View Poll Results: 10 days left, what'll it be?

Voters
92. You may not vote on this poll
  • Hard Brexit (crash out)

    45 48.91%
  • No Brexit (Remain by revoking A50)

    24 26.09%
  • Withdrawal Agreement (after a new session is called)

    0 0%
  • Extension + Withdrawal Agreement

    3 3.26%
  • Extension + Crashout

    9 9.78%
  • Extension + Remain

    11 11.96%
  1. #8981
    Quote Originally Posted by Rockyreg View Post
    I think the main bugbear with a surplus is that if you have a surplus then somebody has to have a deficit. Obviously not all of the EU countries can have a surplus and with the deficit rules the only choice many countries have in meeting the rules is to shrink or lower growth in your economy, much to the displeasure of the electorate
    No, you could in fact have a surplus in every country (by printing money corresponding to the increased non-monetary values produced--which is something the ECB and national banks of EURO member states do). The problem is really that some buy more than they can afford, not that others work more than they absolutely need to to survive.
    But I will give you that the someone has to have a deficit deflection is very popular and widespread, because there is potential for a lot of money to be made off of managing debts and those in debt really like to shift the blame elsewhere.

  2. #8982
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    Quote Originally Posted by sircaw View Post
    I can not believe Nick Clegg is infact a Sir.
    Why not? I can't think of a single politician who has done as much good for our people in the past quarter century.

    The guy literally spent five years acting as a human shield to protect the citizens of the UK from a Tory government and burned his career in the process (as most voters are too stupid to see that).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mafic View Post
    EU is under pressure from many angles. They should make friendly negotiations with the UK but instead they are playing hardball.
    This thing so many people either don't understand or refuse to understand, is that the EU is making friendly negotiations with the UK over Brexit, overly friendly negotiations.

    The reason it seems to some like they are being mean (compared to the normal dealing the UK does) is because the UK normally gets overly generous treatment in it's political/economic dealings because it's a member of the EU. In the Brexit negotiations the EU is simply treating us how every other country will treat us once we have left the EU and ceased to be part of a pseudo-superpower.

    I will be blunt here, our empire has been dead for over half a century, we are merely a little island in the north sea (hell the only reason we were able to liberate the Falklands was due to our EU membership), once we have left the EU our political/economic standing will be significantly diminished. If anyone dislikes the way the EU is treating us in negotiations then buckle the hell up because they're using kiddie gloves compared to what's coming.

  3. #8983
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    This thing so many people either don't understand or refuse to understand, is that the EU is making friendly negotiations with the UK over Brexit, overly friendly negotiations.
    You have no idea how good it is to hear a British say that for once. I'll let you do the talking from now on. :P
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    “It’s majoritarian, the majority wins, it’s ruled by the majority for the majority – sod the minority. Whereas true democracy includes everybody’s opinion in society,” - Margaret Georgiadou, 2019 about Brexit referendum.
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  4. #8984
    Cross posting this, aaron banks has been referred for a criminal investigation for laundering russian money for the brexit campaign.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rudol Von Stroheim View Post
    I do not need to play the role of "holier than thou". I'm above that..

  5. #8985
    Herald of the Titans dribbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    This thing so many people either don't understand or refuse to understand, is that the EU is making friendly negotiations with the UK over Brexit, overly friendly negotiations.
    Utter tosh.

    Is the EU really relevant to anyone anymore? Certainly not the UK, Portugal seems to think they are a shower of shit too.

    Portugal prepares to SIDELINE Barnier and negotiate OWN deal with Britain.

    https://www.express.co.uk/news/world...os-Silva-trade

    European unity? What EU unity.

    Portuguese foreign minister Augusto Santos Silva accused the EU of leaving his country in limbo because negotiators have failed to secure a timely Brexit deal. The foreign minister believes his country’s tourism, textile and automotive sectors will be heavily affected unless a sufficient Brexit deal is negotiated.
    And as I swap my winter holiday from Portugal or the Canaries to Barbados he is right to be concerned about his tourist industry. It is not just the UK that is leaving the EU, it's my £5k annual winter holiday too. Imagine if 17 million brexiteer Brits did exactly the same...

  6. #8986
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    Quote Originally Posted by dribbles View Post
    Utter tosh.
    I'm sorry the facts of the matter don't tally with your opinions :P

  7. #8987
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    I'm sorry the facts of the matter don't tally with your opinions :P
    Dribbles and facts are like Reese-Mogg and working class people.

