Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Zaydin]

Today, on "The Jokes Write Themselves" Theater, Trumps Pecker continues to cause him problems, testifying under oath that the catch and kill schemes only started after he was explicitly asked by the Trump campaign for his help.

[Huehuecoyotl]

Today, on "The Jokes Write Themselves" Theater, Trumps Pecker continues to cause him problems, testifying under oath that the catch and kill schemes only started after he was explicitly asked by the Trump campaign for his help.

If this were a normal trial, Trump's lawyers would be desperately trying to swing some kind of a plea deal at this point (and indeed would have been months before it got to trial). Because the very first witness has provided enough evidence to prove at least some of the charges all on his own. And we know that there are other witnesses that will corroborate this, and provide tangible evidence as well.

Short of a MAGA crazy being on the jury, this should be a slam dunk after the first witness on the first day. But I've personal experience of jurors in the UK being absolute fucking morons, and ignoring evidence to suit their own agenda. So this isn't a done deal yet.

More popcorn on order though. I'm bulk buying.

[Kaleredar]

If this were a normal trial, Trump's lawyers would be desperately trying to swing some kind of a plea deal at this point (and indeed would have been months before it got to trial). Because the very first witness has provided enough evidence to prove at least some of the charges all on his own. And we know that there are other witnesses that will corroborate this, and provide tangible evidence as well.

Short of a MAGA crazy being on the jury, this should be a slam dunk after the first witness on the first day. But I've personal experience of jurors in the UK being absolute fucking morons, and ignoring evidence to suit their own agenda. So this isn't a done deal yet.

More popcorn on order though. I'm bulk buying.

I don't exactly know what a plea deal would look like. What does the prosecution want from Trump? There's no "bigger fish" to flip on. He's the crime boss, the buck stops with him. They don't care about his underlings; they're all just doing what he wants. There's no greater conspiracy to uncover or buried bodies or some information he's really withholding from them. They're trying to nail him down on this.

At any rate, as you note, hopefully they were able to purge any MAGA crazies from the jury pool. If reports are to be believed Trump's lawyers are making a real hack job of this and coming off as extremely clueless and incompetent, which I'm sure doesn't look good in front of a truly "neutral" jury.

[Gorsameth]

wasn't the hearing about Trumps gag order yesterday? Did anything come out of that?

- - - Updated - - -

I don't exactly know what a plea deal would look like. What does the prosecution want from Trump? There's no "bigger fish" to flip on. He's the crime boss, the buck stops with him. They don't care about his underlings; they're all just doing what he wants. There's no greater conspiracy to uncover or buried bodies or some information he's really withholding from them. They're trying to nail him down on this.

At any rate, as you note, hopefully they were able to purge any MAGA crazies from the jury pool. If reports are to be believed Trump's lawyers are making a real hack job of this and coming off as extremely clueless and incompetent, which I'm sure doesn't look good in front of a truly "neutral" jury.

I imagine a plea deal would be of the "you admit guilt, don't fight it and get a slightly reduced sentence to save us the trouble, and yourself the cost, of months in court" variety.

Which Trump won't accept because his ego can't allow him to admit guilt.

[Shadowferal]

wasn't the hearing about Trumps gag order yesterday? Did anything come out of that? .

Not yet.
Merchan was too aggravated. And apparently...like many judges, won't rule while feeling such emotion. (My take)

[Gorsameth]

Not yet.
Merchan was too aggravated. And apparently...like many judges, won't rule while feeling such emotion. (My take)

good on them for not letting emotion influence their judgement, but also very bad news for Trump.

Thanks.

[Ausr]

wasn't the hearing about Trumps gag order yesterday? Did anything come out of that?

- - - Updated - - -

I imagine a plea deal would be of the "you admit guilt, don't fight it and get a slightly reduced sentence to save us the trouble, and yourself the cost, of months in court" variety.

Which Trump won't accept because his ego can't allow him to admit guilt.

He's going to get a $1k fine and a "please don't do it again" before he does it again and gets another verbal warning, I bet.

