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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by golomb View Post
    I have quick question, not sure if i missed this part, but do we use Bloodbath on CD or we should wait for BC?

    Thank you!
    Wait for BC of course. With Convergence they will have a similar cooldown and your abilities will do far more damage which leads to far juicier bloodbaths.

    I've been trying the Bloodbath build on a target dummy without tier set, and while my DPS is markedly inferior out of execute phase which was to be expected, execute phase makes it ramp up quite dramatically. Even at 30 stacks (which is feasible on a Mythic boss), the combination of Execute + Rampage + Battle cry + Bloodbath was already quite vicious. Out of BC however I can't say I love the rotation, and it won't change with the tier set. I know I'll miss Inner Rage already, but it's still better than subjecting myself to Arms.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    Wait for BC of course. With Convergence they will have a similar cooldown and your abilities will do far more damage which leads to far juicier bloodbaths.

    I've been trying the Bloodbath build on a target dummy without tier set, and while my DPS is markedly inferior out of execute phase which was to be expected, execute phase makes it ramp up quite dramatically. Even at 30 stacks (which is feasible on a Mythic boss), the combination of Execute + Rampage + Battle cry + Bloodbath was already quite vicious. Out of BC however I can't say I love the rotation, and it won't change with the tier set. I know I'll miss Inner Rage already, but it's still better than subjecting myself to Arms.
    I tried to make that fact clear in the guide. Due to both the overlap of BC/BB and loss out consistent Raging Blow damage, the spec is burstier, but shallower outside of cooldowns than T20/IR. As you said though, the real difference comes with the Execute phase, even short ones are notably more powerful.

    That may generate some criticism that the spec is only stronger with Execute, but the beauty of the spec is that you can easily switch the Ring for the Helm, and even Frothing for Carnage, and see marked improvements from 100-20%, and especially during sustained AoE.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    I tried to make that fact clear in the guide. Due to both the overlap of BC/BB and loss out consistent Raging Blow damage, the spec is burstier, but shallower outside of cooldowns than T20/IR. As you said though, the real difference comes with the Execute phase, even short ones are notably more powerful.

    That may generate some criticism that the spec is only stronger with Execute, but the beauty of the spec is that you can easily switch the Ring for the Helm, and even Frothing for Carnage, and see marked improvements from 100-20%, and especially during sustained AoE.
    I can see myself liking Carnage a lot more than Frothing, frequent Rampages would certainly fill the boring holes in the non-BC rotation. Once bosses die quickly on farm which would make an Execute focused setup redundant, or on bosses like Eonar and High Command, I may just run the setup you mention.

  4. #44
    What a cool guide! Thanks. Is there any Arms equivalent?

  5. #45
    Most of the stats on T21 suck, so is it better to keep 4p T20 with IR until I get 4p T21? I mean running 2p T21 and 2p T20 does not seem to be a good setup?

  6. #46
    Does this guide only apply for those who have T21?

    What guide would I use if I am just starting out, ILVL 920 or so, but no set pieces?

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by VyersReaver View Post
    What a cool guide! Thanks. Is there any Arms equivalent?
    Check the other pinned thread in this forum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by toddx318 View Post
    Does this guide only apply for those who have T21?

    What guide would I use if I am just starting out, ILVL 920 or so, but no set pieces?
    With no tier whatsoever, I'd probably just play IR (see the linked 7.2.5 guide), but then I like IR. Honestly, it doesn't matter all that much, your main priority is to gear up, rather than to min/max.

  8. #48
    Deleted
    hello from France,

    Thx for the Guide Archimitros .


    I have some question.

    i got The 2P bonus yesterday and tried some combinations...all sucks....

    should i stay IR + legs and helmet (leg) untill i get the 4p?


    Thx for all that work.

    Bb

  9. #49
    Deleted
    I already have 4 pc T21. After simulation and live test my dps drop 200k using BB build and rotation. Outside BC+BB fury warrior do nothing with new set.
    80%+ of dmg is done during BC window and its not more than before. The only compensation is during execute. Also i do less AOE - i still can't understand why.

