1. #18141
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    You realize I never said public release... right? There's a subtle difference there that is massive.
    Most other releases go through same redactions.

  2. #18142
    I am Murloc! Thwart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Lol re the 180 as well. McConnell is definitely getting tired of Trump. When McConnell realizes that Trump is going to cost him the Majority Leader seat, that will be the end of the support.
    It's pretty much too late at this point. If Trump loses in the Presidential election, the Senate is gone as well. I cannot imagine any scenario where this wouldn't be true. McConnell pretty much has to support him at this point unless he does something so spectacularly stupid that not only would the House impeach him, but all of the Republicans would turn on him as well in the Senate.

  3. #18143
    Quote Originally Posted by Arvei View Post
    Even Trump's collusion hasn't been disproven. There's a reason he picked someone who cleaned up the Iran-Contra scandal for AG. Barr is Trump's new fixer and until congress gets the full unredacted report I wouldn't believe anything that Barr says. I wonder why the White House has done a 180 on wanting to see the Mueller report...
    Another conspiracy theory? Check. The new FIXER!! OMG!

    They said no collusion in the 4 page memo. But you want to see the report right? Well Mueller is helping with the redactions. You'll see it soon enough. If what William Barr said was wrong don't you think Mueller would come out and set the record straight? I mean this is the god king that you guys worshiped for two years and now you're turning on him. The spin is out of control.

    Trust me - You'll find nothing in the report that says collusion or obstruction. What we will find is a bunch of other stories that the media will run with and help you on your quest to hate Trump more. It's kind of like Trump said in his tweet:

    "There is no amount of testimony or document production that can satisfy Jerry Nadler or Shifty Adam Schiff."

    He should change that tweet to:

    "There is no amount of testimony or document production that can satisfy Jerry Nadler, Shifty Adam Schiff, or the Politics section of MMO-Champion.com's General Off Topic forum."

  4. #18144
    Merely a Setback Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    McConnell is definitely getting tired of Trump.
    Urge...to...be...asshole...too...strong....GAH!

    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    McConnell is definitely getting tired of WINNING.
    Aaaaaaaaah so much better.

    Yes, as I've suggested on dozens of occasions, McConnell is out of options. He knows that he can't win re-election without the rabid fanbase, regardless of what actually happens. If he turns on Trump, he's out of a job, end of story. Problem is, if he sticks with Trump, and bad things continue to happen -- say, the NRA loses the ability to donate to the GOP, the trade war goes south (HARDY HAR HAR) millions lose health care because of Trump's actions, and the economy sags and buckles under the strain of inflation + no real job/wage growth, all of which are predictable at this point -- he's out of a job then, too. His only option is to stick with Trump like glue and hope a miracle happens -- such as a war with Iran.

    But that doesn't mean he likes it.

    I donate to food banks, help friends' kids with math homework and contribute sick days to other faculty members because I think it's the right thing to do. I pay my water bill because, if I don't, I don't have water. I'd love to save that $120/3 months to, say, buy a copy of Borderlands 3 and an extra controller. But ain't nobody playing co-op with me when I haven't showered for three months.

    And McConnell is noticing that Trump smells a little ripe. Trump hasn't been paying his water bill. McConnell can keep playing on Trump's PS4, but it's getting smellier and smellier in there. He gets to keep playing as the stench intensifies to the point where he's gagging and the stench sticks to his shell...or, he can go home.

  5. #18145
    Quote Originally Posted by Frusciante View Post
    Another conspiracy theory? Check.
    Another 15 post burner account from someone that should be banned but is breaking the rules and posting here anyway? Check.

  6. #18146
    Quote Originally Posted by Dome Fossil View Post
    Another 15 post burner account from someone that should be banned but is breaking the rules and posting here anyway? Check.
    Another burner account accusation that's totally made up and false like the Mueller investigation in? Check.

  7. #18147
    Merely a Setback Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frusciante View Post
    Another burner account accusation that's totally made up and false like the Mueller investigation in? Check.
    "Totally made up and false."

    Multiple indictments and guilty pleas. Russians and Russian meetings among multiple figures of Trump's campaign and the GOP. A mountain of evidence and Barr's own report says Trump is not exonerated. Assuming the Barr report is the truth, then Mueller couldn't get enough to criminally indict Trump himself, but that doesn't mean the whole thing was "totally made up and false." There's plenty of shit in his campaign, and not only that, there's 17 other investigations on going.

  8. #18148
    Merely a Setback Breccia's Avatar
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    Schiff, while talking about the Mueller subpoena -- oh, right, the HJC voted to subpoena the report if Barr doesn't hand it over of his own free will -- also said Mueller's testimony is mandatory.

    I think it’s inevitable that Bob Mueller is going to have to testify before Congress. We’ll have an interest in his testimony or others on the issue of the counterintelligence findings. And the Judiciary Committee, maybe the Oversight Committee as well, might have an interest in other aspects of investigation.
    Schiff was quite clear: Mueller found evidence of Russia attacking the election. There were indictments and everything. Mueller's report is a counterintelligence report. Congress needs to see it. End of story.

