Mega-Thread: Mueller investigation

[Zan15]

man /the donald is really popcorn worthy...tonight.

they are more creative with their deep state conspiracies then most writers are

[callipygoustp]

I mean, we have to see what this is all about. I think a lot of people (myself included) really used the nothingburger title in reference to Trump-Russia collusion, and so far this looks like bank fraud and campaign finance violations by Cohen. which is worthy of investigation, don't get me wrong. And if Trump lied about his knowledge of the Stormy Daniels payment, that could be problematic too.

I think A LOT of people were using nothingburger to describe any accusations made against Trump or his associates regardless of validity of those accusations. Many of those accusations have resulted in somethingburgers.

[Edge-]

man /the donald is really popcorn worthy...tonight.

they are more creative with their deep state conspiracies then most writers are

I'm continually almost tempted to go down that rabbit hole again, but the last few times have always left me with such a depressing view of the future of humanity that I'm still too terrified to return. Call me a snowflake, but I just can't even "enjoy" wallowing in that kind of depravity and fantasy anymore.

[NYC17]

I mean, we have to see what this is all about. I think a lot of people (myself included) really used the nothingburger title in reference to Trump-Russia collusion, and so far this looks like bank fraud and campaign finance violations by Cohen. Which is worthy of investigation, don't get me wrong. And if Trump lied about his knowledge of the Stormy Daniels payment, that could be problematic too.

You know who doesn't think it's worthy of being investigated?

Your boy, Trump.

Crazy, right?

[Dacien]

Will you be defending people who think women should be murdered over abortion this time?

I expressed regret over that once it came out that his statements were not heat-of-the-moment, taken out of context. Is that not enough? Even the editor-in-chief of The Atlantic who hired him defended him in this manner until these facts came to light. I wouldn't normally interrupt the thread for this, but you keep mentioning it in unrelated threads, so I hope we can put this to bed.

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You know who doesn't think it's worthy of being investigated?

Your boy, Trump.

Crazy, right?

He's not my boy.

I just happen to think Trump-Russia is a nothingburger. I understand that has come to mean he's "my boy", but it isn't so.

[NYC17]

Damn, that nothingburger keeps getting bigger. We've added lettuce, pickles, tomatoes and now ketchup. Pretty soon it might be...a real burger?

At this point it's more like the Lost Boys feast from Hook.

[alexw]

Damn, that nothingburger keeps getting bigger. We've added lettuce, pickles, tomatoes and now ketchup. Pretty soon it might be...a real burger?

Its must be a deep state fake burger because there are no sesame seeds on the bun!

[NYC17]

I expressed regret over that once it came out that his statements were not heat-of-the-moment, taken out of context. Is that not enough? Even the editor-in-chief of The Atlantic who hired him defended him in this manner until these facts came to light. I wouldn't normally interrupt the thread for this, but you keep mentioning it in unrelated threads, so I hope we can put this to bed.

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He's not my boy.

I just happen to think Trump-Russia is a nothingburger. I understand that has come to mean he's "my boy", but it isn't so.

Incorrect. You have attached yourself to every(incorrect) argument that attempts to delegitimize Mueller and the investigation. You have taken every opportunity to do so. And even when faced with the absurdity of the arguments that you attached yourself to, you bend yourself into a pretzel trying to explain how it's all "nothing".

The fact you continue to think so after all the supposed research you have done is an indication that you might not be cut out for this.

But naturally your reply doesn't address the larger point. That being that the president disagrees with you about the legitimacy of investigating Cohen. There doesn't seem to be much from you on that.

How. Odd.

[Dacien]

I'm continually almost tempted to go down that rabbit hole again, but the last few times have always left me with such a depressing view of the future of humanity that I'm still too terrified to return. Call me a snowflake, but I just can't even "enjoy" wallowing in that kind of depravity and fantasy anymore.

Yeah I can't do it. I'm better off reading actual substance to actually learn what's going on. I guess it's fine if you enjoy the drama.

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Incorrect. You have attached yourself to every(incorrect) argument that attempts to delegitimize Mueller and the investigation. You have taken every opportunity to do so. And even when faced with the absurdity of the arguments that you attached yourself to, you bend yourself into a pretzel trying to explain how it's all "nothing".

The fact you continue to think so after all the supposed research you have done is an indication that you might not be cut out for this.

Alright, it's spinning out of control. We should just keep this about the new development and less about me.

[NYC17]

Yeah I can't do it. I'm better off reading actual substance to actually learn what's going on. I guess it's fine if you enjoy the drama.

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Alright, it's spinning out of control. We should just keep this about the new development and less about me.

Incorrect again.

Your opinion, such as it is, remains colored, influenced, and hindered by your default and absurd notion that everything regarding Trump and Russia is frabricated by justice officials. That is relevant to whether you can discuss this with any degree of validity.

[akris15]

Just saying if you are a Lawyer and got raided you are probably 100% screwed. I don't think people realize how rare and unheard of this is due to the nature of client privacy and confidentiality. You don't order this unless you know you are 100%+ sure you will find something...

