Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Endus]

Are you insisting that I go look at your post history to see how you were talking about this before the Supreme Court decision?

If you're gonna accuse me of taking certain positions, as you very much did, then yes.

Otherwise, you're just making shit up based on nothing. It's your imagination, not reality. This is how Trump operates, not reasonable people.

Because I can, but it seems like a big waste of both of our time when we both know I will see that you correctly assessed this issue before that. I know you correctly assessed it because you aren't an idiot, and only an idiot would wait for the Supreme Court decision.

You "know" this, even when you haven't bothered to look?

This is what I mean. You "know" this the same way a three year old "knows" their imaginary friend is real.

Just admit you're making shit up and talking out your ass. Save some face, even if you're mostly sandpapered it off at this point.

Like everyone else, you trust media that fits your preconceptions and are skeptical media that does not. You may be clever enough to occasionally step back and question things, but we both know that the vast majority of the time you simply accept that anyone you have previously deemed reputably reports. I don't know why you pretend otherwise, other than the fact that admitting the obvious will rob you of a worthless attack line against the people who have been successfully indoctrinated by the right wing machine.

A lot of words from someone who isn't engaging with reality, but only the delusional straw man they invented to use in place of reality.

You don't have an argument. You don't know my positions. You're just making everything up as you go, based on the imaginary conversations you're having with yourself in your own head and literally nothing else.

I understand Trump lives in his own fictional reality, but it's not a good behaviour to copy, dude.

[gondrin]

The Supreme Court ruling references them. The wiki on his case has links to information about them as well.

Um, no they did not. In fact, the only people "referencing" them is the current administration which, as of now, are made up lies. In fact, according to that own wiki page, the only thing that mentions him and gangs is literally him fleeing El Salvador after gangs threatened his family.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deport...urt_proceeding

The Barrio 18 gang allegedly tried to extort his mother's business for money, and threatened that if she did not pay the money they would make sure her eldest son, Cesar, joined their gang instead.[2] As a result, the family sent Cesar to the U.S. After further threats to the family, at the age of 16, Abrego Garcia fled El Salvador and illegally entered the United States in 2011.

In March 2019, Prince George's County, Maryland, police arrested Abrego Garcia with three other men in a Home Depot parking lot where they were seeking work as day laborers.[2][8] One of the men claimed Abrego Garcia was a "gang member," but The Atlantic reported that according to court filings, the man offered no proof and police said they did not believe him.[8] Abrego Garcia was never charged with a crime in connection to his arrest.[21]

Police handed custody of Abrego Garcia over to ICE for deportation proceedings. In those proceedings, the government claimed that he was a member of the MS-13 criminal gang because "he was wearing a Chicago Bulls hat and a hoodie" and a confidential informant claimed that he was active with an MS-13 group based in New York,[2] where he has never lived.[16] An immigration judge determined that the informant's claim[22] was sufficient evidence for denying Abrego Garcia’s bond request, and another judge upheld that ruling, saying the claim that Abrego Garcia was in MS-13 for purposes of the bond determination was not clearly wrong.[20] However, no court has ever “full adjudicat[ed]” this issue.[20] Abrego Garcia has consistently denied any connection to MS-13.[23]

While awaiting resolution to his deportation proceedings, Abrego Garcia married his girlfriend in June 2019, and they had a child together later that year, who is a U.S. citizen. He and his wife are also raising her two children from an earlier relationship, and all three children have special needs.[2][24] Abrego Garcia and his family live in Maryland.

So this already shows that you are trying to justify a lie.

How about the supreme court ruling?

