Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Breccia]

At what point do the courts just like...stop tolerating all this obviously bad faith waste of time?

They did it last year. Kari Lake, or more realistically her lawyers, have learned from that and are now only pushing forwards with cases where they have a valid claim and a shred of evidence, and more importantly, not just making shit up.

It is better to let 100 guilty men go free than send 1 innocent men to jail etc. etc. and in the famous fable, the boy did eventually cry wolf for an actual wolf. Lake won't get in trouble just for bringing the lawsuits, only for bringing lawsuits even she knows are false. Until then, @Zaydin is likely correct, and courts are now "biased" against her in the same way you'd be "biased" against Sylvanas for murdering the world tree and thousands of elves.

[Edge-]

https://www.texastribune.org/2023/10...it-settlement/

Remember that time a bunch of MAGAts in Texas threatened and tried to drive a Biden bus and the cars in the caravan with it off the road?

an Marcos police officers and professional staff must receive training on responding to political violence and voter intimidation and ways to develop community trust as part of a legal settlement approved Tuesday over a 2020 incident in which a caravan of Trump supporters were accused of harassing a Biden campaign bus as it drove on Interstate 35.

The city will also pay $175,000 to four individuals on the bus: former state Sen. Wendy Davis, who was running for Congress at the time; former Biden campaign staffer David Gins; campaign volunteer Eric Cervini; and bus driver Timothy Holloway. They accused San Marcos law enforcement in a 2021 lawsuit of ignoring multiple requests for a police escort as they traveled on I-35 from San Antonio to Austin days before the 2020 presidential election. They said they were surrounded by the Trump supporters who allegedly drove dangerously close to the bus while honking and shouting, forcing it to slow to a crawl.

It's incredible how expensive it is for police to choose not to do their jobs. Also how long it takes to get justice for political threats, intimidation, and attacks.

- - - Updated - - -

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/18/u...-election.html

On Dec. 24, 2020, Kenneth Chesebro and other lawyers fighting to reverse President Donald J. Trump’s election defeat were debating whether to file litigation contesting Joseph R. Biden Jr.’s victory in Wisconsin, a key swing state.

Mr. Chesebro argued there was little doubt that the litigation would fail in court — he put the odds of winning at “1 percent” — as Mr. Trump continued to push his baseless claims of widespread fraud, according to emails reviewed by The New York Times.

But the “relevant analysis,” Mr. Chesebro argued, “is political.”

The emails have new significance because Mr. Chesebro is scheduled to be one of the first two of Mr. Trump’s 18 co-defendants to go on trial this month on charges brought by the district attorney’s office in Fulton County, Ga. The indictment accused Mr. Chesebro of conspiring to create slates of so-called fake electors pledged to Mr. Trump in several states that Mr. Biden had won.

Mr. Chesebro’s lawyers have argued that his work was shielded by the First Amendment and that he “acted within his capacity as a lawyer.” They have called for his case to be dismissed, saying he was merely “researching and finding precedents in order to form a legal opinion, which was then supplied to his client, the Trump campaign.”

Scott R. Grubman, a lawyer for Mr. Chesebro, said lawyers often argue for positions that are not widely held. “For example, any lawyer who has ever filed a pleading challenging existing Supreme Court precedent falls within this category,” he said. “Maybe a long shot, but far from criminal. In fact, it’s how the law changes over time.”

Mr. Trump has also signaled that one of his possible defenses is that he was simply acting on the advice of his lawyers.

But Mr. Chesebro’s emails could undercut any effort to show that the lawyers were focused solely on legal strategies. Rather than considering just the law and the facts of the case, Mr. Chesebro made clear he was considering politics and was well aware of how the Trump campaign’s legal filings could be used as ammunition for Republicans’ efforts to overturn the results when Congress met to certify the Electoral College outcome on Jan. 6, 2021.

When the foundation of your legal defense is, "I was acting in an official government capacity, you can't charge me for that!", it's incredibly inconvenient to discover that the prosecution has your old emails where you admit your active participation was explicitly political in nature, not governmental.

Also incredibly bad for your legal defense if the foundation is, "I was just listening to my lawyers legal advice!" when the prosecution has emails where your lawyers were discussing explicitly political matters, not legal.

[Breccia]

Also incredibly bad for your legal defense if the foundation is, "I was just listening to my lawyers legal advice!" when the prosecution has emails where your lawyers were discussing explicitly political matters, not legal.

Simply put, Trump is trying to hide behind two different walls ten feet apart. If he claims he was following his lawyers, none of them were WH employees, therefore, it was not WH business. If it was WH business, then he should not be paying (?) non-WH lawyers to set policy.

Honestly, at this point, the fact that he is using two mutually contradictory defenses should be used against him in court.

"Your Honor, I thought the gun wasn't loaded."
"But you claimed here self-defense."
"Yes, I shot him because he was threatening me."
"With a gun you thought wasn't loaded. Someone was threatening you, you basically picked up a doorstop and hoped it would work?"

