But Biden will not do that neither will Harris they are both products of the failed system that Trump has managed to twist and abuse. I agree with you that we need to break up the system that have allowed them to weasel their way into power but I don't think that they will do it. Biden has made it pretty clear that he can't wait to embrace people like Lindsey Graham after what they have done these last four years. Biden will most likely be the forgiver in chief and we will be in a worse spot for it.
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Quickmix the Decepticon.
I see no reason to believe Biden will be willing to work along with any of the republicans, especially if the democrats take the house and senate.
I don’t really care what he might have said on the matter in the mid 90s or whatever; 2020 is not 1997 or 2008 or even 2016. It’s clear to everyone, especially the democrats at this point in time, that the republicans are completely morally bankrupt.
As for “Biden and Harris will have been elected by a failed system...” uh, not really. If they win because they win the popular vote (likely) and the electoral college vote (An unfortunate necessity and one that’s more up in the air) after having won the democratic primaries fair and square, which Biden did, I’d deem that an absolutely deserved victory, and a testament to America’s ability to do away with the petty machinations of would-be tyrants.
“Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
Words to live by.
If they try that bipartisan crap then we are fucked as a nation and I hope they realize that and is probably what the republicans fear they have figured out by now.
When the Democrats get in, they know they need to give the Republicans a taste of their own medicine this time or they prove that there are no consequences and even further emboldens those like AOC to run which they fear.
If the Democrats get power, they need to be as bipartisan as the republicans were in Trumps first 2 years and cooperate just as much as then and what they pulled under Obama. If they haven't figured out that by now, we are effectively screwed as a nation unless the younger generation raise up enough to replace them with people who will.
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I’m curious what is the purpose of a “Conservative party”.
A complete and total collapse of the Republican party, followed by a schism in the Democratic Party, leading to a national Progressive or Dem Soc Party on the left and the Democratic Party on the right, would be the best thing for the country overall.
Since Progressives and Democrats are pretty much in lock step on social values (essentially, have whatever social values you want personally, but don't try to legislate your preferences to strip rights from others with different preferences), that would leave the lines of division on things like worker rights, tax policy, the role of government in providing social services, the strength of the military, etc.
You know, the things that actually matter in terms of governance and making a difference in the day to day in the lives of constituents, instead of nonsense like "religious freedom" to discriminate against LGBT and control women's health.
look out for the interests of the elite (democracy relies on thier voluntary participation) , and maintain a firewall against fascism.
republicans have obviously failed badly in the US. 'Conservative Parties and the Birth of Democracy' is the book for you. I'm sure if you google it you will find articles with Ziblatt (how democracies die is pretty decent too)
GOP are just kind of crazy, the ads being played in Iowa about Greenfield and Ernst are bonkers, in one pro Ernst ad she talks about keeping insurance for pre-existing conditions, another for making medication affordable, and a final one about how she will protect social security, these positions are the literal opposite of the planks of the Republican Party and the opposite of her voting record. Then her attack ads on Greenfield have her kicking families out of their homes, raising taxes and spending $95 trillion on healthcare (not a typo), and a final ad where Greenfield morphs into Nancy Pelosi while AOC's dismembered head is yelling about socialism.
It is like the entire GOP has gone collectively insane in solidarity with Trump.
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As I said, I see no real reason why the democrats would attempt to be bipartisan any more at this point in time. The democrat big wigs seem absolutely, 100% done with the republicans.
The necessary "bipartisanship" I can see from them is if the democrats fail to retake the senate, and McConnell's yertle-the-turtle ass remains in place, demanding his republican underlings in the senate continue towing the exact same obstructionist line they have been for the past decade. Though I would hopefully expect at that point that Biden and Pelosi's house will make the senate an absolute hell for McConnell and co, and work around him as much as possible.
“Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
Words to live by.
