talking about Trump scandals and scandals of his former appointees.

Breaking: Trump Interior secretary Ryan Zinke lied to investigators several times about conversations he had with federal officials, lawmakers and lobbyists about a petition by two Indian tribes to operate a casino in New England, the department IG found.

My old nemesis. This guy might have been the my most hated in the Cabinet, which is saying much with Scott Pruitt, Bets Devos and others. Jeez they had some scum in the cabinet.

Back to Zinke. This guy was like really, really, corrupt in the Trump administration. The IG found stated he lied in him blocking two casino's opening in New England area. This story broke back in February of 2019 and now the investigation is over.

Oh I guess I could put this in midterms thread. Since this leads to the worst of it all is he is leading in the US House race in Montana. Once more, this guy was really, really, corrupt. I don't even have to look which district this is but no doubt hard core Red and all-in Trumpers where electing a corrupt official, not a future corrupt official over at least finding someone who is corrupt-lite.

[Edge-]

So I assume nothing will happen to Zinke since the Trump administrations greatest achievement, other than signing a historically unpopular tax cut, seems to be proving that there are no consequences for lying to Congress or law enforcement under oath.

[Dontrike]

Have to wonder exactly why he wants them back so bad.

Likely a combination of narcissism where he believe he actually owns them, using them for bribe material if he is caught in some shit, and knowing he can sell them easily to his favorite dictatorships.

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Mishandling of classified documents is one of the most clear examples of rampant prosecutorial discretion. If you disagree, tell me which you would apply to Hillary's alleged violations of the same exact statute at play in the Trump raid: "potentially malicious mishandling of top-secret government documents", "potentially endangering American interests around the world," "had [her] lie and shift [her] position at every possible step of this investigation."

Of course "but Hillary" would be your argument.

[postman1782]

Just want to clarify that @Specialka is the right winger; @Spectral is nothing of the sort.

The fuck he isn't.

[cubby]

Mishandling of classified documents is one of the most clear examples of rampant prosecutorial discretion. If you disagree, tell me which you would apply to Hillary's alleged violations of the same exact statute at play in the Trump raid: "potentially malicious mishandling of top-secret government documents", "potentially endangering American interests around the world," "had [her] lie and shift [her] position at every possible step of this investigation."

Of course "but Hillary" would be your response. You literally have no idea what you're talking about, and cannot be bothered to learn the difference, because as usual you've been told what and how to think.

Trump had nuclear secrets laying around his office, and when repeatedly asked to return them, did not. Let us know when you catch up with reality.

Come off this insane bluster in your post. State for the record that you think Trump's handling of classified documents will be pinned (quoting you here) "on minorities or on gay and trans people." Seriously. Refute yourself first. Show you are capable of rationality in the face of an issue you are obviously very passionate about. I'm waiting. Seriously, this post comes across as your intention to browbeat people you know are guilty, and only using questions are means of advancing that aim. I'll need to see a little proof that you can look at unhinged portions of your post in retrospect, and recognize that readers will conclude you are not operating in good faith, and try restating or rescinding some to actually get at answers you seek. Lacking all that, I'm happy to wait for the judge ordering the unsealing of the probable-cause affadavit, and ruling on multiple motions from Trump lawyers, and see how well the AG can continue to speak publicly on an investigation that is selectively leaking information while claiming information must be kept from the public to protect the integrity of the investigation.

I see the GQP has released their talking points. Kushner was on Fox last night pushing them out there. Good job 'dang gettin' your parroting correct. Uncle Donald would be proud. You Yal'qaeda peeps are killing this country.

[gondrin]

Of course "but Hillary" would be your response. You literally have no idea what you're talking about, and cannot be bothered to learn the difference, because as usual you've been told what and how to think.


I see the GQP has released their talking points. Kushner was on Fox last night pushing them out there. Good job 'dang getting your parroting correct. Uncle Donald would be proud.

They would fit perfectly as Jeff Dunham dolls with the amount of repeating what someone else tells them is right. One sign of a cult is unquestioning groupthink. I would say there needs to be an intervention, but it is a feature of the far right, not a bug.

