Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Breccia]

A new poll says that one in three Americans, and about six in ten Republicans, do not believe that Trump had classified documents at Mar-a-Lago.

Which means they either believe that Trump declassified them but somehow the record of that doesn't exist; that Trump declassified them by thinking hard; or that the FBI is just flat-out lying.

Now, I at least would understand the idea in that first option, even though I don't believe such. "We haven't found the records yet" is a fair thing to say. The other two? Pure fantasy bullshit only believed by cultists.

[cubby]

A new poll says that one in three Americans, and about six in ten Republicans, do not believe that Trump had classified documents at Mar-a-Lago.

Which means they either believe that Trump declassified them but somehow the record of that doesn't exist; that Trump declassified them by thinking hard; or that the FBI is just flat-out lying.

Now, I at least would understand the idea in that first option, even though I don't believe such. "We haven't found the records yet" is a fair thing to say. The other two? Pure fantasy bullshit only believed by cultists.

With everything going on, this is still the worst takeaway. People literally don't believe reality. It still boggles my mind, even after all these years.

[Endus]

Now, I at least would understand the idea in that first option, even though I don't believe such. "We haven't found the records yet" is a fair thing to say. The other two? Pure fantasy bullshit only believed by cultists.

With everything going on, this is still the worst takeaway. People literally don't believe reality. It still boggles my mind, even after all these years.

We need to start using the proper language for this behaviour.

They're radicals. They have been radicalized. Intentionally so, by the Republican Party and its representatives, who have actively sought to radicalize their supporters into extremist views. They reject reality because they have been sold a narrative and invited to dig themselves in so deep that to accept reality would require them to admit that everything they have ever believed for a decade or more was a lie. But that's how radicalism works; once you've arranged that disconnect, it's easy to push the lie ever further, because the short step to the new lie is now always easier than the giant leap back to reality. For these kinds of people, truth not only doesn't matter now, it never mattered; you get into this situation because you want a story that doesn't challenge you.

This is how propaganda changed decent Germans into Nazis in less than 20 years. And that was before the Internet, which is like tossing gasoline on a bonfire.

[Edge-]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-...ar-a-lago-raid

How desperate is Trump?

Trump: There’s a lot of speculation because of the severity of the FBI raiding Mar-a-Lago, were they looking for the Hillary Clinton emails…
Hannity: Wait, you’re not saying you had it
Trump: No, they may have thought that it was in there

Fuckin lol.

The spying on Trump’s campaign

Trump wants to be like Antonin Scalia and refer to himself in the third person. Trump is not Antonin Scalia.

[Belize]

With everything going on, this is still the worst takeaway. People literally don't believe reality. It still boggles my mind, even after all these years.

It's a cult, what else is new?

[Kaleredar]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-...ar-a-lago-raid

How desperate is Trump?



Fuckin lol.



Trump wants to be like Antonin Scalia and refer to himself in the third person. Trump is not Antonin Scalia.

So they were looking for Hillary’s emails…

But ended up walking off with a bunch of stuff that trump stole that they incidentally found?

Like, in no way has he actually defended having these documents in any coherent form.

[Edge-]

So they were looking for Hillary’s emails…

But ended up walking off with a bunch of stuff that trump stole that they incidentally found?

Like, in no way has he actually defended having these documents in any coherent form.

Trump's in full-on panic mode, hence the "If I think about it it's declassified" line. He's just throwing chum into the water for conservative media, "DID THE FBI REALLY RAID MARALAGO LOOKING FOR HILLARY'S EMAILS?? WHERE ARE HER EMAILS?!" and his cultish base.

He has nothing to fall back on, his back is against a wall, and he's flailing.

[Kaleredar]

Trump's in full-on panic mode, hence the "If I think about it it's declassified" line. He's just throwing chum into the water for conservative media, "DID THE FBI REALLY RAID MARALAGO LOOKING FOR HILLARY'S EMAILS?? WHERE ARE HER EMAILS?!" and his cultish base.

He has nothing to fall back on, his back is against a wall, and he's flailing.

Well, yeah. And luckily, none of this stuff means anything in a court of law.