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinion...4a949_lkhn.pdf

On March 15, 2025, the United States removed Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia from the United States to El Salvador, where he is currently detained in the Center for Terrorism Confinement (CECOT). The United States acknowledges that Abrego Garcia was subject to a withholding order forbidding his removal to El Salvador, and that the removal to El Salvador was therefore illegal. The United States represents that the removal to El Salvador was the result of an “administrative error.” The United States alleges, however, that Abrego Garcia has been found to be a member of the gang MS–13, a designated foreign terrorist organization, and that his return to the United States would pose a threat to the public. Abrego Garcia responds that he is not a member of MS–13, and that he has lived safely in the United States with his family for a decade and has never been charged with a crime.

On Friday, April 4, the United States District Court for the District of Maryland entered an order directing the Government to “facilitate and effectuate the return of Abrego Garcia] to the United States by no later than 11:59 PM on Monday, April 7.” On the morning of April 7, the United States filed this application to vacate the District Court’s order. THE CHIEF JUSTICE entered an administrative stay and subsequently referred the application to the Court.

The application is granted in part and denied in part, subject to the direction of this order. Due to the administrative stay issued by THE CHIEF JUSTICE, the deadline imposed by the District Court has now passed. To that extent, the Government’s emergency application is effectively granted in part and the deadline in the challenged order is no longer effective. The rest of the District Court’s order remains in effect but requires clarification on remand. The order properly requires the Government to “facilitate” Abrego Garcia’s release from custody in El Salvador and to ensure that his case is handled as it would have been had he not been improperly sent to El Salvador. The intended scope of the term “effectuate” in the District Court’s order is, however, unclear, and may exceed the District Court’s authority. The District Court should clarify its directive, with due regard for the deference owed to the Executive Branch in the conduct of foreign affairs. For its part, the Government should be prepared to share what it can concerning the steps it has taken and the prospect of further steps. The order heretofore entered by THE CHIEF JUSTICE is vacated.

Statement of JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR, with whom JUSTICE KAGAN and JUSTICE JACKSON join, respecting the Court’s disposition of the application.

The United States Government arrested Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia in Maryland and flew him to a “terrorism confinement center” in El Salvador, where he has been detained for 26 days and counting. To this day, the Government has cited no basis in law for Abrego Garcia’s warrantless arrest, his removal to El Salvador, or his confinement in a Salvadoran prison. Nor could it. The Government remains bound by an Immigration Judge’s 2019 order expressly prohibiting Abrego Garcia’s removal to El Salvador because he faced a “clear probability of future persecution” there and “demonstrated that [El Salvador’s] authorities were and would be unable or unwilling to protect him.” App. to Application To Vacate Injunction 13a. The Government has not challenged the validity of that order.

Instead of hastening to correct its egregious error, the Government dismissed it as an “oversight.” Decl. of R. Cerna in No. 25–cv–951 (D Md., Mar. 31, 2025), ECF Doc.
11–3, p. 3. The Government now requests an order from this Court permitting it to leave Abrego Garcia, a husband and father without a criminal record, in a Salvadoran prison for no reason recognized by the law. The only argument the Government offers in support of its request, that United States courts cannot grant relief once a deportee crosses the border, is plainly wrong. See Rumsfeld v. Padilla, 542 U. S. 426, 447, n. 16 (2004); cf. Boumediene v. Bush, 553 U. S. 723, 732 (2008). The Government’s argument, moreover, implies that it could deport and incarcerate any person, including U. S. citizens, without legal consequence, so long as it does so before a court can intervene. See Trump v. J. G. G., 604 U. S. ___, ___ (2025) (SOTOMAYOR, J., dissenting) (slip op., at 8). That view refutes itself.

Because every factor governing requests for equitable relief manifestly weighs against the Government, Nken v. Holder, 556 U. S. 418, 426 (2009), I would have declined to intervene in this litigation and denied the application in full.

