View Poll Results: 10 days left, what'll it be?

Voters
92. You may not vote on this poll
  • Hard Brexit (crash out)

    45 48.91%
  • No Brexit (Remain by revoking A50)

    24 26.09%
  • Withdrawal Agreement (after a new session is called)

    0 0%
  • Extension + Withdrawal Agreement

    3 3.26%
  • Extension + Crashout

    9 9.78%
  • Extension + Remain

    11 11.96%
  1. #16661
    Quote Originally Posted by kaid View Post
    From what I was looking at this seemed expected in the first round of these votes. We shall see if monday if any of those that were closer get whipped harder to push one across the line. Ironically if all the labor abstentions voted to revoke article 50 they had enough votes to push it through. I think seeing that and the second ref getting close are what is making some of the ERG doofs like boris worried and may get them to vote for mays deal.
    Whilst I do think revoking article 50 would be best for the country and it does fit with my personal preferences I don't want it done just by an Act of Parliament. A second referendum would be needed to show the Brexiteers that the will of the people has changed on this matter, and if a second referendum ends up with May's deal or a no deal Brexit then at least this time the people will have some idea what they were actually voting for.

  2. #16662
    Quote Originally Posted by Flarelaine View Post
    I think the trick is that they would not mind a hard border with Ireland.
    The trick is they probably would not mind the Troubles; it's a boost to sectarianism and a chance to continue. I would not be surprised if some of the DUP lost people in the Troubles and care more for a new chance at revenge than peace.
    Hail Lilith and see you in Hell!

  3. #16663
    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    Whilst I do think revoking article 50 would be best for the country and it does fit with my personal preferences I don't want it done just by an Act of Parliament. A second referendum would be needed to show the Brexiteers that the will of the people has changed on this matter, and if a second referendum ends up with May's deal or a no deal Brexit then at least this time the people will have some idea what they were actually voting for.
    I would agree that once they come to some kind of conclusion that has the votes to pass they need to put it into a referendum if the people want it or not because I don't think anything that can get the votes resembles what people voted for in the initial referendum.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    The trick is they probably would not mind the Troubles; it's a boost to sectarianism and a chance to continue. I would not be surprised if some of the DUP lost people in the Troubles and care more for a new chance at revenge than peace.
    But I think they would not be okay with a hard border likely triggering another swing towards unification that if people were given the option of hard border or unification may chose the latter if the UK is busy shooting itself in the feet.

  4. #16664
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    The trick is they probably would not mind the Troubles; it's a boost to sectarianism and a chance to continue. I would not be surprised if some of the DUP lost people in the Troubles and care more for a new chance at revenge than peace.
    That much goes without saying.

  5. #16665
    Quote Originally Posted by dribbles View Post
    I don't think you will find anyone who says that May's deal is a good deal however legally it takes us outside the EU. As a first step, a deal that can be torn apart by a more UK friendly PM over the coming months is better than nothing.

    This mess is on the remainers and the EU who at every opportunity have done all they can to put road blocks in front of the UK leaving the EU as they want to stop enacting the democratic will of the people.

    We would not be in this position if the government had a strong majority and a leader such as Boris Johnson.

    A general election can fix this as many constituencies, especially Labour, remove MP's who have promised one thing and done the exact opposite. No one can predict what parliament will look like until useless remainer MP's have been held accountable at the ballot box.
    Lol, sod off with this bullshit. Are you seriuos right now? The UK had nearly 3 years to get their shit in order and did almost nothing during that time, even right now there are almost no preparations in place for a no deal transition.

    Nobody is going to take anyone from the UK serious any longer if they try to blame this one on the EU. Take respondibility for your own shortcomings for a change.
    Turning and turning in the widening gyre
    The falcon cannot hear the falconer
    Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold.

  6. #16666
    I have a question, because I don't live in the UK and the news don't really show any of the negotiations happening in the british parliment, but... Do we know what the Pro-brexit politicians want, or is it just "We don't like that deal, May. You are a failure, now make a deal we want!" without any input in what they want?