Hey @tehdang what do you think of your boy trump’s claims that the FBI “thought he had Hillary’s emails and that’s why they raided him?”

Despite, you know, every single piece of documentation produced by the FBI, the courts, and the judges involved stating very clearly what they were after at all times?

Or does this fall under “legitimate concern from trump?”

[Endus]

Trump's in full-on panic mode, hence the "If I think about it it's declassified" line. He's just throwing chum into the water for conservative media, "DID THE FBI REALLY RAID MARALAGO LOOKING FOR HILLARY'S EMAILS?? WHERE ARE HER EMAILS?!" and his cultish base.

He has nothing to fall back on, his back is against a wall, and he's flailing.

Until he's under oath, literally nothing he says matters. He can and will tell whatever lie he thinks his supporters might swallow, and there's no consequences for doing so. Like, this isn't even him being a moron, like you said, it's him chumming the waters to inflame his supporters, hoping for his coup to come back.

[Edge-]

https://lawandcrime.com/trump/nation...elling-anyone/

National Security lawyers weigh in on Trump's, "If I think about declassifying something, it's declassified." claim.

To start off with, the charitable interpretation -

“It is true that a President can declassify information by just saying ‘It’s declassified’ — to someone,” McClanahan said. “But remove the listener, and you have an idle fantasy, not a declassification action.”

So he's granting Trump that if he did tell someone to declassify materials that, ostensibly, the declassification process would begin. But he'd have to tell someone, which he doesn't appear to have done.

How about if he think about declassifying materials?

Well...that actually opens a huge can of worms for him if we buy that argument -

“Plus, this isn’t really an argument he wants to push too far,” McClanahan continued. “Because if he wins, the next question must be, did President Biden ever think that those records should be classified while Trump still had them?”

Fair point! If a POTUS can classify or declassify with a thought, what's to stop the current POTUS from re-classifying documents that the former POTUS has in their possession?

Another take on the absurdity of the claims and how Trump's own habits may have worked against him -

Theoretically and constitutionally, the argument can be made that for most classified information the President can declassify information or specific documents by affirmatively and vocally saying so. As a practical matter, the process just does not work that way and would be completely outside of all known practical norms and experiences to such an extent that literally no one would know what to do or how to act in the wake of such an argument. This is especially valid with respect to President Trump because he had a well-known habit of saying he wanted certain things he wanted handled that were then ignored by staff or pushed back on and he relented because the request was illegal and/or illogical, practically or politically.

And if there are documents related to nuclear technology

I would also note that the President does not have authority to declassify information subject to the Atomic Energy Act as statutorily that power specifically lies with the Secretary of Energy or their designee. That policy, which dates back to the mid-1950s, was upheld by Trump’s Justice Department.

And finally on his claim that bringing the documents to Maralago meant they were "declassified" -

As for Trump’s argument that the simple act of moving documents to Mar-a-Lago declassifies them, that’s simply absurd. If we actually examined it at face value and took it seriously, I would assert that could only apply to boxes carried personally by Trump. And I doubt that happened. The movers who carried the boxes and the people who maintained them at Mar-a-Lago certainly had no authority. And as soon as President Trump was citizen Trump, neither did he. This argument is laughable.

Ending with this fun analogy -

Trump is the guy whose actions lead to companies adding to user instructions the warning not to use the microwave to dry your pet.

[Breccia]

How desperate is Trump?

Well, it could be worse. He could have gone on Tucker Carlson.

On the 19th, Carlson -- at that point, surely scraping and scrounging every local news source for something he could blow out of proportion -- delivered a speech about a woodshop teacher who had made up a fake pair of wooden tits. Highly unproffesional.

Carlson called this teacher Stephen Hanna and said he was a pervert, a threat to children, the guy in the van trying to give your sixth grader candy, the--

"Har har. What did he really say?"

Those are all exact quotes. Thing is...that wasn't Stephen Hanna. Yeah, Carlson named the wrong teacher.

