Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[We are covfefe]

This is likely going to result in a lot of well.. less than pleasant encounters for ICE. Especially if said people have weapons.

[Draco-Onis]

So it now appears the DOJ is ordering ICE to invade people's homes without a warrant if the agent really really believes there's an undocumented individual in the home.

https://newrepublic.com/post/194442/...5SExwpzIrPSDLw

The Justice Department quietly invoked the Alien Enemies act last month to give Immigration and Customs Enforcement agents the power to conduct warrantless searches of people’s homes as long as they suspect them to be an “alien enemy.” USA Today obtained the memo that contained this order on Friday.

“As much as practicable, officers should follow the proactive procedures above—and have an executed Warrant of Apprehension and Removal—before contacting an Alien Enemy,” the memo reads. “However, that will not always be realistic or effective in swiftly identifying and removing Alien Enemies.… An officer may encounter a suspected Alien Enemy in the natural course of the officer’s enforcement activity, such as when apprehending other validated members of Tren de Aragua. Given the dynamic nature of enforcement operations, officers in the field are authorized to apprehend aliens upon a reasonable belief that the alien meets all four requirements to be validated as an Alien Enemy. This authority includes entering an Alien Enemy’s residence to make an AEA apprehension where circumstances render it impracticable to first obtain a signed Notice and Warrant of Apprehension and Removal” (emphasis added).

In the memo, the Justice Department defined an “alien enemy” as anyone who is 14 years of age or older, not a U.S. citizen or lawful permanent resident, a citizen of Venezuela, and “a member of the hostile enemy Tren de Aragua,” per the Alien Enemy Validation Guide, a document that has already been slammed by immigration experts.

The broad definition has already resulted in the apprehension and deportation of more than 200 men to El Salvador who just happened to have tattoos, like gay makeup artist Andry José Hernández Romero.

This type of order will likely lead to more indiscriminate arrests and wanton racial profiling. The memo, which is from March 14, is another massive departure from the U.S. immigration norms.

Strange men in civilian clothes with their faces covered invading people's home without identifying themselves surely this won't end in a tragic fire fights and deaths /s

This administration is not just cruel but keeps proving itself incredibly stupid, they give zero fucks about anyone even the gestapo doing their dirty work.

[tehdang]

The piece of shit racists tried to take someone from a court room without a warrant. Please explain how telling them they have the wrong warrant is somehow worse than embezzlement of 70k in funds by the scumfuck he just pardoned.

I corrected your misapprehension of judicial immunity. Are you now in agreement with me? I’m really having trouble seeing why you won’t abandon this post like you abandoned your last one. I’m not going to chase you from subject to subject.

[Draco-Onis]

This is likely going to result in a lot of well.. less than pleasant encounters for ICE. Especially if said people have weapons.

That's not going into given their complete incompetence how long until they break into the wrong address too.

[Sunseeker]

Strange men in civilian clothes with their faces covered invading people's home without identifying themselves surely this won't end in a tragic fire fights and deaths /s

This administration is not just cruel but keeps proving itself incredibly stupid, they give zero fucks about anyone even the gestapo doing their dirty work.

Maybe that's what's needed to get people to pull their heads out of their asses. And I'm referring to both Republicans who think this is totes awesomesauce and Democrats who think this can be resolved with hugs.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

So it now appears the DOJ is ordering ICE to invade people's homes without a warrant if the agent really really believes there's an undocumented individual in the home.

Republics love the 2nd amendment and stand your ground laws, so they shouldn’t complain when they start being put into use.

[Edge-]

Republics love the 2nd amendment and stand your ground laws, so hopefully they won’t complain when they start being put into use.

there is a fair bit of overlap between antigovernment loons and second amendment enthusiasts. though i somehow doubt those are the folks who are gonna get targeted for warrantless invasions of their fourth amendment rights by ice agents and the like.

[Sunseeker]

there is a fair bit of overlap between antigovernment loons and second amendment enthusiasts. though i somehow doubt those are the folks who are gonna get targeted for warrantless invasions of their fourth amendment rights by ice agents and the like.

"Targetted"? Its not like they know what house theyre going into. They'll probably just go door-to-door.

[Xath]

I corrected your misapprehension of judicial immunity. Are you now in agreement with me? I’m really having trouble seeing why you won’t abandon this post like you abandoned your last one. I’m not going to chase you from subject to subject.

