1. #96221
    Void Lord Breccia's Avatar
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    Trump claims Canadians would have better health care as the 51st state.

    "Does Canada have universal health care?"

    Yes.

    "Does America have universal health care?"

    No.

    "Does Canada have better health care than America?"

    According to this US News ranking, yes. Canada is 7th on the the list of 89 countries. The US is 19th, which isn't horrible, but Canada is still better.

    "How trustworthy is that list?"

    I mean, even Americans are saying Canada is better. And since Finland is #4, I'd say it's accurate.

    This site also agrees.

    So does this one.

    So does this one.

    The World Health Organization doesn't rate near as I can tell, but does track life expectancy. Guess what?

    Just kidding. They rate all kinds of things and they do it every year.

    So, basically, everyone who knows, knows that Canada has better health care. Adding to that, even if they magically became the 51st state, Canadians wouldn't suddenly go to Utah or Virginia hospitals, so no, it wouldn't get better, just more expensive, since they would lose universal health care and be required to pay taxes for Americans on Medicare/Medicaid.

    As a reminder, Trump ran in 2016 claiming he had a health care plan, and he never had one. He ran in 2024 with the "inklings" of a plan, naturally, we haven't seen that yet either. There is no measurable, reasonable way to claim that Canada becoming the 51st state would improve their health care overall. Trump is just throwing out random words for his cultists to cheer at, despite there being negative evidence.

  2. #96222
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/loca...-says/3655654/

    rofl, the SS is now going after kids for posting "threats" on tiktok

    they came for the children first, and Republicans were fucking dead silent
    I liked this quote from that article...

    "According to this official, ICE made 538 arrests — 373 criminal arrests and 165 non-criminal arrests —throughout the U.S. on Thursday."

    Why are we arresting people that aren't criminals?

    Sooner or later ICE is going to mess up and "enter" a school. Then the shit storm will happen.

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    Trump will say that WHO doesn't matter since the US isn't a part of it anymore. They are just making up data because they are sore the US left.

  3. #96223
    Void Lord Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu 2020 View Post
    Anyone else find it interesting that all of the ICE raids are happening in big cities, and not in rural regions where most undocumented migrants work for Republican owned farms for a couple of dollars an hour?
    I'm waiting for the cost-to-benefit analysis. How much are these raids costing, including deportations, and how many people are being removed? It's way too soon for any realistic numbers, just things Trump will say which are lies, but his policies were forecast to cost up to three hundred billion a year. That's about $1,500 per US taxpayer. Unless an illegal immigrant actually stole your job, I'm not sure illegal immigrants are costing you $1500.

  4. #96224
    Quote Originally Posted by Logwyn View Post
    "According to this official, ICE made 538 arrests — 373 criminal arrests and 165 non-criminal arrests —throughout the U.S. on Thursday."
    Probably booked for "resisting arrest", as cops are want to do.

  5. #96225
    Quote Originally Posted by Logwyn View Post
    "According to this official, ICE made 538 arrests — 373 criminal arrests and 165 non-criminal arrests —throughout the U.S. on Thursday."

    Why are we arresting people that aren't criminals?
    Haven't read the article, but I'm assuming it's because they're arresting people whose only "crime" is being allegedly undocumented.

  6. #96226
    Void Lord Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Logwyn View Post
    Trump will say that WHO doesn't matter since the US isn't a part of it anymore. They are just making up data because they are sore the US left.
    Probably. "Everyone is lying but me" is something Trump routinely says. But nobody believes him, including Trump and his voters.

  7. #96227
    Deploying Marines to the southern border to stand around, again? Really? Is this a wise use of taxpayer dollars? Seems like a waste of money and the time of those marines, to me, but I guess the administration got some good b-roll for their upcoming propaganda videos.

