Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[zealo]

Dear, if you performed the same interpolation for Obama, you'd end up with ~12 trillion.

Obama entered office not long after the worst financial crash in the US in decades, when one of the largest investment banks in the country collapsed.

There is no good reason for why the deficit should be this bad when the economy was doing far better than that when handed over to Trump.

[Dontrike]

Obama entered office not long after the worst financial crash in the US in decades, when one of the largest investment banks in the country collapsed.

There is no good reason for why the deficit should be this bad when the economy was doing far better than that when handed over to Trump.

And as we saw Obama was decreasing the rate the deficit grew over time and Trump damn near made it jump 50% from Obama's last year. Trumplestiltskins not understanding context is not surprising. It's like snails and salt.

[Mormolyce]

Why are conservatives such violent thugs?

Don't confuse conservatives with racist thugs.

They're just people who sit happily next to racist thugs and say nothing. And vote the same way as the racist thugs. But take extreme personal offence if you call out the racist thugs.

[rda]

I see people are still replying to folks like rda. Honestly, it's just not worth the condescending "dear" to do so, imo.

The only reason I am putting "Dear" near some posts is that I keep being astounded at an absolute ineptness of many of the points that are being made and are then eaten for granted by the uncritical nodders. I am not going to post for long in this thread, mind you, most of the posts here are uninteresting misguided garbage. It's just that in the short time that I am here I keep being amazed at the ineptness of the arguments, and the arrogant ignorance of posters who are "making" them.

[Templar 331]

The fact that he thinks a popcorn machine will boost morale makes him as dumb as the person he grabs hamberders with.

What's worst is the machine is in his office. Meaning he wants to see you come get some popcorn. What happens when you don't?

[Themius]

I thought I saw everything, but "how does economic growth help people specifically?" left me speechless.

Themius, dear. Study more. You are asking things so basic, nobody knows where to even start answering.

You need to study more seriously.

If the economy grows and inflation grows, but WAGES DO NOT GROW a growing economy does not affect the common person in a positive way. Having a growing economy where factors don't directly lead to a growth in spending power means jack and shit for the common person you need to study more you need to learn more not me.

For instance the economy GREW a fuck shit ton from 1983 to 2018 yet fast food workers in 1983 made on average $18.30 adjusted for spending power so what did all that growth in economy mean for the common person when all jobs with the exception of technology effectively have less spending power today than over 30 years ago?

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https://www.marketwatch.com/press-re...at-2019-04-24/

Wage growth even higher for those at the bottom. Because of historic unemployment we will see real wage growth. The high GDP will import de-flation from struggling western countries that are simply not growing like the United States. This is good for the American Worker.

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https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth
If the United States had numbers like that the party in power would not win another election for a generation.

I feel that slower growth but with a leading cause of bankruptcy taken care of would be well received.

Wages barely grew and that doesn't undo literally almost 40 years of the stagnation and regression of wages.

[Belize]

That's nice.

You missed an amazing opportunity to say "That's nice, dear"

[Endus]

I thought I saw everything, but "how does economic growth help people specifically?" left me speechless.

Themius, dear. Study more. You are asking things so basic, nobody knows where to even start answering.

You're essentially arguing that wealth "trickles down", here, and trickle-down economics is so thoroughly debunked you don't have any justification for pretending your hobby horse is high enough for you to look down from.

Without the nonsense of trickle-down theory, there's nothing about economic growth that necessarily benefits the working and middle classes; growth largely benefits the wealthy. And we've got literally decades of that happening to point to as evidence. Economic growth has been steady, and wages for the working and middle class have been more-or-less stable since the late '70s, despite that economic growth; the two lines are disconnected.

Here is that issue, in simple graphic format;



Around the late '70s, the two lines diverged, with wages stagnating, and productivity continuing to rise. That economic growth is no longer tied to wage growth for workers.

[Captain N]

Around the late '70s, the two lines diverged, with wages stagnating, and productivity continuing to rise. That economic growth is no longer tied to wage growth for workers.

It's almost as if the beginning of the fall of unions in 1974 had something to do with wages beginning to stagnate.

[Benggaul]

Guys, rda is the same guy who said "This will be the last time I post about this" in the Mueller thread and then continued posting for another week. He claims to "not have a side in this" but then continually defends Trump. He is, as he himself states in another thread "A Russian living in Russia" and, while I am loathe to tar an entire country with the same brush, we already have a Russian propagandist in here "trying to earn his turnips" as others have put it so is it really worth spending your time replying to this one? You've seen the disingenuous arguments. You've seen the mental gymnastics to twist the facts and ignore the context. You've seen pretty much all you need to just shrug your shoulders and move the discussion forward rather than bogging yourselves down with his brand of nonsense.

