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  1. #1
    Immortal Gandrake's Avatar
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    Blizzard Needs to Define Boundaries of Competitive Play

    If you have been following recent happening events in the Overwatch Community, you will know that One Trick player Fuey500 and others have been at the center of this controversy in which they are being suspended by automated bans issued by reports.

    In Stylosa's newest video, he makes a point by saying "if so many people are reporting these kind of players, do you really want them in the game?" and I have to agree with him.

    With all these recent developments I have to wonder what is and is not acceptable behavior in a competitive environment or what the platform of competitive play is intended for. Where exactly is the line even drawn when it comes to comp? What experience is competitive play supposed to offer? What kind of players is it supposed to attract? Is it supposed to be Quick Play but just a little more serious? Are players with a very competitive mindset that play like they want to win every match they participate in, and try to, too serious for Overwatch?

    Because personally, the impression I am starting to get from Blizzard is that Quick Play and Competitive Play are the exact same thing except you're expected to make an effort to win in Competitive Play without necessarily having WINNING in mind as a top priority.

    Ricky Bobby says "if you ain't first, you're last" and that pretty much sums up how I feel about people in Competitive Play who aren't playing with the sole intention of winning games. You don't have to talk, we don't have to be friends, we don't have to like each other. But you damn well better be playing to win or the whole game mode is worthless.

    It will probably come as no surprise that I don't like One Trick players and see them as extremely detrimental to the environment of competitive play, not just because of their inflexibility but a complete lack of respect and total disregard for what I believe are the principles of competitive play.

    When I first started playing the game I was a Reinhardt one trick,

    Guess how long that one worked out for me. Spoiler: Not Long

    He was the only hero I could play and at the time he was very popular. Dude who locked him didn't give a fuck I couldn't play anything else and sometimes I couldn't play Lucio, so I'd be stuck playing a DPS hero I couldn't play.

    I would try my hardest but people would still get really frustrated because I couldn't do my job like shoot pharah down for example and say something like they wished they could have played Soldier all game long but wouldn't actually say anything back when I asked them why they couldn't put orb of discord on pharah or why they never asked if they could play soldier instead.

    Same story with every 1 trick ever. Glad I was able to solve that problem by reading up on How To Give a Fuck: For Dummies and learned how to play another hero.
    Last edited by Gandrake; 2017-11-24 at 09:05 PM.
    And while the cobras dance around your feet like you're a god
    It only takes one bite for you to realize you are not


  2. #2
    Well the title kind of sums it up, Blizzard does need to do that.

    They're trying to drive in two lanes right now and it doesn't work, you can't have a 'casually competitive' mode and cater to both crowds, it's a mess.

    This game needs a functional Quick Play that isn't simply a complete fiesta every single time, give incentives to play it.

    Make sure people are aware Competitive is meant to be >competitive<, you don't always get what you want in this mode, remove the level 25 limit cap and make it so you require a certain amount of hours on multiple heroes first or something, remove incentives for simply participating, just give rewards for achieving certain ranks/winning.

    Introduce a proper solo queue, the game really, really needs this, I don't care what reason they have for this not to be included but it should exist.

    I could go on for awhile but the game is a mess at almost all levels of play right now, I'm not going to mention the matchmaking and SR systems because those are more complicated and I generally believe all of the players who constantly whine about not being able to climb because all the systems in place are holding them back are not being honest to themselves, but they could improve things here too.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Gandrake View Post
    If you have been following recent happening events in the Overwatch Community, you will know that One Trick player Fuey500 and others have been at the center of this controversy in which they are being suspended by automated bans issued by reports.

    In Stylosa's newest video, he makes a point by saying "if so many people are reporting these kind of players, do you really want them in the game?" and I have to agree with him.

    With all these recent developments I have to wonder what is and is not acceptable behavior in a competitive environment or what the platform of competitive play is intended for. Where exactly is the line even drawn when it comes to comp? What experience is competitive play supposed to offer? What kind of players is it supposed to attract? Is it supposed to be Quick Play but just a little more serious? Are players with a very competitive mindset that play like they want to win every match they participate in, and try to, too serious for Overwatch?

    Because personally, the impression I am starting to get from Blizzard is that Quick Play and Competitive Play are the exact same thing except you're expected to make an effort to win in Competitive Play without necessarily having WINNING in mind as a top priority.

    Ricky Bobby says "if you ain't first, you're last" and that pretty much sums up how I feel about people in Competitive Play who aren't playing with the sole intention of winning games. You don't have to talk, we don't have to be friends, we don't have to like each other. But you damn well better be playing to win or the whole game mode is worthless.

    It will probably come as no surprise that I don't like One Trick players and see them as extremely detrimental to the environment of competitive play, not just because of their inflexibility but a complete lack of respect and total disregard for what I believe are the principles of competitive play.