Nevertheless, I agree with the Court’s order that the proper remedy is to provide Abrego Garcia with all the process to which he would have been entitled had he not beenunlawfully removed to El Salvador. That means the Government must comply with its obligation to provide Abrego Garcia with “due process of law,” including notice and an opportunity to be heard, in any future proceedings. Reno v. Flores, 507 U. S. 292, 306 (1993). It must also comply with its obligations under the Convention Against Torture. See Convention Against Torture and Other Cruel and Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment, Dec. 10, 1984, S. Treaty Doc. No. 100–20, 1465 U. N. T. S. 113. Federal law governing detention and removal of immigrants continues, of course, to be binding as well. See 8 U. S. C. §1226(a) (requiring a warrant before a noncitizen “may be arrested and detained pending a decision” on removal); 8 CFR §287.8(c)(2)(ii) (2024) (requiring same); see also 8 CFR §241.4(l) (in order to revoke conditional release, the Government must provide adequate notice and “promptly” arrange an “initial informal interview . . . to afford the alien an opportunity to respond to the reasons for the revocation stated in the notification”). Moreover, it has been the Government’s own well-established policy to “facilitate [an] alien’s return to the United States if . . . the alien’s presence is necessary for continued administrative removal proceedings” in cases where a noncitizen has been removed ending immigration proceedings. See U. S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Directive 11061.1, Facilitating the Return to the United States of Certain Lawfully Removed Aliens, §2 (Feb. 24, 2012).

In the proceedings on remand, the District Court should continue to ensure that the Government lives up to its obligations to follow the law.

Hmm, I don't see anywhere here where he was actually convicted or even charged with being a gang member. Just that he was accused of being in one by someone he was working with which turned out to be a lie in and of itself.

So, any other actual cases that show him actually being a gang member?

I mean, I can claim you are a pedophile, or a child molester or any number of other things. That does not make them true in any sense.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

And yet you don't understand the words exactly, media literacy, and room for interpretation.

There is zero room for interpretation when a man says "No Judges, no Court Cases". But go ahead. Spin me another interpretation. You keep on saying there's room...but you haven't provided a single alternative. What do you, my media literate superior, interpet from that tweet?

Media literacy? Sure, some people struggle with that. 34 felony convcitions though. Liable for Rape. You don't need media literacy to understand those. They voted for a rapist felon.

If your argument is "People should've just believed him, then you have to say that for all of his tweets, so ignore this one that, in hindsight, somewhat came true, what about all the others that didn't, why shouldn't the people have believed those?"

My argument was never "they should have just believed him". I was countering your argument...the one where you said "He never told them he deny due process". He did tell them that. And if your defense is "How could they know it just wasn't another one of his lies"...well...if they know he's such a damn liar...why did they vote for him? Rapist, Felon, President. 3 things that Kamala Harris isn't.

You can tell the difference because you have media literacy and know how to look for trustworthy sources, but 60% struggle on that front, and yours and Endus's, and others' solution to that is: Have you thought about not struggling?

They are responsible for their vote. No one else. All the lies, grifts, "Ha-ha-I-thought-he-was-just-joking", etc do not absolve them of their vote.

I could give two fucks about their "media literacy". No one else was in that voting booth. Just them. They elected a rapist felon. They knew what they were doing.

Sure, they should've known what they voted for

No. Not Shouldn't. They knew what they were voting for. A convicted felon.

, no doubt, but they struggle to find sources that don't just regurgitate the same crap

.

My heart bleeds for them. They don't struggle to find sources. They don't fucking look for other sources.

If someone is convicted of 34 felonies but not locked up, some might find that odd and believe the free person talking that all of those 34 felonies are just <insert opponents> trying to get him to stop running.

Sure. They might find that. But then, they should take a long step back and fuck their own faces. A jury of his peers found him guilty, beyond a reasonable doubt, of 34 felonies.

Does this make sense to you who knows shit and is able to fact check with reliable sources, no, but can this make sense to someone who doesn't, absolutely.

Everyone is able to fact check sources. They choose not to.

I whole heartetly agree, fuck them, if they haven't turned on Trump by now.

Then stop defending them. But why is now different than before? Why are you defending them for supporting Trump before the election...but now you say "fuck them, if they haven't turned on him now"? I mean, they're still the same media illiterate fucktards they were before now. So what's different?