  8. #96228
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    Sorry, but this is not responsive to my post. Please incorporate your opinion on either what you think is the "best he [Trump] can hope for" in terms of the linked article, or how "CA Dems win on this issue," as I have given my comment on both. I can only take this as your desire to post background information on California to benefit the thread, and I do appreciate you. I don't know if we actually disagree on anything.
    Putting any conditions on the aid package is a no go. GOP reps from fire prone state (WA, OR, WY, MO, UT) will not put up with it. Conditional aid package has never been done before and I doubt that anybody want to set a precedent.

    The most likely scenario is that Trump's supporters in Congress will try to bundle some of his agendas with the aid package. That has been done before.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/loca...-says/3655654/

    rofl, the SS is now going after kids for posting "threats" on tiktok

    they came for the children first, and Republicans were fucking dead silent
    Not going into schools, churches and hospitals to arrest people, unless they are dealing with criminals, used to be the unofficial policy of ICE. It was made official by Obama. So, I don't think ICE will actually start doing that anytime soon. The optic is just ugly.
    Last edited by Rasulis; 2025-01-25 at 12:51 AM.

  9. #96229
    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    Not going into schools, churches and hospitals to arrest people, unless they are dealing with criminals, used to be the unofficial policy of ICE. It was made official by Obama. So, this is something new for ICE.
    Very much so. Houses of worship have long been sorta "safe" ground in many regards, especially for marginalized folks. But between those operating those houses becoming less welcoming and those running the government more malicious, it seems that even organized religious groups can provide minimal "lawful" protection.

    I'm betting we're gonna see a lotta underground networks popping up.

  10. #96230
    Void Lord Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    I don't think ICE will actually start doing that anytime soon. The optic is just ugly.
    What about the last four days suggests Trump cares about optics?

  11. #96231
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Very much so. Houses of worship have long been sorta "safe" ground in many regards, especially for marginalized folks. But between those operating those houses becoming less welcoming and those running the government more malicious, it seems that even organized religious groups can provide minimal "lawful" protection.

    I'm betting we're gonna see a lotta underground networks popping up.
    There has always been an underground network for illegal immigrants. Both the Catholic Church and Jewish Family Services are highly involved in San Diego. It is an open secret. Both CBP and ICE are aware of the network, but they turned a blind eye in the past. We'll see if they are going to start arrestings Priests and Rabbis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    What about the last four days suggests Trump cares about optics?
    Trump does not care. ICE does.

  12. #96232
    Void Lord Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    Trump does not care. ICE does.
    Hmm...I'll give you that one. For now.

  13. #96233
    The Lightbringer tehdang's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    Putting any conditions on the aid package is a no go. GOP reps from fire prone state (WA, OR, WY, MO, UT) will not put up with it. Conditional aid package has never been done before and I doubt that anybody want to set a precedent.

    The most likely scenario is that Trump's supporters in Congress will try to bundle some of his agendas with the aid package. That has been done before.
    Then in your terms, the best Trump can hope for is "bundling some of his agendas with the aid package."

    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Once again, all you have is empty tone policing and not an actual discussion of the subject matter.
    I continue to read in wonder at all the things that fall under your conception of "tone policing." Feel free to offer something substantive and constructive if you'd like; I think I've resolved my own misunderstanding about that post.
    "I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

  14. #96234
    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    Trump does not care. ICE does.
    Not sure on this one since the largest union inside ICE openly endorsed Trump even though Biden/Kamala was willing to give them the same funding if republicans didn't explicitly choose to kill the bill.

    They didn't endorse Trump because of funding, the dems where already fighting for them to get it anyways just being blocked by republicans. They endorsed Trump because Trump will let them be assholes, I can't see these people caring about optics.
    Last edited by Tech614; 2025-01-25 at 01:28 AM.

  15. #96235
    Quote Originally Posted by Somewhatconcerned View Post
    I am curious to see how much more red CA trends if voter ID is instated. Not saying it will flip red....but you never know ..

    https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...-id-water-aid/
    Literally nothing Trump said was true.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Somewhatconcerned View Post
    I bet CA would become a battleground state overnight.