    When I first started playing the game I was a Reinhardt one trick,

    Guess how long that one worked out for me. Spoiler: Not Long

    He was the only hero I could play and at the time he was very popular. Dude who locked him didn't give a fuck I couldn't play anything else and sometimes I couldn't play Lucio, so I'd be stuck playing a DPS hero I couldn't play.

    I would try my hardest but people would still get really frustrated because I couldn't do my job like shoot pharah down for example and say something like they wished they could have played Soldier all game long but wouldn't actually say anything back when I asked them why they couldn't put orb of discord on pharah or why they never asked if they could play soldier instead.

    Same story with every 1 trick ever. Glad I was able to solve that problem by reading up on How To Give a Fuck: For Dummies and learned how to play another hero.
    It's because online games like Overwatch are now infested with retards who've no competitive spirit what so fucking ever and think that everyone else exists for their benefit, often with the justification that "I paid for this game and I can play it whatever way I want" or "I play for fun".

    You can't argue with that loser, defeatist attitude because people nowadays haven't a single fucking bone in their spine. They've all grown up being told how special they are and how everyone's a winner.
    It's that kind of selfish, egotistical, idiotic bullshit that drives me away from multiplayer games where I must rely on other peoples cooperation. Because in a vast majority of the cases, you don't get their cooperation.

    And companies like Blizzard do absolutely nothing about it. They're not even trying to encourage the right thing. They could make a video series, they could make fucking anything to educate their retarded players but they don't.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Woobels View Post
    Well the title kind of sums it up, Blizzard does need to do that.

    They're trying to drive in two lanes right now and it doesn't work, you can't have a 'casually competitive' mode and cater to both crowds, it's a mess.

    This game needs a functional Quick Play that isn't simply a complete fiesta every single time, give incentives to play it.

    Make sure people are aware Competitive is meant to be >competitive<, you don't always get what you want in this mode, remove the level 25 limit cap and make it so you require a certain amount of hours on multiple heroes first or something, remove incentives for simply participating, just give rewards for achieving certain ranks/winning.

    Introduce a proper solo queue, the game really, really needs this, I don't care what reason they have for this not to be included but it should exist.

    I could go on for awhile but the game is a mess at almost all levels of play right now, I'm not going to mention the matchmaking and SR systems because those are more complicated and I generally believe all of the players who constantly whine about not being able to climb because all the systems in place are holding them back are not being honest to themselves, but they could improve things here too.
    No no no! We can't actually DEMAND anything of people! That's oppressive and mean! Don't actually ask people to improve or do their best, that's just not inclusive.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Gandrake View Post
    If you have been following recent happening events in the Overwatch Community, you will know that One Trick player Fuey500 and others have been at the center of this controversy in which they are being suspended by automated bans issued by reports.

    In Stylosa's newest video, he makes a point by saying "if so many people are reporting these kind of players, do you really want them in the game?" and I have to agree with him.

    With all these recent developments I have to wonder what is and is not acceptable behavior in a competitive environment or what the platform of competitive play is intended for. Where exactly is the line even drawn when it comes to comp? What experience is competitive play supposed to offer? What kind of players is it supposed to attract? Is it supposed to be Quick Play but just a little more serious? Are players with a very competitive mindset that play like they want to win every match they participate in, and try to, too serious for Overwatch?

    Because personally, the impression I am starting to get from Blizzard is that Quick Play and Competitive Play are the exact same thing except you're expected to make an effort to win in Competitive Play without necessarily having WINNING in mind as a top priority.

    Ricky Bobby says "if you ain't first, you're last" and that pretty much sums up how I feel about people in Competitive Play who aren't playing with the sole intention of winning games. You don't have to talk, we don't have to be friends, we don't have to like each other. But you damn well better be playing to win or the whole game mode is worthless.

    It will probably come as no surprise that I don't like One Trick players and see them as extremely detrimental to the environment of competitive play, not just because of their inflexibility but a complete lack of respect and total disregard for what I believe are the principles of competitive play.

    When I first started playing the game I was a Reinhardt one trick,

    Guess how long that one worked out for me. Spoiler: Not Long

    He was the only hero I could play and at the time he was very popular. Dude who locked him didn't give a fuck I couldn't play anything else and sometimes I couldn't play Lucio, so I'd be stuck playing a DPS hero I couldn't play.

    I would try my hardest but people would still get really frustrated because I couldn't do my job like shoot pharah down for example and say something like they wished they could have played Soldier all game long but wouldn't actually say anything back when I asked them why they couldn't put orb of discord on pharah or why they never asked if they could play soldier instead.