The less people respond to these people the less we'll all have to scroll on past ignored posters to get to a real discussion.

[Zan15]

Dear, if you performed the same interpolation for Obama, you'd end up with ~12 trillion.

Why on earth would you go back and even do that to something that has already happened????
Take the first 2 years of Obama's debt growth and ignore the changes in year 3-8????



I could see if there was some plan or projection that the current administration had that showed the same kind of planned reduction but that is not the case here.
There is no estimate, prediction or budget plan that will reduce the current trend.
If anything it accelerates the debt expectation and just taking the current trend and saying its going to be 8 trillion would be wrong.

[Vatrilian]

So 3.2% gdp growth, record stock market, historic unemployment for literally every group of persons, wage growth by 3.8%, and very low inflation. What a shit show. Want to see a shit show look at Canada’s economy or look at the rest of the industrialized west. No one is growing but the United States, I wonder why?

[Noxx79]

So 3.2% gdp growth, record stock market, historic unemployment for literally every group of persons, wage growth by 3.8%, and very low inflation. What a shit show. Want to see a shit show look at Canada’s economy or look at the rest of the industrialized west. No one is growing but the United States, I wonder why?

Ask trump why this wasn’t good enough when Obama was president.

But since you’re barely literate, I don’t expect you to.

[Breccia]

Ask trump why this wasn’t good enough when Obama was president.

Exactly.

Trump is doing almost as well as the person Trump called "worst President ever".

Also, "wage growth" isn't as important as "real wage growth". Trump pumped up the inflation. It's not really 3.8%. Further information contained in this thread.

[Zan15]

So 3.2% gdp growth, record stock market, historic unemployment for literally every group of persons, wage growth by 3.8%, and very low inflation. What a shit show. Want to see a shit show look at Canada’s economy or look at the rest of the industrialized west. No one is growing but the United States, I wonder why?

lol Canada's GDP has never really been a monster and is currently within their normal range.

GDP Growth Rate in Canada averaged 0.78 percent from 1961 until 2018, reaching an all time high of 3.10 percent in the fourth quarter of 1963 and a record low of -2.30 percent in the first quarter of 2009.

Their growth rate was 1.6% in the first Quarter More than 100% better than their average.

The US? 3.2%, about the average.


not sure what you expect using their GDP as an example?
As for the other stats

Their unemployment is 5.6% and their moving average over the last 50 years is 7.64 percent from 1966 until 2019, its near a 40 year low, just like the US
Year-over-year average hourly wage growth for all employees in March was 2.4 per cent


The annual inflation rate in Canada rose to 1.9 percent in March 2019 the same as the US.
https://tradingeconomics.com/united-.../inflation-cpi
https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/inflation-cpi

[Sky High]

Trump is basically at 2 trillion in a quarter of the time it took Obama to get near 7, that would put Trump on path to go over 8 trillion.

Math. Learn it.

Also, the context of Obama being given a shitty economy and turning it around is far better than Trump being handed a great one and still somehow running up the deficit like it's one of his casinos.

Well no, the Trumpcucks only ever care about things that make their daddy look good, everything else is fake news.

[jakeic]

record stock market

There was a lot of non-sense in what you posted, basically an illiterate persons take on the economy, but this point in particular is stupid. The indexes by which you judge the stock market are by design to always be at record levels, so claiming it as a feather in your cap is like claiming you're an excellent carpenter because your roof has not collapsed.

[Amalaric]

If Trump is Thanos will some Democrats become the Avengers?

[Vatrilian]

There was a lot of non-sense in what you posted, basically an illiterate persons take on the economy, but this point in particular is stupid. The indexes by which you judge the stock market are by design to always be at record levels, so claiming it as a feather in your cap is like claiming you're an excellent carpenter because your roof has not collapsed.

Its not just the record but the percent gained since he was elected. You choose to ignore the historic unemployment, wage growth, and GDP gain. There were no record gains in Obamas first term.

[Dontrike]

So 3.2% gdp growth, record stock market, historic unemployment for literally every group of persons, wage growth by 3.8%, and very low inflation. What a shit show. Want to see a shit show look at Canada’s economy or look at the rest of the industrialized west. No one is growing but the United States, I wonder why?

Now explain what he did to do any of that.

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Its not just the record but the percent gained since he was elected. You choose to ignore the historic unemployment, wage growth, and GDP gain. There were no record gains in Obamas first term.

Unemployment was going down for years, before Trump, and the trend only continued.
Wage growth is barely keeping up with inflation.
GDP gain has not be record in any way, in fact it's pretty damn unimpressive considering Trump said he could get higher than 6%.