    Edit: I got all the legs and did test with both combination.
    Last edited by mmocdee9a20130; 2017-12-01 at 08:54 AM.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Rummen View Post
    I already have 4 pc T21. After simulation and live test my dps drop 200k using BB build and rotation. Outside BC+BB fury warrior do nothing with new set.
    80%+ of dmg is done during BC window and its not more than before. The only compensation is during execute. Also i do less AOE - i still can't understand why.

    Edit: I got all the legs and did test with both combination.
    Like I said, the stats on T21 suck and that's one of the reasons, another reason is probably beacuse they over nerfed the bonuses. I read somewhere that T21 is only a 100k increase over T20, WTF

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    I tried to make that fact clear in the guide. Due to both the overlap of BC/BB and loss out consistent Raging Blow damage, the spec is burstier, but shallower outside of cooldowns than T20/IR. As you said though, the real difference comes with the Execute phase, even short ones are notably more powerful.

    That may generate some criticism that the spec is only stronger with Execute, but the beauty of the spec is that you can easily switch the Ring for the Helm, and even Frothing for Carnage, and see marked improvements from 100-20%, and especially during sustained AoE.
    I noticed the rotation feels really weak also with nothing doing damage outside of BC; but in the execute phase my dps ramps up ALOT.
    Softbottom - Stormscale

  12. #52
    Hey, not sure if this is the right place to ask. But is the consensus that fury will be the better performing spec for warriors this tier?

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by mstg View Post
    Like I said, the stats on T21 suck and that's one of the reasons, another reason is probably beacuse they over nerfed the bonuses. I read somewhere that T21 is only a 100k increase over T20, WTF
    No they don't, the stats are great, unless you're wearing Helm/Legs, which you shouldn't be as those are legendary slots. I don't know what you read, but you should try visiting the guide on the first page of this thread.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisxor View Post
    I noticed the rotation feels really weak also with nothing doing damage outside of BC; but in the execute phase my dps ramps up ALOT.
    Yes, as the guide states, the build is very dependent on BC and Execute damage. If you don't like it, I suggest playing Helm/Carnage, since it's only ~1% behind.

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    Quote Originally Posted by scwasp View Post
    Hey, not sure if this is the right place to ask. But is the consensus that fury will be the better performing spec for warriors this tier?
    Potentially, we'll need to see what happens with next week's tuning pass.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    No they don't, the stats are great, unless you're wearing Helm/Legs, which you shouldn't be as those are legendary slots. I don't know what you read, but you should try visiting the guide on the first page of this thread.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Yes, as the guide states, the build is very dependent on BC and Execute damage. If you don't like it, I suggest playing Helm/Carnage, since it's only ~1% behind.

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    Potentially, we'll need to see what happens with next week's tuning pass.
    im looking forward to play carnage as i like the faster pace but can i ask how should i play in execute phase if i do use carnage as a talent?

    Forgot to mention if i use Helm + ayala or Crucible ring those are my leggos atm and i use Carnage as talent whats my priority rotation <20% ?!
    Last edited by Kezuma; 2017-12-01 at 08:28 PM.

  15. #55
    So ayala/sotb simming 2nd highest?

    Which means until we have BIS tier 21 slots + BIS offpieces and are mix and matching t20/21 pieces to fill set ayala/sotb is highest.

    TLDR:
    Use t21 2pc + t20 4pc +ayala/sotb
    Then use t21 4pc + t20 2pc +ayala/sotb
    Once you get BIS t21 pieces and BIS offpieces go valarjar/sotb

    Wish someone would have predicted this, oh wait...

  16. #56
    In practice I wouldn't be surprised if the Carnage/Helm build ended up being better. I feel the ring build will be too dependent on a good execute phase, which will 1) be increasingly difficult for obvious reasons as people gear up and 2) isn't guaranteed on many bosses. Sure, on Worldbreaker, High Command, Imonar or Varimathras it will be nice, but I can think of several bosses that can murder your execute phase by forcing you to disengage; Hounds with an overlap, Eonar because it's a shit fight, Portal Keeper because you need to avoid mechanics, Kin'garoth if he bubbles sub 20%, Coven if you need to avoid any of the mechanics that will kill you quickly, or Aggramar if you need to switch to an add.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Kezuma View Post
    im looking forward to play carnage as i like the faster pace but can i ask how should i play in execute phase if i do use carnage as a talent?