    Same story with every 1 trick ever. Glad I was able to solve that problem by reading up on How To Give a Fuck: For Dummies and learned how to play another hero.
    Yes....but its hard to define..../inforce

    I have had 1 trick pony's, or bad counters people picking snipers, bastion etc vs tracer, genji's etc. And yes 1 trick pony's are bad. But what if that is the player who is playing the right counter/hero for the map/enemy team combo. How many times i get shouted at when i take a Mei in nightmarket..until they see how i play with it.

  5. #5
    I am Murloc! Seefer's Avatar
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    I will leave this here for you to watch

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nb5ob18OByM
    History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people - Martin Luther King, Jr.

  6. #6
    Immortal Gandrake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woobels View Post
    This game needs a functional Quick Play that isn't simply a complete fiesta every single time, give incentives to play it.
    I agree. I don't understand how they ever thought the competitive platform they developed this game on could ever be played casually. We see the problems that the proclamation that Quick Play is a "do whatever you want here" type of environment when the defending team is playing cheese comp, a low skill defense composition that requires more than basic strategy and a modicum of hero knowledge to counter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Woobels View Post
    Make sure people are aware Competitive is meant to be >competitive<, you don't always get what you want in this mode, remove the level 25 limit cap and make it so you require a certain amount of hours on multiple heroes first or something, remove incentives for simply participating, just give rewards for achieving certain ranks/winning.
    This comes up a lot, but as the example is generally cited pulled from Paladins I feel like many readers become resistant just because they feel like someone is saying another game is better.

    It would definitely be nice to know that even at the lowest levels of play that players have a respectable hero pool and the experience with a variety of heroes to learn how each one can uniquely impact their games in a big way if they see an opportunity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seefer View Post
    I will leave this here for you to watch

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nb5ob18OByM

    Haha thanks, I actually hadn't finished watching that today. I love Cliff. I don't agree with everything he says, but he is one of my favorite Overwatch youtubers.
    And while the cobras dance around your feet like you're a god
    It only takes one bite for you to realize you are not


  7. #7
    Free Food!?!?! Tziva's Avatar
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    wall of text...

    I don't necessarily have a problem with Blizzard judging greyer areas on a case-by-case basis on the circumstances. Sometimes drawing hard lines in the sand mean that there are some situations that get handled in a way that is against common sense. In the case of swapping heroes, I think it's more dangerous to say "you have to swap if your team asks for it" or "refusing to ever swap is fine" than it is to look at individual cases where there was conflict over swapping and decide how to handle it from there. I think presented as an ambiguous framework, it's easy to say "then how will players know what is allowed and what isn't" but I think if we were actually presented with the details of particular scenarios we can often see that a Hanzo insisting he play Hanzo over Soldier because he's better at Hanzo is probably fine (unideal but fine) while a player intentionally throwing the game because someone else locked Hanzo is not, just as some examples.

    Players who are concerned about being on the wrong side of the rules can just consider what is best for the team in that circumstances to be their guide. Sometimes someone playing an unideal hero they are better at is better for the team (especially in lower ranks) than sticking a Rein main on a Widow. And sucking it up and playing a different character is better than throwing a tantrum and blowing the match because you couldn't get the hero you wanted (or because you're mad at the hero someone else picked).

    I use those as examples because a lot of the drama I've seen involved with one tricking and swapping has usually had additional variables at play, like someone intentionally throwing the match or losing their shit on their team either because they didn't get to play their hero or because someone else insisting on only playing one hero.

    Anyway, that is a very long winded way to say that I am fine with Blizzard setting general guidelines for competitive philosophy rather than hard lines.

    General thoughts on the rest of the topic:

    • I think part of the issue with people treating Comp like QP is because people are playing Comp who don't care about Comp but want the golden guns. I can't really think of a good solution to this. You can make Golden Guns obtainable through QP but if Comp was still more efficient, those people will still play Comp. You could make QP was on par with Comp and then it loses some of the prestige for being a Comp player since that's the entire point of the guns.
    • My personal approach is: anything goes in QP as long as you're trying. Want to run a six DPS team? Well, I'm not always delighted with it, but as long as people are actually trying to win, I think that's fine. But I'm not fine with is people totally dicking around. QP is where people should go to learn new heroes and try weird things, but it's still a competitive and team-based environment and I still expect people to be respectful to their teammates and put in effort.
    • In Comp, I feel like people should be taking things more seriously and trying to at least form a reasonable comp, and swap for countering as needed. I think people should be allowed to continue to play outside of the meta (within reason) and try unusual/less ideal characters as long as they are trying and there is a good reason for it. Sometimes it's better to have a Symm who is really good at that hero then force her to play a character she's never played before.
    • I think Blizzard needs to add more incentive for trying other heroes in general and for swapping in comp. IMO one tricking and having a "main" goes against the core philosophy of this game and it's design. We shouldn't have a scenario where people are refusing to swap characters because that's literally the only character they have ever played, and we definitely shouldn't be rewarding that behaviour with improved SR gains. (I was in a match the other day that had two people who had only ever played Ana. Both insisted on being Ana because that was all they knew. )
    Last edited by Tziva; 2017-11-24 at 10:03 PM.
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  8. #8
    Immortal Gandrake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baskev View Post
    Yes....but its hard to define..../inforce

