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  1. #1
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    #DumpStarbucks: Blue Lives and the Right to Refuse Service

    Police officers were reportedly asked to leave a Tempe Starbucks for making customers feel unsafe, sparking the #DumpStarbucks campaign

    A Starbucks barista at a store in Tempe, Arizona reportedly asked six police officers to leave or move out of a customer's line of sight because their presence made them feel unsafe, according to a series of tweets on Friday from the Tempe Officers Association.

    Now, the hashtag "#DumpStarbucks" is trending on Twitter, after the Tempe Officers Association tweeted a logo seemingly designed in 2012 by the National Organization for Marriage to protest Starbuck's support of same-sex marriage.

    The tweets from the Tempe Officers Association allege that a group of six officers, including some veterans, entered a Starbucks at Scottsdale Road and McKellips in Tempe before their July 4 shift and purchased beverages. Then, a barista asked the officers to either remove themselves from a customer's line of sight or leave the store because the customer "did not feel safe" with the officers' presence.

    The officers then reportedly left the establishment. The Tempe Officers Association claims "such treatment has become all too common in 2019" and said it will "look forward to working collaboratively" with Starbucks to address the incident.

    A Starbucks spokesperson told USA Today that the company was gathering details about the incident, and had reached out to the Tempe Police Department and the Tempe Officers Association to apologize and ask for "better understand what happened."

    The #DumpStarbucks hashtag on Twitter is primarily full of tweets criticizing the outrage itself, along with people making jokes about the lines at Starbucks being shorter due to police sympathizers boycotting the brand. Some also drew comparisons between an incident last year when two black men were arrested in a Starbucks while waiting for a business meeting after a barista called police.

    Others questioned whether conservatives would be hypocritical if they boycotted Starbucks for asking officers to leave while supporting the right of business owners to refuse service to people of their choosing.
    This seems to be symptomatic of the increasing rift between law enforcement and the citizenry in many parts of the country; incidents of police brutality make the public distrust them, which makes police resentful and more likely to employ/less likely to speak out against further incidents of brutality.

    It may very well be that existing law enforcement structures need to be reformed or restaffed entirely, as it doesn't seem any amount of oversight will change the fundamental culture among law enforcement. If anything, all it seems to be doing is making everyone less safe less safe.

    Now, the other element here is the classic question of who can refuse service - I expect the usual suspects will find some way to reconcile permitting discrimination by bakers but not by baristas.

    "Which matters more; the freedom to live an authentic life, or the freedom to crush degenerates under the heel of a jackboot?
    As a centrist, I am undecided."

    - Natalie Wynn, "Transtrenders"

  2. #2
    I saw some comparisons between this and the Christian baker situation, making the argument that people on the right were very pro-free association in that case, but don't seem to be here. But as far as I can tell the pro-DumpStarbucks people are pretty much practicing what they preached, which is refusing to patronize an establishment they disagree with. Those are free market forces. And many people are rallying behind Starbucks. Those are also market forces.

    The bottom line is, if we as a society agree on a particular stance, it's going to have deleterious effects on the business. If we have differing views on it, the business will find it's decisions to be acceptable.

    This is a much more preferable approach than government mandate.

  3. #3
    Immortal Templar 331's Avatar
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    They weren't refused service, they were sitting in the store drinking their coffee and another customer felt uneasy so they asked the store to remove them. If there's more to this story I'd like to know it before I cry foul on anyone. Were the cops roudy? Did the customer have a criminal history?

    But in any case this is being blown out of proportion. I had to hear this story on Fox News while waiting for a haircut this morning and boy did they play the victim card.

  4. #4
    Titan Daemos daemonium's Avatar
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    Police community relations seem really really bad in America. i don’t doubt that some police departments try to improve them but without a massive country wide push its likely any good will is going to be drowned out.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    Police community relations seem really really bad in America. i don’t doubt that some police departments try to improve them but without a massive country wide push its likely any good will is going to be drowned out.
    There was one but Trump reversed all federal police reform actions and lawsuits even sponsored training.

  6. #6
    Titan Daemos daemonium's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Draco-Onis View Post
    There was one but Trump reversed all federal police reform actions and lawsuits even sponsored training.
    Haven’t heard of this got a link by any chance?

  7. #7

  8. #8
    The Insane Kellhound's Avatar
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    Pretty safe to say the barista has a dislike for the police, after all, it isn't good for business to displace 6 paying customers for one....
    Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum.
    “Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered automatic weapons.”
    "His knowledge on that topic is only power point deep..." "Power corrupts and PowerPoint corrupts absolutely."
    "Who's the more foolish? The fool, or the fool who follows him?"

  9. #9
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    Pretty safe to say the barista has a dislike for the police, after all, it isn't good for business to displace 6 paying customers for one....
    And why is that, exactly? Other public servants don't get asked to leave because they make people feel uncomfortable.

    I suspect it's for the same reason that, as Twitter pointed out, "Fuck the Mailman" isn't a hit song.

    "Which matters more; the freedom to live an authentic life, or the freedom to crush degenerates under the heel of a jackboot?
    As a centrist, I am undecided."

    - Natalie Wynn, "Transtrenders"

  10. #10
    I've been treated really badly by police in the past, and they've also done me some really solid favors when they didn't have to at other times. They're all just different people. You'll find examples of straight up murder, like Walter Scott, and then you'll find them being total bros or sacrificing themselves to save lives.

    So unless these cops were doing something, I don't really think the scorched earth approach of "f**k th police" really helps anything in any way.

  11. #11
    The Insane Kellhound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    And why is that, exactly? Other public servants don't get asked to leave because they make people feel uncomfortable.