[some guy]

If I was the prosecution I would have asked to start at $1k and it doubles for each instance. I mean, $10k isn't much for the self proclaimed best business man ever.

[BigToast]

I hear (or smell..) that Donny has a poopie diaper.

[Breccia]

I don't exactly know what a plea deal would look like.

Normal rules wouldn't fit here, indeed. In a normal setup, Trump would plead guilty to a felony, give up appeals, and agree to get a lighter sentence at a scheduled time. It would save prosecution a ton of time and money and they'd accept.

Which is why it won't happen. Trump can't plead guilty to a felony. He can't admit personal guilt, he can't admit he's a criminal, and he can't get this one pardoned. The USA has many problems and many cultists, but no way does Trump win the EC behind bars. This means he can't pardon himself for all his other crimes, either.

And it gets worse. Trump can't plead to a misdemeanor, either, because this is election fraud. Trump's biggest feature is his giant fat gut, followed by his ass. But third is the hair. And fourth is he led a terrorist violent uprising to cause election fraud, because he claimed there was election fraud. Trump also cannot win the election, while yelling "ELECTION FRAUD!" after swearing under oath that he willingly personally did criminal election fraud.

So it's not that you can't imagine the situation existing, you can't imagine Trump going for it. There is no offer that can be floated that Trump will accept. Doing so will cause him to die in prison.

- - - Updated - - -

I think everybody has made their own assessment of Trump’s character. And so far as I know, you don’t pay someone $130,000 not to have sex with you.

-- Mitt Romney

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Well. It has not been a good day to be Donald Trump.

1) The subpoena Trump tried to give Stormy Daniels was rejected.

The Court of Appeals has held that a subpoena is properly quashed when the party issuing the subpoena fails ‘to demonstrate any theory of relevancy and materiality, but instead, merely desire[s] the opportunity for an unrestrained foray into confidential records in the hope that the unearthing of some unspecified information [will] enable [them] to impeach witness[es].

You can't issue a subpoena for "give me all your stuff".

2) Trump issued yet another warning about Mexican rapists and other dangerous immigrants

Right here in eastern Pennsylvania, you had an illegal alien criminal who murdered a woman from Chester County, stabbing her 38 times in front of her 7-year-old daughter and 4-year-old son.

He was a violent, violent person

The convicted murderer, Danilo Cavalcante, was arrested April 2021. He was already in Pennsylvania the previous July. He entered in Trump's watch.

3) Trump claimed that nobody could protest his trial, because police blocked off the street.

Why are Palestinian protesters, and even rioters, allowed to roam the Cities, scream, shout, sit, block traffic, enter buildings, not get permits, and basically do whatever they want including threatening Supreme Court Justices right in front of their homes, and yet people who truly LOVE our Country, and want to MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN, are not allowed to ‘Peacefully Protest,’ and are rudely and systematically shut down and ushered off to far away ‘holding areas,’ essentially denying them their Constitutional Rights

Naturally, NBC News posted a video showing the street completely open. There was one Trump supporter. One.

4) Trump tried to break the gag order with another 3AM attack on Cohen.

Once again, Trump called him a convicted liar, forgetting Cohen was convicted of lying on Trump's behalf.

5) A long-time courtroom artist was surprised by Trump's actions.

When Judge Juan Merchan was explaining one ruling, Williams told CNN’s Erin Burnett that Trump “had his eyes closed, his head would sort of tilt back and forth” and then “all of a sudden he would hear something, he would snap to attention, take a piece of paper, write something down and hand it to [his attorney] Todd Blanche.”

“So, he really wasn’t asleep but he had his eyes closed and he did the same thing through the opening statement of the prosecutor, he closed his eyes the entire time,” she recalled.

It was in stark contrast to when Trump’s opening statement was put forward by his attorney, she noted. Then, Trump “sits back, he looks towards the jury, he has a very different body language at that point in time.”

Williams said it was “very typical” for defendants not to “want to look at the prosecutor when they make an opening statement” and then look up when their own attorney is addressing the court.

“But this was just so dramatic, I’ve never seen anybody close their eyes for all this period of time, ever, and I’ve been doing this so long,” she added.

