[8.0] Battle of Azeroth Arms discussion thread

[Jastall]

So...let me get this straight. you want to eliminate the classes “moment of glory” and shift that damage to the filler attack, taking away from our niche as the guy who absolutely ends the fight and turning us into frost DKs or enhance shamans, all so you can have an easier time padding the meter on farm content.

Yeah, I agree. Much as I sometimes get annoyed when I get a bad execute phase, it's a DPS warrior's thing. It's the reason why, during progress, I'm usually the first to get brezzed if the boss is sub-20%. It's so iconic to warriors that sub-20% is always called the execute phase even when other classes with similar mechanics don't use execute.

[Rafalga]

I just want a decent kit for m+. Not a "God dps every minute" type of shit this time. But seeing Sweeping's current form( base but activated CD), it looks like fury again in m+.

[Quaade]

Of course they would and when people have the tools to do everything fine then there is no difference in classes/specs except for looks.

The problem with warrior has rarely been about DPS or execute (which, again, IS very valuable in progression) but utility and survivability spells and they are shifting things on that front too which might or might not help.

No, it seems usefull in progression, seems. If we had less damage on Execute we sould still do the same total damage. So 100 to 2% would be faster and -20% would take a little longer, it alll evens out, if people know how to stay alive.

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I just want a decent kit for m+. Not a "God dps every minute" type of shit this time. But seeing Sweeping's current form( base but activated CD), it looks like fury again in m+.

To be honest Fury AoE is activated with a GCD as well, only no cooldown and better against three to four targets -_-

[Deleted]

I'd like it more , if it didn't share the animation with pummel.

Amen to that.
I wanted to open a thread on the forums to see if we can get an animation to such an iconic ability.
Or at the very least, getting racial animations on MS.

[Tyze]

Man our aoe will be so boring without having cleave baseline..

[Deleted]

Man our aoe will be so boring without having cleave baseline..

To be honest, Arms' aoe has always been boring-ish.

Cleave? Cleave was amazing. Burst aoe too with Bladestorm and some cds.
But aoe? Eh.

Thunderclap somehow made things easier way back in MoP by Deep Wounds, and I suspect we will have some DW builds for a strict aoe scenario. But aside from that, it's just how the spec always played.

[Deleted]

I don't really get the idea of having a strong execute phase being a worse thing on farm content. I mean it doesn't matter how short the execute phase is as long as the relative total fight length gets proportionally shorter as well. The only thing which skews execute in favor while progressing is people being dead and the execute phase taking proportionally longer than the rest of the fight would normally.

In fights where execute is good during progression, it stays good during farm.

[Jerbo]

I don't really get the idea of having a strong execute phase being a worse thing on farm content. I mean it doesn't matter how short the execute phase is as long as the relative total fight length gets proportionally shorter as well. The only thing which skews execute in favor while progressing is people being dead and the execute phase taking proportionally longer than the rest of the fight would normally.

In fights where execute is good during progression, it stays good during farm.

I think people just don't understand the math behind it. Sometimes shorter can become better if you spend more time in execute phase with CDs.

[tehdef]

This dude blindly trying to cripple execute which has been a staple for 13 years is giving me cancer.

[Quaade]

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I think people just don't understand the math behind it. Sometimes shorter can become better if you spend more time in execute phase with CDs.

The Execute phase in similarly shorter, so with better gear shorter over all fight. So the time spent <20% is relatively shorter. If the fight shortens by 10% due to better gear, so does <20%.

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This dude blindly trying to cripple execute which has been a staple for 13 years is giving me cancer.

It has never been this bad before, so regardless if it was a stapple it needs to be changed so we're less reliant on it. It was also a stapple that cars could only drive 20 km/h before we got better engines.

A car dude even expressed disbelief at the thougth that a car in the future could go 40 km/h in the future.