    I suspect it's for the same reason that, as Twitter pointed out, "Fuck the Mailman" isn't a hit song.
    Some people do not like the police because their job is to make people obey the law when they don't want to obey it.
    Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum.
    “Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered automatic weapons.”
    "His knowledge on that topic is only power point deep..." "Power corrupts and PowerPoint corrupts absolutely."
    "Who's the more foolish? The fool, or the fool who follows him?"

  12. #12
    The police can't even handle someone asking them to move over at a Starbucks, but they expect me to think they can handle fair and unnecessarily violent law enforcement? Yikes.

  13. #13
    The Insane Kellhound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by staresun View Post
    Translation "I also like to suck police dick".
    Cute statement from a burner account. I am going to guess you are one of those people that hates to follow the rules, and as such hates those that make you do so.
    Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum.
    “Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered automatic weapons.”
    "His knowledge on that topic is only power point deep..." "Power corrupts and PowerPoint corrupts absolutely."
    "Who's the more foolish? The fool, or the fool who follows him?"

  14. #14
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dacien View Post
    I've been treated really badly by police in the past, and they've also done me some really solid favors when they didn't have to at other times. They're all just different people. You'll find examples of straight up murder, like Walter Scott, and then you'll find them being total bros or sacrificing themselves to save lives.

    So unless these cops were doing something, I don't really think the scorched earth approach of "f**k th police" really helps anything in any way.
    Man, if only the right wing had this level of sympathy and patience for other demographics.

    Police are getting a taste of what it is like to be a minority in this country, and if you're afraid that the same will happen to you then maybe you should reconsider your support of a status quo that systemically makes people feel like that all the time.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    Some people do not like the police because their job is to make people obey the law when they don't want to obey it.
    I doubt it's occurred to you that the culture that gives rise to the perception of police as automatons designed to elicit obedience from the population might....I don't know...cause said police to dehumanise their charges and be less likely to employ restraint or be sympathetic.

    It's true of most Americans, unfortunately. The cultural narrative has become infected with segregationist myths.

    "Which matters more; the freedom to live an authentic life, or the freedom to crush degenerates under the heel of a jackboot?
    As a centrist, I am undecided."

    - Natalie Wynn, "Transtrenders"

  15. #15
    If you feel unsafe sitting in the same store as cops enjoying a coffee, you should probably be checked in for a mental health evaluation.

    Also, since this isn't brought up anywhere..
    Cops were asked to leave and presumably they did. Why is it when other businesses ask people to leave, the cops have to be called because they refuse like petulant children.

    Think about that, who was Starbucks going to call if the cops acted like petulant children?

  16. #16
    This doesn't pass the smell test. At best, it was a stupid barista who should be fired. If people want to push it to boycott, they can. Hopefully, they had their body cameras, so there should be plenty of evidence to back up their claims.
    Quote Originally Posted by Destroyer of Leftism View Post
    While I certainly support more sex for more people and don't think the old norms are viable, it's also become pretty obvious that leftists only support sexual freedom because they think it will spread STDs more, damage the family and damage society. Their intentions are not to spread more freedom, they just want people sick, hopefully dependent on their healthcare too.
    Yes, someone actually said that.

  17. #17
    The Insane Kellhound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    Man, if only the right wing had this level of sympathy and patience for other demographics.

    Police are getting a taste of what it is like to be a minority in this country, and if you're afraid that the same will happen to you then maybe you should reconsider your support of a status quo that systemically makes people feel like that all the time.

    - - - Updated - - -



    I doubt it's occurred to you that the culture that gives rise to the perception of police as automatons designed to elicit obedience from the population might....I don't know...cause said police to dehumanise their charges and be less likely to employ restraint or be sympathetic.

    It's true of most Americans, unfortunately. The cultural narrative has become infected with segregationist myths.
    Actually, I am not a major fan of the overall state of police today, but that does not mean I do not understand why they act the way they do at times. Understanding does not mean accepting, and I have files both official complaints and commendations concerning officers over the years. To lump all officers into one group based on the good or bad deeds of others is never wise.
    Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum.
    “Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered automatic weapons.”
    "His knowledge on that topic is only power point deep..." "Power corrupts and PowerPoint corrupts absolutely."
    "Who's the more foolish? The fool, or the fool who follows him?"

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    This doesn't pass the smell test. At best, it was a stupid barista who should be fired. If people want to push it to boycott, they can. Hopefully, they had their body cameras, so there should be plenty of evidence to back up their claims.
    If I lived in Arizona and had kids I'd be scared of being in a place police as well. You may have forgotten but two weeks ago cops threatened to shoot a pregnant woman in the head cause her daughter grabbed a dollar store doll and she didn't notice.
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    I don't care if he committed tax fraud. Scoring political victories and crushing the aspirations of your political opponents is more important than adhering to moral principles.
    Well at least they're being honest now.

  19. #19
    Herald of the Titans Zaydin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StillMcfuu View Post
    If you feel unsafe sitting in the same store as cops enjoying a coffee, you should probably be checked in for a mental health evaluation.

    Also, since this isn't brought up anywhere..
    Cops were asked to leave and presumably they did. Why is it when other businesses ask people to leave, the cops have to be called because they refuse like petulant children.

    Think about that, who was Starbucks going to call if the cops acted like petulant children?
    Considering all the news stories about violent cops or cops abusing their authority or both, you would have to be insane to not be wary around cops.
    "If you are ever asking yourself 'Is Trump lying or is he stupid?', the answer is most likely C: All of the Above" - Seth Meyers

  20. #20
    Huh. Weird. I'll be interested to find out further details in this. Could be a dumb barista. Could be some unknowns. Whatever, I'm bored and wanna find out.

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