    There's already been a shift. I don't think the people there can take Newsom and co much longer. And if Trump goes with conditional aid and Gavin refuses...the voters will blame him big time.

    https://thehill.com/homenews/state-w...city/?tbref=hp
    How? You think illegals are voting? Just say you are stupid.

  16. #96236
    Quote Originally Posted by postman1782 View Post
    How? You think illegals are voting? Just say you are stupid.
    Weird how he thinks conditional aid might engender good feelings towards Republicans.

    I mean, everyone knows that children have the best relationship with their parents when their parents only share conditional love with them, and not unconditional love.

    It's just good 'ol rural, folksy, American as apple-pie common sense.

  17. #96237
    Void Lord Breccia's Avatar
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    Trump cancels NIH external communications.

    "Okay, what does that mean?"

    They didn't say, they went full radio silent. But the NIH is the single largest public funder of medical research in the world, and a cutoff of communications would end any research they wanted to fund.

    "Surely this is just the same temporary pause that happens ever admin."

    Interesing theory. Link something from 2021.

    "Uh..."

    Or 2017, 2009, 2001...just, you know, go nuts. Make sure whatever you find also has the NIH cutting off all travel and all job offers, because they just did that, too.

    This includes cancer research, by the way.

    Dr. Chrystal Starbird, a cancer structural biologist and professor at UNC Chapel Hill, said her study section was scheduled to meet next week. On Wednesday she received notice of its cancellation through email.

    "It was pretty vague — it said that it's canceled, that they can't offer any further explanation at the time, and it thanked us for our service to the NIH," Starbird said.

    She explains that these aren't the kinds of meetings that can easily be rescheduled. There are a lot of moving parts, involving different institutions all operating on different timetables. A delay — especially an indefinite delay, like this one — could have a negative impact on important cancer research, Starbird says.
    Anyone claiming Trump wants to improve health care is lying. Anyone who is looking for some tiny shred of evidence that some part of Canada's health care is worse than the United States should keep this part in mind, because Canada's government is still talking to Canada's medical researchers.

  18. #96238
    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Trump cancels NIH external communications.

    "Okay, what does that mean?"

    They didn't say, they went full radio silent. But the NIH is the single largest public funder of medical research in the world, and a cutoff of communications would end any research they wanted to fund.

    "Surely this is just the same temporary pause that happens ever admin."

    Interesing theory. Link something from 2021.

    "Uh..."

    Or 2017, 2009, 2001...just, you know, go nuts. Make sure whatever you find also has the NIH cutting off all travel and all job offers, because they just did that, too.

    This includes cancer research, by the way.



    Anyone claiming Trump wants to improve health care is lying. Anyone who is looking for some tiny shred of evidence that some part of Canada's health care is worse than the United States should keep this part in mind, because Canada's government is still talking to Canada's medical researchers.
    The Trump administration Part 2, Powered By the Republican Party is speedrunning how much damage they can do to a government and how much pointless harm they can inflict.

    As we've always said: The cruelty is very much the point.

    Donald Trump wants cancer to win. He is cancer.

  19. #96239
    The Undying Cthulhu 2020's Avatar
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    BTW if yall want to know why Vivek probably got fired from DOGE, I can't exactly give you the reason Elon gave him the boot, but what I can tell you is that right wing twitter is absolutely eating Vivek ALIVE for takes like this:



    MAGA was all about "legal citizenship" before the election, and now that Trump's won they've gone full mask off. The Leopards have started eating the faces of even the most devout MAGA followers if their skin tone isn't light enough.
    “Terrible things are happening outside. Poor helpless people are being dragged out of their homes. Families are torn apart. Men, women, and children are separated. Children come home from school to find that their parents have disappeared.”
    Diary of Anne Frank
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  20. #96240
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    The Trump administration Part 2, Powered By the Republican Party is speedrunning how much damage they can do to a government and how much pointless harm they can inflict.
    They're not just damaging a government. The result will be damaged lives for millions of people.

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