Mega-Thread: Mueller investigation

[Orange Joe]

All I see is seething hatred from the right and NOTHING to help unify our country. Nothing.

Fixed that for you. From the perspective of someone on the left.

[DocSavageFan]

"We"?

I propose *you* don't vote at all until you take a long, hard look at the state of world affairs and come back with a more informed opinion. Again, anyone who thinks Trump is remotely equivalent to any of the current crop of mainstream candidates is delusional.

So your solution is that I shouldn't vote until I agree with your perspective. Got it. Talk about delusional.

[Breccia]

Anything less than the full release of the report is an unacceptable violation of required transparency in government.

Well hold on, there are ongoing investigations. A lot of them, actually.

But there's no reason Congress shouldn't have it.

[Elegiac]

So your solution is that I shouldn't vote. Got it. Talk about delusional.

Yep. If people aren't going to exercise their right to vote seriously then the optimal outcome for all parties involved is for said people to just stay at home.

[Elegiac]

Well hold on, there are ongoing investigations. A lot of them, actually.

But there's no reason Congress shouldn't have it.

Yeah I mean, one would think given Congress' constitutional oversight of the executive branch via the impeachment process would imply that they have legal privileges for subpoenaing information that might be relevant to that function. :thinkstorm:

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You forgot the part when she said the full report must be released, if I remember correctly. She's also correct. There are plenty of lefties like Kyle Kulinski, Jimmy Dore and Glenn Greenwald that hold the same opinions.

Stop. Smearing.

There are plenty of lefties that are either Russian fifth columnists or facile idiots. See: Jill Stein.

They're not wrong in criticising Gabbard for not taking the threat posed by electoral cyberwarfare seriously.

[Shaderas]

All I see is seething hatred from the left and NOTHING to help unify our country. Nothing.

I see it from the right quite frequently as well... they don't want to engage with the left, they just want to see them suffer and "feed on their tears" .. this mentality seems to run pretty rampant these days.

[DocSavageFan]

Yep. If people aren't going to exercise their right to vote seriously then the optimal outcome for all parties involved is for said people to just stay at home.

Wrong. I take my right to vote very seriously.

[Elegiac]

Wrong. I take my right to vote very seriously.

Hmm....

I'm undecided how I'll vote in 2020 at this time.

Computer says no.

[DocSavageFan]

Hmm....



Computer says no.

So tell us...since you apparently already know the ballot, who are you going to vote for in 2020?

[Cthulhu 2020]

I'm sure that if the situation were reversed and President Hillary were under investigation for two years by a Democrat, who was appointed by a Democrat appointed by Hillary, after another Democrat appointed by Hillary recused himself because he had an obvious conflict of interest, which produced indictments of 34 people including many of her election campaign staff, and the 300 page results of that investigation was reduced to a 4 page summary by another Democrat appointed by Hillary after he wrote a 19 page memo claiming the investigation of Hillary was illegitimate (which Hillary liked because she spent the last 2 years criticising everyone involved into the investigation of her on slender or no pretexts), that claimed there was no case for indictment in it, and the Democrats in Congress blocked the release of the full report, while the report went to Hillary's White House so her lawyers could work with the Democrats Hillary appointed to redact as much of the report as she liked...

...then the Republicans would say "well fair's fair, I guess justice has been done. I was wrong this whole time, my bad."

Yep, they'd be completely okay with all of this and would never ever think about questioning it.

[Elegiac]

So tell us...since you apparently already know the ballot, who are you going to vote for in 2020?

I'd vote for Mickey Mouse if it was between him and Trump, quite frankly.

[Fahrenheit]

So tell us...since you apparently already know the ballot, who are you going to vote for in 2020?

Whomever is running against Trump, provided they don't sink past his levels of avarice & incompetence. He needs to be gone first. Then I'll worry about the banalities of traditional politics.

[cubby]

Even if they subpoena the report, can't the DoJ fight it and get it stuck in the courts? My thought process might be wrong on this.

They can, and almost certainly will. That's where it get murky. I'm not 100% on the subpoena power of Congress and precisely what is NOT covered.

[DocSavageFan]

Whomever is running against Trump, provided they don't sink past his levels of avarice & incompetence. He needs to be gone first. Then I'll worry about the banalities of traditional politics.

Hence the reason I didn't vote for president in 2016.