If they take the house and old Moscow Mitch the B1tch still holds the Senate, then there still will be no bipartisanship regardless of what they do. He will hold the entire thing hostage and will blame them for not getting anything done unless they can actually get their messaging out enough about it to prove it is him.
If they attempt to actually play nice at all at this point, even if the Republicans control the Senate, they further prove they are spineless and there are no consequences.
If the Democrats take the house and the presidency, they need to actually investigate Kavanaugh and have him removed for Perjury, if this new girl is confirmed, I would have them look into her and her religious group she hid originally and any omissions from her stuff there and do the same.
I would also have them investigate Trump and drag all his stuff to light, I would investigate McConnell personally and his actions in regards to Trump and how the Russians personally rewarded him and his state for him protecting Trump, I would investigate Lindsey, Tillis, Matt Gates and all the others who enabled him and were derelict in their duties and make the next few years a living hell for him and have all their lies and miss deeds plastered wall to wall on every news stations and sight for all to see.
I would also investigate Fox for their actions and lies and their pretending to be a news source to their viewers but claiming to be an entertainment source to get around honesty and would have them forced to either actually be honest or to put visible disclaimers on every show at the start, end and after every commercial break that their show isn't a news source and is entertainment. I would even push to force the hosts of such shows to verbally say it at the start of every episode.
Even if the Republicans keep the Senate, the Democrats need to go hard on them and refuse to play nice, make their lives a living hell and make them regret all they did and strip them of their image and their ability to lie to their people.
Biden could start issuing executive orders limiting their abilities to collect donations or other such stuff (Not sure the limits of them legally) but basically do executive orders that the entire nation agrees and make sure the house passes them as a law. Then watch the Republicans try and fight the executive order and make sure it is televised and when they try and claim that they support it but it over steps his bounds, his response right there, in the Senate in session and on camera is, "Well, a bill has passed the house about this very issue you claim to support and is sitting on McConnell's desk right now, instead of fighting this, put your money where you mouth is and lets vote on that bill right now for the cameras".
All they need is the president and congress and the Democrats can reign hell on them for all they have done, they just have to have the balls to do it, something they have never seemed to have when they get power for as long as I have been old enough to vote and payed attention.
Edit: AFK and off to bed, will check back later.
Last edited by Fugus; 2020-10-11 at 07:28 AM.
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Except the democratic big wigs have never shown the balls to actually do this, let's not forget Chuck Schummer is no Mitch McConnell he has shown zero ability to keep his caucus in line. We have democrats like Joe Manchin who have already openly stated they are want to bring "bipartisanship back". The reason things are the way they are is because the democratic party remains a party that has spent decades trying to be a big tent party all the while pissing on its base.
I do not see this changing we simply do not have the kind of leadership at the top that republicans do, I don't see neither Pelosi, Biden or Schummer as the type of people to push for this or have the party discipline to pull it off. I clearly hope I am wrong but I think democrats should have lower expectations of their party. The way I see it republicans will take back the house at least in 2022 due to the democratic base being disappointed with the DNC once again.
Last edited by Draco-Onis; 2020-10-11 at 08:14 AM.
So the 2010s again (the last 40 years even)? Which has been the slogan this year for some reason?
History says you're right but I always hold out that someone on the left steps up and pulls the party out of its "Always the 2nd option" rut but wouldn't bet on it.
Democrats don't have or have never been able to really carve out a clear agenda once in true power, and thus lose it as quickly as they gain it. The best thing from the DNC in the last 40 years has been the ACA, what was a concession to the Right one not many seem to improve upon. Obama was obviously better for the country than Trump and yet a sizable portion of his voters went to Trump because the moderate DNC only looks attractive when it has to clean up the mess of moderates to the right. Otherwise it looks like a party of leaders who seem like they are always walking on eggshells too worried about pleasing the other side to do anything worthwhile.
There is a reason why the DNC is notorious for its turnout issues while the RNC is so confident in its base that it rather persuade others to not vote. Fence sitting is a terrible ideology.
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