Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Draco-Onis]

I wish Americans would understand it takes time to steer a cruise ship and democrats are hampered by having to undo republicans nightmares the first 4 years. Democrats almost always, almost always in modern era have significantly better economy than Republicans...this is readily verifiable.

I wish they weren't so fucking short sited

I think the reasons are not limited to the last 10 years, the American middle class is dead it's been going on for decades. If you stretch the economic data over a longer time frame you can see the decline in a lot of metrics. I would argue the downfall started due to the presidency of Ronald Reagan, while republicans are heavily responsible democrats have not done much to reverse the damage republicans have done. For example Obama kept the Bush tax cuts, Clinton continued the path of deregulation leading to the 2008 financial crisis.

Democrats have been leaning more and more right for decades and at this point the American public is simply lashing out and blaming the usual suspects (immigrants and minorities). Since there is no left wing in this country to give them an alternative and doing something about it, it has become the truth. You can look at it world wide the left wing of the world is too busy protecting corporate interests to make the changes necessary to stop fascism.

[Somewhatconcerned]

"The Democrats are going to take away your Hamburgers" - Donald Trump, August 22, 2024

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/a...t-disease.html





I hope he does it.

FAFO

This is actually good.

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I think the reasons are not limited to the last 10 years, the American middle class is dead it's been going on for decades. If you stretch the economic data over a longer time frame you can see the decline in a lot of metrics. I would argue the downfall started due to the presidency of Ronald Reagan, while republicans are heavily responsible democrats have not done much to reverse the damage republicans have done. For example Obama kept the Bush tax cuts, Clinton continued the path of deregulation leading to the 2008 financial crisis.

Democrats have been leaning more and more right for decades and at this point the American public is simply lashing out and blaming the usual suspects (immigrants and minorities). Since there is no left wing in this country to give them an alternative and doing something about it, it has become the truth. You can look at it world wide the left wing of the world is too busy protecting corporate interests to make the changes necessary to stop fascism.

Unfortunately tax cuts are always going to be a huge poison pill for the opposition party.

You can't run on "we're going to increase your taxes."

[Doomcookie]

I mean, the economy is shit, but the problem is how "shit" is measured in the first place.

Workers are struggling to make ends meet. That's why the economy "sucks". It's not just inflation, and I've said myself inflation was a global issue, not anything that could be blamed on Biden's policies. And this issue is global, too, though the USA may be the worst for it.

All the measures of economic health are things rich people care about. Stock market growth, GDP, etc. None of those matter to workers. They don't translate. And the story over the past few decades has been economic growth for the rich, and economic stagnation or decline for the workers. Economy booms, the rich get richer, and the workers don't feel any change. It's a rising tide but the workers can't afford boats, and they're chained in place, so they start to drown.

We need to forget the usual measures of economic health almost completely, and focus on things like cost-of-living indices versus real wages, housing prices vs wages, etc. If the rich aren't doing well economically, fuck 'em, they're already rich.

You nailed something, that this is not a result of Biden's policies.

Cost of living went up, and so did wages. Inflation is the one thing the average person cares most about, if they are not looking at their 401K. Wage growth actually spiked a lot over the last few years. But, such things were also localized, where some local economies just fell behind. If incomes and wages are increasing faster than inflation, then inflation largely does not matter.

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This is actually good.

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Unfortunately tax cuts are always going to be a huge poison pill for the opposition party.

You can't run on "we're going to increase your taxes."

Trump is going to raise taxes, and he's a rapist.

You don't seem to mind either one.

[Draco-Onis]

Unfortunately tax cuts are always going to be a huge poison pill for the opposition party.

You can't run on "we're going to increase your taxes."

No it's not tax increases on the rich and corporations are widely popular but for that to happen democrats would have to stand up to their donors. That's why tax breaks like carried interest which has zero support can never be repealed. Even Trump couldn't justify keeping a huge welfare check to wall street neither could democrats they just didn't say anything about it.

[Xyonai]

This is actually good.

I don't disagree, this country has needed to tighten standards on high fat and high sodium foods for decades. However, without proper mechanisms to -replace- unhealthy food with affordable, healthier alternatives, this just becomes yet another poor tax.

[Kathandira]

This is actually good.

Republicans said it was not good last time. The masses cried about their freedom. Is ok now that it comes one side and not the other?

