1. #82801
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    As part of the opinion, the Supreme Court decided that assertions of executive privilege survive leaving the office.
    So you admit that everything you've said is useless, since the issue isn't Trump declaring privilege before leaving office. It's after. As a reminder, Trump has yet to prove he either declassified or made privileged anything the FBI took, before he left office. He's said so on that knockoff Twitter you probably follow, but until he says it under oath, NARA saying they have no records of either claim easily beats the man who did nothing but lie for four years and got every lawyer he worked with fired or arrested.

    Everyone called it, and you spent the last week arguing something that proved your own point wrong. I wonder why you bothered shooting so many own goals, but maybe it's because the rest of your team didn't show up and you just needed something on the board to prove you tried.

    And it still doesn't change the fact that, classified or not, privileged or not, Trump took government property he wasn't allowed to have.

    And the reason @cubby knows you were being incoherent was because he read your posts. Repeating the same incoherent argument over and over doesn't make it coherent. Repeating the same wrong argument doesn't make it suddenly right, either.

  2. #82802
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    As part of the opinion, the Supreme Court decided that assertions of executive privilege survive leaving the office. That's what's at play here. (You're acting like I quoted dissenting opinions in the case, instead of the majority opinion, that in part concerns the presidency instead of Nixon)

    The previous ruling on Trump was on documents sought by Congress in the lawful exercise of their special committee. No such committee exists at this time.

    I think I've gone over that point enough in my prior posts, and repeated myself quite a bit already on the subject. If that together with the judicial opinion and cited primary source documents they rely on are not enough for you, then I just can't help you. I depart only slightly from the district judge's legal reasoning in my posts up to this point, and you've refused to even offer anything substantial on that. I really am coming to the opinion that you have no interest in learning, or even summarizing to show understanding, her rationale or my deviations.
    Wrong, 100% wrong. Trump doesn't have executive privilege. Only the current president does.

  3. #82803
    The Unstoppable Force Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    As part of the opinion, the Supreme Court decided that assertions of executive privilege survive leaving the office. That's what's at play here. (You're acting like I quoted dissenting opinions in the case, instead of the majority opinion, that in part concerns the presidency instead of Nixon)

    The previous ruling on Trump was on documents sought by Congress in the lawful exercise of their special committee. No such committee exists at this time.

    I think I've gone over that point enough in my prior posts, and repeated myself quite a bit already on the subject. If that together with the judicial opinion and cited primary source documents they rely on are not enough for you, then I just can't help you. I depart only slightly from the district judge's legal reasoning in my posts up to this point, and you've refused to even offer anything substantial on that. I really am coming to the opinion that you have no interest in learning, or even summarizing to show understanding, her rationale or my deviations.
    ...So when did Trump exert executive privilege on these documents when he was president such that it could then "extend" to him retaining said privilege after having left office?

    "He kept them when he was president, therefore that qualifies as him exerting executive privilege" is not an answer. Even though I think that's the limit of your reasoning, here.

    He can't "re-exert" privilege over documents he was caught having illegally handled, illegally retained, and illegally stored. Because only the president can exert executive privilege on anything, and Trump isn't the president.
    “Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  4. #82804
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    ...So when did Trump exert executive privilege on these documents when he was president such that it could then "extend" to him retaining said privilege after having left office?

    "He kept them when he was president, therefore that qualifies as him exerting executive privilege" is not an answer. Even though I think that's the limit of your reasoning, here.

    He can't "re-exert" privilege over documents he was caught having illegally handled, illegally retained, and illegally stored. Because only the president can exert executive privilege on anything, and Trump isn't the president.
    Funny thing is, no president, including the current one, can exert Executive Privilege over Top Secret, SCI or other classified documents. Those are outright property of the US government. That is what tehdang keeps missing here. If it were love notes from Kim Jong Un, Putin, Santa Clause or any person, this wouldn't even be a thing, even though they would still be property of the US government. The only thing the government wants back is its classified documents.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Um...you sure? I thought it meant he couldn't refile. Appealing a court case does not create a new court case.

    Speaking of which, let's talk about Trump's lawyer Bobb.

    She's fucked. And she knows it.

    Bobb has now retained her own lawyer. As we've discused, once a lawyer becomes the subject of a criminal investigation herself, one in which her former client is involved, ethically she must withdraw. It's a conflict of interest to represent someone you might testify against. As such, it wouldn't surprise me at all to hear that Bobb is withdrawing from Trump's case.