I'm not wrong I'm just not going to bother arguing with a brick wall instead I will throw your hypocrisy in your face in the futile hope you realize you elected a fascist dictator.

[Edge-]

"Targetted"? Its not like they know what house theyre going into. They'll probably just go door-to-door.

they will absolutely target houses based on all kinds of data, including just going to immigrant neighborhoods etc. targeting individually? maybe at times, but generally not. but i wouldn't be surprised to see them occasionally roll deep into immigrant communities.

[Breccia]

Nobody is above the law

You don't believe this. You defended Trump for years, including his grand jury results. Therefore, your entire "defense" is handwaved as hypocrisy.

- - - Updated - - -

(refused to actually discuss the issue, pedantically nitpicking instead)

(Dismisses lack of argument derisively)

[Doomcookie]

You proposed that some level of invective against the Trump administration (lying, errors, whatnot) would allow you to assert that this judge’s arrest was de-facto unjustified. Secondly, it would absolve you of the logical fallacy of proving a negative: force your opponent to prove it isn’t one. Both are wrong, and I just finished pointing out why your standard is wrong.

We’ve been through the weaponization stuff several times, so I’ll try to be brief. Trump was charged by several political opponents, prosecutors that ran for office promising to fight him legally, and all the rest. You’re proposing to me that such prosecutions can be said to be wrong simply because of the claim of weaponization. Impossible. You can claim certain crimes wouldn’t be prosecuted etc etc, but not that the arrest and trial are unjustified. It’s nonsense.

I guess I’ll have to say it once again to you. Your bluster and political invective doesn’t free you from obeying simple logic and avoiding fallacies. If the judge is innocent or guilty of this charge does not rely on the surrounding character of the chief executive of the agency bringing it! She could be guilty as sin and the boss of the boss of the boss of agency bringing this action is a corrupt mis-manager. Spouting off, as you do, confirms only one thing: you really dislike the administration, and you don’t mind telling everybody why.

Now, I have never set out to convince you, EdgE, that all your exaggerations and the kernel of truth behind some portion of them should be dropped. You can believe the US will fall tomorrow into a police state and all the elections will be canceled forever if you like. Your hysteria does not absolve you from treating an arrest as a case that can be examined for its merits. You may think it does, but it does not. The law doesn’t give you an “out” like “this crime doesn’t count, can’t you see the prosecutor’s boss just did this terrible thing!!!”

I’m really sad that your model of the justice system is inferential. You may infer justice. Your law doesn’t rely on lawbreaking: people exist above the law (this judge) simply because you infer that no proper charges may be brought by the people constitutionally and statutorily appointed to bring such charges. I simply won’t yield your behavioral, predictive system.

I’m not in it to debate your prejudice or the foundations for it. You’re always free to believe that you know *right now* that the arrest is abuse. However, you will never be free to tell others that they can infer an abusive arrest just given everything else the administration has done on a variety of fronts. That puts the cart before the horse. To the contrary, we will both discover if this arrest was like the deportation of Garcia to El Salvador, or an entirely different kind.

Nobody is above the law, even if you’re really, really unhappy about who’s in charge of enforcing the law.

So, how long should Trump spend in prison?

[Draco-Onis]

they will absolutely target houses based on all kinds of data, including just going to immigrant neighborhoods etc. targeting individually? maybe at times, but generally not. but i wouldn't be surprised to see them occasionally roll deep into immigrant communities.

The most pathetic part is that Trump is deporting less people than Biden because going the regular route you have people go through the system and leave instead of hiding in fear. There's also the fact that government spending is ballooning every law enforcement department including DEA and people monitoring violent crime against minors have been roped in to work on deportations. This is just about sound and fury signifying nothing he is destroying the economy, traumatizing families and still fucking failing.

[Rasulis]

Judge says 2-year-old US citizen appears to have been deported with ‘no meaningful process’
The girl was deported Friday with her mother to Honduras, despite her father’s efforts to keep her in the United States.

Is this Trump's administration test case for deporting US citizens and their 14th Amendment case?

[Breccia]

Things are not looking great for friend of the forums Mike Lindell.

