Self-defense, what do you recommend?

[Shiny212]

Well, if they are not available for most people, then it is not a realistic choice for self defense outside your home. So her point for the most part, as a choice for self defense, is correct.

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Would depend on which study you want to believe is true and also, what you own bias are. I can link other studies which would refute the ones you linked.

..a study that has any of the meaning behind the word isn't for you to "believe" in. It's fact. Only 1 of the studies with opposing viewpoints is valid, and I'd be willing to bet everything I own that you are on the wrong side. But of course, guns and your need to have the biggest most deadly ones borders on religion in the US. I don't expect you to be reasonable, so do us all a favour and stop pretending you are.

The AR- 14 or 15 is a good home defense weapon. Esp if you are dealing with multiple targets.

Lol! The tank would be only good if you keep it maintained and in running order, which would be expensive and for running over things. It is not legal to have the ammo and the tank to be fully combat ready for private ownership.

Maybe if you live in Baghdad, suburban US? Not so much. It's the number 1 choice of mass murderers. MAYBE you should do some long hard thinking.

[Player Twelve]

Firearms are totally allowed and legal here if you get the proper training and permits, most people are just not allowed to carry concealed handguns in the streets.

Outside of hunting and sports shooting it's very hard to get hold of a permit and a gun. You'll have to be in a very vulnerable position to be allowed to get one for self-defense purposes.

[Ghostpanther]

Yes, no doubt. I just wanted to point out that guns are as a matter of fact not illegal in Sweden even tho people seem to claim that all the time for some odd reason. Just cause there isn't a (legal) local gunstore in every other corner of the hood. You can own almost limitless amounts of rifles and handguns if you just do it properly.

For self defence? Don't be there if probably the best idea. If that isn't an option unless you are a fighter just give them your damn wallet and then leave unless you figure it's worth dying for.

If that is all they want. Yeah. But I am not going to wait around and see if it is. So they better make it known fast and clearly that is all they want.

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we'll let the courts decide that.

The law already has.

[Deleted]

Yes, no doubt. I just wanted to point out that guns are as a matter of fact not illegal in Sweden even tho people seem to claim that all the time for some odd reason. Just cause there isn't a (legal) local gunstore in every other corner of the hood. You can own almost limitless amounts of rifles and handguns if you just do it properly.

Yeah, I should have been more specific. My bad. I am aware that you can legally obtain them, however, not really readily and it's a comparably lengthy process (having to be a member of a shooting club for a whole while in most cases). For most people, it's not an option like it is in the US.

[breadisfunny]

If that is all they want. Yeah. But I am not going to wait around and see if it is. So they better make it known fast and clearly that is all they want.

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The law already has.

well im gonna set a precedent.

[Ghostpanther]

..a study that has any of the meaning behind the word isn't for you to "believe" in. It's fact. Only 1 of the studies with opposing viewpoints is valid, and I'd be willing to bet everything I own that you are on the wrong side. But of course, guns and your need to have the biggest most deadly ones borders on religion in the US. I don't expect you to be reasonable, so do us all a favour and stop pretending you are.



Maybe if you live in Baghdad, suburban US? Not so much. It's the number 1 choice of mass murderers. MAYBE you should do some long hard thinking.

Look first off, if you want to have a good respectful discussion, then stop with the personal attacks. It is fine to say you disagree and then show why. I respect that. I have been wrong before and will in the future. Those I respect have given me some good food for thought at times and even changed my opinion on occasion.

I can take the time to link some studies which back up my points. But I am sure it would be dismissed by those with your stance and attitude. Plus like I said before, the statistics for such studies are assuming you fall into a certain category.

That is totally false.The number one choice is the handgun.

[XDurionX]

If that is all they want. Yeah. But I am not going to wait around and see if it is. So they better make it known fast and clearly that is all they want.

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The law already has.

Do you really think people run around murdering random people they encounter where you live? A gun escalates every situation, and CREATES lethal situations. It doesn't combat them. If you present someone with a lethal threat, he in turn thinks he has to resort to violence to protect his own life. It is BY FAR more likely to create an undesired outcome than to save someone. Gun owners have this weird fantasy of turning into John McClane to save the day, this never happens. If someone has to reckon with potential lethal threats, he will bring lethal threats himself. Guns don't save anyone, they just harm everyone.

[ParanoiD84]

Outside of hunting and sports shooting it's very hard to get hold of a permit and a gun. You'll have to be in a very vulnerable position to be allowed to get one for self-defense purposes.

Yeah you need to been in a sport shooting club for 6 months before even trying to apply for a permit.

[Deleted]

Most self defence courses are a complete scam, if you want to fight them without a weapon then choose a real full contact martial art such as boxing, Judo or Muay Thai. You need sparring and constant practice to stay competitive which is something you cannot get from those shot courses that are usually aimed at women.

[Shiny212]

Look first off, if you want to have a good respectful discussion, then stop with the personal attacks. It is fine to say you disagree and then show why. I respect that. I have been wrong before and will in the future. Those I respect have given me some good food for thought at times and even changed my opinion on occasion.

