Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Joszef Kiprich]

TIL bookmarks are technically complex.

Or opening an incognito page, or just not log in to Google. Very complex indeed.

- - - Updated - - -

Yep Trump is crazy, and that's fit in this thread. We lost because Biden is senile belongs in another thread.

[NineSpine]

Deport him where? He is from El Salvador and a judge ruled he couldn't be deported there because gangs threatened his family. Surely you aren't suggesting to just dump him off a plane into mexico or some shit? Dude has a wife and kid in the country, and was a union worker seeking asylum. He should not of been deported period be it to a prison or not.

NineSpine is just being an apologist for Trump doing Nazi shit that judges said he couldn't do.

- - - Updated - - -

We know for a fact they can't prove it. Know why? Cause if they thought they could they would bring him back and do so, it would be a very easy win for the bigots. They can't prove it, which is why they don't want him back. Stop being a nazi apologist. Just admit you're a MAGAT and move on, we don't need your diabtribe where you try to act like you aren't a Trump supporter but then are a-ok with him doing nazi shit.

Me: Trump is an abhorrent fascist and the worst thing that has ever happened to America, but we need to be careful, stick to the facts, and have messaging that works if we want to defeat him.
YOU: OH MY GOD YOU LOVE TRUMP

People like you are why we lost.

- - - Updated - - -

Then deport him don’t send him to a human’s rights hellhole

He was deported. He's from El Salvador.

This is really the problem. You have the right conclusion (this guy never should have been deported or even apprehended) but you don't know the case, the law, what the words even mean. That doesn't help us. You make us look stupid.

[Nymrohd]

How many people in the Trump administration do you think will end up in the 4chan hacking list?

[NineSpine]

Um, no they did not. In fact, the only people "referencing" them is the current administration which, as of now, are made up lies. In fact, according to that own wiki page, the only thing that mentions him and gangs is literally him fleeing El Salvador after gangs threatened his family.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deport...urt_proceeding

So this already shows that you are trying to justify a lie.

How about the supreme court ruling?

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinion...4a949_lkhn.pdf

Hmm, I don't see anywhere here where he was actually convicted or even charged with being a gang member. Just that he was accused of being in one by someone he was working with which turned out to be a lie in and of itself.

So, any other actual cases that show him actually being a gang member?

I mean, I can claim you are a pedophile, or a child molester or any number of other things. That does not make them true in any sense.

I never said he was convicted or charged with a crime. He was held because of two accusations he was involved in a gang, which a judge found credible. Do I think these accusations are credible? Absolutely not. However, when you stomp around claiming that those things never happened, you make us look dumb and ignorant. You hurt the cause. Stop it.

[PhaelixWW]

Yes, you can choose to erect a digital shell around yourself through a series of impractical and often technically complex steps.

Okay, we've gone straight past ludicrous and into plaid.

[NineSpine]

TIL bookmarks are technically complex.

Google gives you results based on the activity of your IP, so you need to use a search engine like DuckDuckGo. You need to either avoid all social media or use plugins that manipulate the content to mitigate recommendations. This includes YouTube, which you can't even use logged out because the algorithm also uses your IP. You really can only avoid it by doing all of your browsing in incognito windows through a VPN.

This ridiculous and laughable series of protections is not something the average person is going to understand, let alone perform. So why are we wasting time talking about it?

- - - Updated - - -

At least on youtube, you click the 3 vertical dots under the video, then click "Don't recommend channel". Two steps. Very intuitive, and practical.

Like talking to brick walls in this fucking place.

The problem is not that I am personally confused how to avoid the algorithms. The point is what the algorithms are doing to our social and political discourse. LOL CLICK THE THREE DOTS doesn't change any of that. We have a serious social problem with misinformation, and I don't know how you think me personally blocking Ben Shapiro is going to do anything about that.

[Katchii]

TIL bookmarks are technically complex.

Not that I'm disagreeing with this sarcastic remark, but the kinds of people who think they ARE technically complex are the kinds of people that also have media literacy issues.

Like the park ranger comment about bear proof trash cans. “there's a significant overlap between the smartest bears and dumbest humans.”

[NineSpine]

Okay, we've gone straight past ludicrous and into plaid.

Ok, I'm going to go explain to my 65 year old mother how to use a VPN, incognito mode, and browser plugins to avoid content delivery algorithms. I'm sure this will be a successful conversation given she has been on Facebook for fifteen years and can't get her head around properly uploading pictures.

I guess first I need to figure out how to explain to her wtf an algorithm is.