    Man, Trump goes through lawyers really quickly. Giuliani, Cobb, Cohen, Bobb, and these are just the ones whose name is in the news this week alone.
    Well, might as well call the lawyer that will take any case. Springfields own Lionel Hutz. However, Trump better have money as he requires a retainer.

  5. #82805
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    Quote Originally Posted by gondrin View Post
    Well, might as well call the lawyer that will take any case. Springfields own Lionel Hutz. However, Trump better have money as he requires a retainer.
    I read an OP ED that said, basically, that while Trump will always be able to get lawyers, we're seeing he can no longer get good lawyers. No criminal lawyer in her right mind would say "my client tells me he's turned everything over, so I will sign this federal court filing instead of him" I don't remember who it was, but they insisted that was a "you get disbarred for that"-level mistake.

    But at least she gets to keep the birdcage she found in his trash.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    He can't "re-exert" privilege over documents he was caught having illegally handled, illegally retained, and illegally stored.
    Yeah, that's a point that should be brought up more. If they were under the ownership of a private citizen and not the government, that implies they are not the property of the Executive Branch and, therefore, not privileged. Trump could be admitting to a felony here.

  6. #82806
    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    I read an OP ED that said, basically, that while Trump will always be able to get lawyers, we're seeing he can no longer get good lawyers. No criminal lawyer in her right mind would say "my client tells me he's turned everything over, so I will sign this federal court filing instead of him" I don't remember who it was, but they insisted that was a "you get disbarred for that"-level mistake.
    With more than 40 Trump lawyers singled out for ethics complaints and even more facing charges, legal experts joke MAGA now stands for MAGA now stands for 'Making Attorneys Get Attorneys'

    For lawyers working with former President Donald Trump, legal risk is considered an expected part of the job: More than 40 attorneys who worked to overturn the 2020 election on his behalf have been hit with ethics complaints.

    The New York Times reported legal experts joke MAGA now stands for "Making Attorneys Get Attorneys," based on the reputational risk of working with Trump.

    "There's no way to adhere to your ethical integrity and keep your job," Kimberly Wehle, a University of Baltimore law professor who closely tracked investigations into the Jan. 6, 2021 attack on the Capitol, told The New York Times of the dilemma Mr. Trump's lawyers face: "There's just no way to not step into a mess."

    The 65 Project, a bipartisan effort to hold Trump-allied lawyers accountable for filing 65 lawsuits across swing states in an attempt to overturn legitimate 2020 election results, has filed more than 40 ethics complaints with their respective state bar associations against lawyers who participated in the scheme.

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  8. #82808
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resurgo View Post
    As damning as this looks, "boxes" are pretty common.

    But, I'm sure the FBI (etc) would listen to any credible source that says Trump has stolen property in other locations. Cohen has been vocal about it, but can't personally verify it -- Trump fired him for doing what he asked.

  9. #82809

  10. #82810
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    WaPo reports that Team Trump has found another way to attack the election: tie the election workers up in so much red tape they can't do their job.

    Supporters of former president Donald Trump have swamped local election offices across the nation in recent weeks with a coordinated campaign of requests for 2020 voting records, in some cases paralyzing preparations for the fall election season.

    In nearly two dozen states and scores of counties, election officials are fielding what many describe as an unprecedented wave of public records requests in the final weeks of summer, one they say may be intended to hinder their work and weaken an already strained system. The avalanche of sometimes identically worded requests has forced some to dedicate days to the process of responding even as they scurry to finalize polling locations, mail out absentee ballots and prepare for early voting in October, officials said.

    In Wisconsin, one recent request asks for 34 different types of documents. In North Carolina, hundreds of requests came in at state and local offices on one day alone. In Kentucky, officials don’t recognize the technical-sounding documents they’re being asked to produce — and when they seek clarification, the requesters say they don’t know, either.

    The latest flood of requests began immediately after Lindell
    Yes, that Lindell.

    a prominent Trump ally, exhorted his followers at a mid-August gathering in Springfield, Mo., to obtain copies of what’s known as “cast vote records” from every election office in the country. Lindell live-streamed his “Moment of Truth” summit on his own social media platforms and got a boost of viewership from former Trump adviser Stephen K. Bannon, who broadcast his podcast from the event on both days.
    Honestly, that should be the end of it, right there. It should be clear these are disingenuous requests and treated as such. Don't like it? Take them to court. It'll take a couple months and the election will be over.