  9. #18149
    Quote Originally Posted by Rysthruun View Post
    Seek professional help for your assaholism

    Also, No means no Ripster.Suddenly, it doesn't seem that ironic your handle is slang for rapist.
    So you got so mad when I pointed out reality that this is your response. Grats dude. Sorry that you've got rage issues.

    Grand Jury is still active because their are still on going cases. Again, Roger Stone is an example. While the case is active, releasing the entire report could jeopardize any case in trial or pre-trial. The grand jury will remain until the affairs of Muellers investigation are in their disposition phase. Cases handed off to state prosecutors are separate from any federal investigation. States are capable of empaneling their own grand jury's.

    It's certainly probable and likely quite a few leaks came from the white house. I have yet to see where that has been confirmed. I'm not talking about those, I'm talking about pre-empitive leaks to the media that shaped the coverage of the investigation the last 2 years and resulted in that video. I'm talking about leaks no one else would know about besides Muellers inner circle or their staff.

    A judge certainly could. He/She would have to weigh doing long standing damage to the investigatory bodies, intel community, sources, methods, pave the way for an appeal and re-trial for any active case being tried by the grand jury, open up the grand jurors to harassment and media scrutiny, while simultaneously potentially releasing exculpatory evidence vs waiting 2-3 weeks for the report to be redacted and then at that time weighing the public interest against what hasn't been released. If these are GOP talking points, then they are logical and rational ones. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

    I agree with you the Trump tower meeting is suspicious to say the least. However, the statute for conspiracy is very clear, broad, and has an extremely low threshold.

    Telling my tax accountant I'm not going to pay taxes is an example of how low this threshold is

    https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/371

    Despite what we know about the meeting 19 lawyers who were assisted by a team of approximately 40 FBI agents, intelligence analysts, forensic accountants, and other professional staff didn't find evidence that surpassed that threshold by a reasonable doubt despite the Special Counsel issuing more than 2,800 subpoenas, executing nearly 500 search warrants, obtaining more than 230 orders for communication records, issuing almost 50 orders authorizing use of pen registers, making 13 requests to foreign governments for evidence, and interviewing approximately 500 witnesses in conjunction with any potential evidence acquired during the counter intelligence investigation prior to SC Muellers appointment.
    Tell me, what's your threshold for tolerable, active, intentional threats to national security? Mine is well below "beyond a reasonable doubt." Impeachment isn't sending trump to jail.

    That being said, mueller's report didn't say no collusion. Mueller's investigation won't be over until all reasonable cases are tried (until at least stone's verdict is in, as he could reach a cooperation plea deal). If a grand jury is still ongoing, either they're still obtaining evidence from it, or they expect more indictments to come.

    Releasing an unredacted report on whether or not the president is compromised, when we have ample public evidence he is, seems like it would be overwhelmingly in the public interest. Denying that is not "logical and rational." If they release excuplatory evidence, that's not an inherently bad thing. Grand jurors names would be essentially the only thing withheld. The retrials/appeals due to releasing grand jury info is laughable, as they already do voir dire. When the leadership of one of the branches of gov't is suspected of committing serious crimes, I'd say it's worth the "long standing damage" to have the report in the open (let alone in congress' hands).

    Again, sorry about your rage issues, and no one buying your false flag.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rudol Von Stroheim View Post
    I do not need to play the role of "holier than thou". I'm above that..

  10. #18150
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    "Totally made up and false."

    Multiple indictments and guilty pleas. Russians and Russian meetings among multiple figures of Trump's campaign and the GOP. A mountain of evidence and Barr's own report says Trump is not exonerated. Assuming the Barr report is the truth, then Mueller couldn't get enough to criminally indict Trump himself, but that doesn't mean the whole thing was "totally made up and false." There's plenty of shit in his campaign, and not only that, there's 17 other investigations on going.
    Right but there are no charges related to it and the drama fo the past what 3 years now hasn't been about tax fraud. People are just poking fun at people who hitched their cart to this nonsense.

  11. #18151
    Quote Originally Posted by Mighty Tim View Post
    Right but there are no charges related to it and the drama fo the past what 3 years now hasn't been about tax fraud. People are just poking fun at people who hitched their cart to this nonsense.
    Weird how we found out about manafort coordinating with russians huh? His own lawyers messing up redactions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rudol Von Stroheim View Post
    I do not need to play the role of "holier than thou". I'm above that..

  12. #18152
    Quote Originally Posted by Ripster42 View Post
    Weird how we found out about manafort coordinating with russians huh? His own lawyers messing up redactions.
    Alright? Isn't gonna change the current climate of people laughing at those with egg on their face.

  13. #18153
    Merely a Setback cubby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Schiff, while talking about the Mueller subpoena -- oh, right, the HJC voted to subpoena the report if Barr doesn't hand it over of his own free will -- also said Mueller's testimony is mandatory.