In every society, there are people like this, and every society deals with them swiftly and harshly

-- Tucker Carlson

Evidently not, they let you walk around

-- Breccia

Other mixed articles have gone into specifics about how, specifically, Trump broke the law. The NY AG mentioned that Trump overinflated the values of 23 properties every year from 2011 to 2021, and yes, each one is a separate count. One of the specifics was saying Trump said Mar-a-Lago was worth $739 million but it's actually worth $75 million.

"Why should she care, it's in Florida?"

It is, yes. It is physically in Florida. Where is Trump Org headquartered?

"...oh, shit."

Yeah. Apparently, at one point, Trump donated the residential designation on his property, sharply restricting what could be built there and therefore lowering its value, to lower his tax bill. If he overvalued the property, he overvalued the donation, and he cheated on his taxes. That, and he lied to banks about how much they were worth, I'm sure.

Keeping two sets of books is frowned upon, regardless of which one is real. You can't lie to investors, lendors, or the tax collector and expect to get away with it. It's called fraud, and it's a felony. Remember how recently I said Trump never would but should take a plea bargain? Remember how Trump took the 5th 400+ times, even when asked his name? Trump has just been harpooned, but if he pulls it out, that's when the sharks smell the blood. If Trump fights this, he will have to put his own giant fat ass in that seat and actually answer questions, or -- and we're seeing proof of this from that recent appeals court situation -- his lack of presented evidence will be taken as lack of any evidence, he'll lose every motion and hundreds of millions of dollars he can't afford.

The penalties sought include a minimum of $250 million from Trump and his family and that none of them can run a business in New York. What I didn't know until today, is NY also wants to block Trump from buying any new properties for five years, and, getting any loan from a bank licensed in NY for five years. Because he's objectively that bad of a risk, that NY is now moving to protect banks from him.

Trump is old, fat, sick, fat, and fat. Five years is a life sentence. Considering his biggest actual product is his real estate (people are scrubbing Trump's names off Trump's properties) and most of what he owns is losing money and collateral, Trump not being able to buy new properties and get new loans that he could money launder into old loans is a death sentence.

[Edge-]

https://twitter.com/kenvogel/status/1572693098622222337



Apparently Josh Hawley thinks there's only one gender now.

I appreciate "Liberals" with the capitol L for a proper noun in there, too.

[beanman12345]

So they were looking for Hillary’s emails…

But ended up walking off with a bunch of stuff that trump stole that they incidentally found?

Like, in no way has he actually defended having these documents in any coherent form.

Lol. They released the search warrant with Trumps blessing. We know exactly what they were looking for, but the smooth brain cultists will believe whatever they are told, the more ridiculous the easier they believe. And it's going to as Trumps brain is disintegrating.

[Canpinter]

https://twitter.com/kenvogel/status/1572693098622222337



Apparently Josh Hawley thinks there's only one gender now.

I appreciate "Liberals" with the capitol L for a proper noun in there, too.

So is there only one gender option or like only one period and we have to take turns like a time share?

[Drutt]

Apparently Josh Hawley thinks there's only one gender now.

I am sure there is more than one gender, but I'm not sure Hawley has more than 1 brain cell.

[Edge-]

https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/22/polit...rds/index.html

What do some Republican Senators think about Trump's mishandling of classified documents?

They're very concerned.

Interestingly they're not backing him on this, and those that won't oppose his handling are at least refusing to directly answer the question because "I don't know the proper methodology" or something to that effect.

[Breccia]

I am sure there is more than one gender, but I'm not sure Hawley has more than 1 brain cell.

He sexually identifies as "Idiot".

By the way, the "special master" is now asking Trump for proof the FBI planted evidence.



Related, the "special master" is asking Team Trump for a specific, itemized list of lawyer-client privileged items by the 26th. As in, four days.

Why do I get the fat orange suspicion that both of these deadlines will be missed?

Hey @cubby I take back half the things I said. It does seem to matter what you say out of court! Because that's twice now he's asked for evidence of a claim they never made in court, or more precisely, Trump never made under oath so bringing them up in court had no legal effect.

[Edge-]

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...ed-states.html

For a moment of levity -

Trump Loses Mar-a-Lago Appeal on Grounds of Precedent Called Cobbledick v. United States

Cobbledick...lol.

