Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Kaleredar]

I love everything about this. Idiots getting scammed out of their money, dumbasses not understanding how fineness of gold works... And in all fairness, the store tells you these are 'commemarative' in nature and don't posess any monetary value. The store page goes out of their way clarifying that these only hold sentimental value.

A quick google search seemed to indicate that fake money still needs to say "not legal tender" or some such on it; prop money used for films and TV shows does.

I'm sure the company could argue "nobody would be dumb enough to think this is real money," and that they weren't trying to replicate any real denomination, but... well, here we are.

[Skulltaker]

A quick google search seemed to indicate that fake money still needs to say "not legal tender" or some such on it; prop money used for films and TV shows does.

I'm sure the company could argue "nobody would be dumb enough to think this is real money," and that they weren't trying to replicate any real denomination, but... well, here we are.

I get that that's the case for money that actually looks like real money, but this is basically what you'd find in Monopoly... maybe on the back?

[postman1782]

So, Deutsche Bank, Trump's main creditor, after Russia of course, the place where Justice Kennedy's son worked and who got Kavanaugh installed as a SC Justice, was raided by 100 agents and at least 10 homes of executives raided.

https://www.reuters.com/business/ger...be-2022-10-18/

Possible international investigation of Trump now?

[Breccia]

Possible international investigation of Trump now?

Unrelated incident.

That said, a bank currently under investigation and possibly in trouble for tax fraud would have every reason to stop granting extensions on large loans coming due any second.

[postman1782]

Unrelated incident.

That said, a bank currently under investigation and possibly in trouble for tax fraud would have every reason to stop granting extensions on large loans coming due any second.

No wonder he is grifting so much money from his dumbass followers.

[Paranoid Android]

So, Deutsche Bank, Trump's main creditor, after Russia of course, the place where Justice Kennedy's son worked and who got Kavanaugh installed as a SC Justice, was raided by 100 agents and at least 10 homes of executives raided.

https://www.reuters.com/business/ger...be-2022-10-18/

Possible international investigation of Trump now?

Unrelated incident.

That said, a bank currently under investigation and possibly in trouble for tax fraud would have every reason to stop granting extensions on large loans coming due any second.

Still one of the many stories that came up an might be dead(?). Deutsche Bank wildly giving loans to Trump back in the day seemed very shady. In fact when this came up and now with Breccia's link, Deutsche Bank seems to be one of the most criminal organizations in the world. No repercussions, possibly.

All these dumb in the head Q-Anon, crazy conspiracy theorists are thinking aliens fixed the election yet can't direct their attention to how the rich and its benefactors just keep skirting the laws. Maybe this is a reach here, asking this much of people.

[Poopymonster]

Still one of the many stories that came up an might be dead(?). Deutsche Bank wildly giving loans to Trump back in the day seemed very shady. In fact when this came up and now with Breccia's link, Deutsche Bank seems to be one of the most criminal organizations in the world. No repercussions, possibly.

All these dumb in the head Q-Anon, crazy conspiracy theorists are thinking aliens fixed the election yet can't direct their attention to how the rich and its benefactors just keep skirting the laws. Maybe this is a reach here, asking this much of people.

Because, someday, they'll be "Fuck You" rich. Why change the rules when they'll become "Fuck You" rich someday and those rules will work for you?
Someday...

[Gorsameth]

America does not have poor people.
Just temporarily embarrassed millionaires.

[Breccia]

Deutsche Bank seems to be one of the most criminal organizations in the world.

It would make sense that, after his first six bankruptcies, Trump would be stuck going to a loan shark.

Deutsche Bank has been caught multiple times doing multiple crimes, not the least of which is the spelling of their name come at me Germany. Per CNN and likely others:

The giant German lender was hit with about $630 million in penalties on Tuesday over a $10 billion Russian money-laundering scheme that involved its Moscow, New York and London branches.

It follows a $7.2 billion settlement Deutsche Bank reached with the U.S. Department of Justice last month over toxic mortgage assets and the $2.5 billion it agreed to pay in 2015 over interest rate manipulation.

The latest fines penalize Deutsche Bank (DB)'s failure to deal with a stock-trading scheme that enabled some of its clients in Russia to improperly move huge sums of money out of the country and into offshore accounts, according to regulators.

-- January 31, 2017

- - - Updated - - -

This CBS News article lays out, in a damning fashion indeed, the number of active Trump cases in NYC alone.

Five.

