View Poll Results: 10 days left, what'll it be?

Voters
92. You may not vote on this poll
  • Hard Brexit (crash out)

    45 48.91%
  • No Brexit (Remain by revoking A50)

    24 26.09%
  • Withdrawal Agreement (after a new session is called)

    0 0%
  • Extension + Withdrawal Agreement

    3 3.26%
  • Extension + Crashout

    9 9.78%
  • Extension + Remain

    11 11.96%
  1. #7981
    Quote Originally Posted by dribbles View Post
    - No trade agreements - The EU sell more to us than we to them, it will hurt them more than us.
    - No Irish border solution - Poor Ireland. What will the EU do? Going to cost them...
    - Food & medicine stockpiling - How many EU people will suffer and die as they no longer have access to medicines from British world class drug companies?
    - Planes grounded - Very inconvenient if from the EU you are trying to cross the Atlantic.
    - 20 mile port tailbacks - Got to feel sorry for the EU residents around Calais with all those diesel fumes from backed up lorries.

    Yep spot on ctd123, big problems ahead for the EU - you and I were both right!
    And yet again you spin your own ideas what you want to happen on it.
    ''With this attack, we have no choice but to protect our kind by unleashing our almighty weapon upon them. Summoning the Apocalypse'' - Stellaris Apocalypse trailer.

  2. #7982
    Herald of the Titans dribbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuiking View Post
    And yet again you spin your own ideas what you want to happen on it.
    Not spin at all, just a reflection of what all EU leaders know. As a visionary young EU leader acknowledged and was reported just yesterday :-

    “Britain is militarily, politically and economically tremendously significant on our continent”

    https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-br...-idUKKCN1L829U

    Now he knows, unlike the craggy bitter old fogeys who generally represent the EU now in gods waiting room, he will have, and be here to deal with the massive future problems the EU face.
    Brexiteers are the new remainers. To remain outside of the EU.

  3. #7983
    A visionary young man indeed: from the article linked
    “It was probably the worst decision of recent years - Britain’s decision to leave the European Union,” Kurz told a rally of German Chancellor Angela Merkel’s conservatives in Erfurt to applause.
    Never change Dribbles

  4. #7984
    Quote Originally Posted by dribbles View Post
    - No trade agreements - The EU sell more to us than we to them, it will hurt them more than us.
    - No Irish border solution - Poor Ireland. What will the EU do? Going to cost them...
    - Food & medicine stockpiling - How many EU people will suffer and die as they no longer have access to medicines from British world class drug companies?
    - Planes grounded - Very inconvenient if from the EU you are trying to cross the Atlantic.
    - 20 mile port tailbacks - Got to feel sorry for the EU residents around Calais with all those diesel fumes from backed up lorries.

    Yep spot on ctd123, big problems ahead for the EU - you and I were both right!
    EU can sell elsewhere. We can't buy elsewhere with same standards that in many countries are much higher than our own.

    Irish will hurt for a bit. Then they can just go around the small island to France, Germany, Spain, Whereever.

    I'm sure the miniscule UK phamas are so going to not be propped up by Bayer which is larger than all independent UK pharmas put together.

    Oh I'm sure the EU will find a way accross the atlantic. Not like Spain/France don't have a sea towards it. Or swing 12.1NM around the UK if need be.

    Calais will be fine. It's already set itself up. Dover, Harwich, Folkestone etc. They're the ones that have issues since pretty much all our lorries will be set back.

    Only someone who is a far right facist or deluded is at this point in time thinking the UK has any cards on the table that matches the EU's Royal Flush. The UK is betting, acting like it has a royal flush, bluffing, when EU and anyone who has taken more than 5 minutes to look at the reality knows the UK is holding 2 5 7 9 queen and only two of them are the same suit.