[Jerbo]

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The Execute phase in similarly shorter, so with better gear shorter over all fight. So the time spent <20% is relatively shorter. If the fight shortens by 10% due to better gear, so does <20%.

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It just matters what percentage of the fight is in the execute range, not how long the fight is. If you have a 10 minute fight with 2 minutes of execute, that is 20% of the fight in execute range. Say you get much better gear and have a 5 minute fight with 1 minute of execute, you still have 20% of the fight in execute range.

[Dubious143]

I can see where their going with new tactician proc in turn phasing in Overpower. Minor weaving of MS / CS / Execute Is always fun. Since we get normal weapons back, weapon swap macro coming back for sure. Hope blizzard doesn't gate defensive abilities to harshly. Their gonna enforce weapon restriction on offensive abilities for sure.... sadly warriors complain but deep down blizzard knows we as a class will accept w.e comes hahaha

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[Deleted]

I don't really know about weapon swapping to be honest.

[Ansi]

I've been playing alpha for a few weeks now (and warrior since vanilla). I think the current Arms design on alpha feels very unpolished and simplified. It also feels like I'm losing a lot of the Arms warrior fantasy.

Let me explain.

(Battle for Azeroth Alpha Version 8.0.1.26231)

What I dislike

• On alpha we're stacking damage buffs in a way that feels like it's not strategical, but more like the older Retribution paladin designs where you just hit whatever lights up.
• You hit Overpower a lot, but it doesn't hit very hard in comparison to other abilities and it uses the 'shoulder animation'. Where is my 'oomph'?

What I miss

• The Legion design makes me want to spend as much rage as possible. It's an illusion, but it feels good and fits the warrior fantasy.
• When CS procs it feels like a 'break through', because your next ability hit much harder (I miss the crit bonus).

I realize the two playstyles are basically quite similar in some fashion when it comes to numbers and stacking/proc'ing─but the feel and fantasy in Legion is much better than on alpha! On alpha it feels mechanical and like I have no 'oomph'.

What I like

• I like having a different major cooldown than Recklessness/Battle Cry. I think the baseline cooldown should be Avatar instead though because it has more universal use, is more simple to understand and it looks and feels cool.
• I like having Overpower baseline. It's a clear strength to be able to hit classes that dodge a lot as well in PvP. The shoulder animation feels wrong though─if you (Blizzard) prefer the shoulder animation, then I think you should give the ability a new icon instead of a sword.

What I'm worried about

• AOE is getting toned down for some classes. It doesn't look like it is going to be one of our strengths. Sweeping Strikes is a fun cooldown, but overall it feels like we're a bit too weak overall with the current design.

/Ansi

[Pestilent]

I will have to wait and see when things are more fleshed out I suppose still, but as a primarily M+ player, the one big grief I still think I will have is losing shockwave, which was a pretty core stun to running M+.

Personally I would like to see intimidating shout tweaked a little if we are to lose shockwave for good, maybe make a baseline version of it freeze fear mobs in place, and then make a glyph that puts the current version once again (for pvpers who need that functionality), it wouldn't be quite as good as having shockwave but it would at least make sure we never accidentally have one randomly fear out and pull more packs of mobs, though honestly if I could I would totally trade intimidating shout for shockwave if that were an option, it really is just that crucial in M+, and I get a distinct feeling we will have lower desirability with a couple others getting their stuns now baseline (monk/warlock for instance).

Aside from that one big thing, I still think Deadly Calm, Second wind, and to a lesser extent impending victory are all terrible talents (with the caveat that deadly calm is either terrible or if changed can be tuned to be too good which has happened in the past).

Impending victory has a little use, but I find it super lackluster, and still requires melee range and a GCD wasting dmg on what usually ends up being less healing overall from many other classes that can either proc or use a heal whenever they need it without target or range requirements.