    I have had 1 trick pony's, or bad counters people picking snipers, bastion etc vs tracer, genji's etc. And yes 1 trick pony's are bad. But what if that is the player who is playing the right counter/hero for the map/enemy team combo. How many times i get shouted at when i take a Mei in nightmarket..until they see how i play with it.
    I think at low ELO, people make a bigger deal than they should and would be better off just supporting their teammates. At low ELO people are still working out the essentials and comp doesn't matter that much. Like, yes, your attack hanzo and mei are probably not going to be impressive but if you just work with your team and get a lucio to help your mei flank a bunch of out of position idiots then you can make it work

    a common target is widowmaker. we all know how stubborn players who want to play widowmaker can be because of how abusive players have been to them and try to lay a team's defeat at their feet every game and guilt trip them for it. but honestly if your widowmaker is shooting somewhere around 40-50% scoped accuracy, does not have a lot of obstacles in her way or not a lot of preventative measures being made to make her less effective, you are probably just better off supporting her instead of berating her.

    I don't like Hanzo because he is very inconsistent and a very difficult hero to play and there are a variety of much stronger heroes they could play, but Widowmaker is very reliable - she is hitscan and has one of the most effective value per shots in the game as a boosted widow can get your team easy picks even if they are not impressive and just got lucky... a pick is a pick and just the fact the enemy team is scared they could get picked by widow will create space for your team until they decide to do something about it...

    and if their team is bad and your widow is positioned well and you support her, even if she is total trash well now your team is fighting a 6v4 after your team demolishes the winston who is expecting to kill your widow easy or robs him of his bubble so he cant use it to protect his team from your widow and turned their defense point into open season

    But at higher ELOs people know the game. They know what is stupid. They know what is not stupid. You are probably not losing games in gold solely because of an attack torbjorn making a serious effort to win even though they are an uncooperative asshole. However, when you are in masters and someone is playing bastion on lijang gardens, as much as you want to win and wish that you could make it work so you could win, you are not playing to win at this point - you are playing to lose as little as possible, which is very likely to be a far cry from the experience players at that rank expect the platform of competitive play to deliver.
    Last edited by Gandrake; 2017-11-24 at 11:29 PM.
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  9. #9
    I am Murloc! Seefer's Avatar
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    I think in order to make competitive more structured they need to add more ways to get the golden guns that way it keeps people who only want the golden guns out of competitive who don't want to be there.
    History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people - Martin Luther King, Jr.

  10. #10
    Immortal Gandrake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tziva View Post
    wall of text...
    Well I had a friend I used to moderate a message board with years back and he always used to say "A post is like a skirt, keep it long enough to cover the content but short enough to keep things interesting". Personally, I never took to it. But he was a funny guy, I miss him.

    I don't think it's farfetched to believe some of these players, they might be playing at a level they are comfortable at and maybe they're just trying to be the very best Bastion or whatever hero player that they can possibly be, but aren't necessarily concerned about ranking up or just want to play their favorite hero in Competitive because of how terribly ill suited the environment of Quick Play is for an enjoyable game of Overwatch. And maybe at their ranks there are also other players who aren't One Tricks but feel the same way too and are only playing Competitive because there are actually people in the game mode that give two flyin' donkey fucks about winning.

    It bothers me they don't want to talk about it and everything they do just seems to point in the direction that, yes, competitive play is a semi-competitive game mode for players. They aren't banning throwers, the punishment for leavers is wayyyy too lenient and a lot of people in the game mode just have no clue what is going on.

    The tilt at season start over placements is real. People get so pissed off over them and they don't mean anything. It's mostly new players. The fact that they are even called placements, like they even matter is makes it tiltware.

    I was playing with my friend once on my other account. we are in mid silver and I picked Bastion on attack. this DVA just starts losing their shit and asks who boosted me from bronze. When I told him he was 88 SR from being bronze and that his current was his season high, he told me to shut the fuck up and that he was muting me. When we lost, I typed in chat he could add us to his friends list and I'd boost him to gold for a pizza and the dude just starts screaming. we could hear him smashing shit in the background until the game took us back to the main menu.

    For a guy that wasn't trying that hard to win, he sure took that defeat pretty harshly. I should have gotten on my friend's mic and asked if that was a no on the pizza.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seefer View Post
    I think in order to make competitive more structured they need to add more ways to get the golden guns that way it keeps people who only want the golden guns out of competitive who don't want to be there.
    Hell, I'd remove them from competitive. The only reward Competitive Play should offer players is the privilege and opportunity to play with other players who are playing to win. I mean, the sprays and whatever etc. that's okay as long as it's not something that's just handed out for completing placements, but I really want to see the mode rebuilt from the ground up and re-purposed to appeal only to a specific type of player.