    "Surely these officials are required by the law and their job to respond."

    Yeah I'm going to stop you right there, and ask "If you called 911 on your neighbor, but told them you didn't know why you were calling or what crime you thought was happening. Then, go to city hall to request a zoning license, but that you don't know where or what kind of zone it is. Guess what happens? I'm going to counter-suggest that these same officials have some wiggleroom when dealing with unruly people intentionally wasting their time and the time of everyone else that has a legit request. Especially in the case of copy-pasted requests where it's clear that someone else is sending out marching orders, probably someone who doesn't live there, and who definitely doesn't need multiple repeated answers.

    The law might require them to answer, but I bet there's wiggle room in that, too. "We'll get that to you as soon as we can" could be a 100% honest response that still results in the request pushed back until after 2022 issues are completed.

    Federal law requires voting records be stored for 22 months. Lindell claims he's trying to preserve them. Of course, his blood is 10% cocaine, so it's safe to assume he's lying. Or, that he wants a large pile of papers to point to and say "this proves fraud" when it will do nothing of the kind.

  11. #82811
    So, something big is going on in Washington DC with Trump today, he was pulled off his golf course in New Jersey, still in his golf shoes and shit that he wears while golfing, put on a plane, not his plane of course since it is still not repaired, met on the tarmac by a sheriff's car, and put into a government vehicle, not a secret service vehicle.

    The problem is, he had NOTHING scheduled for DC today, especially something that would require him to be pulled off his golf course without changing.

    Right now everything is hush hush, nothing reported on media, it was broken on Twitter, and there is video of him leaving the plane still in golf shoes and golf attire.

  12. #82812
    Quote Originally Posted by postman1782 View Post
    So, something big is going on in Washington DC with Trump today, he was pulled off his golf course in New Jersey, still in his golf shoes and shit that he wears while golfing, put on a plane, not his plane of course since it is still not repaired, met on the tarmac by a sheriff's car, and put into a government vehicle, not a secret service vehicle.

    The problem is, he had NOTHING scheduled for DC today, especially something that would require him to be pulled off his golf course without changing.

    Right now everything is hush hush, nothing reported on media, it was broken on Twitter, and there is video of him leaving the plane still in golf shoes and golf attire.
    Sauce on any of this?

    https://twitter.com/PenguinSix/statu...93793223262208

    Best I'm finding is a blurry photo with people making up a story to go along with it. And theorizing he was handcuffed, but he actually wasn't.

    Waiting on something more than Twitter rumors on this one.

  13. #82813
    Quote Originally Posted by postman1782 View Post
    So, something big is going on in Washington DC with Trump today, he was pulled off his golf course in New Jersey, still in his golf shoes and shit that he wears while golfing, put on a plane, not his plane of course since it is still not repaired, met on the tarmac by a sheriff's car, and put into a government vehicle, not a secret service vehicle.

    The problem is, he had NOTHING scheduled for DC today, especially something that would require him to be pulled off his golf course without changing.

    Right now everything is hush hush, nothing reported on media, it was broken on Twitter, and there is video of him leaving the plane still in golf shoes and golf attire.
    Might have something to do with the video that resurfaced of him taking all those boxes to Bedminster right after they asked him for documents.

    Especially if they had already went there and found stuff, honestly wondering what was in his ex-wife's coffin that required all those people to carry it since, I heard she was cremated.
    Since we can't call out Trolls and Bad Faith posters and the Ignore function doesn't actually ignore it. Add
    "mmo-champion.com##li.postbitignored"
    to your ublock or adblock filter to actually ignore ignored posters. Now just need a way to ignore responses to them as well.

  14. #82814
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    Quote Originally Posted by postman1782 View Post
    So, something big is going on in Washington DC with Trump today, he was pulled off his golf course in New Jersey, still in his golf shoes and shit that he wears while golfing, put on a plane, not his plane of course since it is still not repaired, met on the tarmac by a sheriff's car, and put into a government vehicle, not a secret service vehicle.

    The problem is, he had NOTHING scheduled for DC today, especially something that would require him to be pulled off his golf course without changing.

    Right now everything is hush hush, nothing reported on media, it was broken on Twitter, and there is video of him leaving the plane still in golf shoes and golf attire.
    Do you have any source for this other than a Reddit thread I can't open?

    - - - Updated - - -

    The headline on Raw Story is Speculation Swirls. We might hear more later, or, he could have actually been meeting the Party of Trump and/or people who want the Party of Trump voters. He has been attacking his own party right and alt-right lately.