    Schiff was quite clear: Mueller found evidence of Russia attacking the election. There were indictments and everything. Mueller's report is a counterintelligence report. Congress needs to see it. End of story.
    Agreed. And Trump is now backing away from the full report being released (if he was ever serious about it in the first place). I bet Barr finally found enough puppets to act out the main points so Trump would understand that he is fucked if the full, unedited report is released.

    I expect some legal battles in having it released to Congress unedited. Something I'm not certain about is whether Mueller still has it in a form that he could release if requested. I know he answers to the Dept of Justice, and I also know he himself can be subpoenaed, but I don't know if someone like Schiff can subpoena the report from Mueller directly.
    No one is above the law!

  14. #18154
    Quote Originally Posted by Mighty Tim View Post
    Alright? Isn't gonna change the current climate of people laughing at those with egg on their face.
    Egg on their face? Again, we already know his campaign colluded, because manafort's lawyers messed up. How does that match up with what you're saying? It makes you look like you've got no idea what you're talking about.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rudol Von Stroheim View Post
    I do not need to play the role of "holier than thou". I'm above that..

  15. #18155
    Merely a Setback cubby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mighty Tim View Post
    Right but there are no charges related to it and the drama fo the past what 3 years now hasn't been about tax fraud. People are just poking fun at people who hitched their cart to this nonsense.
    Wow? Really? You think the conclusions that you haven't read or seen or heard are nonsense. You think the multiple prison sentences and still sealed indictments are nonsense.

    I can tell you from here it looks like most of your "thoughts" on this are nonsense. Let us know when you're ready to face reality and we'll talk.
    No one is above the law!

  16. #18156
    The Insane Daelak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frusciante View Post
    Another conspiracy theory? Check. The new FIXER!! OMG!

    They said no collusion in the 4 page memo. But you want to see the report right? Well Mueller is helping with the redactions. You'll see it soon enough. If what William Barr said was wrong don't you think Mueller would come out and set the record straight? I mean this is the god king that you guys worshiped for two years and now you're turning on him. The spin is out of control.

    Trust me - You'll find nothing in the report that says collusion or obstruction. What we will find is a bunch of other stories that the media will run with and help you on your quest to hate Trump more. It's kind of like Trump said in his tweet:

    "There is no amount of testimony or document production that can satisfy Jerry Nadler or Shifty Adam Schiff."

    He should change that tweet to:

    "There is no amount of testimony or document production that can satisfy Jerry Nadler, Shifty Adam Schiff, or the Politics section of MMO-Champion.com's General Off Topic forum."
    Mueller is subordinate to Barr. He cannot release nor comment on an investigation. Congress, via subpoena, since the AG is now explicitly stonewalling to ensure that the WH can get enough talking points disseminated before the HJC gets to see the unredacted report.

    For anyone to accept a four page memo at face value from an AG who on his own volition wrote a 19 page memo regarding how Trump cannot be indicted, and who has successfully shielded a prior WH administration, is insane.

    Barr is the quintessential party loyalist for over four decades. The entire segway from Sessions resignation, to Rosenstein's delayed resignation, to Barr's confirmation and consequential written Mueller summary should be under investigation for obstruction of justice itself. From an investigators POV, that entire series of events should warrant a whole host of ethical and obstruction investigations.
    Quote Originally Posted by zenkai View Post
    There is a problem, but I know just banning guns will fix the problem.

  17. #18157
    Quote Originally Posted by Mighty Tim View Post
    Alright? Isn't gonna change the current climate of people laughing at those with egg on their face.
    How is it egg on their face?

    Even the report summary confirms Russia interfered with the 2016 election. Barr's summary however leaves out how much interference it caused.

  18. #18158
    Legendary! Thepersona's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vatrilian View Post
    I think it will in the long run. The greatest thing it has done is energize the base. That wins elections. It has become which side can energize their base more.
    wtf?
    it seems that the 2018 election (you know, the most recent one) dindn't happen for you... the polls there were mostly accurate, and there was a massive blue wave
    Forgive my english, as i'm not a native speaker



  19. #18159
    Quote Originally Posted by Thepersona View Post
    wtf?
    it seems that the 2018 election (you know, the most recent one) dindn't happen for you... the polls there were mostly accurate, and there was a massive blue wave
    well, to be fair the 30-35% of the voter population that makes up Trumps base and just so happens to think Obama is (to this day) a Kenyan Manchurian candidate must feel pretty good that their daddy was cleared up. all this really did was make people like Rachel Madow look insane, everyone else already knows or at least feels like Trump is crook.

  20. #18160
    Legendary! Thepersona's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sky High View Post
    well, to be fair the 30-35% of the voter population that makes up Trumps base and just so happens to think Obama is (to this day) a Kenyan Manchurian candidate must feel pretty good that their daddy was cleared up. all this really did was make people like Rachel Madow look insane, everyone else already knows or at least feels like Trump is crook.
    I still wait for the Full release of the report though. I wont trust Barr on his word, in this case.
    Like really, if the report clears the president (and in that case, makes his 2020 bid much more feasible), then why the hell he doesnt want to release it ASAP?
    Last edited by Thepersona; 2019-04-03 at 04:57 PM.
    Forgive my english, as i'm not a native speaker



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