    That probably sounds like losing money to Blizzard, so it's undeniable that they'd rather not - because by them telling an audience of players who are there because they don't enjoy quickplay, they will then have to address the issues onset by the unbearable mindset of the quick play community I struggle to even call "casual" that makes it such a miserable and unfulfilling experience to participate in.

    A lot of people won't just come out and say it, but as someone that avoids participating in Quick Play whenever possible, the primary reason I got so into comp and just never went back was because I could not stand the "just a game" mentality of quickplay. It's just like... Basketball is just a game. No one complains when you're jackin' up threes like Iverson every time you touch the ball even tho every single one drops like a sack of flying potatoes?

    So I know there are people out there who are playing competitive not because they enjoy it or want to be there, but because they'd rather play 6v6 somewhere where the game is being played more seriously than Quick Play because I had to do the same thing too just to learn how to play DPS heroes. Quick Play is terrible. It's like the McDonald's of Overwatch game modes.
    Last edited by Gandrake; 2017-11-25 at 12:42 PM.
    And while the cobras dance around your feet like you're a god
    It only takes one bite for you to realize you are not


  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Creamy Flames View Post
    It's because online games like Overwatch are now infested with retards who've no competitive spirit what so fucking ever and think that everyone else exists for their benefit, often with the justification that "I paid for this game and I can play it whatever way I want" or "I play for fun".

    You can't argue with that loser, defeatist attitude because people nowadays haven't a single fucking bone in their spine. They've all grown up being told how special they are and how everyone's a winner.
    It's that kind of selfish, egotistical, idiotic bullshit that drives me away from multiplayer games where I must rely on other peoples cooperation. Because in a vast majority of the cases, you don't get their cooperation.

    And companies like Blizzard do absolutely nothing about it. They're not even trying to encourage the right thing. They could make a video series, they could make fucking anything to educate their retarded players but they don't.

    - - - Updated - - -



    No no no! We can't actually DEMAND anything of people! That's oppressive and mean! Don't actually ask people to improve or do their best, that's just not inclusive.
    Boy you are hitting so many salty one liners in your diatribe that you jump off the rails and fail to make any kind of point what so ever.
    If you push a button that finds you a 'random group' and it gives you a random group of people with random skill and random knowledge then you have no right to complain that a 'random group' button did what it was designed to do. The fault lies in your inability to make friends to play with instead of relying on a button designed to be random. It is a 'random group' button, not a 'best of the best' button.

  12. #12
    I think that the issue here is simple: I'm a low tier OW player, but a veteran gamer, and my first shooter ever is OW. I was absolute trash at aiming at the start of the game (literally couldn't hit someone 2 meters away from me as Mcree) and I'm progressively getting better at it, but:

    Quick Play is trash. I cannot play in this mode. Everyone is simply doing their own thing, and it does not feel like a team game or a team effort, thus I am forced into Competitive. That's simply the only way you can enjoy the game for what it is, or at least what it is supposed to be. I am not an one trick at all, since I play all support heroes, 3 tanks in rein, winston and dva, and multiple dps in 76, genji, tracer, doomfist, pharah, reaper and some mcree if I feel that I do not completely suck.

    This does NOT mean that I am good or even close to good on those heroes, and my rank simply reflects that. I can fully understand an one trick player that does not want to play anything else, and noone has any reason to not co-operate with them: it is much worse to be able to play most heroes and pick what you "feel" is better, as in picking Moira while you have a Pharah and a Genji, and even a Silver like me will tell you in hero select that your pick simply won't work.

    Picks must be made by understanding how the game will play out. With that said, if someone is a one trick, there's only one viable and logical way of playing that match: build around the person. They are a 76 one trick? Pick Ana to nano him, mercy to further boost him, dva to stop missiles from reaching him and 1 other dps that will counter what your opposing team has picked. They are a torb? Awesome, pick Orisa, Rein, Mercy & Moira and laugh.

    The team not cooperating with their teammate is simply ignorant. A team must acknowledge their weaknesses and their strengths and adapt. If your strength is a Torb one trick, invest in that strength. Not doing so, will simply lead to your defeat as a team. At this point one may say: "Why shouldn't the one trick co-operate with the whole other team?". It is simple: if they are a one trick, putting them on any other hero simply won't work for your team. That player has been matched with you, so they are of the same caliber as you, and that's how they decide to play the game. If you don't want them in your team, simply make one! It is that simple.

    Lastly, remember that this is a generally mediocre game, and you're not playing for anything other than an arbitrary number that generally amounts to nothing plus some bytes that happen to be golden on a screen.