  7. #16667
    Herald of the Titans dribbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dizzeeyooo View Post
    Boris Johnson at 7am yesterday

    As of lunchtime today, he is now saying the deal is dead again.

    Was he right yesterday morning, or this morning, or this afternoon? @dribbles
    It is clear that Boris will do and say whatever it takes in the best interests of his country. That includes facilitating the removal of terrible Theresa and his installation as a brexiteer in her place in order to serve the democratic will of the people.

    Over 17 million people will thank him for acting so honourably and selflessly for that reason.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana View Post
    Lol, sod off with this bullshit. Are you seriuos right now? The UK had nearly 3 years to get their shit in order and did almost nothing during that time, even right now there are almost no preparations in place for a no deal transition.

    Nobody is going to take anyone from the UK serious any longer if they try to blame this one on the EU. Take respondibility for your own shortcomings for a change.
    But the process of the UK leaving over those 3 years was clearly led by remainers in collusion with the EU not brexiteers. If the PM had been a brexiteer surrounded by soul mates we would not be in this mess. This mess has been created by anti democratic remainers and the EU who have firmly been in charge of the progression of the UK exit. The EU and remainers must own this, brexiteers have had no part to play in it. Yet.

    Don't worry they will have soon, and only they will sort it out.

  8. #16668
    Quote Originally Posted by dribbles View Post
    It is clear that Boris will do and say whatever it takes in the best interests of his country. That includes facilitating the removal of terrible Theresa and his installation as a brexiteer in her place in order to serve the democratic will of the people.

    Over 17 million people will thank him for acting so honourably and selflessly for that reason.
    I get the strong impression from this that you actually really dislike Johnson?

  9. #16669
    Quote Originally Posted by dribbles View Post
    Over 17 million people will thank him for acting so honourably and selflessly for that reason.
    They will need some kind of seance to manage that. Statistically speaking, around 1m of those are dead already.
    When challenging a Kzin, a simple scream of rage is sufficient. You scream and you leap.

    Quote Originally Posted by George Carlin
    Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.
    Brexophilia: The act of rubbing yourself against dead political ideas for sexual pleasure.

  10. #16670
    Quote Originally Posted by Huehuecoyotl View Post
    They will need some kind of seance to manage that. Statistically speaking, around 1m of those are dead already.
    Maybe there is another million outraged at article 11/13/17 stuff.

  11. #16671
    Quote Originally Posted by Shalcker View Post
    Maybe there is another million outraged at article 11/13/17 stuff.
    Lol I don't think there's a million outraged over all of Europe.
    Quote Originally Posted by AeneasBK View Post
    Damnit hubcap, you are such a retard.
    Seriously guys, this forum would be a better place if everyone just stopped acknowledging Zenkai. It's just demeaning to everyone.

  12. #16672
    Moderator Northern Goblin's Avatar
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    Turns out some of the MEPs didn't know what they were voting for on Article 13 and want to vote again.

  13. #16673
    Quote Originally Posted by Odinfrost View Post
    I have a question, because I don't live in the UK and the news don't really show any of the negotiations happening in the british parliment, but... Do we know what the Pro-brexit politicians want, or is it just "We don't like that deal, May. You are a failure, now make a deal we want!" without any input in what they want?
    Well see it like this.

    Every Pro-Brexit politician ran for the hill the day after Cameron resigned and non of them wanted anything to do with making sure the UK left the EU in a good fashion.

    Than when May got in power she had some pretty strong anti EU cabinet members in relevant positions.
    David Davis, Boris Johnson and Liam Fox

    As far as I know all 3 of these had a really important positions in the this processes and are all anti EU so in the past 3 years they all had a chance to shape this processes in such a way that the Leave camp could accept.

    Honestly I don't think they really care about May's deal that much or leaving the EU as it is now. Leaving the EU is secondary to there quest for becoming PM themselves. Don't forget though, reason why the UK is in a mess is because the British government was never prepared for anything. Ireland and the EU prepared for multiply scenario's and knew what they where doing at every step, EU just followed the processes. May and her goons ran on multiply fairytale level assumptions and instead of trying to work towards a solution that had broad support she just went further to the right.