E. Jean Carroll defamation case and forthcoming sexual assault lawsuit

At the federal court on Pearl Street in lower Manhattan, a judge last week ordered Trump to sit Wednesday for his second high-stakes deposition in three months. He'll be questioned by a lawyer for author E. Jean Carroll, who sued Trump for defamation in 2019 after Trump accused Carroll of lying when she said he raped her in the mid-1990s.

Civil fraud lawsuit against Trump and his company

A block east of the federal courthouse is the Centre Street state civil court where for years attorneys for Trump and his company fought a losing battle to limit subpoenas in a sprawling New York attorney general probe into their financial practices. Trump's other recent deposition was ordered by Judge Arthur Engoron in this case.

Manhattan criminal fraud and tax evasion trial

By then, attorneys for the company will be busy one block north on Centre Street, at a state criminal court, where on Monday the Trump Organization's criminal fraud and tax evasion trial will begin.

"I thought that one was dropped?"

It is true, that the investigation became less talked about when it seemed charges against Trump specifically were unlikely and two DAs even quit in protest. But the case is going forward, Trump's attempt to stall failed, and the trial starts Oct 24th. Weaselberg is required to testify as part of his plea deal to fifteen felonies. I'm having a hard time finding what specific criminal penalties could be imposed on a building, but I'm guessing multiple decades of tax evasion and payroll fraud add up to "a lot".

"Okay but that's still three, what are the other two?"

Special master in Mar-a-Lago documents probe

Five blocks south of the state criminal court building is the Brooklyn Bridge, which on the outer-borough side runs past another federal courthouse. The building's atrium is named for Raymond Dearie, the semi-retired judge who is serving as special master in Trump's lawsuit against the federal government.

Trial of Trump confidant Thomas Barrack

On the eighth floor of that Brooklyn court building, another federal judge is presiding over the ongoing criminal trial of billionaire businessman Thomas Barrack, a longtime Trump friend and adviser who served as chair of the 2016 Inauguration committee.

Barrack is accused of acting as an unregistered foreign agent in an effort to sway U.S. foreign policy in favor of the United Arab Emirates' interests. He has entered a not guilty plea in the case.

When Barrack inevitably pleads out, it will inevitably lead to a federal investigation into Trump's campaign. If Trump hired a foreign agent and knew he hired a foreign agent and knowingly took foreign money into his American campaign, which is illegal, then he could be charged the same way Cohen was.

[Edge-]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/marjor...erate-soldiers

Neoconfederate racist Marjorie Taylor Green visits Wilder Brigade Monument in Georgia to celebrate confederate soldiers and our nations history! Because of course she'll celebrate monuments erected to celebrate those who went to war to fight for their right to own people!

Except it's not. It's actually a monument to Union troops. The Wilder Brigade was a Union unit, they were patriotic Americans who killed rebellious traitors.

[Breccia]

Neoconfederate racist Marjorie Taylor Green visits Wilder Brigade Monument in Georgia

Uh...did she delete that Tweet?

[Edge-]

Uh...did she delete that Tweet?

It's a "Truth", not a Tweet.

[some guy]

It's a "Truth", not a Tweet.

So what do you call a false "Truth"?

[Breccia]

It's a "Truth", not a Tweet.

Wow. I believe the term I use is "so much irony, it's magnetic".

[Endus]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/marjor...erate-soldiers

Neoconfederate racist Marjorie Taylor Green visits Wilder Brigade Monument in Georgia to celebrate confederate soldiers and our nations history! Because of course she'll celebrate monuments erected to celebrate those who went to war to fight for their right to own people!

Except it's not. It's actually a monument to Union troops. The Wilder Brigade was a Union unit, they were patriotic Americans who killed rebellious traitors.

I'm increasingly unsure whether MTG is actually this fuckin' stupid (Lauren Boebert, by comparison, definitely is dumber than a sack of wet cardboard). While she consistently has these awful takes, they're always in service of the same underlying motives. This could be seen not as MTG being wrong about who the monument was to, but her trying to erase that dedication and replace it with her new narrative, at least among her followers. That said narrative is pro-enslavement white supremacist fascism just makes it a serious threat.

She's not stupid. She's evil. Goebbels-level evil, in her heart. She just hasn't had the capacity to fully put her horrors into effect. Yet.

[jonnysensible]

I'm increasingly unsure whether MTG is actually this fuckin' stupid (Lauren Boebert, by comparison, definitely is dumber than a sack of wet cardboard). While she consistently has these awful takes, they're always in service of the same underlying motives. This could be seen not as MTG being wrong about who the monument was to, but her trying to erase that dedication and replace it with her new narrative, at least among her followers. That said narrative is pro-enslavement white supremacist fascism just makes it a serious threat.