  13. #13
    I think players need to define the boundaries of competetive play. You find people who play within your boundaries then you put them on your friends list. When you see them on you invite them and you get your game on the way you want to play.

    If you use a random group button to determine your team mates then you get what you asked for, random people who play in random ways. It is not a guaranteed 'best of the best button', it is a random group button. You push that button you are rolling the dice and sometimes you come up craps.

    You as the player are capable of being in complete control of who you play with but it requires more than just 1 button push and mental effort to try. Instead you want to bitch and moan when a random group button does what it is designed to do and blame everyone but yourself.

    You don't want torb one tricks? Don't invite them to your groups.

    "But Deadman.... I wouldn't have anyone to blame for me losing and I wouldn't have anything to bitch about on the forums if I did that!". I am sure you will find something to bitch about.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Well View Post
    I think that the issue here is simple: I'm a low tier OW player, but a veteran gamer, and my first shooter ever is OW. I was absolute trash at aiming at the start of the game (literally couldn't hit someone 2 meters away from me as Mcree) and I'm progressively getting better at it, but:

    Quick Play is trash. I cannot play in this mode. Everyone is simply doing their own thing, and it does not feel like a team game or a team effort, thus I am forced into Competitive. That's simply the only way you can enjoy the game for what it is, or at least what it is supposed to be. I am not an one trick at all, since I play all support heroes, 3 tanks in rein, winston and dva, and multiple dps in 76, genji, tracer, doomfist, pharah, reaper and some mcree if I feel that I do not completely suck.

    This does NOT mean that I am good or even close to good on those heroes, and my rank simply reflects that. I can fully understand an one trick player that does not want to play anything else, and noone has any reason to not co-operate with them: it is much worse to be able to play most heroes and pick what you "feel" is better, as in picking Moira while you have a Pharah and a Genji, and even a Silver like me will tell you in hero select that your pick simply won't work.

    Picks must be made by understanding how the game will play out. With that said, if someone is a one trick, there's only one viable and logical way of playing that match: build around the person. They are a 76 one trick? Pick Ana to nano him, mercy to further boost him, dva to stop missiles from reaching him and 1 other dps that will counter what your opposing team has picked. They are a torb? Awesome, pick Orisa, Rein, Mercy & Moira and laugh.

    The team not cooperating with their teammate is simply ignorant. A team must acknowledge their weaknesses and their strengths and adapt. If your strength is a Torb one trick, invest in that strength. Not doing so, will simply lead to your defeat as a team. At this point one may say: "Why shouldn't the one trick co-operate with the whole other team?". It is simple: if they are a one trick, putting them on any other hero simply won't work for your team. That player has been matched with you, so they are of the same caliber as you, and that's how they decide to play the game. If you don't want them in your team, simply make one! It is that simple.

    Lastly, remember that this is a generally mediocre game, and you're not playing for anything other than an arbitrary number that generally amounts to nothing plus some bytes that happen to be golden on a screen.
    No no no no, you see... these guys want the team to form around their pick, they don't want to form a team around someone elses pick.
    Last edited by DeadmanWalking; 2017-11-27 at 01:42 AM.
    If you push a button that finds you a 'random group' and it gives you a random group of people with random skill and random knowledge then you have no right to complain that a 'random group' button did what it was designed to do. The fault lies in your inability to make friends to play with instead of relying on a button designed to be random. It is a 'random group' button, not a 'best of the best' button.

  14. #14
    Immortal Gandrake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    Boy you are hitting so many salty one liners in your diatribe that you jump off the rails and fail to make any kind of point what so ever.
    Well they have gone a bit over the top, but I understand the frustration and definitely agree with many notions listed here, but you're right in suggesting much said is left up to interpretation rather than being given substance. But a number of streamers and content creators have covered the subject of how random and displeasing the matchmaking of Quick Play is.

    But what gets me is that Blizzard suspended XQC for "abuse of the report system". He'd reported a player he'd previously played a number of games with and claims his reports were "taken out of context", ahem "doggy".

    It took Blizzard two months to ban a stream sniping thrower. Two months. To ban a player that was literally throwing games. But he gets banned within 24 hours for typing "fuck you" into his player reports regarding a player that had 17 hours on Symmetra and less than 10 minutes on every other hero but was getting their ass kicked in every game.

    Really shows where Blizzard's priorities are.

