Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Mihalik]

Trump saying the quiet part out loud again. As well as not knowing how the SCOTUS works.

Oh he does know how it works. It's just his way of saying, it's time to purge the court, not to leave even token dissenter, just 9 yes men who will rubber stamp everything put in front of them.

Democracy is dead in America. The question now is for how long?

Will it be a decade or two? Or for generations to come?

If anybody still thinks Biden will ever be sworn in (doesn't matter if he wins or not) is delusional.

The fascists have won. And if I were still living in the US (glad I'm not) and be trans/gay/a civil rights activist/a public figure who opposed the Trump administration, I'd be making sure that my passport is in order and look up ways to seek asylum in Mexico/Canada.

[Benggaul]

Holly shit... NY is out of the top 10! Good for them... nice! I might finally get to fly in to see my folks... “soon”...

New York has only rarely been on my list for several weeks. Since the beginning of June they've been over 1k only about a dozen times. They haven't been "top ten" very often at all for months.

[Belize]

I wasn't talking about Yall-Queda raising up if their cult leader wasn't elected. I have them for family and I know a lot of them will turn into terrorists if Biden becomes president.

I was talking about if Biden wins by the popular vote going into the electoral college and then the governors turn them into faithless electors who defy their states to elect Trump anyways. THAT will lead to violence and if it didn't, then we have just emboldened them further and they will push the envelope even further again because we have proven we won't do anything and this nation is effectively lost.

It'd be a very short lived "war", more akin to the French Revolution at worst.

All of the real economic and social power in the U.S. rests in either blue states as a whole, or blue cities within red states. The logistics simply aren't there for Conservatives.

William Sherman had a quote (paraphrased) before the American Civil war that the South were fucking idiots for even thinking about trying, because they were barely able to make shoes, while the North held all of the power.

This hasn't changed 150 years later. If Republicans try to pull this shit, it's their head on a platter, and they're going to find real quick that the portion of their base that's willing to do more than talk tough on Twitter is very, very small.

[jonnysensible]

It'd be a very short lived "war", more akin to the French Revolution at worst.

lol best case is years of lead, worst case is omega syria - 10 years or more of really brutal stuff.

i think he will ratfuck and then fuck off if he loses. then cultivate a media platform that will lead to more stochastic terrorism.

[Mihalik]

It'd be a very short lived "war", more akin to the French Revolution at worst.

You are assuming both sides are as committed to and as capable of long term sustained violence.

They are not. Right wingers in America are much more willing and prepared to act violently.

Furthermore, there's a major distinction between civilians and the state security apparatus.

In the US the state security apparatus is wildly right leaning. This from local police departments to federal law enforcement, to intelligence services all the way to the military.

Additionally in the US the military is culturally very Southern, much of the US military infrastructure is concentrated in Southern/Midwest states. The economic weight of blue states/cities is meaningless when the state security apparatus meant to defend it is solidly red.

Everyone who ever fantasized about the US military or the FBI dragging Trump out of The White House has been deluding themselves with fantasies about a military/law enforcement that only exists in Hollywood fiction.

In a fascists state the entire American state security apparatus will go "We're just obeying orders" so fast that it will give everyone whiplash.

[Adam Jensen]

Trump on his message to Blacks upset with handling of Breonna Taylor case: "I love the Black community, and I've done more for the Black community with the possible exception of Abraham Lincoln."

Such a simple minded piece of garbage. Moron with his lack of intelligence can only brand himself as he had been the greatest since Lincoln. So insulting for any person to make a claim that they helped out a certain group than another person.

Won't get too deep but if also believe that setting African American slaves was the pinnacle then again just plain insulting.

LBJ, racist LYNDON BAINES JOHNSON, did more for the black community than Donald Trump.

[Thepersona]

LBJ, racist LYNDON BAINES JOHNSON, did more for the black community than Donald Trump.

I mean, he did pass the biggest chunk of civil rights legislation since the reconstruction era. I dont think he did it for the goodness of his heart, but his actions were effing solid.

[eschatological]

See, the seeds of this have been around since the Clinton Admin, and began germinating during Obama's tenure when the Reactionary Tea Party movement popped up in response to the possibility of a black guy being president. Then that animosity continued to fester, as the voice of the Republican electorate shifted into just being about not being 'Liberals' and dictated electable policy amongst the GOP and finally culminated in someone 'brave' - IE: Tactless - enough to simply say the quiet parts out loud and pandered directly to the ignorant masses.

Trump could've been some hick from Kansas or a tech mogul from California and I think he would've still won with the way he had acted during the 2016 election cycle.

They've existed long before that. McCarthy decried secret communists, Nixon had a hate boner for all liberals that he collabed with Hoover to create secret police files on many of them. Reagan used coded language, and not so coded language like the Cadillac welfare queens, which were never a thing. Bush Sr. called "liberalism" the "l word" as if it was a curse word.

But yes, I agree, it gained actual political force when the Republicans won the House for the first time in 40 years in 1994, with Newt Gingrich's New World Order or whatever the fuck he called it, which mainly just consisted of attacking and defaming constantly. It's not a coincidence that the only "good Republicans" are Republicans from before that period, when they had no power and had to work with the Dems on damn near everything.