I just can't with good conscience blame them for their inability to research shit when no one ever showed them how.

I can. The ability to ask questions is something we were all born with.

I continue to blame the fourth estate first and foremost because it should be their fucking job to distinguish truth from lie and help the ones who have neither the time nor the ability to properly inform themselves.

Fuck that. They have the time to inform themselves. They choose not to. Everything they needed to know was in front of their stupid faces. They elected a rapist. They elected a felon. Because they just couldn't vote for the black woman.

[Xath]

How many years are you guys going to do this shit before you realize that it isn't helping? Or maybe I should say decades at this point.

When you insist on rejecting the facts of a situation, because any fact that makes Trump look more evil must absolutely be true, you give MAGA ammunition.

Garcia was not a permanent resident. He was initially an undocumented immigrant who received a special asylum status many years after he arrived. This means the government is under no obligation to convict him of a crime to deport him. It's entirely possible that if he is brought back, the government can prove a case very minimally to remove him and it will be perfectly in line with the law.

These are hard facts we have to deal with, and pretending he was one inch from being a citizen, and never could be deported without a criminal conviction, does not help the situation. These are flimsy, obviously false claims, and when you make them it gives the other side an easy way to reject your arguments. It doubly doesnt help when you guys respond to every criticism with "YOU MUST LOVE TRUMP". No, I care what is true and I care what messaging works, because if we cede honesty and humility we will never win.

Then deport him don’t send him to a human’s rights hellhole

[Mayhem]

There is zero room for interpretation when a man says "No Judges, no Court Room". But go ahead. Spin me another interpretation.

Expedited removal has been a thing since 1996 and doesn't require a judge or a courtroom. The Biden administration used expedited removal, they limited it to people caught within 100 miles of the border.

[Tech614]

Then deport him don’t send him to a human’s rights hellhole

Deport him where? He is from El Salvador and a judge ruled he couldn't be deported there because gangs threatened his family. Surely you aren't suggesting to just dump him off a plane into mexico or some shit? Dude has a wife and kid in the country, and was a union worker seeking asylum. He should not of been deported period be it to a prison or not.

NineSpine is just being an apologist for Trump doing Nazi shit that judges said he couldn't do.

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It's entirely possible that if he is brought back, the government can prove a case very minimally to remove him and it will be perfectly in line with the law.

We know for a fact they can't prove it. Know why? Cause if they thought they could they would bring him back and do so, it would be a very easy win for the bigots. They can't prove it, which is why they don't want him back. Stop being a nazi apologist. Just admit you're a MAGAT and move on, we don't need your diabtribe where you try to act like you aren't a Trump supporter but then are a-ok with him doing nazi shit.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Expedited removal has been a thing since 1996 and doesn't require a judge or a courtroom. The Biden administration used expedited removal, they limited it to people caught within 100 miles of the border.

Okay sure. I'll give you that.

But is it meant for use on every single undocumented immigrant? I mean, it wasn't before Trump decided to make it so.

But yeah...I guess you got me there. Strange how these people that don't know anything about due process would know about expedited removal though.

[Tech614]

Okay sure. I'll give you that.

But is it meant for use on every single undocumented immigrant? I mean, it wasn't before Trump decided to make it so.

But yeah...I guess you got me there. Strange how these people that don't know anything about due process would know about expedited removal though.

Mayhem is conveniently leaving out the part where expedited removal is only for undocumented that haven't lived in the country for 2 years. And if hes claiming Trump has only deported people that have been in the country sub 2 years without due process well, we all know hes full of shit.

Not sure why we have all these weak ass attempts at gaslighting in this thread all of a sudden trying to apologize for Trump doing Nazi shit and sending people to a concentration camp.

[Mayhem]

Okay sure. I'll give you that.

But is it meant for use on every single undocumented immigrant? I mean, it wasn't before Trump decided to make it so.