  5. #7985
    Quote Originally Posted by dribbles View Post
    Not spin at all, just a reflection of what all EU leaders know. As a visionary young EU leader acknowledged and was reported just yesterday :-

    “Britain is militarily, politically and economically tremendously significant on our continent”

    https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-br...-idUKKCN1L829U

    Now he knows, unlike the craggy bitter old fogeys who generally represent the EU now in gods waiting room, he will have, and be here to deal with the massive future problems the EU face.
    Nobody said Britain wasn't significant. Only nationalists like you have to pretend your country is suffering from insignificance, because nationalists like you need a reason to "improve" the country. Britain is too good for you. Don't talk shit about her, you little traitor.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kallisto View Post
    Calais will be fine. It's already set itself up. Dover, Harwich, Folkestone etc. They're the ones that have issues since pretty much all our lorries will be set back.
    It's not that we can find a way around it. What his tiny brain doesn't compute is that on-time delivery supply chains are in severe danger of breaking down. This doesn't mean Airbus will wait for supplies in the UK. It means Airbus will move the entire facility off the island. They have all but said so already. Alas, little Dribs here, our cute little pocket fascist, thinks that somehow we'll all be patient and... play along, because his little nationalist's dream of the British Empire is worth it...

    Nevermind that he's the only one dreaming it at this stage. Not even most of his Brexiteer fellows are in line with him. What a joke...
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  6. #7986
    Quote Originally Posted by dribbles View Post
    - 20 mile port tailbacks - Got to feel sorry for the EU residents around Calais with all those diesel fumes from backed up lorries.

    Yep spot on ctd123, big problems ahead for the EU - you and I were both right!
    Queues will be in Kent as well. You disingenuous liar.

  7. #7987
    Dreadlord Nigel Tufnel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kallisto View Post
    I'm sure the miniscule UK phamas are so going to not be propped up by Bayer which is larger than all independent UK pharmas put together.
    Am I missing something? Why are you not counting GSK & AstraZeneca? GSK is British, AstraZeneca is British/Swedish?

    GSK's revenue ($42.05bn) was over 50% higher than Bayer's ($27.76bn) in 2017.

    In fact, if you look at the list:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ies_by_revenue

    It's dominated completely by non-EU companies (sort by 2017).

    And I'm not sure what broader point it is you're making?

    You, like Dribbles, want a hard Brexit? You want our esteemed leaders to fail to reach an agreement? You actively want to see a disruption in the flow of goods to and from the UK? No-one in the EU would suffer any hardship from delays in accessing e.g., GSK products? Really?

    Of course we know that the EU holds the upper hand. But you're being disingenuous by spinning it, as you have done above, as if a hard Brexit is of (ultimately) no loss to the EU.

    This is lose / lose. Yes, it will be significantly worse (in my opinion) for the UK but don't pretend it's a one way track. That's nonsensical.
    Last edited by Nigel Tufnel; 2018-08-25 at 09:06 PM. Reason: typos

  8. #7988
    Quote Originally Posted by Nigel Tufnel View Post
    Am I missing something? Why are you not counting GSK & AstraZeneca? GSK is British, AstraZeneca is British/Swedish?

    GSK's revenue ($42.05bn) was over 50% higher than Bayer's ($27.76bn) in 2017.

    In fact, if you look at the list:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ies_by_revenue

    It's dominated completely by non-EU companies (sort by 2017).

    And I'm not sure what broader point it is you're making?

    You, like Dribbles, want a hard Brexit? You want our esteemed leaders to fail to reach an agreement? You actively want to see a disruption in the flow of goods to and from the UK? No-one in the EU would suffer any hardship from delays in accessing e.g., GSK products? Really?

    Of course we know that the EU holds the upper hand. But you're being disingenuous by spinning it, as you have done above, as if a hard Brexit is of (ultimately) no loss to the EU.

    This is lose / lose. Yes, it will be significantly worse (in my opinion) for the UK but don't pretend it's a one way track. That's nonsensical.
    You are correct with regard to pharma companies but I can't help but think you are being little harsh here. At least he has made an effort to try to address Dribbles' points which is certainly as step up from the usual two pages of insults directed towards Dribbles.

  9. #7989
    Herald of the Titans dribbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pann View Post
    You are correct with regard to pharma companies but I can't help but think you are being little harsh here. At least he has made an effort to try to address Dribbles' points which is certainly as step up from the usual two pages of insults directed towards Dribbles.
    The problem with a lot of these Corbyn Labour supporters on here, and their EU equivalents, is they have such extreme views that they only attract validation from nutters like KKK head David Duke and former BNP leader Nick Griffin. It puts everything the remainers and EU supporters say into context when they start ranting at an ordinary salt of the earth liberal Brexiteer such as I.