[Smitzelplix]

Trump on his message to Blacks upset with handling of Breonna Taylor case: "I love the Black community, and I've done more for the Black community with the possible exception of Abraham Lincoln."

Such a simple minded piece of garbage. Moron with his lack of intelligence can only brand himself as he had been the greatest since Lincoln. So insulting for any person to make a claim that they helped out a certain group than another person.

Won't get too deep but if also believe that setting African American slaves was the pinnacle then again just plain insulting.

I think this article would go nicely with what you linked. It shows that Trump doesn't really care about about the Black community, he's just doing whatever he can to improve his election chances and when it doesn't go his way he throws a tantrum.

'Why the hell did I do that?': Trump 'went s---house crazy' when criminal-justice reforms failed to improve his polling with Black voters, report says

[Thepersona]

I think this article would go nicely with what you linked. It shows that Trump doesn't really care about about the Black community, he's just doing whatever he can to improve his election chances and when it doesn't go his way he throws a tantrum.

'Why the hell did I do that?': Trump 'went s---house crazy' when criminal-justice reforms failed to improve his polling with Black voters, report says

So, you're telling me that all of the drive by shitposters that wrote here "Trump is winning back the black voter (paraphrased)" were lying pieces of shit? Who would've thought?

[Fugus]

It'd be a very short lived "war", more akin to the French Revolution at worst.

All of the real economic and social power in the U.S. rests in either blue states as a whole, or blue cities within red states. The logistics simply aren't there for Conservatives.

William Sherman had a quote (paraphrased) before the American Civil war that the South were fucking idiots for even thinking about trying, because they were barely able to make shoes, while the North held all of the power.

This hasn't changed 150 years later. If Republicans try to pull this shit, it's their head on a platter, and they're going to find real quick that the portion of their base that's willing to do more than talk tough on Twitter is very, very small.

Sad thing is I know my brother in law is one of them that would try. He is basically the living example of how a good soldier doesn't mean you are a good leader.

He is willing to fight anyone and everyone doesn't matter if it is armed or unarmed. But he would rather eat a bullet himself than dare question his beliefs or educate himself on anything that would force him to question them. I would be willing to fight and die on the hill but too scared to question why he is on that hill to begin with or whether he is fighting on a hill that endangers what he is supposed to care about. And yes, he is in Florida so he fits in rather well down there.

Even his own kids know that his stances are crazy. Had my niece who lives up here just today ask me about politics because he had told her that if Biden got elected Americans would have to get in line at food drives to eat. She knows he isn't educated and can't admit when he is wrong. Had to tell her that isn't going to happen and is more likely under Trump at this point and that political advise from him is about as good as advice on smoking weed is from me (A non-smoker).

[Corvus]

You are assuming both sides are as committed to and as capable of long term sustained violence.

They are not. Right wingers in America are much more willing and prepared to act violently.

Furthermore, there's a major distinction between civilians and the state security apparatus.

In the US the state security apparatus is wildly right leaning. This from local police departments to federal law enforcement, to intelligence services all the way to the military.

Additionally in the US the military is culturally very Southern, much of the US military infrastructure is concentrated in Southern/Midwest states. The economic weight of blue states/cities is meaningless when the state security apparatus meant to defend it is solidly red.

Everyone who ever fantasized about the US military or the FBI dragging Trump out of The White House has been deluding themselves with fantasies about a military/law enforcement that only exists in Hollywood fiction.

In a fascists state the entire American state security apparatus will go "We're just obeying orders" so fast that it will give everyone whiplash.

I think you are really underestimating the US military - they are an entirely different beast to the US police.

Unlike a lot of other countries, the military's allegiance isn't to the president or the party - it is to the constitution. While the officer corp may favour republican over democratic, being older, the younger enlisted lean more democratic than republican. And even if the officers do favour the republicans, a recent survey has 60% of the officer corp having an unfavourable view of Trump, even higher than the enlisted.

And polling shows that more military personnel, both enlisted and officers, are planning to vote Biden than Trump.

And why would the military risk it all to defend Trump? After all he is a man who dodged service, who sold out allies, fawned over enemies and denigrated the military war dead.

I wouldn't be worried about a civil war or the military supporting any Trump attempts to steal the election.

[Fugus]

I think you are really underestimating the US military - they are an entirely different beast to the US police.

Unlike a lot of other countries, the military's allegiance isn't to the president or the party - it is to the constitution. While the officer corp may favour republican over democratic, being older, the younger enlisted lean more democratic than republican. And even if the officers do favour the republicans, a recent survey has 60% of the officer corp having an unfavourable view of Trump, even higher than the enlisted.

And polling shows that more military personnel, both enlisted and officers, are planning to vote Biden than Trump.

And why would the military risk it all to defend Trump? After all he is a man who dodged service, who sold out allies, fawned over enemies and denigrated the military war dead.

I wouldn't be worried about a civil war or the military supporting any Trump attempts to steal the election.

Your going easy on him.