[DocSavageFan]

Anything less than the full release of the report is an unacceptable violation of required transparency in government. No one, not even those who like Trump should be content to delegate their own critical thinking to a man Trump himself has appointed. It's pretty surprising that so many self proclaimed independents and "skeptical centrists" seem willing to do just that.

It will be a "full" release...with appropriate redactions.

[Elegiac]

It will be a "full" release...with appropriate redactions.

So, zero redactions then. Good to know.

Exactly what is it that makes you so worried about the entire report making it to the light of day?

[DocSavageFan]

Because you incorrectly assessed the situation? I guess you won't vote in 2020 either.

I didn't incorrectly assess the situation...I couldn't vote for a proven warmonger (i.e. Hillary's War...Libya) or someone that's even more unlikable than Trump imo.

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There could potentially need to be redacted sections related to the Grand Jury and ongoing investigations. Everything else should be made public now, with the rest to follow when the law allows.

Anything that would expose sources and methods would need to be reacted as well.

[DocSavageFan]

Exactly what is it that makes you so worried about the entire report making it to the light of day?

I'm OK with full release with appropriate redactions. But it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see where this is going. Liberals will find anything that's even remotely negative about Trump and magnify the hell out of it to the point of absurdity.

Currently, the partisan hacks have become so deranged that many actually believe Barr misrepresented or lied about Mueller's findings in his summary. I know where this is going.

[Bodakane]

I didn't incorrectly assess the situation...I couldn't vote for a proven warmonger (i.e. Hillary's War...Libya) or someone that's even more unlikable than Trump imo.

I just don't understand how a man who wants to have military parades and threaten war with everyone from NK to 1000 asylum seekers is not a war monger.

The shit you Trump supporters say sometimes is just so fucking opposite reality it is mind boggling.

[Ashrynn]

Alright, well I'm off of MMO-C for good. I keep reading comments from people who clearly don't understand our legal system. Let me explain how this happens:

Mueller's report in concluded. Mueller is quoted as saying "No Evidence of Collusion" in his summary and the indictments are over. Adam Schiff who has been claiming to have direct evidence based on his position for years is now stating that it's obvious he's guilty. So there was never anything there other than what we had, but sitting congressman continued to lie as others speculated. Fine. People love him because he's 'challenging Trump and scaring Republicans!' Ok. Some people live in a different reality than my own apparently.

People demand the full report. Ok. As with anything there are redactions - Grand Jury, means and methods of investigations and people who are not charged, etc. So when we get the "full" report, the same people who have pushed this story will then come screaming "HES HIDING IT THEY REDACTED IT OMG THE GOVT IS CORRUPT." Or some other nonsense.

You'll ignore the very obvious fact that Mueller and his team of 20 attorneys could at any point issue a statement that Barr/Trump are directly misrepresenting their findings. As they were forced to issue a statement with the BuzzFeed article, we know that they will do this if it compromises their work/investigations.

You'll ignore everyone on the Left: Jimmy Dore, Michael Tracey and Glenn Greenwald who are critical and have been from the get-go. Including the points of not giving the latter two any airtime as they disputed said narrative.

You'll ignore high profile individuals like Brennan now coming forward to state that 'he may have gotten it wrong' after continually stating Trump was an obvious Russian asset.

You'll ignore anything that doesn't directly confirm what you already know is true. And you'll run into 2020 fractured and broken and angry and paranoid.

You'll lose, screaming. And when you do it will again be because Trump is being aided by Russia.

But what is actually sad about all of this nonsense is that... This was ridiculous. SDNY and the foundation have legitimate concerns that even those on the Right can't defend well. But it doesn't matter. Because people were force-fed apparent bullshit for 2.5 years and the bubble just popped.

I don't think people understand the amount of damage that was done to the reputation of our news media. CNN/MSNBC are in a nosedive in ratings and people are running to Fox News. So good luck! I really wish there was an actual plan, but there isn't. This is not some long fought war that will eventually be won.

It's absurd, paranoid and has just ended in abject failure. Feel free to get pissy with what I said, but we just had a week of Trump winning over and over and I'm frankly tired of seeing delusional posters led by "intellectuals" of the #Resistance still pushing nonsense. Trump is not a practiced politician, he won off pure luck and the public's general hatred of HRC. He'll now win in 2020 because he's "vindicated".

Leave your bubble, you paranoid nutters.