[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[Teleros]

We, as a nation, need to able to implement what is agreed (presumably this is the same on the continent) so it is imperative that UK industry is kept in the loop - note this does not mean implementing exactly what they want but they need to be able to put in place whatever systems are required and have them ready for when the transition period comes to an end.

Oh, no disagreement from me there - but that's talking to UK industry, not listening to them . TBH I expect that if Whitehall is planning something truly retarded then (a) it'll leak, and (b) UK businesses will make their feelings known in no uncertain terms through other channels.

[Pann]

Oh, no disagreement from me there - but that's talking to UK industry, not listening to them . TBH I expect that if Whitehall is planning something truly retarded then (a) it'll leak, and (b) UK businesses will make their feelings known in no uncertain terms through other channels.

I think industry leaders have got the message that we're leaving the EU and there's no going back, also they'll be aware of the government's plans - probably more so than the majority of us - so I don't think that there is much danger that they would try to push for and achievable or unrealistic outcome.

[dribbles]

David Frost has confirmed that negotiations are ongoing.

https://twitter.com/DavidGHFrost/sta...61822833717251

Obviously much can continue using video conferencing however the worry is that Whitehall don't appear to be talking to UK industries and this - assuming a June cutoff - is not going to give UK businesses enough lead time to implement whatever is or isn't agreed.

Yes the remnants of the old EU are still there like the embers of a dying fire pretending everything is hunky dory and going through the motions with the UK. Realistically it once would have been sensible and wise for businesses to have planned for a no deal, and they did in spades, but now it is far better they plan that there is no EU.

[LeGin Tufnel]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52273988

IMF suggests the world “faces greatest recession since the Great Depression”.

All major economies will be in recession by the end of the year.

In short: a great time to make things a fuck of a lot worse.

But, hey, lets take anonymous posters with no professional credentials who use roll eyes emoticons to dismiss facts that don’t suit their agenda.

[Acidbaron]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52273988

IMF suggests the world “faces greatest recession since the Great Depression”.

All major economies will be in recession by the end of the year.

In short: a great time to make things a fuck of a lot worse.

But, hey, lets take anonymous posters with no professional credentials who use roll eyes emoticons to dismiss facts that don’t suit their agenda.

I don't think anyone questions there will be an economic aftermath, a crisis is bound to happen the question is how severe it might be and that is hard to estimate as it depends on things we cannot predict correctly;

How much will the economy pick up again?
How many jobs will actually be lost?
Will consumerism die down too much?
How many countries can re-open again before a vaccine?
How many sectors in that country can effectively open up again?
Can we really afford to not invest in social democratic constructs such as our healthcare?
How will nations react to this?
Will there be more populism after this? more nationalism and thus more protectionism shrinking the world economy even further in an attempt to protect one self?

And so on and that is just limiting it to us, the westerners that is me not even factoring in other negatives such as immigration and refugees streams going to increase again but perhaps we don't even have to look that far, what of nations who have large regions dependant on tourism, something that simply won't happen.

There are so many factors in place and that's why i do find it correct that we are not going to resort to calling it a depression just yet especially not stating that it will be the same as the great depression as markets are fickle and there's such a thing among investors where there are psychological barriers also stating that a great depression is coming creates a negative outlook what means people are not going to spend, banks will become stricter with loans all of this making it so you create a self full filling prophecy to a point.

[LeGin Tufnel]

and there's such a thing among investors where there are psychological barriers also stating that a great depression is coming creates a negative outlook what means people are not going to spend, banks will become stricter with loans all of this making it so you create a self full filling prophecy to a point.

Yep, sure, I accept this.

But to espouse the exact opposite (charging ahead with a positive outlook) which, in the context of this thread, is ignoring the needless disruption a WTO-terms exit at the end of the year will cause, is irresponsible.

Some soundbites, after the publication of the OBR report yesterday:

- biggest economic shock in 300 years if lockdown lasts 3 months
- bleak warning from the UK's fiscal watchdog shows national output could drop by 35% in the second quarter of 2020
- unemployment rate could hit 10pc with more than 3.4m out of work
- but chancellor insists “bounce back will be swift”

Well, I have zero faith in the optimistic promises of Sunak or any other Brexiteer who have, from the start, tried to cast the inevitable negative economic consequences of Brexit as either “project fear” or a “short term blip“ or whatever. All in the name of restoring their precious “sovereignty”.

The UK has until June 30 to request a delay. This should be done immediately. Of course, though, it won’t be as the government and those that defend them are a bunch of extremist nutters.

[Acidbaron]

Yep, sure, I accept this.

But to espouse the exact opposite (charging ahead with a positive outlook) which, in the context of this thread, is ignoring the needless disruption a WTO-terms exit at the end of the year will cause, is irresponsible.

Some soundbites, after the publication of the OBR report yesterday:

- biggest economic shock in 300 years if lockdown lasts 3 months
- bleak warning from the UK's fiscal watchdog shows national output could drop by 35% in the second quarter of 2020
- unemployment rate could hit 10pc with more than 3.4m out of work
- but chancellor insists “bounce back will be swift”

Well, I have zero faith in the optimistic promises of Sunak or any other Brexiteer who have, from the start, tried to cast the inevitable negative economic consequences of Brexit as either “project fear” or a “short term blip“ or whatever. All in the name of restoring their precious “sovereignty”.

The UK has until June 30 to request a delay. This should be done immediately. Of course, though, it won’t be as the government and those that defend them are a bunch of extremist nutters.