[Dacien]

But naturally your reply doesn't address the larger point. That being that the president disagrees with you about the legitimacy of investigating Cohen. There doesn't seem to be much from you on that.

How. Odd.

Trump can think investigating Cohen is a witch hunt all he wants, I don't think Mueller and the Attorney's Office for the Southern District of New York are raiding his office without substantial reason.

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Incorrect again.

Your opinion, such as it is, remains colored, influenced, and hindered by your default and absurd notion that everything regarding Trump and Russia is frabricated by justice officials. That is relevant to whether you can discuss this with any degree of validity.

We're still waiting for evidence of criminal collusion. Papadoupolos (at least as far as what Mueller has produced) is as close as we've come, and I've written probably a hundred paragraphs about why it is not evidence of criminal collusion. Strictly speaking about what Mueller has produced, there is nothing in the way of Trump-Russia criminal collusion. If Trump Tower or any of the other highlights gain the attention of Mueller, we can talk about that then.

[Edge-]

Trump can think investigating Cohen is a witch hunt all he wants, I don't think Mueller and the Attorney's Office for the Southern District of New York are raiding his office without substantial reason.

So you think a judge just signed off on the warrant because...why the fuck not?

It's amazing how suddenly when Trump is involved, everything becomes instantly suspect in a way that benefits him.

[NYC17]

Trump can think investigating Cohen is a witch hunt all he wants, I don't think Mueller and the Attorney's Office for the Southern District of New York are raiding his office without substantial reason.

Well, Mueller isn't raiding it. It's strictly done by the SDNY. It's a separate, 2nd criminal investigation into Trump and his lawyer.

The problem Dacien, is that Trump was on TV earlier whining about Sessions, Rosenstein, and Mueller. Specifically regarding Mueller, he said that "many people" have told him to fire Mueller and "we'll see what happens".

So, since Trump has the ability to cause a domino effect which might end in the firing of Mueller, it's not as simple as the handwave you attempted. This is the problem with thinking that everything regarding Trump and Russia is nothing. It touches everything.

[Dacien]

So you think a judge just signed off on the warrant because...why the fuck not?

No, my post is directly in contradiction of this. I think the judge signed the warrant because they had very good reason.

[-aiko-]

You don't order this unless you know you are 100%+ sure you will find something...

Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, I admit that the law isn't my forte, but to raid Cohen's office they would need a search warrant, no? And to get a search warrant they would need to convince a judge. So yeah, I definitely think they have something here.

[NYC17]

Plain wording would have included a modifier of some type. Otherwise your statement is fallacious and, most assuredly, not plainly worded.

Incorrect. It's pretty pathetic that I need to link a definition for you, but since you're married to your absurd line of criticism...here we go.

This is the word fraction. It has a few different meanings, but as you'll see the most common one has subtext to it which implies something. That something belies your whining about the need for a "modifier":

frac·tion
ˈfrakSH(ə)n/Submit
noun
noun: fraction; plural noun: fractions; noun: Fraction; noun: the Fraction
1.
a numerical quantity that is not a whole number (e.g., 1/2, 0.5).
a small or tiny part, amount, or proportion of something.
"he hesitated for a fraction of a second"
synonyms: tiny part, fragment, snippet, snatch, smattering, selection More
a dissenting group within a larger one.
each of the portions into which a mixture may be separated by a process in which the individual components behave differently according to their physical properties.
2.
(in the Christian Church) the breaking of the Eucharistic bread.

I cannot believe your absurdity dictated this


The modifier isn't required. In fact it's redundant. The only person who would demand one be used is someone who was being pedantic, and can't let the fact that they were completely wrong about something most people would consider to be insignificant be the final word

Unfortunately for you, that is the final word. Better luck next time.

[Dacien]

The problem Dacien, is that Trump was on TV earlier whining about Sessions, Rosenstein, and Mueller. Specifically regarding Mueller, he said that "many people" have told him to fire Mueller and "we'll see what happens".

So, since Trump has the ability to cause a domino effect which might end in the firing of Mueller, it's not as simple as the handwave you attempted. This is the problem with thinking that everything regarding Trump and Russia is nothing. It touches everything.

What handwave? I think there's a very good reason for the raid. Trump doesn't think so? That's his problem.

Edit: I think I understand what you're getting at.

Okay, if Trump flips his crap and fires Mueller over this, that definitely ties it in some way to the Trump-Russia investigation. I'll concede that.

[Sormine]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, I admit that the law isn't my forte, but to raid Cohen's office they would need a search warrant, no? And to get a search warrant they would need to convince a judge. So yeah, I definitely think they have something here.

Pretty much it's that simple, yup. They convinced a judge that A) There was likely something of value B) They would find it with this warrant and C) Cohen would probably not willingly hand this thing over (this is the most important part).

[akris15]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, I admit that the law isn't my forte, but to raid Cohen's office they would need a search warrant, no? And to get a search warrant they would need to convince a judge. So yeah, I definitely think they have something here.

Sorry if that came out wrong but Judges don't like ordering warrants on Lawyers even if they know they could find things of interest.