    Forgot to mention if i use Helm + ayala or Crucible ring those are my leggos atm and i use Carnage as talent whats my priority rotation <20% ?!
    Check the Execute section.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Derilore View Post
    So ayala/sotb simming 2nd highest?

    Which means until we have BIS tier 21 slots + BIS offpieces and are mix and matching t20/21 pieces to fill set ayala/sotb is highest.

    TLDR:
    Use t21 2pc + t20 4pc +ayala/sotb
    Then use t21 4pc + t20 2pc +ayala/sotb
    Once you get BIS t21 pieces and BIS offpieces go valarjar/sotb

    Wish someone would have predicted this, oh wait...
    Nowhere does it say anything about BiS tier pieces, off pieces, or anything of the sort; nor does it say that Ayala+Soul is the 2nd highest legendary combination; in fact it's the fourth highest combination in a vacuum. What it says is that 6p tier is the 2nd best combination, at that gear setup, with equal ilevel, which is very unlikely.

    Insignia can also take the place of Ayala, as could Rethu, or any of the other non-tier slot legendaries; I simply used Ayala as a baseline.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    In practice I wouldn't be surprised if the Carnage/Helm build ended up being better. I feel the ring build will be too dependent on a good execute phase, which will 1) be increasingly difficult for obvious reasons as people gear up and 2) isn't guaranteed on many bosses. Sure, on Worldbreaker, High Command, Imonar or Varimathras it will be nice, but I can think of several bosses that can murder your execute phase by forcing you to disengage; Hounds with an overlap, Eonar because it's a shit fight, Portal Keeper because you need to avoid mechanics, Kin'garoth if he bubbles sub 20%, Coven if you need to avoid any of the mechanics that will kill you quickly, or Aggramar if you need to switch to an add.
    Depends on the encounter, how much gear inflation reduces the duration of encounters, and how exactly Mythic plays out. That last one is important, since most would expect N and H to favor Helm (I'd say N already does for Mythic raiders, and H is close).

    While being forced off target sub-20% may reset Juggernaut stacks, Juggernaut is not quite the climb it used to be either. Although damage will certainly be lost, it's not the sole concern, and the only encounter I currently anticipate that could seriously impact Juggernaut is the potential for Kin'garoth to become shielded sub-20%, as none of the other bosses have mechanics which should interrupt Execute.

    • Aggramar doesn't spawn adds during Execute, the only potential issue on Mythic may be if Ravenous Blaze can target Melee (which I don't believe it can).
    • None of the Hound's abilities should take you off target for anything near 8 seconds.
    • None of Coven's abilities should take you off target, unless you're killing adds (which frankly, you won't, if the boss is <20%). It's probably going to be a shit fight for melee in general though, so few melee will likely be taken on progression.
    • None of Portal Keeper's mechanics should take you off target, certainly not for 8s, and if you're not using Ring, you'll probably be using Belt over Helm for AoE anyway.
    • Eonar is an AoE fight, you won't be using Helm, Ring, or be Executing regardless. Maybe for certain roles, like the Legion ship phase, but I would think a Warrior would be assigned to spend most of their time cleaving.

  18. #58
    Deleted
    just a question about priority....


    the guide says bt > Rb (priority)

    but why not using all the Rb stacks before the end of enrage (after rampage) and then using Bt (and prey bt crit) to avoid the use of fs?


    thx

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by gernuk View Post
    just a question about priority....


    the guide says bt > Rb (priority)

    but why not using all the Rb stacks before the end of enrage (after rampage) and then using Bt (and prey bt crit) to avoid the use of fs?


    thx
    Because BT generates more rage, which will help you get back to Rampage faster and have to use FS less.

  20. #60
    So if I primarily play M+ instead of raids and focus more on an aoe build, are those still the optimal legendaries?
    Or is it gonna stay helm + belt? (I have all legendaries now so swapping to bis isn't a problem)
    Last edited by Kazlofski; 2017-12-02 at 12:52 PM.

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