I can take the time to link some studies which back up my points. But I am sure it would be dismissed by those with your stance and attitude. Plus like I said before, the statistics for such studies are assuming you fall into a certain category.

That is totally false.The number one choice is the handgun.

You just summarily dismissed a perfectly valid study based on your stance and attitude because you believe other studies will somehow refute it? Point to where the science was faulty, please. Otherwise it's accepted scientific fact.

Referring to mass murders of incredible magnitude. The aforementioned weapon is a wildly popular choice due to its ability to inflict massive casualties handguns couldn't dream of. But as you say, the bigger the gun, the better it is for home defense right? Never mind the very real consequences of having such weapons in civilian hands.

[Deleted]

Have you honestly been in a situation that required you to have a weapon? If not, then why now? Pepper spray or a taser should probably do for now, please don't go buying and carrying a handgun without knowing exactly where your limits are, as using it safely and efficiently isn't just something you pick up over a weekend.
If you don't know what you're doing with it, you're more likely to shoot yourself, someone unintended, getting yourself shot by someone else, or simply have it taken away from you. Also, maintaining those skills will require ongoing training. Just know where you're going and don't make stupid decisions - that minimizes most of the risk.

[XDurionX]

This is factually untrue.

It is not, there's in fact overwhelming scientific evidence. Some gun owners are just antiintellectual. I respect your wish to carry a gun, it's just unreasonable to think it may help you someday. It takes a lot of training and responsibility to employ a weapon in the right way. Vast majority of gun owners have neither the training nor the experience. Even cops with years of training make a lot of mistakes. To think you could scare off a potential attacker when your surprised and/or overwhelmed is just fiction. As others have said, the best protection is situational awareness at all times. Not a pound of metal on your belt.

[Gaaz]

All that macho talk about best guns and whatnot... You might as well discuss what color furry dice should hang from your rear view mirror so as to reduce the likelihood of a car crash. It does not take much research to find that:
a) your chances of successfully neutralizing an attacker with your gun are close to 1%. Some researchers put that number as low as 0.25%. Most optimistic are at 2%. I do not like those odds personally.
b) more than half of self defense gun usages are illegal and will land you in jail. Basically, having self defense guns creates gun violence, not avoids it. Again, multiple studies.
c) having a gun ESCALATES, not deescalates conflict. About half of those convicted for shooting during armed assault claimed that they shot because the victim had a gun and they were acting in self defense ("Under the gun: weapons, crime and violence in America." Wright JD, Rossi PH, Daly K.)
Especially important is the last point. Even if you are the extremely lucky / proficient / competent gun owner from the 1% group that has a chance to use the gun in response, you are basically twice as likely to get shot if you try to use it.
Yes, I am anti gun. Stan Smith was wrong. Guns do not protect people from other people with smaller guns. They paint a target on you that makes you about twice as likely to get shot.
If you are worried about general robberies or sexual assaults - get a pepper spray.

[Shiny212]

It is not, there's in fact overwhelming scientific evidence. Some gun owners are just antiintellectual. I respect your wish to carry a gun, it's just unreasonable to think it may help you someday. It takes a lot of training and responsibility to employ a weapon in the right way. Vast majority of gun owners have neither the training nor the experience. Even cops with years of training make a lot of mistakes. To think you could scare off a potential attacker when your surprised and/or overwhelmed is just fiction. As others have said, the best protection is situational awareness at all times. Not a pound of metal on your belt.

The scary part that police training is less than stellar in the US; not the only country to have that issue, but opposed to say the UK, they put guns in their hands and fail to teach them DE-escalation, resulting in thousands upon thousands of police shootings that don't occur anywhere else in the world. Criminals are somehow so much worse in the US that you need to shoot them dead twice as much.

[Ghostpanther]

You just summarily dismissed a perfectly valid study based on your stance and attitude because you believe other studies will somehow refute it? Point to where the science was faulty, please. Otherwise it's accepted scientific fact.

Referring to mass murders of incredible magnitude. The aforementioned weapon is a wildly popular choice due to its ability to inflict massive casualties handguns couldn't dream of. But as you say, the bigger the gun, the better it is for home defense right? Never mind the very real consequences of having such weapons in civilian hands.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/cr...rticle/2542118 this was my point. Most mass shootings are with handguns. Granted, the latest ones the shooters did use the AR-15. But it is false to say it is the weapon most likely to be used.

I can dismiss any study which assumes I fit their subject study.

Yes, it is a good weapon for home defense for the same reason it is a good choice to kill multiple people. For a single intruder, it is overkill. But if several are involved. It can be very effective. They are not going away. Same as other deaths from non firearms, is not going to stop the methods causing them to disappear. Some laws dealing with them, such as the bump stocks should be done however. Stronger enforcement and more effective background checks need to be done. The one shooter in Texas is a prime example of that.