    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/709135...h-zionism-row/

    Moderates like me who give facts and have a consensual approach to Brexit are going to attract criticisms and from some of the more EU radicalised remain fanatics vitriol in the extreme. I feel a great sense of public duty in attempting to bring a calmness and some serenity to these loons, sometimes it works other times not so much and you see them explode against reason and common sense in an embarrassing way so publicly.

    But at least the passive viewer can take a view. Let's hope they keep some kind of access to the drugs they are so obviously on after Brexit, otherwise I fear for their sanity.
    Brexiteers are the new remainers. To remain outside of the EU.

  10. #7990
    Quote Originally Posted by dribbles View Post
    The problem with a lot of these Corbyn Labour supporters on here, and their EU equivalents, is they have such extreme views that they only attract validation from nutters like KKK head David Duke and former BNP leader Nick Griffin. It puts everything the remainers and EU supporters say into context when they start ranting at an ordinary salt of the earth liberal Brexiteer such as I.

    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/709135...h-zionism-row/

    Moderates like me who give facts and have a consensual approach to Brexit are going to attract criticisms and from some of the more EU radicalised remain fanatics vitriol in the extreme. I feel a great sense of public duty in attempting to bring a calmness and some serenity to these loons, sometimes it works other times not so much and you see them explode against reason and common sense in an embarrassing way so publicly.

    But at least the passive viewer can take a view. Let's hope they keep some kind of access to the drugs they are so obviously on after Brexit, otherwise I fear for their sanity.
    *chuckles*

    Yes, please. Give us facts. That would be a first.
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  11. #7991
    Oh he gives us facts quite regularly; only problem being that they consistently counter his claims

  12. #7992
    Quote Originally Posted by Nigel Tufnel View Post
    Am I missing something? Why are you not counting GSK & AstraZeneca? GSK is British, AstraZeneca is British/Swedish?

    GSK's revenue ($42.05bn) was over 50% higher than Bayer's ($27.76bn) in 2017.

    In fact, if you look at the list:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ies_by_revenue

    It's dominated completely by non-EU companies (sort by 2017).

    And I'm not sure what broader point it is you're making?

    You, like Dribbles, want a hard Brexit? You want our esteemed leaders to fail to reach an agreement? You actively want to see a disruption in the flow of goods to and from the UK? No-one in the EU would suffer any hardship from delays in accessing e.g., GSK products? Really?

    Of course we know that the EU holds the upper hand. But you're being disingenuous by spinning it, as you have done above, as if a hard Brexit is of (ultimately) no loss to the EU.

    This is lose / lose. Yes, it will be significantly worse (in my opinion) for the UK but don't pretend it's a one way track. That's nonsensical.
    Eh I thought GSK was bought out by J&J for soe reason.

    No I don't want hard brexit, quite the opposite I want goverment to basically turn around and say "We took it under advisement, since the vote was advisery. We come to the decision that Brexit is absolutely ludicrous and we're not doing it. Part of a representative Democracy is to know when not to shoot ourselves in the foot on the whim of the ill informed."

    I'm not saying EU won't be hurt, but it won't be anything other than a bee sting for them compared to for us a complete mangled leg.

  13. #7993
    Quote Originally Posted by Kallisto View Post
    Eh I thought GSK was bought out by J&J for soe reason.

    No I don't want hard brexit, quite the opposite I want goverment to basically turn around and say "We took it under advisement, since the vote was advisery. We come to the decision that Brexit is absolutely ludicrous and we're not doing it. Part of a representative Democracy is to know when not to shoot ourselves in the foot on the whim of the ill informed."

    I'm not saying EU won't be hurt, but it won't be anything other than a bee sting for them compared to for us a complete mangled leg.
    Ignoring the political context of the British side the EU would never accept the reversal of Brexit without something in return.

  14. #7994
    Quote Originally Posted by ati87 View Post
    Ignoring the political context of the British side the EU would never accept the reversal of Brexit without something in return.
    I wouldn't be so sure about that. I think they would be happy with some token gestures.
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  15. #7995
    Unless there was some form of capitulation on behalf of the brexiteers I sort of doubt it as that could mean a repeat in a few years time. Barring a massive shift in public opinion I'm pretty sure the UK will spend at least a few years in some sort of "We're still trying to sort this out" limbo or just flat out trip in their shoelaces and Brexit hard, before coming to their senses.

    The EU can't live with article 50 being invoked left and right just so countries can try and get a better deal at the expense of the rest.