[Belize]

Big "I don't take any responsibility at all" vibes on display, yikes.

[PhaelixWW]

Ok, I'm going to go explain to my 65 year old mother how to use a VPN, incognito mode, and browser plugins to avoid content delivery algorithms. I'm sure this will be a successful conversation given she has been on Facebook for fifteen years and can't get her head around properly uploading pictures.

I guess first I need to figure out how to explain to her wtf an algorithm is.

Boy, you have an extremely low opinion of your mother's intelligence. The picture you paint of her is of someone who'd have trouble boiling water.

[NineSpine]

Boy, you have an extremely low opinion of your mother's intelligence. The picture you paint of her is of someone who'd have trouble boiling water.

You have an EXTREMELY overinflated view of the technical competency of the average person. Do you genuinely believe the average person even knows what an IP address or an algorithm is? You are spending too much time online if you think that that is the norm.

The idea that we are going to solve the misinformation and propaganda problem by teaching people to use VPNs and somehow convincing them not to use social media is the dumbest shit I have ever seen on this forum.

[Poopymonster]

Boy, you have an extremely low opinion of your mother's intelligence. The picture you paint of her is of someone who'd have trouble boiling water.

We can see she may problems although we do not know whether or not it's a lifelong affliction, nor how many aspects of her life it affects.
One problem in particular shows that this is not a recent incident.

[Kathandira]

Google gives you results based on the activity of your IP, so you need to use a search engine like DuckDuckGo. You need to either avoid all social media or use plugins that manipulate the content to mitigate recommendations. This includes YouTube, which you can't even use logged out because the algorithm also uses your IP. You really can only avoid it by doing all of your browsing in incognito windows through a VPN.

This ridiculous and laughable series of protections is not something the average person is going to understand, let alone perform. So why are we wasting time talking about it?

- - - Updated - - -



Like talking to brick walls in this fucking place.

The problem is not that I am personally confused how to avoid the algorithms. The point is what the algorithms are doing to our social and political discourse. LOL CLICK THE THREE DOTS doesn't change any of that. We have a serious social problem with misinformation, and I don't know how you think me personally blocking Ben Shapiro is going to do anything about that.

Bit of a double edged sword. These algorithms also show you think you DO want to see. Yes, there is a misinformation circuit on the internet. And it is each of our own responsibility to mitigate it. Misinformation also comes right from the mouths of people in the office, on the bus, and at the park. This is handled in a similar fashion. I decide I don't want to hear it, I express that I don't want to hear it, and I move along.

[NineSpine]

Bit of a double edged sword. These algorithms also show you think you DO want to see. Yes, there is a misinformation circuit on the internet. And it is each of our own responsibility to mitigate it. Misinformation also comes right from the mouths of people in the office, on the bus, and at the park. This is handled in a similar fashion. I decide I don't want to hear it, I express that I don't want to hear it, and I move along.

I don't care what you do, what you want to hear, or how you move along. I care about solving a collective problem. We don't solve crime problems by "lol I just don't commit crime" or the anti-vaccine problem by "lol I just vaccinate". Your personal choices are immaterial to the problem. You don't matter.

[Azadina]

The lengths some of you are going to to ignore the point I am making is why it's been going on for pages and pages, because you think that having the right conclusions means that you can ignore the facts.

Let's say you call me a murderer in 2019. The court finds the accusation valid enough to hold me for a year. Ultimately, nothing comes of it.

If someone comes around in 2025 saying "HE WAS NEVER ACCUSED OF MURDER" that person looks like an absolute buffoon and nobody is going to take them seriously if they know anything about the case. That person is doing a disservice to me. While advocating for me, they are making the people on my side look ignorant and ill informed.

Ultimately nothing comes of it, because the accusation was made up bullcrap to begin with. That's the part you're refusing to see. It doesn't matter if the court lapped up the bullshit enough to act on, it was still made up. And here we are, 6 years later where you're using that court action as something to validate the suspicions yet again.

It was bullshit from the start. Repeat it with me.

[fwc577]

The lengths some of you are going to to ignore the point I am making is why it's been going on for pages and pages, because you think that having the right conclusions means that you can ignore the facts.

Let's say you call me a murderer in 2019. The court finds the accusation valid enough to hold me for a year. Ultimately, nothing comes of it.

If someone comes around in 2025 saying "HE WAS NEVER ACCUSED OF MURDER" that person looks like an absolute buffoon and nobody is going to take them seriously if they know anything about the case. That person is doing a disservice to me. While advocating for me, they are making the people on my side look ignorant and ill informed.