So, either he really was asleep, or he was being highly disrespectful on purpose, or he was told "don't look" and didn't understand a pair of four-letter words.

6) Trump has been announcing his plans to dramatically increase inflation.

"Wait, no, Trump says inflation is bad. He keeps blaming Biden for it."

He does, yes. Then announces policies that will make it worse.

1) Decreasing the strength of the dolllar.
2) Tariffs.
3) Massive tax cuts based on deficit spending (yes, he did that already, yes, it increased inflation)
4) Labor cuts.

"Wait, Trump never said anything about firing people."

...read that sentence back. And, yes, he did. Trump wants to throw out illegal employed immigrants, okay that's a policy issue right there, but there are more employed illegal immigrants than unemployed Americans. Even if every single unemployed American wanted a job currently staffed by an illegal immigrant, which isn't true, but even if it was, total employment and therefore total American production would drop.

[Edge-]

https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/24/polit...ion/index.html

A grand jury in Arizona has handed up an indictment against former President Donald Trump’s allies over their efforts to overturn his 2020 election loss, including the fake electors from that state and several individuals connected to his campaign.

Boris Epshteyn, a former White House aide who remains one of Trump’s closest advisers, former White House chief of staff Mark Meadows and Rudy Giuliani are among those who have been indicted, according to a source familiar with the investigation.

Arizona Attorney General Kris Mayes, a Democrat, announced the indictment Wednesday night, focusing on the 11 individuals who acted as pro-Trump electors in the state. The names of several other indicted defendants remain redacted, Mayes said in a statement Wednesday, until those people have been served.

“A state grand jury made up of everyday regular Arizonans, has now handed down felony indictments for all 11 Republican electors as well as several others connected to this team,” Mayes said. “These are serious indictments, but this is the first hurdle the state must pass in our constitutional criminal justice system.”

While Trump is not among those charged in Arizona, the details in the indictment suggest he is “Unindicted Coconspirator 1.”

rofl, don and his criminal empire continue to rack up the indictments and charges. let's see if any of them stick.

but hey, if rudy goes to jail at least he won't go homeless after going bankrupt paying the women he defamed!

[Zaydin]

https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/24/polit...ion/index.html



rofl, don and his criminal empire continue to rack up the indictments and charges. let's see if any of them stick.

but hey, if rudy goes to jail at least he won't go homeless after going bankrupt paying the women he defamed!

Trumpists aren't wrong when they say there was fraud in 2020, they are just wrong about who was behind it: It wasn't Democrats, it was Donald Trump and his lackeys in a desperate effort to stay in power after he lost.

[Breccia]

if rudy goes to jail at least he won't go homeless after going bankrupt paying the women he defamed!

Giuliani already had legal issues and was unable to pay lawyers. This won't help. He's going to flip.

[Corvus]

Even though Haley dropped out a month and a half ago and no longer is campaigning, she still picked up nearly 17% of the vote in the Pennsylvania primary.

That's a good sign - wouldn't take a lot of them flipping or just sitting out the election for Trump to be done.

[Sunseeker]

Even though Haley dropped out a month and a half ago and no longer is campaigning, she still picked up nearly 17% of the vote in the Pennsylvania primary.

That's a good sign - wouldn't take a lot of them flipping or just sitting out the election for Trump to be done.

It's a fairly strong sign that a significant portion of Republican voters will sit out. This contingent is unlikely to be made up of Red Dinos or Blue Rhinos, those elusive "independents" and "moderates" who consistently vote Republican in every election, but of bog standard Republicans who are just tired of Trump. Not tired of Trump and what he does for them when he's in power mind you, but tired of "Current Trump", who isn't helping push forward their party's bullshit, but instead making their party's bullshit revolve around him.

[ringpriest]

It's a fairly strong sign that a significant portion of Republican voters will sit out. This contingent is unlikely to be made up of Red Dinos or Blue Rhinos, those elusive "independents" and "moderates" who consistently vote Republican in every election, but of bog standard Republicans who are just tired of Trump. Not tired of Trump and what he does for them when he's in power mind you, but tired of "Current Trump", who isn't helping push forward their party's bullshit, but instead making their party's bullshit revolve around him.