    Will never understand them, ignore them at best, utterly insulted that they even exist at worse.

  8. #8988
    Quote Originally Posted by Slant View Post
    1. Leave the Euro, return to the DM. Increase the value of the DM until nobody can afford to buy from us ever again, thus destroying our economy and everyone is forced to buy Japanese cars. Or well, American trash. So yeah, Japanese cars.
    I love the tacit admission that the Euro is boosting Germany's export by devaluing its currency, but the refusal to admit the opposite that Italy and other Southern Europe economies don't have its export sector hampered by the Euro.

    A system that benefits countries with strong economies and punish those that have weak ones. I love it.

    @Kiri

  9. #8989
    Quote Originally Posted by Life Capital View Post
    I love the tacit admission that the Euro is boosting Germany's export by devaluing its currency, but the refusal to admit the opposite that Italy and other Southern Europe economies don't have its export sector hampered by the Euro.

    A system that benefits countries with strong economies and punish those that have weak ones. I love it.

    @Kiri
    Again, for the "special" people: Germany isn't responsible for Euro currency policy. The ECB is. If you want to bitch, bitch at them. Literally, we couldn't do anything about this even if we wanted to.
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    “It’s majoritarian, the majority wins, it’s ruled by the majority for the majority – sod the minority. Whereas true democracy includes everybody’s opinion in society,” - Margaret Georgiadou, 2019 about Brexit referendum.
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  10. #8990
    Quote Originally Posted by Life Capital View Post
    I love the tacit admission that the Euro is boosting Germany's export by devaluing its currency, but the refusal to admit the opposite that Italy and other Southern Europe economies don't have its export sector hampered by the Euro.

    A system that benefits countries with strong economies and punish those that have weak ones. I love it.

    @Kiri
    Yeah no, you misread his post.

    Germany kept the value of its currency strong and constant for decades and still got its economy to grow into one of the strongest worldwide.
    Devaluation is not necessary to be able to export.

    Just compare with Japan which constantly devaluated and thereby created crisis after crisis for itself.
    Or with Italy, with its banking problems.
    Devaluation is not a healthy way to increase exports, it is basically stealing from the workers and rentiees so the CEOs can make more money.

    That is why Slant listed "leaving the Euro", "returning to the DM", and "increasing the value of DM".
    All three would be necessary to destroy Germany's economy.
    Last edited by Noradin; 2018-11-01 at 04:38 PM.

  11. #8991
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Slant View Post
    Current crazy theories about what Germany can do:

    1. Leave the Euro, return to the DM. Increase the value of the DM until nobody can afford to buy from us ever again, thus destroying our economy and everyone is forced to buy Japanese cars. Or well, American trash. So yeah, Japanese cars.
    Competent assessment, as having the DM for 50+ years destroyed our economy year after year after year. No wait, it didn't.


    Going back from the € garbage to a respectable currency might indeed terminate one or two million jobs in businesses depending on export. Even if we are generous and say, it would be three million new jobless (that would rival record unemployment) and another five million family members affected by those job cuts, that would still leave a country with 80+ million inhabitants with roughly a 90:10 winner:loser ratio going from a weaker to a stronger currency.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noradin View Post
    Just compare with Japan which constantly devaluated and thereby created crisis after crisis for itself.
    This is utter nonsense. From 1975 till today the Yen value (measured in $) almost tripled. Also Japan didn't have 'crisis after crisis'.

  12. #8992
    Quote Originally Posted by Life Capital View Post
    I love the tacit admission that the Euro is boosting Germany's export by devaluing its currency, but the refusal to admit the opposite that Italy and other Southern Europe economies don't have its export sector hampered by the Euro.

    A system that benefits countries with strong economies and punish those that have weak ones. I love it.

    @Kiri
    I do not think that the system is necessarily designed for this as much as it simply is not made to have weak economies in it in the first place. I stand by my opinion that Italy, Greeze, and others should have never joined the Euro in the first place. They were not ready for it. On the flip-side, I am not sure if the Euro was, economically speaking, all that good for Germany, either. Let me rephrase that. Germany benefits from it, but a not having had it would have been better. It still constrains Germany. Maybe not as much as Bretton-Woods did, but still. Anyone would have been happier, economically speaking, if the Euro never happened - or had been more exclusive. Sadly, that was all politically motivated, because certain people wanted to make that push at a unique point in time where it was actually possible.