  15. #82815
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Sauce on any of this?

    https://twitter.com/PenguinSix/statu...93793223262208

    Best I'm finding is a blurry photo with people making up a story to go along with it. And theorizing he was handcuffed, but he actually wasn't.

    Waiting on something more than Twitter rumors on this one.
    I didn't say anything about cuffs, but they have video of him.

    https://twitter.com/_MajorNews/statu...49426702090242

    That is him landing at Dulles, still in golf attire.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Do you have any source for this other than a Reddit thread I can't open?

    - - - Updated - - -

    The headline on Raw Story is Speculation Swirls. We might hear more later, or, he could have actually been meeting the Party of Trump and/or people who want the Party of Trump voters. He has been attacking his own party right and alt-right lately.
    Just Twitter so far. Left wingers that follow him to report on the bullshit he does, said he had nothing scheduled in DC today.

  16. #82816
    Quote Originally Posted by postman1782 View Post
    I didn't say anything about cuffs, but they have video of him.

    https://twitter.com/_MajorNews/statu...49426702090242

    That is him landing at Dulles, still in golf attire.
    Oh nice, video.

    Cool, so now we wait to see if anything leaks, or until any announcements are made. But I see Twitter is doing their usual thing and just making up all kinds of stories, lol.

  17. #82817
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by postman1782 View Post
    he had nothing scheduled in DC today.
    Fair enough, but I'll follow @Edge- 's lead on this one. If it turns out to be anything, I won't feel bad about waiting overnight. If it doesn't, I'll feel even less bad.

    I will say, I did predict earlier that the most likely result was Biden dragging Trump into his office to say "you shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down, fatty, or I'll take the brake pads off the FBI Train and let NARA tie you to the tracks. Go ahead, Merrick My Day." Not a pardon, just a technically legal threat that Trump buys his freedom with his silence. I stand by that -- as much as I want to see the taxpayer bill for extra-small handcuffs, I don't have enough faith in the justice system to say that's the most likely outcome. But, I wouldn't expect something this blatant -- assuming the video/photos aren't faked of course -- to be that. The bargain for Trump's silence doesn't work if everyone knows Biden ordered it personally.

  18. #82818
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Oh nice, video.

    Cool, so now we wait to see if anything leaks, or until any announcements are made. But I see Twitter is doing their usual thing and just making up all kinds of stories, lol.
    So far, speculation from Twitter, is that 3 indictments were unsealed, but I haven't found any actual info on it. But again, there is still no reason for him being in DC, as he had nothing on his schedule that wouldn't require him to change from golf shit.

  19. #82819
    The Unstoppable Force Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Fair enough, but I'll follow @Edge- 's lead on this one. If it turns out to be anything, I won't feel bad about waiting overnight. If it doesn't, I'll feel even less bad.

    I will say, I did predict earlier that the most likely result was Biden dragging Trump into his office to say "you shut the fuck up and sit the fuck down, fatty, or I'll take the brake pads off the FBI Train and let NARA tie you to the tracks. Go ahead, Merrick My Day." Not a pardon, just a technically legal threat that Trump buys his freedom with his silence. I stand by that -- as much as I want to see the taxpayer bill for extra-small handcuffs, I don't have enough faith in the justice system to say that's the most likely outcome. But, I wouldn't expect something this blatant -- assuming the video/photos aren't faked of course -- to be that. The bargain for Trump's silence doesn't work if everyone knows Biden ordered it personally.
    Biden saying anything resembling "look Trump, lemme make a deal with you, I call off the FBI and you don't run for president" would be monumentally disastrous if word leaked that it had happened. It would basically legitimize every conspiracy about the FBI raid by means of "Biden is trying to persecute trump, it's all an FBI partisan ruse, Biden is weaponizing the FBI" and would turn the whole situation right back on Biden. Suddenly every headline is no longer "trump coming under scrutiny for X" or "new details about what Trump was hiding and how," every news article is now "Biden tried to make deal over 2024 election to call off FBI inquiry."

    Plus, Trump reneges on deals all the time. Who's to say that he "accepts" Biden's deal and then come 2024 just runs anyway?
    “Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  20. #82820
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    Quote Originally Posted by postman1782 View Post
    he had nothing on his schedule that wouldn't require him to change from golf shit.
    To misquote Conway, it wasn't very good golf weather anyhow. It was arraigning all day. I'll see myself out.

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