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Mishandling of classified documents is one of the most clear examples of rampant prosecutorial discretion. If you disagree, tell me which you would apply to Hillary's alleged violations of the same exact statute at play in the Trump raid: "potentially malicious mishandling of top-secret government documents", "potentially endangering American interests around the world," "had [her] lie and shift [her] position at every possible step of this investigation."

Come off this insane bluster in your post. State for the record that you think Trump's handling of classified documents will be pinned (quoting you here) "on minorities or on gay and trans people." Seriously. Refute yourself first. Show you are capable of rationality in the face of an issue you are obviously very passionate about. I'm waiting. Seriously, this post comes across as your intention to browbeat people you know are guilty, and only using questions are means of advancing that aim. I'll need to see a little proof that you can look at unhinged portions of your post in retrospect, and recognize that readers will conclude you are not operating in good faith, and try restating or rescinding some to actually get at answers you seek. Lacking all that, I'm happy to wait for the judge ordering the unsealing of the probable-cause affadavit, and ruling on multiple motions from Trump lawyers, and see how well the AG can continue to speak publicly on an investigation that is selectively leaking information while claiming information must be kept from the public to protect the integrity of the investigation.

Ok, I know I am feeding into this, by why would this be pinned on any minority group? Were the Top Secret, SCI or any other classified documents pertaining to minority groups in any way? What does that have to do with him having them in the first place in his own house? Why are you making excuses on the fact that is an extreme breach of security? Why aren't you questioning the fact that he allowed various foreign entities into his home that had potential access to them instead of making excuses that he should be allowed to do said things.? Why are you making excuses on why he is stating they are HIS DOCUMENTS instead of the property of the american public, aka the US government?

Why are you making excuses for someone to potentially SELL, TRANSFER OR USE said documents to as a means to blackmail the US government(the public) as a means to bend to what he wants? Why are you so anti-american? You know what they call people who act like this. Cowards and traitors.

But, it must be because of Hillary's emails. ::eyeroll::

If that is ok, then we need to investigate why the ENTIRE TRUMP FAMILY used PRIVATE EMAIL SERVERS for official government business while they were in the White House. What were on those servers? Maybe they ALL need to go to jail.

[Kaleredar]

Just want to clarify that @Specialka is the right winger; @Spectral is nothing of the sort.

Spectral’s hot takes on guns and the “overreach of the fbi and cia” make me believe otherwise.

[fwc577]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but since the butthurt Hillary’s Emails bullshit is coming up again.

Weren’t the documents found on her servers retroactively classified and the versions she had were from before they were classified? I swear I remember hearing this when her emails were a huge talking point.

[beanman12345]

Spectral’s hot takes on guns and the “overreach of the fbi and cia” make me believe otherwise.

Yeah, I think hes a libertarian lol.

[Edge-]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but since the butthurt Hillary’s Emails bullshit is coming up again.

Weren’t the documents found on her servers retroactively classified and the versions she had were from before they were classified? I swear I remember hearing this when her emails were a huge talking point.

Many were at least partially classified at the time, but they found "hundreds" more that included retroactively classified data in emails stored there.

She was also thoroughly investigated, cooperated fully and did not have to have the FBI execute a search warrant, and was cleared of any criminal intent. None of this is to defend her handling of the server to begin with, but to highlight that the seriousness of two situations are vastly different, as inconvenient is that is for most Republicans trying to make the comparison.

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https://www.cnn.com/2022/08/24/polit...ion/index.html

Lindsey Graham, having lost his lawsuit to get out of testifying to a grand jury, is now seeking to prevent the grand jury from asking him any questions relating to "all the topics" the Fulton County AG Fani Willis subpoena'd him about. Also, "other topics" as well. So...he doesn't want them to be able to ask him anything, even his name I guess.

Odds are he will lose this lawsuit as well.

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https://twitter.com/therecount/statu...52899971469312

“He governed in a very peculiar way … I’m assuming he did what he thought was appropriate.”

