View Poll Results: 10 days left, what'll it be?

Voters
92. You may not vote on this poll
  • Hard Brexit (crash out)

    45 48.91%
  • No Brexit (Remain by revoking A50)

    24 26.09%
  • Withdrawal Agreement (after a new session is called)

    0 0%
  • Extension + Withdrawal Agreement

    3 3.26%
  • Extension + Crashout

    9 9.78%
  • Extension + Remain

    11 11.96%
  1. #20901
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    I'm actually somewhat looking forward to seeing your reaction when this doesn't happen :P
    I mean, we know what'll happen. He'll ignore it didn't happen and pretend it was his plan all along. Then he'll continue to antagonize this forum in what must be the longest unmoderated troll in the history of the internet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    The difference is that when no deal doesn't happen in October, whoever the resulting PM is will have no choice but to call a no deal vs no Brexit referendum, which will almost certainly result in no Brexit, at which point it's highly possible that Dribbles will spontaneously combust with rage :P
    Mark my words, it'll be the day he announces he's been a Remainer all along and was just doing all of this to rile you guys up into action.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pann View Post
    It's in today's Times but it is behind a pay wall. There might be some truth to it or there might not, I guess we'll have to wait and see.

    The article is in this Reddit post; https://www.reddit.com/r/ukpolitics/...boris_johnson/

    It does not contradict what Coveney said this morning however there is talk about a bilateral deal between Dublin and Westminster which I saw the possibility of this mentioned in an Irish Times article earlier this week.

    This might turn out to be nothing or it could be end up being extremely important.
    Any bilateral deals member states of the EU are making can only concern things the EU doesn't handle itself. So expect that deal to be about the breeding regulations for mail delivering swallows (Africa) and not anything of actual importance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ranzino View Post
    "NI only" backstop on the table in theory still ? BoJo could save some face with a "most of UK" brexit. ok, Scotland will object after oct 31, but technically PM Boris was successful
    This would actually interfere with the integrity of the Union. The United Kingdom cannot agree to that as much as the EU can't agree to just leave the Irish border open and trust that the British won't exploit it.
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    “It’s majoritarian, the majority wins, it’s ruled by the majority for the majority – sod the minority. Whereas true democracy includes everybody’s opinion in society,” - Margaret Georgiadou, 2019 about Brexit referendum.
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  2. #20902
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    Quote Originally Posted by ranzino View Post
    who will be asking for extension ? unless Commons could force PM Johnson to do so or he is all of a sudden interested in a never ending cycle, it wont happen.
    Basically, if it gets close to the withdrawal date and Johnson hasn't negotiated a better deal and got it through parliament (not going to happen) or organised another referendum (unlikely) then parliament will pass a vote of no confidence in the government triggering a general election, parliament will then petition the EU for an extension (which the EU has already confirmed it will grant for an election or a referendum).

  3. #20903
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    Basically, if it gets close to the withdrawal date and Johnson hasn't negotiated a better deal and got it through parliament (not going to happen) or organised another referendum (unlikely) then parliament will pass a vote of no confidence in the government triggering a general election, parliament will then petition the EU for an extension (which the EU has already confirmed it will grant for an election or a referendum).
    Jesus... they should do it right the fuck now and not wait "close to the withdrawal date". See, this is what the EU doesn't want to see... the British Government and Parliament is still not taking this seriously. To them it's still just a game and nobody else is invited. Nevermind that the EU is waiting.

    I would pull a veto out of principle just for this. I would call them right now and tell them they got a week to start sorting shit out or they may save themselves the trip to Brussels to ask for an extension... But I'm not as polite as our leaders.
    Users with <20 posts and ignored shitposters are automatically invisible. Find out how to do that here and help clean up MMO-OT!
    “It’s majoritarian, the majority wins, it’s ruled by the majority for the majority – sod the minority. Whereas true democracy includes everybody’s opinion in society,” - Margaret Georgiadou, 2019 about Brexit referendum.
    PSA: Being a volunteer is no excuse to make a shite job of it.

  4. #20904
    Great to see the UK got an extension and used it to accomplish nothing, it'll be fucking hard to sell another short extension request to the EU.

    A GE will end up with a similar useless result

  5. #20905
    Quote Originally Posted by Crispin View Post
    Great to see the UK got an extension and used it to accomplish nothing, it'll be fucking hard to sell another short extension request to the EU.

    A GE will end up with a similar useless result
    Look at the bright side, the Brexit Party may win and we would be rid of Farage in the EP.
    Users with <20 posts and ignored shitposters are automatically invisible. Find out how to do that here and help clean up MMO-OT!
    “It’s majoritarian, the majority wins, it’s ruled by the majority for the majority – sod the minority. Whereas true democracy includes everybody’s opinion in society,” - Margaret Georgiadou, 2019 about Brexit referendum.
    PSA: Being a volunteer is no excuse to make a shite job of it.