Ah okay in that light,

Well governments have yet to learn the virus is going to dictate the time line not them. After the hospitalization rate has levelled out you can reduce measures taken and with levelled out i literally mean once you're past the peak and when the curve has stopped dropping and if that means hospitalizations are manageable.

However it is normal why governments are pushing for reopening, those are governments who have often worked on dismantling safetynets for workers and small businesses, governments who have led poorly managed economic reforms that can't afford a long term drop as that means the debt they have to pay back becomes a serious issue.

That is something you have to keep in mind when looking at those people promoting it, they don't want to be blamed for years of bad policies. Because the only added benefit of this crisis is that it is highlighting all those parts a government has fucked up on the last decade, those things they swept under the rug and now they need a well oiled machine you see cogs and bolts jumping off left and right.

[Pann]

The UK still remains adamant that talks will not continue past the end of the year.

'The UK's negotiator on post-Brexit relations with the EU David Frost told his Brussels counterparts today that "the U.K. does not intend to ask for an extension to the transition period, which ends on Dec 31 this year". Make of that what you will'

https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1250441912512704523

[Huehuecoyotl]

The UK still remains adamant that talks will not continue past the end of the year.

'The UK's negotiator on post-Brexit relations with the EU David Frost told his Brussels counterparts today that "the U.K. does not intend to ask for an extension to the transition period, which ends on Dec 31 this year". Make of that what you will'

https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1250441912512704523

What do I make of it? I make of it that the UK is currently governed by petulant children, who are unable to accept that the world has changed radically and what they wanted six months ago has suddenly become incredibly unimportant in the current scheme of things.

Personally I don't want people running the country that can't react to a changing set of circumstances. Especially when the route they are taking is likely to make a disastrous situation worse. They need to pull up their big boy pants, ask for an extension and replan for leaving at a point to be determined in the future. That point to be determined on the basis that the country has sufficiently recovered from the damage of this pandemic to be able to cope with the rigours of leaving the EU.

I would ask dribbles what he thinks, but I see his posting style has earned himself another well deserved holiday. So I guess we'll have to wait for those pearls of wisdom.

[Gorsameth]

The UK still remains adamant that talks will not continue past the end of the year.

'The UK's negotiator on post-Brexit relations with the EU David Frost told his Brussels counterparts today that "the U.K. does not intend to ask for an extension to the transition period, which ends on Dec 31 this year". Make of that what you will'

https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1250441912512704523

I once again point out that this makes perfect sense if they never intended to get a deal in the first place and desire a no-deal Brexit.

[Bodonius]

Isnt it time to close this tread? There is no way brexit isnt happening.

[Noradin]

Isnt it time to close this tread? There is no way brexit isnt happening.

Wrong thread?
Or did you mean to say that there is no way it is happening?

[tehealadin]

What do I make of it? I make of it that the UK is currently governed by petulant children, who are unable to accept that the world has changed radically and what they wanted six months ago has suddenly become incredibly unimportant in the current scheme of things.

Personally I don't want people running the country that can't react to a changing set of circumstances. Especially when the route they are taking is likely to make a disastrous situation worse. They need to pull up their big boy pants, ask for an extension and replan for leaving at a point to be determined in the future. That point to be determined on the basis that the country has sufficiently recovered from the damage of this pandemic to be able to cope with the rigours of leaving the EU.

I would ask dribbles what he thinks, but I see his posting style has earned himself another well deserved holiday. So I guess we'll have to wait for those pearls of wisdom.

I wholly agree. Not to demean the issues that brexiteers have with the EU and leaving, but we now have some very real and very fucking serious problems that have to take precedent. I'd like to think that most people who voted for brexit would concede that we have more pressing concerns, leaving the EU should not be at the top of our priorities right now. Regroup when we get out of the woods. We can leave once this storm has passed.

- - - Updated - - -

Wrong thread?
Or did you mean to say that there is no way it is happening?

I took that post to mean that since it is going to happen there is no point in keeping the thread opened.

[ranzino]

unless UK asks for extension, it is over in 8 months + some weeks

[LeGin Tufnel]

Isnt it time to close this tread? There is no way brexit isnt happening.

I enjoy a good double negative as much as the next man, but c'mon dude... time and place.

The [younger] Brexiteers must be absolutely delighted by the appearance of Covid-19. Something to hide behind for the next 50 years. Increases in income tax: "well, Covid-19". Unemployment? "well, Covid-19".

Edit...

Eastern Europeans to be flown in to pick fruit and veg

Honestly. You could not make it up.

[Bodonius]

Its just a dead topic, its already decided and over.

[LeGin Tufnel]

Its just a dead topic, its already decided and over.

Just briefly ‘coz busy but... this will never be a dead topic. Feel free to change the thread title / make a new one with a more tense-appropriate title, but rest assured, I will never let this go.

[Huehuecoyotl]

Just briefly ‘coz busy but... this will never be a dead topic. Feel free to change the thread title / make a new one with a more tense-appropriate title, but rest assured, I will never let this go.

Quite right too. The people that demanded that we do this need to have their feet held to the fire for the rest of their lives. The next time one of them opens their mouths to ask for something else to be changed to suit their demented wishes, we can just tell them "you voted for Brexit. You had your chance to choose for this lifetime, and we'll be fucked if we give you another one".

[ranzino]

....

Eastern Europeans to be flown in to pick fruit and veg

Honestly. You could not make it up.

does Priti know ? all those pesky EU citizens strolling into UK unhindered....

[Bodonius]

I hope EU will soon go away, let Germany stand alone with their grand plans instead of sucking all in.