    Quote Originally Posted by Well View Post
    They are a torb? Awesome, pick Orisa, Rein, Mercy & Moira and laugh.
    You need 3 heroes to support that comp but the enemy team only needs 1 to dismantle it. I know a lot of people don't play Tracer (at all or very well) in silver but she shits all over comps like that. Just spray until you get ultimate and collect a free quadruple kill. Even just a Pharah with Orb of Harmony would decimate that comp.

    and how about when your comp gets noticed? when people start expecting it... what do you do when you're dealing with a Pharah from above and a boosted Bastion eating your shields from the ground? They don't need a second tank to beat your comp - maybe they've got Tracer too and you just don't know it yet

    Plus Torbjorn players are so stupid and easy to manipulate. They come running as soon as you start shooting at their turret. I wonder if their entire life flashes before them when they see a 76 firing at it because "i'll get burst combo'd 100-0 if i try to repair the turret so maybe this is a bad idea" obviously wasn't the first thought they had

    i don't think there is a single hero in the game that is as predictable and easy to kill as Torbjorn
    And while the cobras dance around your feet like you're a god
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  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Gandrake View Post
    What experience is competitive play supposed to offer? What kind of players is it supposed to attract? Is it supposed to be Quick Play but just a little more serious? Are players with a very competitive mindset that play like they want to win every match they participate in, and try to, too serious for Overwatch?
    This has always been a problem with Blizzard games (outside of Starcraft, perhaps) and their attempts to foster competitive communities. They have always been very enthusiastic about pushing a hardcore pro scene in their games, yet the way they design them is massively slanted towards casual play. Everything about Blizzard titles screams "this is a fun, accessible casual game you're not supposed to take too seriously", yet they seem intent upon pushing a hardcore competitive experience as the end goal. Overwatch has probably been the most extreme example of this considering the handling of the esports scene and cases like those mentioned in the OP.

    I do wish that Blizzard would try and focus their games more toward a core audience type rather than spreading themselves thin and giving mixed messages about what exactly their games are supposed to be.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Gandrake View Post
    Well they have gone a bit over the top, but I understand the frustration and definitely agree with many notions listed here, but you're right in suggesting much said is left up to interpretation rather than being given substance. But a number of streamers and content creators have covered the subject of how random and displeasing the matchmaking of Quick Play is.

    But what gets me is that Blizzard suspended XQC for "abuse of the report system". He'd reported a player he'd previously played a number of games with and claims his reports were "taken out of context", ahem "doggy".

    It took Blizzard two months to ban a stream sniping thrower. Two months. To ban a player that was literally throwing games. But he gets banned within 24 hours for typing "fuck you" into his player reports regarding a player that had 17 hours on Symmetra and less than 10 minutes on every other hero but was getting their ass kicked in every game.

    Really shows where Blizzard's priorities are.



    You need 3 heroes to support that comp but the enemy team only needs 1 to dismantle it. I know a lot of people don't play Tracer (at all or very well) in silver but she shits all over comps like that. Just spray until you get ultimate and collect a free quadruple kill. Even just a Pharah with Orb of Harmony would decimate that comp.

    and how about when your comp gets noticed? when people start expecting it... what do you do when you're dealing with a Pharah from above and a boosted Bastion eating your shields from the ground? They don't need a second tank to beat your comp - maybe they've got Tracer too and you just don't know it yet

    Plus Torbjorn players are so stupid and easy to manipulate. They come running as soon as you start shooting at their turret. I wonder if their entire life flashes before them when they see a 76 firing at it because "i'll get burst combo'd 100-0 if i try to repair the turret so maybe this is a bad idea" obviously wasn't the first thought they had

    i don't think there is a single hero in the game that is as predictable and easy to kill as Torbjorn
    XQC was banned because he reported the same guy 5 times in a row one in the same game with 'Go fuck yourself' as the explanation.

    He literally clicked report, selected the reason, types Fuck you, sends it, clicks report, selected the reason, types Fuck you, sends it, clicks report, selected the reason, types Fuck you, sends it, clicks report, selected the reason, types Fuck you, sends it, clicks report, selected the reason, types Fuck you, sends it.

    Google it, it is on youtube on lots of channels of him doing it and the stunned look on his face when his account was locked was fuckin priceless.
    Last edited by DeadmanWalking; 2017-11-27 at 01:47 AM.
    If you push a button that finds you a 'random group' and it gives you a random group of people with random skill and random knowledge then you have no right to complain that a 'random group' button did what it was designed to do. The fault lies in your inability to make friends to play with instead of relying on a button designed to be random. It is a 'random group' button, not a 'best of the best' button.

  17. #17
    Immortal Gandrake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    XQC was banned because he reported the same guy 5 times in a row one in the same game with 'Go fuck yourself' as the explanation.
    Yes, within 24 hours of doing it.

    But it takes them 2 months to ban a player who is throwing, with evidence?

    It's really difficult to take them seriously or expect anyone else to when this is how we are seeing players being actioned. Why is it that we hear more about players who are playing the game to win being suspended, including cheaters, but not throwers and leavers? Cheaters might have a negative impact on the game - this is undeniable, but at least they are playing to win.