  16. #7996
    Quote Originally Posted by Gibblewink View Post
    Unless there was some form of capitulation on behalf of the brexiteers I sort of doubt it as that could mean a repeat in a few years time. Barring a massive shift in public opinion I'm pretty sure the UK will spend at least a few years in some sort of "We're still trying to sort this out" limbo or just flat out trip in their shoelaces and Brexit hard, before coming to their senses.

    The EU can't live with article 50 being invoked left and right just so countries can try and get a better deal at the expense of the rest.
    I mean, the UK has a fairly strong economy and several unique advantages. If e.g. Italy tried to pull what you suggest, their economy would crash in minutes. If any of the Eastern European countries tried it, they would see immediate capital flight.
    Hail Lilith and see you in Hell!

  17. #7997
    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post
    What? We only gave them 1 little upstart who wanted to be a German and later became a pilitician, but that was never planned.
    Unless we argue which composer was german/austrian we get along famously.
    There is no sense to argue about any of those because neither state was a thing back when they were around.

  18. #7998
    Quote Originally Posted by Gibblewink View Post
    Unless there was some form of capitulation on behalf of the brexiteers I sort of doubt it as that could mean a repeat in a few years time. Barring a massive shift in public opinion I'm pretty sure the UK will spend at least a few years in some sort of "We're still trying to sort this out" limbo or just flat out trip in their shoelaces and Brexit hard, before coming to their senses.

    The EU can't live with article 50 being invoked left and right just so countries can try and get a better deal at the expense of the rest.
    No, the EU can't live with that. I agree. That's why the move of the banking oversight and the pharmaceutical oversight agencies to mainland Europe are done deals, regardless of what happens with Brexit. With token gestures I mean a rebate or two being sacrificed, but what else do you want Britain to do?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Noradin View Post
    There is no sense to argue about any of those because neither state was a thing back when they were around.
    Yeah, well. Either way, Austria is family. It's like you're asking to choose between family and a best friend.

    Heck, they even let us use their anthem.
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  19. #7999
    Dreadlord Nigel Tufnel's Avatar
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    Yanis Varoufakis writes:

    https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...holds-the-keys

    Am interested in a europhile's counterpoint to this.

    Also from any actual Greeks: is it as bad as he paints it?

    wages reduced by 40%, pensions by 45%, the minimum wage by 30%, NHS spending by 32%. The UK would now be the wasteland of Europe, just as Greece is today.

    Is this an accurate representation?

    And in summary:

    after having bailed out French and German banks at the expense of Europe’s poorest citizens, and after having turned Greece into a debtor’s prison, last week Greece’s creditors decided to declare victory. Having put Greece into a coma, they made it permanent and declared it “stability”: they pushed our people off a cliff and celebrated their bounce off the hard rock of a great depression as proof of “recovery”. To quote Tacitus, they made a desert and called it peace.

    Pretty damning indictment.

    How do our Corbynistas feel about this? Is this the reason you voted to Leave?

  20. #8000
    Quote Originally Posted by Nigel Tufnel View Post
    Yanis Varoufakis writes:

    https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...holds-the-keys

    Am interested in a europhile's counterpoint to this.

    Also from any actual Greeks: is it as bad as he paints it?

    wages reduced by 40%, pensions by 45%, the minimum wage by 30%, NHS spending by 32%. The UK would now be the wasteland of Europe, just as Greece is today.

    Is this an accurate representation?

    And in summary:

    after having bailed out French and German banks at the expense of Europe’s poorest citizens, and after having turned Greece into a debtor’s prison, last week Greece’s creditors decided to declare victory. Having put Greece into a coma, they made it permanent and declared it “stability”: they pushed our people off a cliff and celebrated their bounce off the hard rock of a great depression as proof of “recovery”. To quote Tacitus, they made a desert and called it peace.

    Pretty damning indictment.

    How do our Corbynistas feel about this? Is this the reason you voted to Leave?
    The situation in the Southern member states is not particularly rosy but I am not sure that Varoufakis is the most impartial source when it comes to Greece's financial woes and the EU but from my, albeit limited, understanding there is some truth in the article. Ultimately Greece never should have joined the Euro and as a result its own problems have been magnified however it is now in a position that leaving the Euro would be an even worse situation than it currently finds itself in.

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