But yeah...I guess you got me there. Strange how these people that don't know anything about due process would know about expedited removal though.

They most likely wouldn't. But what he tweeted wouldn't cause a stir because it could've been explained with exactly that. The "what he meant was"-crowd went hard especially on right wing media and thanks to the fucked up system in the US they most of the time could find something that was enough of an excuse to calm the crowd. Why did people vote for him regardless? Well, some are racists, some are sexists, some are single-issue voters who care for nothing but themselves, some are fed up with something the democrats didn't fix, some are lifetime republicans who trusted the rest to keep him in line, there are a host of reasons, none of them good, most of them could be explained by a lack of media literacy.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

We know for a fact they can't prove it. Know why? Cause if they thought they could they would bring him back and do so, it would be a very easy win for the bigots. They can't prove it, which is why they don't want him back. Stop being a nazi apologist. Just admit you're a MAGAT and move on, we don't need your diabtribe where you try to act like you aren't a Trump supporter but then are a-ok with him doing nazi shit.

More than that..if they could prove it...they wouldn't have "accidentally" shipped him off in the first place.

Dude's gonna die there. The President of El Salvador said today that he's not going to release him. And it's not like Trump's really going to fight him over it.

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Well, some are racists, some are sexists, some are single-issue voters who care for nothing but themselves, some are fed up with something the democrats didn't fix, some are lifetime republicans who trusted the rest to keep him in line, there are a host of reasons, none of them good, most of them could be explained by a lack of media literacy.

I disagree

Single Issue Voters? Media literacy has nothing to do with that. They only care about their one thing. It's not that they can't look for other sources...they just don't give a shit.

Racist/Sexist? Media Literacy doesn't cure that one either.

Life-long Republicans? THose don't even sound like the people you are talking about anyway. And sure, they aren't ever going to vote for a Black female Democrat....but that's got nothing to do with media literacy.

Fed up with something that Democrats didn't fix? Sure. I can see that. Of course, a lot of the stuff the democrats didn't fix was broke by the guy the they decided to vote for.

Here's the big one though "Host of reasons...none of them good". Love that. You can't defend their reasons for voting Trump...but you can still absolve them of the responsibility.

I mean, the best you can do is say "If they had better media literacy...some of them might not have fallen for the grift"... but that still doesn't mean they wouldn't have voted for Trump anyway.

[Tech614]

More than that..if they could prove it...they wouldn't have "accidentally" shipped him off in the first place.

Dude's gonna die there. The President of El Salvador said today that he's not going to release him. And it's not like Trump's really going to fight him over it.

It's just ridiculous NineSpine actually believes a union worker and family man is some secret MS-13 shot caller with nothing to back it up just because this shitter admin is claiming it. Dude was sent to a concentration camp because of his ethnicity and they have no intent to bring him back because of his ethnicity. They obviously can't prove shit or they would have.

[tehdang]

The only case where the MS13 allegations come from is a bond hearing. For those that dont know the evidentiary burden on bond hearings is extremely low. If the Trump administration really believed he was an MS13 member do you know where that evidence could have been presented? In 2019, when he was having hearings for his withhold of removal. If the Trump administration believed this person was leading MS13 and engaged in human trafficking they could have appealed his withhold of removal and deport him right there and there.

Ironically, you're arguing against yourself here. There was no reason to prove to the court that he was an MS-13 member back in 2019, since he could still have been deported to any number of countries, just not El Salvador. Essentially, you're arguing that in 2019, Trump had a clear vision of where he wanted him deported, rather than just that such people should be deported.

Um, no they did not. In fact, the only people "referencing" them is the current administration which, as of now, are made up lies.

The state of play is that a judge found his MS-13 associations credible in a bond hearing. AKA there was evidence enough to convince a judge to deny him bond. If you can admit that as a truth, you can move onto the two normalized progressive positions: the standard for evidence in a bond hearing isn't as ironclad as that of a criminal trial, and it doesn't really matter if he was a member of MS-13, given a different judge decided he had grounds to prevent his removal to El Salvador.