    They said they have started e-mailing players about players they've actioned, but the only emails about bans I have regarding OW are being banned from their forums for things like having a bit of fun by saying it was obvious Tracer was gay before Michael Chu said anything about it, because I mean damn man look at those shoes lol

    Also, here is a reddit post from a player who was on his team at the time that he got banned.

    He was banned off our team just as the round switched and blizzard decided to treat it as a leaver rather than cancelling the match because he got banned. Not only that blizzard decides its okay for the team he is on to lose as much if not more sr than they normally would.

    Clip of the game ending and everyone on the team losing sr: https://clips.twitch.tv/SavageWealth...esidentSleeper

    It's ridiculous that blizzard thinks this is okay since what if xQc was actually a thrower and was banned that match; the team the thrower is on is punished for being unlucky and getting them. But this isn't what happened Blizzard decided to ban probably one of the people that tries the hardest to win in ranked rather than the countless throwers that infest gm everyday.

    It's pretty ironic that Blizzard decide to ban xQc because it also goes against the narrative they crafted about their report system. They stated that if someone is on a character not working with the team, not communicating, and not swapping it is okay to report them for poor teamwork. xQc did this was banned after he reported a sym one trick who never swapped, never joined voice, and didn't do anything to eliminate being countered. Blizzard instead looks at a reddit post and listens to a community that cries whenever someone who plays a bad character is reported.
    And while the cobras dance around your feet like you're a god
    It only takes one bite for you to realize you are not


  18. #18
    You can't force people to play the way you want them to play, not even if you're Blizzard. If you happen to be Blizzard, you can strongly suggest and encourage people to play competitively since that's what that mode is for. If you want people to play the game, leave them alone. If you want people to never play again, by all means, go ahead and tell them how to play and then suspend their accounts if they don't. What are they gonna do, ban everyone until all who remain are the few thousand people whose playstyles mesh identically?

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Gandrake View Post
    Yes, within 24 hours of doing it.

    But it takes them 2 months to ban a player who is throwing, with evidence?

    It's really difficult to take them seriously or expect anyone else to when this is how we are seeing players being actioned. Why is it that we hear more about players who are playing the game to win being suspended, including cheaters, but not throwers and leavers? Cheaters might have a negative impact on the game - this is undeniable, but at least they are playing to win.

    They said they have started e-mailing players about players they've actioned, but the only emails about bans I have regarding OW are being banned from their forums for things like having a bit of fun by saying it was obvious Tracer was gay before Michael Chu said anything about it, because I mean damn man look at those shoes lol

    Also, here is a reddit post from a player who was on his team at the time that he got banned.
    Yes, because the system is automated to work eventually. It requires lots of people to report them, lots of reports means that you yourself can't be banned so easily because someone decides to troll you or someone thinks what you did was wrong even if it wasn't wrong. I had someone report me because I switched to a winston to kill their Genji because they were countering my pick, they didn't like dieing so they reported me. They felt I was abusing them, to me if you are on the enemy team you are fair game for infinite kills.

    There is no excuse for sending blizzard 'fuck you' over and over again no matter the situation. 1 Report detailing what was happening per game per reason is all that is needed.

    Again, if you don't want one tricks on your team then invite a 6 stack and don't invite one tricks. This way you guarantee you don't have to deal with one tricks and the only one tricks in your game will be on the opposing team which gives you a higher chance of winning.
    If you push a button that finds you a 'random group' and it gives you a random group of people with random skill and random knowledge then you have no right to complain that a 'random group' button did what it was designed to do. The fault lies in your inability to make friends to play with instead of relying on a button designed to be random. It is a 'random group' button, not a 'best of the best' button.

  20. #20
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    If you're allowed to sit there and act like that, then what's the point of competitive? Why should anyone have to tolerate your poor attitude? Especially players at the top of their game? Shouldn't you have a more versatile skillset at masters or gm?

    In low elo, it's a little stupid to complain about. I'm not saying players down there don't have valid complaints, but you can make just about anything work down there. But on the topic of 6 stacks, there is all the punishment in the world for 6 stacking.

    Another post from reddit:
    I’ll start off by saying I queue comp mode with 6 people about 80% of the time. I placed at 3766 this season. I have gone 47-11 since placements, and am now sitting at 4050. I had to win 36 more games than I lost in order to climb 300 SR. That is an average of 8.33 (repeating, of course) SR gain per win.

    I’ll also add that I climbed from 3900 to 4020 in one night by 3-queueing with two of my teammates and going on a 6 win-streak, gaining an average of 20 SR per win. If it were not for our triple-queue that night, I would not even be grandmaster. I would not be grandmaster having gone 47-11 since placing at 3766. Does this not seem to be incredibly flawed?
    And while the cobras dance around your feet like you're a god
    It only takes one bite for you to realize you are not


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