[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[ranzino]

so really know: how much of that pamphlet will survive House of Commons tomorrow ?

Rees-Mogg is already busy, sending out letters to conservative MP urging to turn down the deal, says the Guardian online.

[Deleted]

so really know: how much of that pamphlet will survive House of Commons tomorrow ?

Rees-Mogg is already busy, sending out letters to conservative MP urging to turn down the deal, says the Guardian online.

It's going to get rejected flat out, then May and the EU can hold up there hands, say we tried to give you a deal, and then get down to the business of fucking up the UK with a no deal.

[Demolitia]

Hmmms...

I'm finding it hard to draw anything from the 585 page document.

And the critical bullet point in the 7 page summary basically says, we're going to leave without a plan to solve an insoluble problem.

So much unadulterated joy to be had here.

It basically keeps things as they are, with a contribution to be defined until somebody comes up with a better plan
It's an EFTA membership in all but name.

[Demolitia]

so really know: how much of that pamphlet will survive House of Commons tomorrow ?

Rees-Mogg is already busy, sending out letters to conservative MP urging to turn down the deal, says the Guardian online.

Well it depends. You have a very vocal bunch of MPs rooting for a hard brexit. The big question is whether the rest of them think a shitty deal is better than no deal.
And let's be clear, any deal will be shitty in comparison to the current membership arrangements, but better than nothing.
I wouldn't want to be a British MP right now. Pick rabies or cholera.

[Slant]

So they can criticise, but do they have a better proposal that the EU would accept?

Ah, but that's the one perk being in opposition has. You don't need to be constructive.

- - - Updated - - -

And I hope people like you are proud of yourselves you will be destroying so many lives and potentially future children's futures all because of pettyness, how you people sleep at night is beyond me.

People with bad characters usually sleep rather well, unfortunately. And yes, I had to delete the word assholes and replace it. Because that would be mean.

[ranzino]

It's going to get rejected flat out, then May and the EU can hold up there hands, say we tried to give you a deal, and then get down to the business of fucking up the UK with a no deal.

here's the letter by Rees-Mogg; he was speedy to deliver...

https://twitter.com/Peston/status/10...175360/photo/1

already a waste of time: one third of cabinet spoke out against the deal in the discussion today. PM May will have to whip every ass to get a YAY on the matter in parliament, not going to happen. forget it

https://twitter.com/christopherhope/...01864494845952


but behold this gem in May's statement after that nonsense of discussion:
"She said the alternatives to the deal were a no deal Brexit, or not leaving the EU at all."
if she is indeed open minded to call it off: tomorrow is her chance

[Slant]

The Cabinet has backed Mays deal, which I don't think anyone saw coming, but there are probably resignations coming and looks like Mogg/BoJo are gearing up for another no confidence vote and a leadership battle.

Impeccable timing, too. It's not like the nation can't afford a GE right now, right? We'll make sure to halt the rotation of the planet for them to sort it out.. Gnargh. It's like they want this to fail. Can they please be put in front of a judge when all of this is over? If I scam you, I get punished. But if someone scams and entire nation, he goes scot free... that's not fair.

[Slant]

So it basically sounds like we switch to the Norway model until both the EU and the UK are satisfied that the divorce is sufficiently hashed out, and the UK can also make trade deals during this time period, that go into effect when the EU and the UK eventually part ways.

I mean it's not perfect but it's a damn sight better than a no deal.

You realise that the irish problem isn't solved by this, right? Since it's a paradoxical problem, you will stay in Norway forever. Make all the trade deals that you want, but they'll never actually come into effect. This isn't a solution. It's just a way for the EU to put off having to be the bad guy. If Britain is going to suicide, it'll have to do that by itself.

[Slant]

Slant, I think we WILL. If they want a GE or want to conduct a referendum, the EU WILL give them an extension. It's already discussed, Barnier is in favor, Tusk and Juncker are in favor, the only one who spoke somewhat against it was Macron and even he said he'd be in favor with some unspecified conditions. That was pretty much a lifeline by the EU when they last met May and while she shot it down at that point, she definitely didn't forget it's there.

You're probably right. I mean, I don't care. As long as I don't have to put up with silly border stops going to the UK, I don't give a fuck what they call themselves. I'm not interested in the political entity, I just want to meet friends or make vacation there. Or both.

[Deleted]

You realise that the irish problem isn't solved by this, right? Since it's a paradoxical problem, you will stay in Norway forever. Make all the trade deals that you want, but they'll never actually come into effect. This isn't a solution. It's just a way for the EU to put off having to be the bad guy. If Britain is going to suicide, it'll have to do that by itself.

The only way for the UK to leave the EU and not have a border between NI and the RoI is to either secede NI to the RoI or to move the borders of the UK from NI to Great Britain instead, which is basically ceding NI to the RoI in all but name. The main block to this is the DUP, who are Unionists, who May can't piss off because they are the only thing giving her a majority, if the deal pushes the eventual divorce further down the line, the DUP could be out of the picture and the DUP blocker shouldn't be as big of an issue as it is now.

Which is presumably why the DUP are vehemently against this agreement.

And yeah, the EU also getting a say in when the UK leave is probably going to be one of the biggest things that stops this deal in Parliament, even though it makes complete sense for the EU to want a say.

Literally 4 posts down from the one you quoted.

[Adolecent]

So it basically sounds like we switch to the Norway model until both the EU and the UK are satisfied that the divorce is sufficiently hashed out, and the UK can also make trade deals during this time period, that go into effect when the EU and the UK eventually part ways.

I mean it's not perfect but it's a damn sight better than a no deal.

There will never be a special deal between the EU and the UK. The UK will have to fit into the existing models, exactly like it's going to happen now.

The UK lost, like predicted.

[Slant]

Literally 4 posts down from the one you quoted.

Cut me some slack, I just got done eating and I was still catching up.

[Demolitia]

Ultimately perhaps it had to come to this, the very last moment, before she could dare to utter these words.
Of course she won't get the votes in parliament for a referendum even if she wanted one; a lot of Tories will vote no, and Labour will shoot it down because they want a GE, not a referendum.

If they can call it off on their own.

[Deleted]

This is going nowhere by the looks of things.

[Slant]

There will never be a special deal between the EU and the UK. The UK will have to fit into the existing models, exactly like it's going to happen now.

The UK lost, like predicted.

Hey now, the game's not over, yet. The EU may have shot a zinger at the goal, but Parliament is still there to clear it for the corner... don't worry, this will go into OT.

[Deleted]

There will never be a special deal between the EU and the UK. The UK will have to fit into the existing models, exactly like it's going to happen now.

The UK lost, like predicted.

I'm aware, don't speak to me like i'm some Leaver retard.

[Demolitia]

There will never be a special deal between the EU and the UK. The UK will have to fit into the existing models, exactly like it's going to happen now.

The UK lost, like predicted.

Not predicted. Announced on day 1. The problem was to make something that the UK Prime Minister could sell like a win. Which is a bit trickier.

[Kallisto]

According to IDS between 9-11 cabinate members are against this and it wasn't even put up to a vote.

[ranzino]

the deal itself is dead then, grand funeral by House of Commons tomorrow

but what happens next ?

[Nigel Tufnel]

According to IDS between 9-11 cabinate members are against this and it wasn't even put up to a vote.

Have you got a source for that?

That's incredible....

Wtf is May doing?