NineSpine is just being an apologist for Trump.

Proof #1000001 that progressives can't understand politics beyond determining disagreement implies confession to being a Trump stooge. Cult-like behavior if you ask me.

[Dontrike]

I was worried about Biden's mental faculties because it made the Democratic Party look ridiculous and almost certainly cost them the election.

Uhuh, and everyone believes you.

But keep gaslighting Americans. That's definitely the path to victory. Tell Americans the slack jawed guy that can barely put a sentence together and looks like he might keel over at any second was actually perfectly fine. Tell everyone that they are crazy for daring to question the dear leader Biden. That definitely won't turn anyone off.

You literally described Trump throughout this entire paragraph. Also, do you think I'm gaslighting ALL Americans? I didn't know I had that kind of power.

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"Trying to fully understand where Trump's support comes from has nothing to do with Trump" is certainly a take.

We know where his support comes from, people that can't read an entire Dr. Seuss book without sounding out every other word or getting angry at Dr. Seuss.

[gondrin]

Ironically, you're arguing against yourself here. There was no reason to prove to the court that he was an MS-13 member back in 2019, since he could still have been deported to any number of countries, just not El Salvador. Essentially, you're arguing that in 2019, Trump had a clear vision of where he wanted him deported, rather than just that such people should be deported.

The state of play is that a judge found his MS-13 associations credible in a bond hearing. AKA there was evidence enough to convince a judge to deny him bond. If you can admit that as a truth, you can move onto the two normalized progressive positions: the standard for evidence in a bond hearing isn't as ironclad as that of a criminal trial, and it doesn't really matter if he was a member of MS-13, given a different judge decided he had grounds to prevent his removal to El Salvador.

Proof #1000001 that progressives can't understand politics beyond determining disagreement implies confession to being a Trump stooge. Cult-like behavior if you ask me.

I posted what the wiki said and it said as such as a judge found sufficient cause to deny him bond. However, this administration has stated that he is a member of MS-13(which is known to be an outright lie) and that was sufficient cause to deport him. They also stated he was in the country illegally, which he wasn't as of 2019, due to an immigration judge granting him a form of asylum that would allow him to still be deported, but not to his original country. Which means that he couldn't be deported without another country wanting him to be taken in seeing that he was from El Salvador to begin with.

This administration has lied about pretty much everything involving this and here you are defending them. So yes, it does really matter if he was a member of MS-13 because that is the whole basis of this administration deporting him. They keep bringing it up even though there is no evidence of the sort.

So, like the last guy I said this to, I can claim anything about anyone, it doesn't make it true. This is what due process is for. So, I claim that you are a pedophile. Is it a true statement? Without any form of due process, which this guy did NOT get to be deported to El Salvador, that claim I just made can easily be considered true by others. And the last time I checked, there are those who would take a claim as such as gospel regardless if it is true or not and take action accordingly.

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Uhuh, and everyone believes you.



You literally described Trump throughout this entire paragraph. Also, do you think I'm gaslighting ALL Americans? I didn't know I had that kind of power.

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We know where his support comes from, people that can't read an entire Dr. Seuss book without sounding out every other word or getting angry at Dr. Seuss.

I find it funny that people are accusing others of gaslighting Americans and yet, the biggest gaslighter of all is sitting in the White House at the moment.

[NED funded]

Ironically, you're arguing against yourself here. There was no reason to prove to the court that he was an MS-13 member back in 2019, since he could still have been deported to any number of countries, just not El Salvador. Essentially, you're arguing that in 2019, Trump had a clear vision of where he wanted him deported, rather than just that such people should be deported.

????

Right now the Trump admin is arguing that he was (or always has been) an MS13 member and in charge of human trafficking operations. If the Trump admin really believed this to be true, they could have stopped him from getting the withhold of removal and just deport him to El Salvador. The burden of proof in immigration court is not that high.

