Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[diller]

You have a vast overestimation of the ability of the world being able to unite on any subject and I say this as a European.0.

You tend to be wrong on most things and this is another one, countries don't need to 'unite against the US' for this to happen.

[Teriz]

Tough news for the "tariffs don't work" crowd.

Already getting concessions from Mexico, re: increased border enforcement.

You really are that gullible aren't you? If you think Mexico is coming out looking bad in this, you really got your head in the sand. It's the US with egg on its face, because we look like reactionary crazies who are swinging wildly for no real reason. That's going to cause people to look elsewhere for stability, and its going to damage our power in the short and long term.

[tehdang]

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...1#post54634286



Let's get this straight:

Trump's actions have plunged America into a legal and constitutional crisis. We are witnessing an unprecedented transfer of power from the legislative to the executive branches of government conducted in the most senseless and base way possible. It is a hatchet job.

This is not up for debate. This is quantifiable.

When documented white supremacists like Musk & Miller are then appointed to positions of power in said executive branches of government, do not be surprised that there accusations of a "fascist coup".

I have no interest in whether you agree or not. I have no interest in changing your mind.

I don’t think said crisis is anywhere greater or legally more deep than having a placeholder President Biden who was apparently much less able to discharge the duties of president soon after taking office, according to multiple witnesses and reports. America survived whatever caretaking staff ran things in his frequent absence, and it will survive this.

I do presume that people here are willing to be convinced to change their opinions. If you’ve given up on the exercise, then that’s a real shame.

As for civility:

I don't live in America. I feel sorry for the Americans who didn't vote for Trump and who'll suffer as a result of this. I feel sorry for all of us who'll be affected by the consequences of a destructive trade war and the wider political instability Trump is fomenting.

In the UK, like other European countries, we too have seen a significant rise in support for the far-right. This is not an American-only issue. However, and to get to the point: if any fascist, at home or abroad, tries to impose their evil views on me and mine, I will cease being civil.

I hope you know that I’m not personally trying to impose my views on you. This is, for me, a discussion centered around Trump who was just democratically elected for a second time. If you think differently from me, you’re entitled to your own opinion.

[Breccia]

This is more for-

Nonpost handwaved.

[Endus]

You aren't asking for things you never provide are you? That'd be hypocritical, and being a hypocrite is not a civil response.

See also his request for "civility".

Sorry, when you lie to people's faces openly and repeatedly, that's not civil behaviour. Calling for civility in response to your own personal lack of civility is not a reasonable request, and should in no way be respected.

[Breccia]

Trump admits this was never about trade policy.

The President of Mexico said Trump agreed to pause the tariffs because Mexico promised pinky swear to send 10,000 troops to stop fentanyl. Because Trump declared National Emergency Lol over fentanyl, he was forced to accept, otherwise he'd be both be breaking his own NAFTA 1.0.1 and also making it 100% clear to all other countries he was applying tariffs at random.

Of course, Trump had repeatedly insisted over and over leading up to the election, and even as recently as Sunday

Trump on Sunday told reporters he was unconcerned about the potential impact of imposing tariffs on close trading partners, saying the American people would understand.

"We may have short term, some, a little pain, and people understand that, but, long term, the United States has been ripped off by virtually every country in the world," he told reporters on Sunday, as he departed Air Force One at Maryland's Joint Base Andrews.

He added, "We have deficits with almost every country, not every country, but almost. And we're going to change it. It's been unfair. That's why we owe $36 trillion; we have deficits with everybody."

He did not use the word "fentanyl". Or "rapists", actually.

Meaning, his claim that these tariffs were about trade practices are now demonstrably false, since Mexico got them immediately dismissed by doing nothing in any way about trade. Only calling his fat orange bluff, because he had to loophole a National Emergency Lol, and Mexico addressed the lie.

Now, incidentally, if there is substantial flow of fentanyl across the US/Mexico border, one of two things will happen: it will stay the same, or it will drop. If it drops, I don't mind, but that means no tariffs and Trump's lies about this being about trade continue to haunt him since he won't be able to re-apply the tariffs. If it doesn't, he'll have to admit his 10,000 troops on his side of the border couldn't do anything, either. Imagine the shame when that happens.

And you know who knew this? The free market. Stocks barely moved. Everyone saw how trivial this was for Mexico to deal with.

In the end, Trump has now been publicly humliliated by Colombia and Mexico. How embarrassing. Que lastima.

[tehdang]

You aren't asking for things you never provide are you? That'd be hypocritical, and being a hypocrite is not a civil response.

I simply don’t know who made the allegation, what facts were referenced in making it, and the full details of what is alleged. I already gave my response: I don’t know about who is making that accusation and what is alleged to have happened, but maybe there’s a specific source to that which also informed the poster. (Unless the poster had a personal conversation with Musk, or works in the Treasury).

I also give opinions on this forum that come from me as the source. “I think that’s bad” is an example of something where I’d say you’re foolish to ask me for a source.

[Edge-]

Trump admits this was never about trade policy.

The President of Mexico said Trump agreed to pause the tariffs because Mexico promised pinky swear to send 10,000 troops to stop fentanyl. Because Trump declared National Emergency Lol over fentanyl, he was forced to accept, otherwise he'd be both be breaking his own NAFTA 1.0.1 and also making it 100% clear to all other countries he was applying tariffs at random.