[Edge-]

https://apnews.com/article/donald-tr...7990cc4f40ce9b

woman was arrested Wednesday after she stood up at former President Donald Trump’s New York civil fraud trial and walked toward the front of the courtroom where he was sitting.

The woman, later identified as a court employee, retreated after a court officer told her to return to her seat. A short time later, officers escorted the woman out of the Manhattan courtroom and arrested her. She was charged with contempt of court for disrupting a court proceeding, state court spokesperson Lucian Chalfen said.

Chalfen said the woman had been yelling out to Trump that she wanted to help, though reporters in the courtroom did not hear her raise her voice. She was later heard screaming in the courthouse lobby as officers removed her from the building.

Huh, I guess it wouldn't be a Donald trial if it didn't include a court employee (in a different courthouse) and fan of his interrupting court proceedings to offer her assistance to Donald.

Anyways, she's arrested and is also on administrative leave and can't come back to the court any longer.

[Attackrabbit]

Trump Lawyer not licensed to file appeal
Seems par for the course

[Breccia]

Trump Lawyer not licensed to file appeal

Oh, come on! This is just getting ridiculuous.

Speaking of which, Trump filed his fiscal disclosure forms, you know, the ones he says show more info than taxes? Yes, he lied. Anyhow, the OGE had something specific to say about them.

OGE notes that several of the assets on this report are the subject of dispute in the case of New York v. Donald Trump, et al.

However, the time period at issue in that case does not appear to overlap with the reporting period of this report. OGE does not independently verify the value of the reported assets. In certifying this report, OGE relied on the valuation of assets reported by the filer

"Okay, but why post now? These were due months ago.

They were, yes. Trump got multiple extensions because he's a horrible businessman who only hires incompetent people.

[Breccia]

Did I just beat @Edge- and @Breccia with a news break?

By four minutes, but this is a big deal, good on you for getting it out there.

Powell is pleading to misdemeanors, so, she must have something very valuable to trade.

[Breccia]

Chesebro trial goes tomorrow. I wonder if we see a flip with him?

Too early to say. Articles about Powell's plea all say the Village of West Cheseboro was offered the same deal and refused.

Like you quoted, Powell has to testify and has to testify honestly. Considering the wealth of evidence, including communications she personally wrote, that should be easy to enforce. Also, apparently, she's not allowed to withdraw this plea, so if she's asked a tough question she doesn't want to answer, she's still guilty to those crimes she admitted to, but also, goes right back to trial for the original charges, during which, her guilty plea can be used as evidence.

Once again, I am quite sure a deal would not have been offered if there was nothing of value to trade. I think, not only can the prosecution show she got her marching orders from the other RICO members already, but they want her to say that on the stand. I also think that, even if she doesn't personally sell out Trump, she will sell out people who will.

Powell is not the first person to take a deal, but she's absolutely a big name to do so. We all know how RICO works. If one person pleads out, everyone else should be exceptionally nervous. The Prisoner's Dilemna is famous for a reason. If any of the rest want to escape with "only" a few years in prison, a fine, probation, and years of death threats from Trump's demonstrably irrational cult, they might want to hurry.

Because the prosecution has already got Kraken.

[Edge-]

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/donal...b0da897ab6ef13

Very Stable Genius Donald: I should be on the campaign trail but they need me at this trial! I should be in Iowa!

Also Very Stable Genius Donald: Eh, I won't return to the courthouse Thursday, I have a big golf tournament to go to or something.

These contradictory statements were made within 5 minutes of each other.

Has he taken a cognitive test recently?

[Breccia]

I won't return to the courthouse Thursday

In an interesting coincidence, Trump had been told SHUT THE FUCK UP DONNIE by the judge just before that. He was doing courtroom theater of throwing up his hands and huffing every time a witness against him told the truth.

I realize the usual goal of having your client in the courtroom is to get instant access to information you need. I get that. Trump is a serial liar who thinks WWE is sports. I don't think "the usual goal" applies here, I think his lawyers would be better served on his case if he was in another zip code, preferably another time zone. All he does is snort, walk outside, and lie to the microphones, saying things that mean less than nothing because he's not on the stand.

P.S. In your link Trump says he should have been in Iowa. Trump was in Iowa two days ago, and your article is from one day ago. Either he's saying he should have stayed in Iowa, which would make sense except for the golf tournament wasn't in Iowa, or he forgot he was in Iowa 24 hours ago.

- - - Updated - - -

So, because I feel that this is pretty big news -- and I fully admit I feel that way because I'm a vindictive fucking asshole -- I'm going to talk more about the Powell situation, because I paid for the NYTimes for a reason and it's time for some good ol' fashion quoting the whole thing.