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Do you really think people run around murdering random people they encounter where you live? A gun escalates every situation, and CREATES lethal situations. It doesn't combat them. If you present someone with a lethal threat, he in turn thinks he has to resort to violence to protect his own life. It is BY FAR more likely to create an undesired outcome than to save someone. Gun owners have this weird fantasy of turning into John McClane to save the day, this never happens. If someone has to reckon with potential lethal threats, he will bring lethal threats himself. Guns don't save anyone, they just harm everyone.

That is false. Do some research on the cases of people using a firearm successfully in self defense. YouTube has a lot of them.

[Shiny212]

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/cr...rticle/2542118 this was my point. Most mass shootings are with handguns. Granted, the latest ones the shooters did use the AR-15. But it is false to say it is the weapon most likely to be used.

I can dismiss any study which assumes I fit their subject study.

Yes, it is a good weapon for home defense for the same reason it is a good choice to kill multiple people. For a single intruder, it is overkill. But if several are involved. It can be very effective. They are not going away. Same as other deaths from non firearms, is not going to stop the methods causing them to disappear. Some laws dealing with them, such as the bump stocks should be done however. Stronger enforcement and more effective background checks need to be done. The one shooter in Texas is a prime example of that.

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That is false. Do some research on the cases of people using a firearm successfully in self defense. YouTube has a lot of them.

You must understand, the way you're talking about guns, is completely unthinkable to anyone not living there. We don't understand how you can think like this. Our impulse IF we were one of the extremely unlucky ones to be home-invaded by actual armed assailants bent on doing us harm, is to CALL THE POLICE, not assassinate them all with the most lethal weapon we can conceive of. Well trained police officers see, can handle the situation a bzillion times better than you, with more intelligent end goals.

The study didn't assume anything about you, it had a hypothesis and gathered data to come to a conclusion, you disagree with the conclusion because "you're a model gun-owner" therefore the system shouldn't change, even if the study proves it isn't serving society well, to hell with society right, it's your personal ability to shoot bad guys that matters.

[XDurionX]

The scary part that police training is less than stellar in the US; not the only country to have that issue, but opposed to say the UK, they put guns in their hands and fail to teach them DE-escalation, resulting in thousands upon thousands of police shootings that don't occur anywhere else in the world. Criminals are somehow so much worse in the US that you need to shoot them dead twice as much.

I really don't think the training is worse in the US, it's just that guns aren't as prevalent in other countries. It is a very rare occasion for a police officer to have to draw - let alone fire - a gun in most of europe. This is very different in the US where every passer by has the possibility of employing lethal force. What most people don't understand is that if you regulate guns for the law abiding citizens, it makes it way harder to get illegal guns as well. Germany for example has 1/3 of the guns in the US (0.3 per capita vs 0.9-1.0 per capita in the US), but we only have 1/15th of per capita firearm deaths. This is a complex problem that cannot be explained by gun ownership alone, yet it is a huge contributing factor.

[Talon8669]

I realized the other day that I haven't carried any sort of self-defense since I lived in Chicago, and that I really should start carrying something to protect myself and my very wimpy 70-lb Golden Retriever when we are on walks. Just in case.

What sort of self defense weapon do you recommend overall, and why?

https://www.range365.com/best-self-defense-handgun
http://www.selfdefenseninja.com/
https://www.asecurelife.com/self-defense-without-a-gun/

I'd like to take some classes on how to shoot one day (I grew up in AK and it's a bit shameful that I don't know how to shoot), but if I do it would likely be for rifle use for hunting game rather than self-defense.

Honestly I would recommend (2) options done together. First take self defense courses; good knowledge, they will help you in high stress situations to calm your nerves and its good exercise at the least. Secondly I would carry a hand gun, get your concealed permit and leave it in a case in your vehicles. This way if you have the incline that you want to carry it's there and you can. But please for the love of god, if you're ever pulled over by a police officer, disclose the weapon to them and identify where it's located.

[shadowmouse]

Otherwise it's accepted scientific fact.

No, it is a study. Studies do tend to vary on a wide range of conditions. Over the years I have been regularly informed coffee is either going to kill me or it is great for me. The same goes for eggs, salt and a host of other things. There is a reason for the saying that there are lies, damned lies and statistics.

Referring to mass murders of incredible magnitude. The aforementioned weapon is a wildly popular choice due to its ability to inflict massive casualties handguns couldn't dream of. But as you say, the bigger the gun, the better it is for home defense right?

He didn't say that. Think what you will, but that isn't a particularly big gun. It is fairly light, has a wide assortment of accessories that are easily mounted, is easily learned, and easily controlled. That adds up to being a good weapon for home defense.

How popular it is for mayhem doesn't really mean much either. Look at the rise of trucks as weapons. I may recall a few airplanes too. I live in a somewhat controlled environment for firearms. Guess what? Criminals still get them. Guns get stolen, there are ghost guns, there are even garage guns. Tricky thing about nut jobs and criminals, they don't really let inconvenient laws get in their way if it can be avoided.

[ParanoiD84]

That is false. Do some research on the cases of people using a firearm successfully in self defense. YouTube has a lot of them.

Indeed i like the active self defense guy on youtube tons of videos from around the world where guns save their life.