  13. #8993
    Herald of the Titans dribbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kallisto View Post
    Dribbles and facts are like Reese-Mogg and working class people.

    Will never understand them, ignore them at best, utterly insulted that they even exist at worse.
    Let me help you understand then. Here is an easy to follow fact as reported today...

    ONS data on UK population reveals there were 1.6 million EU nationals in 2007
    A decade later in 2017 there were 3.8 million EU nationals living in Britain


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ED-decade.html

    The only non understandable bit about it is if the EU is some kind of paradise why have millions and millions of EU refugees chosen to flee the Brussels dictators and take sanctuary in the freedom loving UK?

    You know the UK, that place full of terrible brexiteers like me. The reality is eurochums you adore people like me and all want to live next to me and my views as my neighbour!

    There has to come a time when enough of you is enough though, don't you agree? My love for all of you is getting spread a little thin.

    Not long to go now, tick tock.

  14. #8994
    Quote Originally Posted by thevoicefromwithin View Post
    This is utter nonsense. From 1975 till today the Yen value (measured in $) almost tripled. Also Japan didn't have 'crisis after crisis'.
    They repeatedly devalued their currency and they did have crisis after crisis because of that (devaluating their currency was a quick and dirty "fix" that kicked the can down the road a few month each time).

  15. #8995
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by dribbles View Post
    You know the UK, that place full of terrible brexiteers like me. The reality is eurochums you adore people like me and all want to live next to me and my views as my neighbour!
    Those guys trying to hug you - those are Romanian plumbers.


    Btw Brits applying for Irish and German passports are at a record high, vast majority of them young and well educated.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noradin View Post
    They repeatedly devalued their currency and they did have crisis after crisis because of that (devaluating their currency was a quick and dirty "fix" that kicked the can down the road a few month each time).
    Why even repeat shit that contradicts every statistic? Yen and Swiss Franc were the two strongest major currencies of the last 50 years.

  16. #8996
    Quote Originally Posted by thevoicefromwithin View Post
    Why even repeat shit that contradicts every statistic? Yen and Swiss Franc were the two strongest major currencies of the last 50 years.
    That does not contradict my post.
    Learn to read more carefully.

  17. #8997
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Noradin View Post
    That does not contradict my post.
    Learn to read more carefully.
    You have no clue about economics whatsoever. Link *one* report when the Japanese devalued thier currency. Can't be hard since they did it 'repeatedly', hmm superstar?

  18. #8998
    Quote Originally Posted by thevoicefromwithin View Post
    You have no clue about economics whatsoever. Link *one* report when the Japanese devalued thier currency. Can't be hard since they did it 'repeatedly', hmm superstar?
    https://www.vdcresearch.com/News-eve...-currency.html

    I dunno, second hit on Google. It wasn't that hard to find.
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    “It’s majoritarian, the majority wins, it’s ruled by the majority for the majority – sod the minority. Whereas true democracy includes everybody’s opinion in society,” - Margaret Georgiadou, 2019 about Brexit referendum.
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  19. #8999
    Herald of the Titans dribbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thevoicefromwithin View Post
    Btw Brits applying for Irish and German passports are at a record high, vast majority of them young and well educated.
    Oh yes I fully accept Bob from Bromwich went to Ireland and Carl from Clacton went to Germany, poor miss guided souls, but they in no way mitigate the effects of millions of EU caravan refugees flooding the UK. I'm sure someone in the US today, with the Mexico equivalence, likened it to an invasion....

    Let's hope Bob and Carl are ready to serve in the new EU army as the price they must pay for retained EU citizenship rights.

    Good riddance if you ask me, the UK doesn't take conscripts any more.

  20. #9000
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Slant View Post
    I dunno, second hit on Google. It wasn't that hard to find.
    The third Google hit about 'alien abductions' is how Betty and Barney Hill from the New Hampshire Mountains were snatched in 1961. Finally proof. And, it wasn't that hard to find.



    There never was 'crisis after crisis' as a result of Yen depreciation. It never happened. The claim is about as clueless and absurd as complaining about regular blizzards in Kongo.

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