  6. #20906
    Quote Originally Posted by Slant View Post
    Look at the bright side, the Brexit Party may win and we would be rid of Farage in the EP.
    Could only hope, it's honestly like a Girlfriend who breaks up but does not leave the house since she's got nowhere to go, occupies the living room and keep bitching about how fucked up the relationship was. Fucking leave already then.

    My opinion over the last year really went from "I hope they'll revoke or get a good dea, so the UK and EU will get the best out of a stupid situation" to fuck that just kick them out.

  7. #20907
    Quote Originally Posted by Crispin View Post
    Could only hope, it's honestly like a Girlfriend who breaks up but does not leave the house since she's got nowhere to go, occupies the living room and keep bitching about how fucked up the relationship was. Fucking leave already then.

    My opinion over the last year really went from "I hope they'll revoke or get a good dea, so the UK and EU will get the best out of a stupid situation" to fuck that just kick them out.
    You're not alone in that. But if they somehow manage to cancel the entire thing, I'd be happy. I just have zero faith left in that country atm.
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    “It’s majoritarian, the majority wins, it’s ruled by the majority for the majority – sod the minority. Whereas true democracy includes everybody’s opinion in society,” - Margaret Georgiadou, 2019 about Brexit referendum.
    PSA: Being a volunteer is no excuse to make a shite job of it.

  8. #20908
    Quote Originally Posted by Slant View Post
    You're not alone in that. But if they somehow manage to cancel the entire thing, I'd be happy. I just have zero faith left in that country atm.
    I think at this point cancelling Brexit would be a worst case scenario. If Brexit doesn't go through, the morons who voted for it and the morons who rode on that wave will always use it as an example how big bag evil EU overruled their democracy. The whole situation is a boil that needs to get lanced, not treated with antibiotics.

  9. #20909
    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel View Post
    I think at this point cancelling Brexit would be a worst case scenario. If Brexit doesn't go through, the morons who voted for it and the morons who rode on that wave will always use it as an example how big bag evil EU overruled their democracy. The whole situation is a boil that needs to get lanced, not treated with antibiotics.
    Plus if they revoke Brexit, Farage would be very likely to win the GE. So we wouldn't just have to deal with Farage in the Parliament, he'd be in the fucking Council

  10. #20910
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Plus if they revoke Brexit, Farage would be very likely to win the GE. So we wouldn't just have to deal with Farage in the Parliament, he'd be in the fucking Council
    Going with FPTP it's not as likely as people think. He might get the most votes but the split might as easily let Labour or LD in.

  11. #20911

  12. #20912
    Quote Originally Posted by Kallisto View Post
    Going with FPTP it's not as likely as people think. He might get the most votes but the split might as easily let Labour or LD in.
    I think FPTP goes both ways in that Tory voters who just want to keep Labout out might see Brexit Party as more likely to have a majority in their constituency. I mean I remember the poll showing that Tory members would be ok with Brexit that would ruin the economy and the union but NOT ok with one that would mean Corbyn is in parliament.

  13. #20913
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    I think FPTP goes both ways in that Tory voters who just want to keep Labout out might see Brexit Party as more likely to have a majority in their constituency. I mean I remember the poll showing that Tory members would be ok with Brexit that would ruin the economy and the union but NOT ok with one that would mean Corbyn is in parliament.
    It could easily go many ways I'm sure. Yeah Labour would lose a few up north. But in areas where remain is strong and Labour pushed for remain they could edge out wins in areas they have not done before. If not Labour then it could easily be heavy damage for Tories and Labour with the country behind the LDs where Remain is strong and we have the most hung of parliaments. It's a complete mystery how things could happen.

    I mean it could also happen is that everyone shits their pants and go for tried and true Tory/Labour.

  14. #20914
    Quote Originally Posted by Kallisto View Post
    I mean it could also happen is that everyone shits their pants and go for tried and true Tory/Labour.
    But here is the thing, strategic voting comes from the implicit expectation that Tories and Labour would be the first two in your constituency. That expectation is no longer rational. Brexit Party and Lib Dem are likely to lead Tories and Labour in many constituencies. So strategically, you'd need to check the polls for your constituency and switch your vote if you are voting negatively (against a party) instead of affirmatively.

  15. #20915
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slant View Post
    But if they somehow manage to cancel the entire thing, I'd be happy. I just have zero faith left in that country atm.
    Don't worry, at this point there's basically only two ways left it can go and they both result in the end of Brexit. Johnson will never get the WA through the house and the EU will not amend it and he knows all of this.