Sidney K. Powell, a member of Donald J. Trump’s legal team after he lost the 2020 election, pleaded guilty on Thursday morning to six misdemeanor counts instead of facing a criminal trial that was to begin next week. She was among 19 defendants, including Mr. Trump, who--

Okay you know what, maybe not "the whole thing" there's a fair amount in here that's stuff we know.

Ms. Powell is the second to take a plea deal, a major victory for Fani T. Willis, the district attorney of Fulton County, whose team has been negotiating with some of the defendants. Last month, Scott Hall, 59, a Georgia bail bondsman, pleaded guilty to five misdemeanors. He had been accused, with Ms. Powell and others, of breaching voting equipment in Coffee County, Ga.

This is standard RICO stuff. People pleading out and testifying against the next link up the chain. It's why it exists.

Ms. Powell was prosecuted under the Georgia First Offender Act, which allows people with no prior felonies to avoid having the conviction on their permanent record if they comply with the terms of their sentence. Ms. Young, the prosecutor, noted in court that if Ms. Powell successfully complies with her sentence, she can then “honestly say” that she has “never been convicted of these charges.”

Yeah, can we see that against poor people caught with a joint? Or is it just rich people?

Before her plea agreement, Mr. Rafferty even claimed in filings that Ms. Powell “did not represent President Trump or the Trump campaign” after the election.

Yeah, that defense was not going to work. We already know from previous Trump failures that a lawyer can use nouns and do verbs with another person, even if that person is not a client. In particular, I don't think Giuliani or Eastman have receipts proving they worked for Trump.

Also, Trump called Powell out by name several times, so, there's that.

It was not immediately clear what impact the plea would have on Ms. Powell’s law license. A spokeswoman for the Texas Bar Association said it would not affect a disciplinary proceeding already underway, and was not sure if it would result in a separate disciplinary case. The current case, which concerns misrepresentations she is accused of having made in lawsuits filed after the 2020 election, was dismissed by a lower court but has been appealed by the bar association.

“I think it’s very bad news for Trump,” said Clark D. Cunningham, a law professor at Georgia State University, noting that her access to Mr. Trump at the White House put her “right in the middle” of the racketeering conspiracy at the heart of the case.

[Paranoid Android]

So Powell better bring it. She got off so easy and I'm not a fan of what she attempted.

If she is not at least disbarred that would be disappointing. Not up on every Trump lawyer but most should be disbarred on You Know subverting democracy.

[The Stormbringer]

So Powell better bring it. She got off so easy and I'm not a fan of what she attempted.

If she is not at least disbarred that would be disappointing. Not up on every Trump lawyer but most should be disbarred on You Know subverting democracy.

I'm fine with her getting off practically scott free if she manages to help bring the whole thing tumbling down and Trump winds up in prison (or equivalent).

[zorkuus]

I'm fine with her getting off practically scott free if she manages to help bring the whole thing tumbling down and Trump winds up in prison (or equivalent).

Don't get your hopes up. The US justice system is very incompetent when it comes to going after certain people. They might just let her off the hook for no real gain.

[Edge-]

https://apnews.com/article/fake-elec...4ca844b80ed825

A Michigan Republican accused of participating in a fake elector plot had all criminal charges dropped Thursday after he and the state Attorney General’s office reached a cooperation deal.

James Renner was one of 16 Republicans who acted as false electors for then-President Donald Trump in 2020, according to charges announced in July by Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel. President Joe Biden won Michigan by nearly 155,000 votes, a result confirmed by a GOP-led state Senate investigation in 2021.

All 16 defendants pleaded not guilty to eight criminal charges, including multiple counts of forgery, after investigators say the group met following the 2020 presidential election and signed a document falsely stating they were the state’s “duly elected and qualified electors.”

But on Thursday, the attorney general’s office announced during a court hearing in Ingham County that it would drop its case against Renner, 77, based on “an agreement between the parties.”

The cracks continue as people realize that making a deal is a much better idea than wasting a lot of time and money in a legal fight resulting in possible expensive fines and prison time because they broke the law.

[Shadowferal]

...and here we go;
Donald Trump Takes Aim At Judge, Violates Gag Order

[postman1782]

Chesebro trial goes tomorrow. I wonder if we see a flip with him? I have my doubts, that dude is fighting tooth and nail so far.

He already declined the plea deal.

[zorkuus]

...and here we go;
Donald Trump Takes Aim At Judge, Violates Gag Order

Here we go what? Nothing's going to happen. Just another sternly worded "don't do it again, or else"...

[Slirith]

Here we go what? Nothing's going to happen. Just another sternly worded "don't do it again, or else"...

Pretty much, our court system has no balls.

[Resurgo]

He already declined the plea deal.

he better hope his lawyer is as good as he thinks he is...

[postman1782]

he better hope his lawyer is as good as he thinks he is...

Well, they pretty much have him dead to rights, just like they did with Sydney and the other 17 defendants, including Trump. They have them on tape committing the crime.