  14. #16674
    Moderator Northern Goblin's Avatar
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    So she can't bring the meaningful vote back a third time, so she's splitting the withdrawl agreement from the political declararion and bringing half a meaningful vote to the Commons tomorrow.

    Except that wouldn't actually satisfy the requirements for leaving the EU.

    Plus the DUP won't back it anyway, so it's dead on arrival and merely an indicator that we'll be requesting a longer Brexit extension, and as such be holding MEP elections

  15. #16675
    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    So she can't bring the meaningful vote back a third time, so she's splitting the withdrawl agreement from the political declararion and bringing half a meaningful vote to the Commons tomorrow.

    Except that wouldn't actually satisfy the requirements for leaving the EU.

    Plus the DUP won't back it anyway, so it's dead on arrival and merely an indicator that we'll be requesting a longer Brexit extension, and as such be holding MEP elections
    Plus I think this entire "trick" qualifies as proof of the UK acting in bad faith. The WA was given as an offer TOGETHER with the political declaration.
    Hail Lilith and see you in Hell!

  16. #16676
    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    So she can't bring the meaningful vote back a third time, so she's splitting the withdrawl agreement from the political declararion and bringing half a meaningful vote to the Commons tomorrow.

    Except that wouldn't actually satisfy the requirements for leaving the EU.

    Plus the DUP won't back it anyway, so it's dead on arrival and merely an indicator that we'll be requesting a longer Brexit extension, and as such be holding MEP elections
    It's on the BBC that the Govt actually expects it to fail but are looking to wittle the loss down from last time. Which seems like a bizarre fucking strategy since this is should be the last throw of the dice for it.

  17. #16677
    Moderator Northern Goblin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Plus I think this entire "trick" qualifies as proof of the UK acting in bad faith. The WA was given as an offer TOGETHER with the political declaration.
    This isn't so much the UK acting in bad faith with the EU, but the PM and Government acting in bad faith with Parliament. Unsurprising though, they've already found to be in contempt once.

  18. #16678
    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    This isn't so much the UK acting in bad faith with the EU, but the PM and Government acting in bad faith with Parliament. Unsurprising though, they've already found to be in contempt once.
    I'd say it's both, just that the EU won't be that bothered because they still win.
    May's Deal passes in whatever form: peaceful transition that protects our side of exports (goods) while not the UK's (services)
    May's Deal fails: CU will very likely get a majority on Monday, again resulting in a deal that favours trade in goods over services.
    Hail Lilith and see you in Hell!

  19. #16679
    So this has given me some insight into the swivel eyed lunacy of the cult that is the ERG.

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Bridgen
    Brexiteer and Conservative MP Andrew Bridgen - who has twice voted against Mrs May's deal - said he does not think the withdrawal agreement will go through tomorrow.

    "The fact that it's been separated from the political declaration is more dangerous," he said, speaking outside Parliament.

    "The withdrawal agreement, without the political declaration, is a trap.

    "There's almost no chance of getting out of the backstop ever without the political declaration being attached.


    "It seems like a legal nightmare for the government to do this. If they've done it just to get round the speaker and make it a different vote, I think it may be counterproductive."

    When asked about his hopes for the next party leader, Mr Bridgen added that he wanted a Brexiteer to take over the Brexit process.

    He added: "Parliament is so fragile that I can't see us getting through the next six months without a general election. So what we need is a big name and an election winner to be heading up the party."
    See I thought they were somewhere between uncaring and stupid, a dangerous mix of both. But reading that.....I mean they honestly think the EU is th monster in the closet.
    Last edited by Kronik85; 2019-03-28 at 08:36 PM.

  20. #16680
    Quote Originally Posted by Kronik85 View Post
    See I thought they were somewhere between uncaring and stupid, a dangerous mix of both. But reading that.....I mean they honestly think the EU is th monster in the closet.
    I mean, it's true that you are not getting out of the backstop. You'll have to invent a new way to handle borders to do that. I guess everything is possible but we haven't seen any ideas yet on how it can be done.
    Hail Lilith and see you in Hell!

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