- - - Updated - - -

https://lawandcrime.com/awkward/fede...-lindell-case/

So Dershowitz apparently filed for a temporary restraining order against the government to try to get back Lindell's phone on his behalf.

Judge said nah, and cited...the recent 11th Circuit ruling that the FBI can continue using classified documents in their investigation. If Lindell wants to show up with the DOJ so both can make their arguments the judge will consider the motion, but Lindel needs to set up a court date for that if he wants it.

Dershowitz wants a special master in this case as well, guess this is going to be a popular Republican delay tactic. Or Dershowitz is worried that he's got non-privileged communications with Lindell that might get out or something.

Either way, the Trump camp continues to rack up the indictments and FBI search warrants alongside their mountain of legal losses.

- - - Updated - - -

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/0...rvice-00058406

The House GOP campaign arm is slashing a near-$1 million ad buy meant to target Rep. Marcy Kaptur (D-Ohio) — essentially walking away from what could have been an easy pickup for the party.

The move comes a day after an Associated Press report that Kaptur’s opponent, JR Majewski, lied about his resume, including claiming that he deployed to Afghanistan. Majewski beat out two state legislators in a May primary contest for the northwest Ohio district.

The National Republican Congressional Committee booked $960,000 in the Toledo, Ohio market to help boost Majewski. It cut that buy entirely on Thursday, according to two sources familiar with the committee’s media purchasing.

Protip: Don't lie about your military service. There are indeed records of your service that can be used to verify if your claims of service are accurate or not.

The AP story noted that public records indicate that Majewski, an Air Force veteran, never deployed to Afghanistan and that he also mischaracterized his professional career. He had described himself as an “executive in the nuclear power industry” but his employers and a now-deleted LinkedIn resume did not support that claim, the AP reported.

So it's more likely the seat, even with the districting change, will remain in Democratic hands. MAGA candidates continue to be both a boon and a massive liability to Republican electoral efforts. Wonder why they keep getting caught in controversies and lies?

- - - Updated - - -





What's up with loser wannabe authoritarians having even less of an idea of what to do with their hands when standing up than even Bungie executives when they walk out on stage?

[gondrin]

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...ed-states.html

For a moment of levity -



Cobbledick...lol.

- - - Updated - - -

https://lawandcrime.com/awkward/fede...-lindell-case/

So Dershowitz apparently filed for a temporary restraining order against the government to try to get back Lindell's phone on his behalf.

Judge said nah, and cited...the recent 11th Circuit ruling that the FBI can continue using classified documents in their investigation. If Lindell wants to show up with the DOJ so both can make their arguments the judge will consider the motion, but Lindel needs to set up a court date for that if he wants it.

Dershowitz wants a special master in this case as well, guess this is going to be a popular Republican delay tactic. Or Dershowitz is worried that he's got non-privileged communications with Lindell that might get out or something.

Either way, the Trump camp continues to rack up the indictments and FBI search warrants alongside their mountain of legal losses.

- - - Updated - - -

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/0...rvice-00058406



Protip: Don't lie about your military service. There are indeed records of your service that can be used to verify if your claims of service are accurate or not.



So it's more likely the seat, even with the districting change, will remain in Democratic hands. MAGA candidates continue to be both a boon and a massive liability to Republican electoral efforts. Wonder why they keep getting caught in controversies and lies?

- - - Updated - - -





What's up with loser wannabe authoritarians having even less of an idea of what to do with their hands when standing up than even Bungie executives when they walk out on stage?

It is called the Mannequin pose. Or maybe that is what I call it. DeSantis looks like he cannot fit into his suit(like the kid from A Christmas Story) and Trump always stands like that.

[Rasulis]

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/0...rvice-00058406
Protip: Don't lie about your military service. There are indeed records of your service that can be used to verify if your claims of service are accurate or not.

GOP picked some truly horrifically bad candidates for this mid-term election.

AOC rival Tina Forte’s husband and son were caught by FBI in drug and gun bust at Bronx family warehouse

As a candidate, J.D. Vance is also pretty awful.