[zorkuus]

So how long before the US has another 9/11 type event because Trump decided to let Israel turn Gaza into glass?

He'll have incompetent people running defense and homeland security. Wouldn't be too hard for someone to make something happen.

[Kaleredar]

He'll have incompetent people running defense and homeland security. Wouldn't be too hard for someone to make something happen.

You’d think a guy that was almost assassinated twice, with a third genuine concern from another country, would maybe have an ounce of self-preservation in mind.

But I guess the grift takes precedent over all.

[Rasulis]

I think the reasons are not limited to the last 10 years, the American middle class is dead it's been going on for decades. If you stretch the economic data over a longer time frame you can see the decline in a lot of metrics. I would argue the downfall started due to the presidency of Ronald Reagan, while republicans are heavily responsible democrats have not done much to reverse the damage republicans have done. For example Obama kept the Bush tax cuts, Clinton continued the path of deregulation leading to the 2008 financial crisis.

It has been deteriorating slowly. Many did not feel it because it was so slow. However, Covid accelerated the trend. The average age of US first time home buyers can be used as indicator.

In the late 80s, when mortgage interest rates were in the teens, the average age of US home buyers were in the mid to late 20s. I bought my first apartment at 24 (1987) and first home at 27 (1990).

It floated between 29 - 33 for the last two decades. During and post covid it went up rapidly. It was 33 in 2021, 36 in 2022, and currently 38.

First-time home buyers in the US are getting older as young Americans struggle to get into the market

[Breccia]

Trump is going to raise taxes

Trump flat-out campaigned and ran on raising taxes, specifically tariffs, which he can unilaterally do. Nobody can stop him.

He'll either do it, and raise taxes like the people who supported him were cheering for him to do; or he won't, and he's a lying coward.

[Somewhatconcerned]

Seems bad. When you politicize departments (like Garland with DOJ), then of course there's going to be a backlash and voters will then vote for people who will then dismantle said departments.

This FEMA agent claims it was done out of avoidance and safety and while there is probably some truth to it, the optics are terrible. Now there will be a tit for tat response from the GOP, but will it end there?

https://thehill.com/homenews/4990582...ters/?tbref=hp

[Edge-]

Seems bad. When you politicize departments (like Garland with DOJ)

Why you so trivially and blatantly lie, expecting literally anyone to believe you, is astounding to me.

[Somewhatconcerned]

Trump flat-out campaigned and ran on raising taxes, specifically tariffs, which he can unilaterally do. Nobody can stop him.

He'll either do it, and raise taxes like the people who supported him were cheering for him to do; or he won't, and he's a lying coward.

This is inaccurate.

One of the first things they will do is renew/expand the tax cuts from 2017.

The effects of tariffs are TBD - it is unclear how how high they will be (IMO they are mostly a negotiating tactic), and the true cost cannot be measured until we see what happens with energy/fuel prices.

It is very possible tariffs raise prices, but overall offset (or even net gain) by tax cuts and energy costs going down.

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Why you so trivially and blatantly lie, expecting literally anyone to believe you, is astounding to me.

I'm not talking about Trump's cases.

[Edge-]

I'm not talking about Trump's cases.

Neither am I. How did Garland politicize the DoJ, in your opinion, that you find so objectionable?

[Rasulis]

This is inaccurate.

One of the first things they will do is renew/expand the tax cuts from 2017.

The effects of tariffs are TBD - it is unclear how how high they will be (IMO they are mostly a negotiating tactic), and the true cost cannot be measured until we see what happens with energy/fuel prices.

It is very possible tariffs raise prices, but overall offset (or even net gain) by tax cuts and energy costs going down.

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I'm not talking about Trump's cases.

Energy cost is not likely to go down. Oil & gas companies like their current profit margin. Producing more will be beneficial to consumers but detrimental to their investors pocket books. Guess which they are going to prioritize.

The US oil industry doesn’t appear to be in any rush to come to the rescue of Americans struggling with high gas prices. Oil company CEOs say Wall Street is to blame.

Fifty-nine percent of oil executives said investor pressure to maintain capital discipline is the primary reason publicly traded oil producers are restraining growth, according to a Federal Reserve Bank of Dallas survey released Wednesday.

For years, the boom-to-bust oil industry spent lavishly to fund all-out production growth. US oil output skyrocketed, keeping prices low. Yet sustaining profits proved elusive. Hundreds of oil companies went bankrupt during multiple oil price crashes, leading investors to demand more restraint from energy CEOs.