She's not stupid. She's evil. Goebbels-level evil, in her heart. She just hasn't had the capacity to fully put her horrors into effect. Yet.

she is fucking stupid as hell. One of the problems people always have is the think everyone is as educated or half as smart as their peers. This is worse when you don't get exposed to mouthbreathers on a regular basis. She is stupid even for an American and thats saying something.

But despite her stupidity she at least worked out being a Qanon election denier is the future of the Gop.

[Endus]

she is fucking stupid as hell. One of the problems people always have is the think everyone is as educated or half as smart as their peers. This is worse when you don't get exposed to mouthbreathers on a regular basis. She is stupid even for an American and thats saying something.

But despite her stupidity she at least worked out being a Qanon election denier is the future of the Gop.

I'm not arguing she's a brilliant strategist. I just think a whole lot of what people people ascribe to "stupidity" are driven more by evil intent than simple stupidity. That she's not too dumb to know the monument's to Union soldiers, she's just evil enough to lie about it and push pro-Confederacy white supremacism in mockery of what that monument represents.

The maxim "never ascribe to malice what is adequately explained by stupidity" has done more to provide a cover for actual malice than any good it's managed to produce.

[jonnysensible]

I'm not arguing she's a brilliant strategist. I just think a whole lot of what people people ascribe to "stupidity" are driven more by evil intent than simple stupidity. That she's not too dumb to know the monument's to Union soldiers, she's just evil enough to lie about it and push pro-Confederacy white supremacism in mockery of what that monument represents.

The maxim "never ascribe to malice what is adequately explained by stupidity" has done more to provide a cover for actual malice than any good it's managed to produce.

im not saying she isnt an evil rat. But she is thick. And she is dumb enough to think the monument is pro confed. You could ask her 10 questions about basic history or science or whatever and she wouldn't give you an answer to any of them. No danger of her splitting the atom anytime soon.

[Breccia]

"Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?"
"Well, I'm the CEO of FOX News, so no."

Suzanne Scott, the chief executive of Fox News Media, expected to be deposed by Dominion.

"Didn't the suit against FOX News get kicked?"

Nope. As this Sept article on NPR says, not only is the lawsuit ongoing, but it has solid stuff to work with.

The November 2020 email from an anguished Fox News news producer to colleagues sent up a flare amid a fusillade of false claims.

The producer warned: Fox cannot let host Jeanine Pirro back on the air. She is pulling conspiracy theories from dark corners of the Web to justify then-President Donald Trump's lies that the election had been stolen from him. The existence of the email, confirmed by two people with direct knowledge of it, is first publicly disclosed by NPR in this story. Fox News declined comment.

Pirro was far from alone in broadcasting such false claims. In the weeks that followed Election Day 2020, other prominent Fox stars, commentators and their guests heavily promoted them.

A repeat target was Dominion Voting Systems, the election machine and technology company. Trump and his allies alleged on Fox that Dominion was engaged in a conscious effort to throw the 2020 race to Joe Biden. They implied and falsely asserted on Fox programs that Dominion's machines and software either discarded Trump's votes or transferred them to Biden. Dominion argues their false claims were frequently egged on by Fox's own stars.

The fact that we have this email is pretty damning for FOX News, as it shows intent to intentionally make statements of fact that they knew were false. And, as the NYTimes article I linked says, this made it all the way to the CEO.

According to several people closely involved in the case, lawyers for Dominion are expected to depose her soon. A judge has granted Dominion access to her emails and text messages from the period after the 2020 election when Fox anchors and guests amplified some of the most outrageous falsehoods about Dominion and its supposed role in a plot to steal the election.

So far, those messages contained at least one instance in which Ms. Scott expressed skepticism about the dubious claims of voter fraud that her network had been promoting, a recent court proceeding revealed. That kind of evidence is what Dominion hopes will ultimately convince a jury that Fox broadcast information it knew to be false, which would leave the company on the hook for significant damages.

What are the steps of defamation? They are:
1) an objectively false statement must be presented as fact
2) it has to be publicly said or written
3) it must be knowingly false, or just as good, said with reckless disregard for the truth (i.e. a reasonable person would not have said it)
4) the statement must have intentionally caused harm

Man, a few years ago the fact that I have that memorized would have surprised me.

So, 2 and 4 are slam dunks. 1 is a matter of opinion. Just kidding: no breach of Dominion occurred, and FOX News does not have any evidence of a breach, because there wasn't one. It's not a matter of opinion, it didn't happen, and FOX News can't prove it did. That leaves 3, to which these emails speak directly to the jury.