    So we will have either scenario A: Johnson runs down the clock to try and force no deal, parliament trigger a no confidence motion resulting in a general election and then either Johnson or Corbyn (as the resulting PM) will go with the last option, a referendum on no deal vs no brexit. Or scenario B: Johnson sees sense and decides not to risk his premiership to delay the inevitable and goes with the last option, a referendum on no deal vs no brexit. Either way the result will be a remain victory and this time the margin will be so wide it will leave no doubt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tathalapas View Post
    I cannot believe people are seriously considering voting LD again after they sold out their voters in 2010.
    They're probably seriously considering voting LD again because that never happened it's just tabloid guff.

    In 2010 the Lib Dems pretty much took up position as a human shield protecting the people of the UK from the firestorm of Tory austerity, most people who voted LD in 2010 have now realised (thanks to experiencing four years of full force Tory government without the LDs to protect them) that they were wrong to blame them in 2015.

  16. #20916
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    Either way the result will be a remain victory and this time the margin will be so wide it will leave no doubt.
    I wish I had your optimism. At this point I fear the inevitable outcome will be the opposite: no matter what happens, the result will be crashing out with no deal.

  17. #20917
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    They're probably seriously considering voting LD again because that never happened it's just tabloid guff.

    In 2010 the Lib Dems pretty much took up position as a human shield protecting the people of the UK from the firestorm of Tory austerity, most people who voted LD in 2010 have now realised (thanks to experiencing four years of full force Tory government without the LDs to protect them) that they were wrong to blame them in 2015.
    Sorry but that is pretty much exactly what happened. For me the most obvious example is student fees, a policy they ditched within minutes of negotiating room with the Tories, they ditched a vote on PR equally as quickly and if you go through their manifesto from 2010 the vast majority of it was not met in the slightest, even after 5 years in government.

    Sure, they had some mediating effect on Conservative economic policy but they also facilitated and actively encouraged it.

    If the Lib Dems had refused to accept any deal they were offered the Tories would never have been able to form a government at all and we would have had another general election, potentially avoiding austerity altogether.

  18. #20918
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    They're probably seriously considering voting LD again because that never happened it's just tabloid guff.

    In 2010 the Lib Dems pretty much took up position as a human shield protecting the people of the UK from the firestorm of Tory austerity, most people who voted LD in 2010 have now realised (thanks to experiencing four years of full force Tory government without the LDs to protect them) that they were wrong to blame them in 2015.
    Not just that (though it is important) but also most of the good things that happened under the coalition were because of the LD.

    Free school meals for infants.
    The raising of the Income Tax personal allowance from £6475 to £10,600
    Bringing marriage equality to most of the nation was really a LD achievement that Cameron tried to claim.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mojojojo202 View Post
    If the Lib Dems had refused to accept any deal they were offered the Tories would never have been able to form a government at all and we would have had another general election, potentially avoiding austerity altogether.
    Which would have gone the same way and repeat for a long ass time. Does no one read history about how the country was in a basic standstill when no one could do shit because of how we end up with heavy minority governments that collapsed in months to a couple years tops.

  19. #20919
    Quote Originally Posted by Kallisto View Post
    Not just that (though it is important) but also most of the good things that happened under the coalition were because of the LD.

    Free school meals for infants.
    The raising of the Income Tax personal allowance from £6475 to £10,600
    Bringing marriage equality to most of the nation was really a LD achievement that Cameron tried to claim.

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    Which would have gone the same way and repeat for a long ass time. Does no one read history about how the country was in a basic standstill when no one could do shit because of how we end up with heavy minority governments that collapsed in months to a couple years tops.
    They pledged to scrap tuition fees and then all their MPs promised to vote against a rise. They then voted to triple them.
    They consistently backed Osbourne budgets, including measures like cuts to top rates of tax and raising VAT
    They voted for big cuts to police numbers when they had promised to raise them.
    They totally abandoned attempts to end Trident, although they did manage to put off renewing it for a couple of years
    They failed to bring about either voting reform or Lords reform they had promised.
    They backed a deeply unpopular and incredibly expensive restructure of the NHS.
    They helped cut school funding and then tried to claim they had increased funding through Pupil Premium (not really true).
    They supported the move to universal credit.


    The LibDems may have had some moderating influence and they may have achieved a couple of things but it really is nothing compared to the promises they broke and Tory policy they actively endorsed.


    The point is they never the threat of the Tory government collapsing win them anything. It was fairly clear that the Lib Dems were going to stick in coalition whatever happened and the Tories exploited that idiocy. If they were so distressed by their actions of the government partners they would have walked away. They didn't.

  20. #20920
    Quote Originally Posted by Pann View Post
    What? What does your post have to do with anything I have written? Did you even bother to read the article?
    Did you? Boris is a lying piece of shit STOP falling for everything he says, he is only saying things you want to hear so he can get his way and he won't actually do anything about it fuck Boris that clown isnt even worth looking into.

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