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  1. #1

    Is the t21 4pc just awful?

    I've been running sims because there's a good chance I'll pick up at least heroic ilevel 4pc this week, but by far my best set seems to be 4pc t20 and 2pc t21.

    This seems really weird to me. For example, taking off power cord and putting eternal disdain on + putting 945 t21 pants/shoulders/chest/cloak is a 3.4% downgrade over just using 4pc t20 and 2pc t21.

    And this is even more weird to me because 2 of my t20 pieces are only ilevel 920.
    Last edited by asil; 2017-11-29 at 11:18 PM.

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by asil View Post
    This seems really weird to me. For example, taking off power cord and putting eternal disdain on + putting 945 t21 pants/shoulders/chest/cloak is a 3.4% downgrade over just using 4pc t20 and 2pc t21.
    Are you sure this isn't because of the legendaries? Most Antorus-level sims show Helm + Belt as BiS for ST, I'd suggest you try and see how that works out with your tier.

    As always, individual results may not be simply transferable. It's very possible specific setups sim in ways that favor a different combination, but that doesn't mean it'll hold true for everyone, or forever.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    Are you sure this isn't because of the legendaries? Most Antorus-level sims show Helm + Belt as BiS for ST, I'd suggest you try and see how that works out with your tier.

    As always, individual results may not be simply transferable. It's very possible specific setups sim in ways that favor a different combination, but that doesn't mean it'll hold true for everyone, or forever.
    Yeah, but the sims aren't looking at old tier and comparing it to the new tier. I went ahead and simmed another aff warlock in my guild, and then simmed other geared aff warlocks I found around org and the same exact thing was true.

    Even with all legendaries at ilevel 1000. I think 4pc t20 is just insanely good with 2pc t21 right now which makes me believe it'll likely be nerfed.

    After looking around the warlock discord, it seems other people think the same thing. Kind of depressing.

  4. #4
    The Insane Taftvalue's Avatar
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    Yes it is. 4p t20 and 2p t21 is the way to go.
    We must reject the idea that every time a law's broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions.
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  5. #5
    For now yes 6 piece tier. Eventually any T20 nerfs and the sheer item level gain on T21 will probably win out.

  6. #6
    Yes, after the nerf of T20 4p (cause t20 2p is already a joke) we are gonna use T21 4p + 2 good non-set items (chest / head)

  7. #7
    aim for titanforged t20 and give the middle finger to t21

  8. #8
    yeah Ill have to wait and see with more gear how my stat weights will go but with my current gear my Ilvl 915 T20 is better itemized than 960 T21. they reworked the stats on all the gear taking a lot of haste away. I'm currently using 4p t20 and 2p t21 and sims higher than 2p t20 with 4p t21.

    I had decent parses on our normal clear, going back to heroic later this week

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/charact...orms/kiramouse

    Edit: yes I use Prydaz, I don't have helm or belt yet, was main-ing DEMO for all of NH and about half of ToS
    Last edited by Kiramouse; 2017-11-30 at 01:20 PM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Kiramouse View Post
    yeah Ill have to wait and see with more gear how my stat weights will go but with my current gear my Ilvl 915 T20 is better itemized than 960 T21. they reworked the stats on all the gear taking a lot of haste away. I'm currently using 4p t20 and 2p t21 and sims higher than 2p t20 with 4p t21.

    I had decent parses on our normal clear, going back to heroic later this week

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/charact...orms/kiramouse

    Edit: yes I use Prydaz, I don't have helm or belt yet, was main-ing DEMO for all of NH and about half of ToS
    Sucks doesn't it? I've mained Affliction since 7.1.5 and i still don't have the belt...only got helm like a month ago.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Shodan30 View Post
    Sucks doesn't it? I've mained Affliction since 7.1.5 and i still don't have the belt...only got helm like a month ago.
    You must not play the game AT ALL, because 7.1.5 is around the time I started came back to WoW and I'm already on my 3rd random legendary alt token thing.