Jared Kushner on Fox with a strong defense of Donald Trump taking 800+ classified documents. I assume he was there to shill his book nobody is going to read - liberals who actually read don't give a fuck, conservatives who actually read and care about conservative theory won't care enough to buy it even if it might be an interesting oddity, or the Trump base who don't read more than their Truth Social feeds - and they figured it's worth seeing if he has a better defense for Trump's actions than has been offered so far.

Seems like he doesn't.

[Breccia]

Lindsey Graham, having lost his lawsuit to get out of testifying to a grand jury, is now seeking to prevent the grand jury from asking him any questions relating to "all the topics" the Fulton County AG Fani Willis subpoena'd him about. Also, "other topics" as well. So...he doesn't want them to be able to ask him anything, even his name I guess.

You can't just refuse to testify. Graham could have just taken the Fifth, if he was worried about himself and his crimes. We saw Trump do it 400+ times, pretending it was a protest, and he could have done the same. Therefore, this is something else. I guess Graham is admitting that Trump is a criminal, and he knew that, and possibly helped.

"I’m assuming he did what he thought was appropriate.”

Could not possibly matter less. Also, this sounds a lot like "Okay, yes, Trump broke the law...but you have to understand--" also konwn as "admission of guilt".

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The House panel...no, not that one, the House panel on COVID -- have a slew of evidence that Team Trump misled the nation with a bunch of bullshit.

Emails, text messages and testimony obtained by the committee show the Trump White House “exerted extreme and inappropriate pressure” on the FDA to reauthorize hydroxychloroquine even after it was shown to be ineffective and potentially dangerous.

The report found administration officials like trade advisor Peter Navarro enlisted outside allies like Fox News host Laura Ingraham and daytime TV talk show host Mehmet Oz — now the GOP nominee for Senate in Pennsylvania — to amplify pressure on the FDA to authorize hydroxychloroquine, a drug normally used to treat malaria and lupus, as a COVID-19 treatment.

Hydroxychloroquine has been heavily promoted as a treatment for the virus by Trump allies despite almost no evidence.

“Newly released evidence shows that Dr. Hatfill and Mr. Navarro used their direct access to top public health officials in an attempt to strongarm them into supporting hydroxychloroquine,” the report stated.

The FDA issued an emergency use authorization for hydroxychloroquine in late March 2020, but then revoked it less than three months later.

The report also details how the Trump administration influenced the FDA to deliver misleadingly positive news about convalescent plasma as a coronavirus treatment on the eve of the 2020 Republican National Convention (RNC) and White House attempts to block the FDA from collecting additional safety data on the first coronavirus vaccine in an attempt to ensure that it could be authorized before the 2020 presidential election.

By the way, anyone else know a Trump voter who said anything in the neighborhood of "I don't want to take the vaccine, we don't know its long-term effects"? Yeah...guess what.

The subcommittee report also details how the FDA wanted to advise vaccine manufacturers that the FDA wanted 60 days worth of followup patient safety data before applications for emergency use authorization were filed. That request would mean authorization wouldn’t occur until after the November 2020 election.

Trump had repeatedly said the shots would be authorized before Election Day, despite experts and agency scientists signaling it was unlikely.

Hahn told the committee the agency faced “pushback about the issue” from multiple officials, including Trump’s chief of staff, Mark Meadows. Meadows said the White House wou

The agency eventually circumvented the White House by quietly publishing the 60-day data request as part of a larger set of background documents for industry. Meadows later that day told Hahn the White House had cleared the release of the guidance.

Now, that bolded? One of two things happened.

1) Meadows took responsibility for the changes, and possibly lied about Trump's approval.

2) Trump was handed a long document and didn't read it.

Other than that last choice, everything we've seen we either already suspected or outright knew. The House has just proven it correct with evidence. Even Trump supporters know this is what Trump did, lie to the nation about COVID treatments, either out of willful ignorance or maliciously. So, manslaughter or murder, really. They just won't admit Trump pushed treatments on the country that were ineffecitve and actually dangerous.

Fighting the 60-day safety study, they might be more willing to admit that in public. Unless they, too, said "We don't know the long-term effects" in which case they know Trump screwed that one up, too. By the way "the vaccine turned out to be safe" is not an excuse to fighting safety tests, just like "It was okay to drive 120MPH in a school zone, turns out, no kids were crossing the street at the time" won't negate the points on your license and possible jail time.

