[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[AeneasBK]

I want mods to fix this, these posts shouldn't even be possible.

Well that's hardly likely to happen.

Sorry if it comes across as attacking you personally Slant, that's not the aim, just kinda depressing coming back to the thread every other day to find 2 pages of pointless "NO U" tittle tattle. At least after all this time, to see it still happen.

And like they say, evading a ban isn't hard or troublesome really.

[Slant]

Well that's hardly likely to happen.

Sorry if it comes across as attacking you personally Slant, that's not the aim, just kinda depressing coming back to the thread every other day to find 2 pages of pointless "NO U" tittle tattle. At least after all this time, to see it still happen.

And like they say, evading a ban isn't hard or troublesome really.

I know. Mods need to address this. I know this section is probably the most unimportant for this forum (even if it is one of the most frequented one, with GenOT and /politics), but they need to find a way to impose a minimum post count to be able to post here. 50 or 100 posts would help the situation already. Are these ban evaders going to spam other forums just to get the post count? Perhaps. And I think that's what they want to avoid... We literally are the trash heap of MMO-C. The undesirables... lol

Guess you're right after all. Fuck this. If only one of them dimwits just ONCE would bring forth an actual intelligent and reasonable argument.

[Amalaric]

The UK will never leave the EU... it was all a ruse in order to get preferential treatment and it failed.

[Wyrt]

The UK will never leave the EU... it was all a ruse in order to get preferential treatment and it failed.

Didn't they already get preferential treatment in a lot of areas?

[Xarkan]

Yes they did they even got out the f having their currency changed to the euro they where the favourite child and it goes to show that the favourite is almost always the most bratty.

Does that.. make Denmark the new favourite child since we also are not in the Euro

Edit: Though imo despite having exceptions Denmark is trying to take part not stand apart

[Slant]

Just in case any optimist was still in doubt:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a8829391.html

Germany and France have warned that Theresa May will need to present a “clear and precise” reason why she needs a Brexit delay when she meets EU leaders later this week, if she wants to have any chance of them approving it.

So far, we're heading into a no-deal crash. Why? Because the UK still has not touched base with reality.

[Blur4stuff]

Is it me or is the only sensible solution to have another vote with Remain vs A Specific Leave Plan? They would probably extend for that.

[ranzino]

Just in case any optimist was still in doubt:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a8829391.html



So far, we're heading into a no-deal crash. Why? Because the UK still has not touched base with reality.

as summit starts at thursday: can the PM just table a reason and ask Commons later (aka next week with Brexit in plain sight) to vote on it ?

[FluFF]

Does that.. make Denmark the new favourite child since we also are not in the Euro

Edit: Though imo despite having exceptions Denmark is trying to take part not stand apart

Sweden also doesn't use the Euro both both Denmark and Sweden are in Schengen, something the UK also didn't wanted and got exempt from.
So in that case both Denmark and Sweden are ''more'' EU than UK already was.

The benefits the UK had went much further then just not adopting the Euro currency, they had a wheelbarrow full of exempts while still having every single EU membership benefit.

[Dizzeeyooo]

can the PM just table a reason

Yes, but that still involves her thinking of a logical reason.

"I want another chance to pass my deal, please ignore the fact that it has received the 1st and 4th largest parliamentary defeats in UK history before now, I promise next time will be different" doesn't really work at this point, especially with prominent Conservatives publicly discussing May's deal passing based on a guarantee of her resignation afterwards, and then someone like Boris being elected to rip the deal apart.

[Skroe]

Jeremy Paxman has a nice little rant about how he is likely the worst Prime minister in UK history, and he'll have met a fair few and interviewed most of cabinet for few decades

He really is.

It was unbelievable to me he held that NATO Bombing of Syria vote without doing a headcount first to see if he had majority support. What kind of political imbecile who has the power to call a vote, even puts it on the calendar before ascertaining if his motion will be carried by the house. In the US... hell most functional democracies... legislatures doing that do so extremely rarely because it is an objectively stupid political thing to do. But I guess David Cameron wanted to be surprised at the outcome? Like what the hell. For or against Syria bombing... objectively if you wanted to bomb Syria, like he did, how does anyone ever go into that room, call a vote, and not expect they a specific outcome because they didn't send their staff around to ask people how they were going to vote. And I mean, this shitshow had very real reprocussions. That meant that NATO unanimity was broken, which meant Obama would have to seek a AUMF from Congress, which wasn't inclined to give it (that's another story), which meant that Obama had to be bailed out by Vladimir Putin.

Then a yearish later, David Cameron follows it up with an Scottish referendum that he forgot to campaign for untila bout three weeks before. And it was one time rival Gordon Brown who ultimately saved the Union within a week of the vote by taking the lead. How did Cameron not mobilize a unionist campaign to set out to squash the independence campaign?

And then he did it again with the Brexit vote! First in holding in. And then not making "Remain", the single issue of his completely maladroit Prime Ministership. The man should have live don the campaign trail, bringing out the Remainer vote for something that important. But he didn't do spit!

Objectively... who the hell was this bumbling idiot? How can someone get to be British Prime Minister, until recently one of the most prominent national leaders there is, and be so objectively terrible at politics. And every time he fucked up, he either got bailed out by somebody else (Brown, Vladimir Putin) and/or precipitated a disaster.

- - - Updated - - -

Just in case any optimist was still in doubt:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a8829391.html



So far, we're heading into a no-deal crash. Why? Because the UK still has not touched base with reality.

France and Germany should just let the UK hard-crash out.