According to this judge's response

Despite this unequivocal provision in the Trial Preparation Order, Mr. Kachouroff, lead counsel for Defendants, repeatedly represented during the Final Pretrial/Trial Preparation Conference that he was unaware that Plaintiff’s Motion in Limine would be discussed at the conference. Nor was he prepared to do so; indeed, Mr. Kachouroff did not have a copy of the Opposition with him. As discussed extensively on the record, after confirming with Mr. Kachouroff that he signed the Opposition consistent with his obligations under Rule 11 of the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, the Court identified nearly thirty defective citations in the Opposition. These defects include but are not limited to misquotes of cited cases; misrepresentations of principles of law associated with cited cases, including discussions of legal principles that simply do not appear within such decisions; misstatements regarding whether case law originated from a binding authority such as the United States Court of Appeals for the Tenth Circuit; misattributions of case law to this District; and most egregiously, citation of cases that do not exist.

"That...uh...that could simply be nearly thirty accidents."

First of all, making nearly thirty accidents in one brief is cause for being dragged out of the court in handcuffs straight to your disbarring. Second of all, no, that's not what happened.

Not until this Court asked Mr. Kachouroff directly whether the Opposition was the product of generative artificial intelligence did Mr. Kachouroff admit that he did, in fact, use generative artificial intelligence.

Yeah. Mike Lindell's team filed a brief written by AI. The one thing about law here literally every reader of these forums knows never to do.

Naturally, the filing lawyer was asked how these came to be. Naturally, he tried to refuse to answer.

Your Honor I may have made a mistake and I may have paraphrased and put quotes by mistake. I wasn’t intending to mislead the Court. I don’t think the quote is far off from what you read to me.

"Are you allowed to put quotes on a paraphrasing?"

No.

"Are you allowed to 'paraphrase' a law, a judge's ruling, or a decision?"

No. Even if you argue that it's the spirit of the law that matters, the actual law is made of very specific words. It's the science that only comes in second to mathematics in the "use exactly what's written or it doesn't work".

Kachouroff then tried "that wasn't the real brief, we filed the draft by accident" so favored by Team Trump, flipped the judge off with six fingers, and ordered strarwberrry ice cream.

[Rasulis]

The Trump administration announcement that it aims to speed deployment of self-driving vehicles by exempting some from certain safety requirements and easing rules requiring reporting of safety incidents sent Tesla shares up nearly 10% on Friday.

Blatant cronyism. Unfortunately for Musk, he still needs permits from individual states.

[Edge-]

The Trump administration announcement that it aims to speed deployment of self-driving vehicles by exempting some from certain safety requirements and easing rules requiring reporting of safety incidents sent Tesla shares up nearly 10% on Friday.

Blatant cronyism. Unfortunately for Musk, he still needs permits from individual states.

good luck insuring them to drive on the road, i guess? i'm not sure any insurance carrier would be interested in that kind of liability

[Rasulis]

good luck insuring them to drive on the road, i guess? i'm not sure any insurance carrier would be interested in that kind of liability

Tesla's cars are already some of the most expensive cars to insured.

Insuring a Tesla car is generally more expensive than insuring many other vehicles. The average cost to insure a Tesla Model 3 is $3,495 annually, while a Model X SUV averages $5,459 per year. The average cost to insure a Tesla Model Y with full coverage is $3,996 annually.

As for the Robotaxi service, I guess Tesla can post bond and self-insured? Not really sure.

[Sunseeker]

they will absolutely target houses based on all kinds of data, including just going to immigrant neighborhoods etc. targeting individually? maybe at times, but generally not. but i wouldn't be surprised to see them occasionally roll deep into immigrant communities.

My point was that cops, who at least have some shred of accountability in their job, fuck up going to the "right house" on a regular basis. ICE, with no accountability and a legal blank check to break down your door, aren't going to give two shits whose house they raid. Immigrant house? Yay they got one! Citizen house? Clearly someone aiding the enemy! The neighbors place? Really the right place all along, look more secret terrorists!

Their "data" will consist of "a brown person was spotted within a hundred yards of this place" therefore they will knock down every door and will always find the right guy. Because like on Cardassia, the verdict is always guilty.

[PhaelixWW]

Things are not looking great for friend of the forums Mike Lindell.

Wake me when we get to the "the dog ate my legal brief" portion of the defense's excuses.