That's not what is happening here.

The TRUE situation would be....

You're accused of murder in 2019. The court holds you for a year but eventually you're acquitted.

Then people are coming around in 2025 and saying, "HE'S NOT A MURDERED, HE WAS ACQUITTED"

The person going around claiming that someone is guilty of murder without a trial is the true buffoon.

- - - Updated - - -

This is why we lost, because Biden had a mental episode on live TV and instead of acknowledging it you say BUT TRUMP BUT TRUMP BUT TRUMP BUT TRUMP!!!!!!!!>>!!<!OJ!HUI!KHG!KJH!JKHK!JK!J!JKL OH MY GOD TRUMP DID YOU SEE TRUMP TRUMP IS CRAZYZZZZ LKSJDLKSDJLALKJSDJKLSAJLKSD TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP!L!JK!J!JKL!LJK!JKLJ!KL!K:LK:L! TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP!!!K:L!KL:!KL:KL!:KL:!

LOLUMAD?

They both had multiple mental episodes on TV in the last 12 months. The difference is right-wingers are sheep and the media stumps for them so hard. So nobody gave a shit about the fact that Trump is sunsetting just as hard as Biden. It's just that they've got different personalities because Trump spent his entire life being a retarded fucking ape.

[PhaelixWW]

You have an EXTREMELY overinflated view of the technical competency of the average person. Do you genuinely believe the average person even knows what an IP address or an algorithm is?

Both are concepts that can be easily explained in less than 5 minutes to 99% of the population.

Esotery is unimportant for the kind of conversation we're talking about.

[fwc577]

He was deported. He's from El Salvador.

This is really the problem. You have the right conclusion (this guy never should have been deported or even apprehended) but you don't know the case, the law, what the words even mean. That doesn't help us. You make us look stupid.

He wasn't just deported to El Salvador. He was specifically deported and identified as being a part of Tren de Aragua so he wasn't returned to the streets of El Salvador, he was deported straight to Cecot.

[NineSpine]

That's not what is happening here.

The TRUE situation would be....

You're accused of murder in 2019. The court holds you for a year but eventually you're acquitted.

Then people are coming around in 2025 and saying, "HE'S NOT A MURDERED, HE WAS ACQUITTED"

The person going around claiming that someone is guilty of murder without a trial is the true buffoon.

- - - Updated - - -

LOLUMAD?

They both had multiple mental episodes on TV in the last 12 months. The difference is right-wingers are sheep and the media stumps for them so hard. So nobody gave a shit about the fact that Trump is sunsetting just as hard as Biden. It's just that they've got different personalities because Trump spent his entire life being a retarded fucking ape.

We have people in this thread claiming he was never accused of anything, there was no evidence of anything, and that these accusations were made up by Trump's administration. That's false. I don't know what else to tell you. Just because you come to the correct moral conclusion about this situation does not mean you get to fill in the blanks with whatever you want.

We have seen the damage that kind of attitude does. Remember when Michael Brown was a poor kid who got shot by the evil police officer with his back turned and his hands up? And then it turned out to be a way more complicated situation. Do you think that that helped us make the case for police reform? No, being on the moral side of the issue did not mean that we could be completely wrong about the facts of the situation and not lose credibility.

The difference is Trump's brand is not stable, coherent leadership. That is Biden's brand. Trump saying he wants to do mass deportation isn't going to hurt his brand, but if Kamala had said the same thing it would have hurt her badly. When you try to sell the American public on "Look at this unstable, incoherent crazy guy! You need to vote for serious people like us!" and then they see that debate, you lose all credibility.

- - - Updated - - -

Both are concepts that can be easily explained in less than 5 minutes to 99% of the population.

Esotery is unimportant for the kind of conversation we're talking about.

Yeah, you are just delusional about the technical knowledge of the average person. I don't know what else to tell you.

Maybe you can also teach them all how to speak Chinese and assemble a motorcycle, since we are just assuming everyone has a high aptitude for everything.

- - - Updated - - -

He wasn't just deported to El Salvador. He was specifically deported and identified as being a part of Tren de Aragua so he wasn't returned to the streets of El Salvador, he was deported straight to Cecot.

Do you think something you said contradicts me?

[En Sabah Nur]

America will be ashes and the same handful of people going in circles right now will still be going in circles with each other...

Eventually, you just have to stop replying and get off that hamster wheel.

Please, pretty please, holy fuck make this tedious bullshit stop.