[ranzino]

May's word is frankly worthless to the EU at this point.

unfortunately as PM and head of government she is the official spokesperson of UK and nobody else is allowed to attend the summit; it is "leaders only" this time.
and the summit will decide on the matter, there is no time for emergency summit next week.

Brexit happens or dies within 48 hours now.

[LeGin Tufnel]

France and Germany should just let the UK hard-crash out.

Yep, sure. That'd definitely be beneficial for the US, so I can completely understand why you think that.

[Skroe]

Yep, sure. That'd definitely be beneficial for the US, so I can completely understand why you think that.

I actually want the UK to stay in the EU. I've made that point clear many many times.

But the British Parliament hasn't taken Brexit seriously for two years. Hell, even before the vote, it didn't take it seriously. And there is no reason to think even with an extension that would change.

Unless May puts the deal to a new referendum, with remain a the alternative, the EU should let the UK drown in it's own bull feces.

[LeGin Tufnel]

But the British Parliament hasn't taken Brexit seriously for two years. Hell, even before the vote, it didn't take it seriously. And there is no reason to think even with an extension that would change.

No, that's too simplistic an analysis. There are plenty in parliament and outside of parliament who take this deeply, deeply seriously. And Didatic was wrong earlier in the thread too. Brexit isn't just the product of austerity. It's much more complicated / multi-faceted.

Anyway, you conclusion is what?

You're cheering on the worst case scenario that will negatively effect the UK (to a greater extent) and the EU (to a lesser extent), when there is still an albeit small chance that the UK will Remain?

When I chat to my friends in NY, Chicago, Kansas, LA - I'm not wishing them ill because of the utter clusterfuck half of you lot have inflicted upon the world.

Speaking of which:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...-brexit-advice

Literally, by cheering on a hard Brexit, you're aligning yourself with these people.

[Pann]

Number 10 has indicated that May will send her letter requesting an extension tomorrow.

[Slant]

as summit starts at thursday: can the PM just table a reason and ask Commons later (aka next week with Brexit in plain sight) to vote on it ?

She's got exactly 6 working days left. If she can't present a solid plan, ratified and ready for implementation (within a reasonable extension period), she will get sent home for the final time on Thursday. The EU doesn't do "buy now, pay later". If it isn't ratified, she has no mandate to make the suggestion as per UK constitutional law.

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Yep, sure. That'd definitely be beneficial for the US, so I can completely understand why you think that.

The UK crashing out has little to do with the US, so that comment is a bit unfair. The EU is getting fed up with this circus, too. As many, many European ministers have emphasized today. The game's up, the bluff is called. Now the UK has to show what cards it got.

Spoiler alert: We know they have no cards.

[LeGin Tufnel]

Number 10 has indicated that May will send her letter requesting an extension tomorrow.

I'm wondering if Bercow has completely fucked this.

a) Delay until pre EU elections. Does that mean recess and she gets to push it a third time? Or does Bercow's ruling stick? is that enough of a reason for the EU to justify a short extension? Surely not. I just do not see the point in a short extension. May will just continue to treat it as some sort of high noon show down.
b) Longer delay. Has to be on basis of 2nd referendum. GE will solve absolutely nothing. Absolutely nothing.

This is a complete mess.

Note, I understand the EU wanting to end this swiftly for the right reasons, but if it crosses into schadenfreude bullshit - you're as bad as Farage and co and don't think otherwise.

[Slant]

No, that's too simplistic an analysis. There are plenty in parliament and outside of parliament who take this deeply, deeply seriously. And Didatic was wrong earlier in the thread too. Brexit isn't just the product of austerity. It's much more complicated / multi-faceted.

Anyway, you conclusion is what?

You're cheering on the worst case scenario that will negatively effect the UK (to a greater extent) and the EU (to a lesser extent), when there is still an albeit small chance that the UK will Remain?

When I chat to my friends in NY, Chicago, Kansas, LA - I'm not wishing them ill because of the utter clusterfuck half of you lot have inflicted upon the world.

Speaking of which:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...-brexit-advice

Literally, by cheering on a hard Brexit, you're aligning yourself with these people.

He's hardly cheering. He has actually made the case for the UK to remain in almost every post he made. Just like I did. But at some point enough is enough. We've accepted that the UK wants to be out, mostly because British stubborness forced us to accept the fact that we can't stop this. But if you must do this, do it in a timely fashion and don't waste everybody's time. We're moving on. So should you. Look forward, start your work on convincing your fellow citizens that applying to the EU (again) in 10 years might be a good idea.

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Number 10 has indicated that May will send her letter requesting an extension tomorrow.

A letter? A bloody letter? A matter of this importance kinda asks for personal delivery. She really wants to leave this to an underpaid postal worker in Belgium? Rofl...

[Pann]

I'm wondering if Bercow has completely fucked this.

a) Delay until pre EU elections. Does that mean recess and she gets to push it a third time? Or does Bercow's ruling stick? is that enough of a reason for the EU to justify a short extension? Surely not. I just do not see the point in a short extension. May will just continue to treat it as some sort of high noon show down.
b) Longer delay. Has to be on basis of 2nd referendum. GE will solve absolutely nothing. Absolutely nothing.

This is a complete mess.

Note, I understand the EU wanting to end this swiftly for the right reasons, but if it crosses into schadenfreude bullshit - you're as bad as Farage and co and don't think otherwise.

In fairness Bercow was just upholding parliamentary procedure and stopping May from bullying her deal through.

We don't know what extension she is going to request (rumour was she wanted both a short and a long extension but apparently she might now have come to her senses on that one) nor is there any guarantee that the EU will agree to her request.

Indeed it is.