He attacked McCain for being a POW.
He attacked Mattis.
He attacked the family of a dead gold star veteran.
He interfered with UCMJ action against a war criminal and prevented them from even losing rank.
He took them away from their families during the holidays and sent them to the southern border where they couldn't do anything during an election year.
He forced them to abandon their own allies who fought and died beside them.
He forced them to leave people who helped them against ISIS behind for ISIS to kill.
He deported active duty military and their family who were serving as a condition of their citizen ship.
His deafening silence of Russia paying to have them killed.
Him calling them suckers and losers and saying that he didn't want disabled vets in parades because "No one wants to see an amputee".


Any military to back him after all that is every bit the sucker and loser he believes them to be.

[Fugus]

No wonder public opinion of America is going down the shitters in all nations that don't directly gain from a weaker US.

Pretty much. I hate to say it, but the best option at this point would be for them to collectively turn on us and isolate us and actually be vocal enough to make it known but it is because of Trump and the Republican party and make sure it hurts us. That's about the only way his voters would actually even remotely get a clue and sad thing is, even then it is really too late for that, they would have needed to do it 6 months ago and made sure we collectively felt the sting as a nation to the point that not even the GoP could pretend a blind eye to it.

[Kaleredar]

Pretty much. I hate to say it, but the best option at this point would be for them to collectively turn on us and isolate us and actually be vocal enough to make it known but it is because of Trump and the Republican party and make sure it hurts us. That's about the only way his voters would actually even remotely get a clue and sad thing is, even then it is really too late for that, they would have needed to do it 6 months ago and made sure we collectively felt the sting as a nation to the point that not even the GoP could pretend a blind eye to it.

The only thing to be gained by having other nations "condemn" Trump would be to directly feed into his "America first, the UN is evil, I alone know what's best for the world and I'm strong enough to stand up to all of them and if you don't elect me the UN death panels will steal your guns and make refugees live in your house" narrative Trump is desperately trying to create.


The solution to these Trump problems very much begin with removing Trump. I have no doubts Biden is perfectly capable of competently interfacing with the geopolitical world.

[ati87]

I mean, he did pass the biggest chunk of civil rights legislation since the reconstruction era. I dont think he did it for the goodness of his heart, but his actions were effing solid.

Wanting credit for a policy that his party prevented from achieving isn't really a selling argument on why you should get any credit.

[Fugus]

The only thing to be gained by having other nations "condemn" Trump would be to directly feed into his "America first, the UN is evil, I alone know what's best for the world and I'm strong enough to stand up to all of them and if you don't elect me the UN death panels will steal your guns and make refugees live in your house" narrative Trump is desperately trying to create.


The solution to these Trump problems very much begin with removing Trump. I have no doubts Biden is perfectly capable of competently interfacing with the geopolitical world.

Oh, I don't doubt Biden will be better than Trump. The syphilitic scrotum of a goat as president would be better than Trump and would be less of a national embarrassment.

I don't mean them condemning Trump directly, that would feed into their victim complex. I mean for them to turn on us and actually state concrete reasons for it that track straight back to his policies.

If they named Trump as the reason directly, then yeah. If they mentioned how we don't keep our end of international agreements anymore or we aren't trustworthy when we abandon our own allies to die or we are a health risk to their nations because we don't follow the advice of experts and other such things, they have no way to really dismiss that. They just have to be vocal as hell out it to the point every news outlet can pick it up and so on. THAT would have an impact.

[Paranoid Android]

LBJ, racist LYNDON BAINES JOHNSON, did more for the black community than Donald Trump.

Yes. I wanted to keep it short but freeing African Americans was the tip. Giving them rights as US citizens was much more of a larger step. Trying not to go too deep again, but you can free them and if they are 2nd or likely 3rd class citizens it is a miserable place to live. Yes, people not trying to make a comparison that it's worse than slavery.

[Mihalik]

sip.

The political leanings of the individual soldier/officer don't account for much within the overall culture of an institution like the military itself.

The military has no mechanism/process to deal with something like a stolen election legitimized by a partisan SCOTUS.

In the ensuing civil unrest they can still be used to suppress protests (as we have seen recently in Lafayette Square, or more historically the Kent State Shootings). And as soon as protesters use force to resist then the whole thing becomes an automatic response.

We know that the soldiers at Lafayette Square wildly disagreed with the orders they were receiving. Yet.... Here we are.

And we know from Kent State how easily things can escalate once you use armed soldiers to suppress protests.

There are plenty of other international examples for similar things, but I stuck the US ones, but there's something worth mentioning.

You know where else were people confident in the moral backbone of the military as an institution and its ability to resist extremists?

Weimar Germany circa 1930.

[Paranoid Android]

Trump when asked if he would commit to a peaceful transfer of power if he loses: "We're gonna have to see what happens."

Trump when pressed again to answer: "Get rid of the ballots, we'll have a very peaceful transfer."

A disqualifying statement.

Holy Shit!

He is speaking as President of literally getting rid of ballots. Now this dude is such a simple moron that you could take it as every ballot that doesn't vote for him. I believe he is talking about all mail-in ballots, which HOLY SHIT this is going to be many votes since the COVID pandemic.

This is real people!