Today, oil companies are under enormous pressure from Wall Street to return cash to shareholders through dividends and buybacks, instead of investing in badly needed supply.

“Discipline continues to dominate the industry,” an executive from an oilfield services firm told the Dallas Fed in the survey. “Shareholders and lenders continue to demand a return on capital, and until it becomes unavoidably obvious that high energy prices will sustain, there will be no exploration spending.”

That was from 2022 when oil price was $120 per barrel. Currently, it is around $68 to $70 per barrel.

Post Trump victory.

Exxon Mobil CEO, Darren Wood, Won't Ramp Up Drilling Just Because Donald Trump Wants to

"The pros to ramping up drilling are good for the consumer but bad for the industry. Businesses would lose money by increasing supply in already over-supplied markets. For the consumer, prices would come down."

FYI, average break even point for fracking is currently around $50 per barrel. For them to start drilling new wells the break even point would around $59 - $70.

[Kaleredar]

Trump flat-out campaigned and ran on raising taxes, specifically tariffs, which he can unilaterally do. Nobody can stop him.

He'll either do it, and raise taxes like the people who supported him were cheering for him to do; or he won't, and he's a lying coward.

Part of me believes that Trump was saying that only because he needed a vaguely-economic term that people generally didn’t know enough about to call him on or question to say next to the word “China” so that people would believe that he had an economic plan. Basically, so he could unga-bunga a “me make economy good again. How? Me tariff China” and assume most people didn’t know enough to call him on it.

As trump so …cogently… tapped into, people care about their pocketbooks most of all. Him baldly destroying the US economy for no reason other than… I guess, sticking to a plan… (which has never been Trump’s strong suit) would not bode well for him or the GOP, and no amount of complaining about woke politics or illegals would distract people from it. It didn’t work in 2020 when he fucked up COVID.

So there’s a possibility that this, like many things trump says, was a lie.

But hey if he’s telling the truth people would very rapidly “find out” what their electoral fucking around bore out. We all need to get our best “honey, what did you expect?” responses ready.

[Endus]

Neither am I. How did Garland politicize the DoJ, in your opinion, that you find so objectionable?

This is definitely not what he meant, but there's a solid argument to be made that Garland being picked for AG was a political choice to ensure prosecutions of political criminals on the right were pursued slowly and cautiously, rather than with the full force of the law like you would any other non-political criminal. It was another example of the Democrats giving Republicans a handout that they should have known would be instantly and forever rejected. As we can see, through Somewhatconcerned's mischaracterization of events.

If you're hesitating to prosecute a case because the accused is a political figure with clout, that's what corruption is.

[DarkTZeratul]

He will convince them to allow Recess Appointments on the grounds that he rescind Gaetz nomination.

Why would they, when they can just not confirm Gaetz?

[Somewhatconcerned]

Neither am I. How did Garland politicize the DoJ, in your opinion, that you find so objectionable?

Mark Houck

[Doomcookie]

Seems bad. When you politicize departments (like Garland with DOJ), then of course there's going to be a backlash and voters will then vote for people who will then dismantle said departments.

This FEMA agent claims it was done out of avoidance and safety and while there is probably some truth to it, the optics are terrible. Now there will be a tit for tat response from the GOP, but will it end there?

https://thehill.com/homenews/4990582...ters/?tbref=hp

Did it concern you when Trump politicized the DoJ to try to help him overthrow the government? Please show in your previous posting history about your concern over Jefrey Clark and the events after the 2020 election.

Nope, it did not.

How is that worse than being a rapist?

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Mark Houck

Where was your concern for this?

https://www.npr.org/2022/06/23/11071...oj-officials-s

How is that worse than a rapist?

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This is inaccurate.

One of the first things they will do is renew/expand the tax cuts from 2017.

The effects of tariffs are TBD - it is unclear how how high they will be (IMO they are mostly a negotiating tactic), and the true cost cannot be measured until we see what happens with energy/fuel prices.

It is very possible tariffs raise prices, but overall offset (or even net gain) by tax cuts and energy costs going down.

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I'm not talking about Trump's cases.

It is accurate. You lied.

Tariffs are taxes, whether you like it, or not. You didn't need to defend the lying rapist, that was a choice.