I don't know if any of the above is illegal or not. It's definitely incompetent and corrupt, of course, but might not be actually illegal. I do just hope that even Trump supporters remember, if he ever tries to put his judgement up for debate, how many Americans he was trying to get sick and die.

[Edge-]

Barr's DoJ memo on the Mueller report is out - https://www.axios.com/2022/08/24/mem...mp-obstruction

"The memo supports the chilling conclusion that any president can interfere with any investigation if they believe it could damage them politically. It is clear why Barr did not want the public to see it," CREW said in a statement Wednesday.

"The memo presents a breathtakingly generous view of the law and facts for Donald Trump," the group added.

"It significantly twists the facts and the law to benefit Donald Trump and does not comport with a serious reading of the law of obstruction of justice or the facts as found by Special Counsel Mueller."

"Among many other problems, it is premised on the fact that there was no underlying criminal conduct, which is not what Mueller found, and waves its hand at there being no exact precedent to compare it to."

That's from CREW, who are primarily interested in government transparency as a watchdog organization. If their take is remotely accurate, it's no surprise Barr tried to use the DoJ to keep it secret. Haven't fully read it yet and honestly I'm no legal expert, so I'm going with the opinions of some actual legal experts here.

[Dead Moose Fandango]

Barr's DoJ memo on the Mueller report is out - https://www.axios.com/2022/08/24/mem...mp-obstruction



That's from CREW, who are primarily interested in government transparency as a watchdog organization. If their take is remotely accurate, it's no surprise Barr tried to use the DoJ to keep it secret. Haven't fully read it yet and honestly I'm no legal expert, so I'm going with the opinions of some actual legal experts here.

Lynch Barr. That's all I have to say. He's a goddamn traitor too.

[cubby]

Barr's DoJ memo on the Mueller report is out - https://www.axios.com/2022/08/24/mem...mp-obstruction

"The memo supports the chilling conclusion that any president can interfere with any investigation if they believe it could damage them politically. It is clear why Barr did not want the public to see it," CREW said in a statement Wednesday.

"The memo presents a breathtakingly generous view of the law and facts for Donald Trump," the group added.

"It significantly twists the facts and the law to benefit Donald Trump and does not comport with a serious reading of the law of obstruction of justice or the facts as found by Special Counsel Mueller."

"Among many other problems, it is premised on the fact that there was no underlying criminal conduct, which is not what Mueller found, and waves its hand at there being no exact precedent to compare it to."

That's from CREW, who are primarily interested in government transparency as a watchdog organization. If their take is remotely accurate, it's no surprise Barr tried to use the DoJ to keep it secret. Haven't fully read it yet and honestly I'm no legal expert, so I'm going with the opinions of some actual legal experts here.

When you're rich, "popular", and literally a former president most if not all the rules do not apply to you. Trump continues to do what he's done his entire life, break the law and sue those that disagree with him into submission. Including, in this case, the United States of America.

Trump was literally found with Special Compartment Access (the highest non-classified classification possible of documents) Nuclear Secrets lying around in his private office and he's not even indicted yet. You or I or anyone other citizen would be in a black site right now, with most of our fingernails lying on the floor.

[Breccia]

Lynch Barr. That's all I have to say. He's a goddamn traitor too.

Respectfully and only barely disagree. Barr isn't a traitor, he suppressed an investigation into a friend of his for obstruction. Oh, he's a criminal and a scumbag, no question. But technically he wasn't aiding Russia. Garland should line up career DOJ members who saw this coming, have them testify, and arrest Barr in public.

[s_bushido]

Lynch Barr. That's all I have to say. He's a goddamn traitor too.

I would much prefer he actually face the justice he obstructed in service of Trump. Killing him accomplishes nothing.

[imoncrack]

the anti trump/republican spite filled vitriol in this thread is amazing, 4249 pages of it is pretty insane.

[s_bushido]

the anti trump/republican spite filled vitriol in this thread is amazing, 4249 pages of it is pretty insane.

There's no reason not to be anti-Trump/Republican. Deal with it.