Do you want us to believe that the Trump admin knew they had caught a leader of MS13 and human trafficker (their words here) and just let him stay in the US? Like is that the argument here? Like no dude. You are just being a bootlicker here.

In any case, even if he has always been secretly MS13 despite multiple court cases where they have failed to make that case that still doesnt stop this from being an illegal deportation (rising to illegal imprisonment if we could get the detaisl fo the cooperation agreement) This is assuming he is even alive as the Trump admin continues to refuse to say they know he is alive.

[alach]

Yeah, heres a quick 90 second refresher on what has happened. Its pretty 1930s Germany level bad.

[NED funded]

First university to tell Trump F U.

Harvard Says It Will Fight Trump Administration Demands
The government has threatened to withhold nearly $9 billion in grants and contracts

I checked the NYT on this and like yeah no shit they rejected those demand and are choosing to fight it. The government wants ideological control of colleges, control on who they hire, on who they admit and even on the sort of ideas that are allowed in. They want DEI for conservative ideas and not actually let them stand on their merits

[Pannonian]

Ironically, you're arguing against yourself here. There was no reason to prove to the court that he was an MS-13 member back in 2019, since he could still have been deported to any number of countries, just not El Salvador. Essentially, you're arguing that in 2019, Trump had a clear vision of where he wanted him deported, rather than just that such people should be deported.

The state of play is that a judge found his MS-13 associations credible in a bond hearing. AKA there was evidence enough to convince a judge to deny him bond. If you can admit that as a truth, you can move onto the two normalized progressive positions: the standard for evidence in a bond hearing isn't as ironclad as that of a criminal trial, and it doesn't really matter if he was a member of MS-13, given a different judge decided he had grounds to prevent his removal to El Salvador.

Proof #1000001 that progressives can't understand politics beyond determining disagreement implies confession to being a Trump stooge. Cult-like behavior if you ask me.

Ah finally. The enemies of the people had their deserved comeuppance! After all there is no question that they're endagering the people, so its only right to punish them!

That you in the foreground with the cute scarf?

[Azadina]

Evidence is evidence. It doesn't become evidence or stop being evidence. It is what it is. There is evidence he had gang involvement. This evidence is weak and ridiculous, but not non-existent.

You're a murderer. There's evidence. Weak and ridiculous evidence, but evidence is evidence. Can YOU prove you're not a murderer? Can you recount up to date list of every person on the planet, so that we can rule out any missing person who was murdered by you?

This is what you've been doing for god knows how many pages now.

[Mayhem]

I disagree

cool

Single Issue Voters? Media literacy has nothing to do with that. They only care about their one thing. It's not that they can't look for other sources...they just don't give a shit.

Racist/Sexist? Media Literacy doesn't cure that one either.

I thought we were past the can't part when talking about lack of media literacy, guess not.

Wait, you really think that when you're presented with new viewpoints and are able to discern fact from fake, it doesn't change your view on gender, race, and sex? So, do you think it's genetic?

I left out the rest because it's basically all the same, you disagree that media literacy can change viewpoints which is weird because I am pretty sure that's the fucking point of media literacy.

But don't take it from me, here have a read.

Media literacy skills help us realize that our words carry weight, rid our creations of bias, and even recognize our own point of view. It would be an understatement to call media literacy a necessary tool to navigate the modern-day world—when we are surrounded by media at a rate like never before, this type of literacy is essential to understanding and interacting with the world around us.

Here's the big one though "Host of reasons...none of them good". Love that. You can't defend their reasons for voting Trump...but you can still absolve them of the responsibility.

Of course, I can partially absolve them, the same way I can absolve someone from bungling <insert skill> no one ever taught them. Does that mean people can't teach themselves? No. Is it rare that people successfully teach themselves to a proficient level? Yes.