Second Wind - Can this just finally go away, its old iterations had purpose, this is literally a leveling talent and maybe a solo raid farming talent, its niche uses are so few and far between now it just feels like a dead talent spot and has been a dead talent for such a long time now, would really like to see it finally replaced with something better, or at least give a secondary part that heals on something, like a HoT from being CCed etc, just anything to make it more valuable as a choice.

Really I still don't fully understand the tiers that have mobility/defensives/heals combined between tier 30/60, its not really a decision when things like defensive stance are mandatory etc, if the weaponmaster datamine talent is really coming in, and it replaced say impending victory slot, I actually think the best way to orient these tiers would be

tier 30 - double time/bounding stride/storm bolt
tier 60 - second wind(or again find a better alternative)/weaponmaster/defensive stance

if they were oriented this way you get tier 30 about CC or mobility choices all fairly equal, and tier 60 aside from second wind being near useless with weaponmaster versus defensive stance is essentially group defensiveness/niche defensiveness versus using defensive stance for your own personal defensiveness that can be used specifically around timed abilities. Seems like doing that with both tiers actually makes you think about both tiers and what content you are doing versus now where you always just take defensive stance and always took shockwave.

[Syegfryed]

Second Wind - Can this just finally go away, its old iterations had purpose, this is literally a leveling talent and maybe a solo raid farming talent, its niche uses are so few and far between now it just feels like a dead talent spot and has been a dead talent for such a long time now, would really like to see it finally replaced with something better, or at least give a secondary part that heals on something, like a HoT from being CCed etc, just anything to make it more valuable as a choice..

this so much, i fucking hate this talent, and hate even more when i remember how cool and good it used to be in MOP

damn useless talent should at least go way so not give a sensation of disgusting

[Tuskchi]

Man I really miss the variety Vanilla talent sheets were offering. You could do really custom stuff. I know they won't return this, but it would be lovely if Arms could get Sword/Mage/Axe spec back and for Fury to have an argument for 1H DW and 2H DW ... why not even Single-hand 2h fury dps? Well, I guess that flew out of the window as blizzard are pretty much set on Titan's Grip = 2h DW Barbarian-esque = Fury Warrior WoW fantasy ...

To be honest, with personal loot being the go-to loot type, haven't they understood that there will be no "weapon stealing" in raids, quite the opposite... people can share loot they don't need ( i.e. frost dks / rogues / warriors ). There must be someone with brain in Blizzard who realized that... :\

[Aggrophobic]

Man I really miss the variety Vanilla talent sheets were offering. You could do really custom stuff. I know they won't return this, but it would be lovely if Arms could get Sword/Mage/Axe spec back and for Fury to have an argument for 1H DW and 2H DW ... why not even Single-hand 2h fury dps? Well, I guess that flew out of the window as blizzard are pretty much set on Titan's Grip = 2h DW Barbarian-esque = Fury Warrior WoW fantasy ...

To be honest, with personal loot being the go-to loot type, haven't they understood that there will be no "weapon stealing" in raids, quite the opposite... people can share loot they don't need ( i.e. frost dks / rogues / warriors ). There must be someone with brain in Blizzard who realized that... :\

What? You just picked every flat damage increase and then raced to the two talents in the tree that actually gave you antyhing to push.
There was no choice or variety back then at all.

[Recom]

What? You just picked every flat damage increase and then raced to the two talents in the tree that actually gave you antyhing to push.
There was no choice or variety back then at all.

Don't bother, vanilla/classic nostalgia post are just that, nostalgia. At best we had 1/2 choices in the form of going 31/20 or 21/30 or something like that. Just wait for classic servers to open and people will realise how shallow it was.

[Aggrophobic]

Don't bother, vanilla/classic nostalgia post are just that, nostalgia. At best we had 1/2 choices in the form of going 31/20 or 21/30 or something like that. Just wait for classic servers to open and people will realise how shallow it was.

For sure. I mean, the talent trees back then actually had some positives like you actually got something while leveling. It feels a little unrewarding with all these levels and so few talents. But to say that there was any actual choice at max level is silly.