Of course, Trump had repeatedly insisted over and over leading up to the election, and even as recently as Sunday

the fentanyl coming through the us border checkpoints?

i thought that's what the marines were sent to the border for?

you know, a pointless, expensive mission where they can't even really do much beyond sit around and act in a support role for the border patrol.

- - - Updated - - -

I simply don’t know who made the allegation, what facts were referenced in making it, and the full details of what is alleged. I already gave my response: I don’t know about who is making that accusation and what is alleged to have happened, but maybe there’s a specific source to that which also informed the poster. (Unless the poster had a personal conversation with Musk, or works in the Treasury).

I also give opinions on this forum that come from me as the source. “I think that’s bad” is an example of something where I’d say you’re foolish to ask me for a source.

you just can't go to any news website to check the news, apparently. it's just impossible.

[Breccia]

I simply don’t-

Nonpost handwaved.

- - - Updated - - -

the fentanyl coming through the us border checkpoints?

i thought that's what the marines were sent to the border for?

Yeah, the military at the border thing, considering the rules about using US military on US soil are, is going to end poorly. But beyond that, 10,000 Mexican soldiers just got the cushiest job in the world. They're going to sit around, laughing and I hope watching TV, while asking everyone "You got fentanyl?" "No." "Okay, off you go."

Maybe Trump shouldn't have lied about the reason for the National Emergency Lol. Maybe he should have stuck to his many claims that this was about unfair trade practices. Now he has to backtrack like a fat orange bitch.

[Edge-]

Yeah, the military at the border thing, considering the rules about using US military on US soil are, is going to end poorly. But beyond that, 10,000 Mexican soldiers just got the cushiest job in the world. They're going to sit around, laughing and I hope watching TV, while asking everyone "You got fentanyl?" "No." "Okay, off you go."

Maybe Trump shouldn't have lied about the reason for the National Emergency Lol. Maybe he should have stuck to his many claims that this was about unfair trade practices. Now he has to backtrack like a fat orange bitch.

DO SOMETHING

is finally working

SOMETHING

is happening

is that

SOMETHING

actually useful or effective?

probably not

but SOMETHING IS HAPPENING

the appropriate people appear to have been notified they must express excitement

[NoiseTank13]

Ford 'ripping up' Ontario's $100M contract with Elon Musk's Starlink in wake of U.S. tariffs



Elon probably seething right. Tbh, I didn't expect Ford to do this. Canadians seem pretty united in their hate for Trump right now.

$100M for only 15,000 people?

[Breccia]

If all this took was Mexico sending a handful of troops, why didn't Trump just ask for this first? Why did he yell "TARIFFS!" at the cameras, only to take it back in not even one business day?

This is the second time in a row. Trump should probably just call next time. It would stop him from looking like a spoiled toddler throwing a tantrum until Mommy Mexico pats him on the head and says "there, there".

[Edge-]

If all this took was Mexico sending a handful of troops, why didn't Trump just ask for this first? Why did he yell "TARIFFS!" at the cameras, only to take it back in not even one business day?

This is the second time in a row. Trump should probably just call next time. It would stop him from looking like a spoiled toddler throwing a tantrum until Mommy Mexico pats him on the head and says "there, there".

why use your words when you can make a big flashy show of DOING SOMETHING even if that something is literally the dumbest way to go about whatever you're doing.

i mean, you can see the results in this thread, some folks are very hyped about DOING SOMETHING

[Timester]

So, Mexico keeps doing what is doing until today and Trump made the US lost millions today? Just the BEST deals indeed.

Perhaps I should contact Trump to sell the land I own on the Moon.

[Breccia]

Perhaps I should contact Trump to sell the land I own on the Moon.

Don't be ridiculous.

He wants to go to Mars. Sell him land there.

[Moralgy]

If all this took was Mexico sending a handful of troops, why didn't Trump just ask for this first? Why did he yell "TARIFFS!" at the cameras, only to take it back in not even one business day?

This is the second time in a row. Trump should probably just call next time. It would stop him from looking like a spoiled toddler throwing a tantrum until Mommy Mexico pats him on the head and says "there, there".

A civil call to discuss things with our allies doesnt make headlines as much as, as edge just said, DO SOMETHING very loudly that destabilizes the country.

[Timester]

Don't be ridiculous.

He wants to go to Mars. Sell him land there.

True. True.

[Edge-]

So, Mexico keeps doing what is doing until today and Trump made the US lost millions today? Just the BEST deals indeed.

Perhaps I should contact Trump to sell the land I own on the Moon.

what else to expect from the king of debt who bankrupted a casino?

it's like the worst stupidity of the 80's is making a huge comeback in the worst, most stupid ways

[Tech614]

If all this took was Mexico sending a handful of troops, why didn't Trump just ask for this first? Why did he yell "TARIFFS!" at the cameras, only to take it back in not even one business day?

This is the second time in a row. Trump should probably just call next time. It would stop him from looking like a spoiled toddler throwing a tantrum until Mommy Mexico pats him on the head and says "there, there".

Because "Mexico continues their standard National Guard Troop rotation" doesn't sound like a win for Trump. Fox News reporting "Mexico caves to US tariffs and sends troops to the border!" sounds like a win. It's all about framing, just look at SomewhatConcerned hes eating it up hook line and sinker.

[Breccia]

Fox News reporting "Mexico caves to US tariffs and sends troops to the border!" sounds like a win.

True, but he could have gotten that in other ways. FOX News could have reported that Mexico caved from a simple phone call. The cultists are already lost, all this did was make the US look like it's led by a fat coward bully to the rest of the world.