I expect that if/when Trump loses later this year, this is going to be the GOP's internal fault line. Not "should we stop being evil?", nor even "maybe we should be less clownishly evil?" but "I'm tired of not being able to do any evil because of this fucking loser!"

[Xyonai]

I expect that if/when Trump loses later this year, this is going to be the GOP's internal fault line. Not "should we stop being evil?", nor even "maybe we should be less clownishly evil?" but "I'm tired of not being able to do any evil because of this fucking loser!"

I feel like after the initial entitled bitching about 'Muh stolen election!' (because you know they will) and assuming a second attempt at a riot/coup doesn't escalate much further than beyond their first try; the proceeding years will just be a bunch of infighting between Republican Factions blaming eachother for their failures, with Fox running damage control for the Establishment Wing and all the other lunatic talking heads blaming the 'RINOs'.

If the MAGA wing loses yet another general election, I don't think there's much steam left in their ship to keep them going, even if Republicans cinch the 2026 mid terms.

[Breccia]

Giuliani announces his plan to turn on Trump by announcing he won't turn on Trump.

Ted Goodman, Giuliani's political adviser, said in a statement that the former New York City mayor is "proud to stand up for the countless Americans who raised legitimate concerns surrounding the 2020 U.S. Presidential Election."

"He won't be bullied or pressured into silence by highly partisan actors," the statement said.

"What does 'highly partisan' mean?"

Merriam-Webster says "feeling, showing, or deriving from strong and sometimes blind adherence to a particular party, faction, cause, or person"

"Can you give an example?"

Rigging an election for a candidate.

[Zaydin]

Another day and Trumps Pecker is causing him more problems. Can't find a better source right now, but day 2 of Peckers testimony includes highlights such as:

Pecker and Michael Cohen worked directly with Trump to create a system to "catch and kill" stories detrimental to Trump. They discussed it in a conversation in a room together; Cohen can provide corroborating testimony.

The National Enquirer had never pursued a "catch and kill" relationship with a potential story subject on behalf of a celebrity before Trump.

Cohen and AMI worked together to benefit Trump and denigrate his opponents even to the extent that Cohen approved and suggested cover text.

Cohen was not acting as Trump's personal lawyer in those capacities; he was a representative of the campaign, speaking on behalf of Trump, Pecker believed.

Pecker used AMI/National Enquirer to cast a net for people potentially with stories that could damage Trump and Trump's campaign. He was an active part of Trump's media efforts–in this case, countering potential negative media under cover of a media outlet.

They caught at least three stories relating to Trump: an affair with Karen McDougal; an encounter with Stormy Daniels; and an unproven claim of a love child made by a former doorman at Trump Tower.

Like Fox, the National Enquirer became an on-demand propaganda outlet for the Trump campaign where the publisher/broadcasters were working directly with the candidate to form the message and reinforce it across channels.

Relatedly, Alina Habba is seemingly throwing in the towel on Trumps chances in New York.

[Breccia]

Relatedly, Alina Habba is seemingly throwing in the towel on Trumps chances in New York.

Alina Habba Shows Up at Trump’s Trial and Suddenly Makes Things Worse

Habba, who is not representing Trump in his hush-money trial, still showed up at the Manhattan courthouse on Monday to offer her opinion. “We’re here because of something that happened when he was in the White House that wasn’t even wrong,” she told reporters.

“You hire lawyers to solve problems, lawyers solve those problems, you pay them. That’s it!” Habba said, in language reminiscent of Trump’s rally speeches.

Habba’s words on Monday are not the first time she has seemingly displayed ignorance of the law, either. She has claimed the New York state law requirement that Trump attend every day of his trial is a violation of “due process,” and she was rebuked in court 12 times in one day in the E. Jean Carroll defamation case. She even had to abandon her attempt to have the Carroll case dismissed.

What brought Habba to this conclusion? She didn't solve shit.