When this CEO -- and the NYTimes goes into detail how much this CEO is a member of the rabid fanbase:

Before the committee investigating the Jan. 6 insurrection held its first prime-time hearing in June, Suzanne Scott, the chief executive of Fox News Media, called Lachlan Murdoch, her boss, to tell him how her network planned to broadcast the event.

They wouldn’t, she said. The channel would stick with its usual prime-time lineup of Tucker Carlson, Sean Hannity and Laura Ingraham. Mr. Murdoch, the executive chairman of Fox Corporation, was fine with Ms. Scott’s decision, according to an executive with knowledge of their conversation.

The decision was true to form, according to interviews with more than a dozen current and former colleagues. Since Ms. Scott took over the top job at Fox News in 2018, her colleagues said, she has managed from behind the scenes with a simple mantra: Respect Fox’s audience. Often, that involves sparing conservative viewers what they don’t want to hear — even when that means ignoring one of the biggest stories of the year.

She took the job in 2018 and made it a "safe space" for Trump cultists. And even she doubted what her own people were saying on her own network.

"Okay but one email--"

People who have heard Ms. Scott speak in meetings say she has been critical of Mr. Trump’s election denial claims, though she mostly keeps her personal politics private. (She is registered as unaffiliated.) One colleague recalled that in a meeting shortly after the 2020 election, Ms. Scott seemed in disbelief as she described how people she considered otherwise serious and rational thought there was any chance Mr. Trump could legitimately stop President Biden’s inauguration.

"Okay, one email and some spoken concerns--"

And according to a message that Ms. Scott sent around the same time, which Dominion lawyers recently cited in court, she warned against “giving the crazies an inch,” referring to pro-Trump conspiracy theorists. NPR first reported on that message, but a transcript of the hearing in which it was disclosed has since been sealed by a judge at Fox’s request. Fox has suffered several setbacks in court lately as it has tried to narrow the scope of the case and limit what internal communications it is required to hand over to Dominion.

Remember, this doesn't have to be a wild conspiracy by lizard Pizzagate. This just needs to be an objectively false statement passed on as truth, when they knew the either knew or should have known (they at least pretend to be a news organization) there was no evidence and a decent chance the statement was wrong.

"I thought FOX News got this kicked with a mix of 'nobody in their right mind would believe Hannity' and 'we just reported what Trump said, and Trump said it was rigged'."

Dominion is fighting both those claims and is expected to win. For one, the second claim's just false. There's plenty of videos of FOX News people saying "Dominion was XXX" without saying "Trump said that..." first. Even the Hannity thing might come up again. Think about it: what if, for example, Joe Biden started every day with a press conference with a literal court jester saying things like "Trump has no penis ahahahahaha" or "Trump has an affair with Rep. Stefanik, my husband has the proof, ahahahahha". Then Biden said "Well, White House Press Corps, nobody would take that court jester seriously". Seems a little transparent, wouldn't you say? SNL is a comedy sketch show, the WH is not.

And last I checked, FOX News doesn't have a disclaimer that they're satire, parody, or the like.

The rest of the NYTimes article goes into her history, especially under Ailes.

"Let me guess, she was one of the women rebelling against his brutally sexist role that got him fired?"

Um...no. She was his enforcer, bringing in more attractive women and having them hike their skirts up. No, really, that happened.

In any event, Dominion may not have a case as airtight as walking out of Mar-a-Lago with SCI folders defaced by Sharpee, but at this point, they could probably show a very strong case just by showing clips of the hosts Scott allowed to air, saying things she personally suspected were not just false, but insane.

Dominion is asking for $1.6 billion and Alex Jones should be saying "don't rule that out just because it's a large number". FOX News probably want to settle in an agreement that does not admit fault, and I don't think Dominion is interested in that. I think they want an on-air apology from the offenders, and I think Hannity would rather resign than give it.

[ringpriest]

I'm not arguing she's a brilliant strategist. I just think a whole lot of what people people ascribe to "stupidity" are driven more by evil intent than simple stupidity. That she's not too dumb to know the monument's to Union soldiers, she's just evil enough to lie about it and push pro-Confederacy white supremacism in mockery of what that monument represents.

The maxim "never ascribe to malice what is adequately explained by stupidity" has done more to provide a cover for actual malice than any good it's managed to produce.

Don't discount the PT Barnum showmanship angle of stunts like this either. They get her on the news. Sure, they get her on the news for being a vile ignoramus, but she's still on the news. And what decent Americans see as vile, her supporters see as good. The takeaway for the average maggot from this is that MTG is on the news saying proConfederacy stuff. Which they like.