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  1. #21
    Deleted
    gr8 b8 m8, i r8 8/8

    Unless you're trying to win Invitational, player skill will always trump the spec.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by hambanner View Post
    gr8 b8 m8, i r8 8/8

    Unless you're trying to win Invitational, player skill will always trump the spec.
    Yeah but you don't know how good the player is, so you choose with the info you have.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by hambanner View Post
    gr8 b8 m8, i r8 8/8

    Unless you're trying to win Invitational, player skill will always trump the spec.

  4. #24
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Emerald Archer View Post
    Yeah but you don't know how good the player is, so you choose with the info you have.
    The only info you can actually have is try to check their Armory or what not. Their spec will tell you an exact, round, nothing.

    ...and frankly myself I stopped running over +10 since within the pure casual bracket I mostly play with friends and if not enough are on-line, we carry a random low-ilvl.

  5. #25
    Honestly if you are just running a +10 it doesn't matter what you bring. I have completed +10's with whatever the affixes are with pretty much any comp you can imagine.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by hambanner View Post
    The only info you can actually have is try to check their Armory or what not. Their spec will tell you an exact, round, nothing.

    ...and frankly myself I stopped running over +10 since within the pure casual bracket I mostly play with friends and if not enough are on-line, we carry a random low-ilvl.
    You typically have a few people roughly the same "skill" according to armory. So they you take the safest bet, it's easy to be good in m+ at most of the top specs, which happen to be faceroll, so you would take a warrior, or an mm hunter, over worse specs.

    Because if you're assuming both people are equal skill, you take the spec that does more dmg, because you have a higher chance of them doing more damage than the other.

  7. #27
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Emerald Archer View Post
    You typically have a few people roughly the same "skill" according to armory. So they you take the safest bet, it's easy to be good in m+ at most of the top specs, which happen to be faceroll, so you would take a warrior, or an mm hunter, over worse specs.

    Because if you're assuming both people are equal skill, you take the spec that does more dmg, because you have a higher chance of them doing more damage than the other.
    Once again: are you trying to win the Invitational? When that arms warrior misses some explosive orbs or AoEs you into 12 stacks of Bursting, you will be just as dead as with a shadow priest who did the same mistake.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by hambanner View Post
    Once again: are you trying to win the Invitational? When that arms warrior misses some explosive orbs or AoEs you into 12 stacks of Bursting, you will be just as dead as with a shadow priest who did the same mistake.
    But you have to make a choice between players? Why wouldn't you make the smartest choice with the information you have available?

    Doesn't have to be a tournament to play smart.

  9. #29
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Emerald Archer View Post
    But you have to make a choice between players? Why wouldn't you make the smartest choice with the information you have available?

    Doesn't have to be a tournament to play smart.
    What is it that makes you play so super smart? What makes you think about how specs as a relevant factor? What sort of M+ are you pushing?

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by styil View Post
    Having a look at the logs of a primarily single target fight like Sisters of the Moon, there is clearly a large difference in single target output between the specs:
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/13#boss=2050

    All else being equal, do you think that it's reasonable to decline the bottom two-thirds of the specs in that list in order to maximise the probability of successfully clearing the Tyrannical dungeon in time, given how crucial single target DPS is this week? A group with, for example, an Elemental Shaman + Assassination Rogue + BM Hunter vs an Enhancement Shaman + Subtlety Rogue + MM Hunter could be the difference between a key downgrade and a key upgrade. And it makes sense that a prudent group leader would do whatever they could to ensure success.
    I try to have at least one big ST dps. Keep in mind even on tyrannical week you will spend most of your time fighting trash, not bosses, so AoE is still important.

    Also, even if I try to make the perfect group on paper, there's always a player or 2 whose reason to exist is to remind me that bad players are everywhere and we don't really bring a spec.

    When you lead a group, you drive a short bus.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by hambanner View Post
    What is it that makes you play so super smart? What makes you think about how specs as a relevant factor? What sort of M+ are you pushing?
    Specs are relevant when you run out of any other means of choosing a player. I don't understand how you could ever debate that, and 20s.

  12. #32
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Emerald Archer View Post
    Specs are relevant when you run out of any other means of choosing a player. I don't understand how you could ever debate that, and 20s.
    In 20s I can only strongly recommend going with players you personally know.

  13. #33
    Seems there should be a lot more factors than just ST dps, but obviously when it's your group you should invite whoever you want. I play an affliction lock and on a few occasions have saved the day after I saw the tank going down with a quick pet switch, taunt and run and tank brez. Enh shaman might be ahead of me on your ST damage list but he isn't going to do those things.

    Personally I would factor in making sure I have BL, a brez and survivability in addition to ST damage. Above all that, I would only want to do higher keys with people I already know, which is the most important factor.

  14. #34
    To humor your idea: yes, i would absolutely try to pick the best ST class if you hold everything else equal.

    However, holding everything else equal isn't practical because it simply isn't the case, so I would rather look at their m+ "score" to decide whom im taking.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by hambanner View Post
    In 20s I can only strongly recommend going with players you personally know.
    Very easy to pug them, if you know what you're looking for. Very rarely do I come across trash players. You eventually get a friends list of pugs you meant which usually fills your team 4/5.

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