  11. #11
    While i don't play casually as often as i did since 7.3 came out (Guild broke up), I'm still raiding weekly and before that i was playing every day (Artifact is at 71st level). I've gotten hood, reap and sow, Prydez, Sephz, foresight, Sacrolash, burning wish, harvester, Fos, Magistrike. It took friggin forever to get an affliction legendary once i switched and they were usually the crappy ones.

  12. #12
    I'm getting a legendary every 4-5 days now since argus patch, I don't even step into LFR or old raids, but I do every invasion when it pops, clear every AP WQ and run maybe 5-10 m+ per week and every emissary.

  13. #13
    i got today the 4 piece of t21, and changed 4 t20 +2 t21 by 2 t20 + 4 t21 and im loosing 45 k dps, after t20 nerf.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Athalon View Post
    i got today the 4 piece of t21, and changed 4 t20 +2 t21 by 2 t20 + 4 t21 and im loosing 45 k dps, after t20 nerf.
    All depends on what gear you have, at which ilvl, etc.

  15. #15
    Got T21 4p today, swapped some gear around and gained ~200k dps.
    I'm now simming 1.85 million dps using Belt and Netherlord.

    Waiting to get set gloves(using head) and my sim skyrockets to 1.88 million.
    Simmed 1.62 earlier when I used t20 4p and t21 2p.

    Tried out the damage difference and easily outperformed my last performances in the top 100 affli lock parses for normal when RNG was 'normal' and I didn't mess up.
    Last edited by Deadandlivin; 2017-12-07 at 05:11 AM.

  16. #16
    Got T21 4p and it's working well for me since I had very low ilvl stuff for T20. Also, it looks like Siphon Life is simming higher for me than Soul Conduit. That happening with anybody else?

    On raid bots I compared MG, Contagion, Soul Harvest and Soul Conduit against MG, Contagion, Soul Harvest and Siphon Life and Siphon Life was 1.1% ahead of it. Not much but I'm kind of excited about bringing back siphon life! This happen to anybody else?

  17. #17
    Stood in the Fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thalem View Post
    Got T21 4p and it's working well for me since I had very low ilvl stuff for T20. Also, it looks like Siphon Life is simming higher for me than Soul Conduit. That happening with anybody else?

    On raid bots I compared MG, Contagion, Soul Harvest and Soul Conduit against MG, Contagion, Soul Harvest and Siphon Life and Siphon Life was 1.1% ahead of it. Not much but I'm kind of excited about bringing back siphon life! This happen to anybody else?
    SL is boosted by T21 4p, so SL > SC, unless maybe you run into too many targets to keep up. But then AC might help. SL vs SC already was pretty close with T20, only SC is RNG so can go higher with proper RNG.

  18. #18
    It seems like this is a trend across almost all classes, that the t21 set bonuses are worse than the t20.

    It's the same as when they nerfed Demonology warlocks to the ground at WoD, so that they could change them to whatever they want. Same here, the tier sets are going to go in BfA, so they nerf them so that we might not even use them until we have the next expansion.

  19. #19
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    As much as the T21 4p is lack luster for ST sims it is still now better with the T20 4p nerf and factoring in ilvl. What people seem to be ignoring however is in antorus only 3 fights are actually mainly single target the rest are cleave and aoe where not only the spec shines but makes the 4p fucking amazing.

    We are not even doing that badly in those ST fights either as they have a healthy amount of movement bar Varimarthas, so when you get the 2p you will immediatley gain dps because of ilvl(bar lucky t20 TF) as the 2p is now better than the t20 4p on ST.

    If i have to be mediocre for 25% of the fights but a fucking monster for 75% of the rest of them, i'm gonna be a happy warlock.

    Go look at logs for those with the 4p bonus if you don't agree, the number speak for themselves
    Last edited by Osanger; 2017-12-07 at 04:00 PM.

  20. #20
    I wouldn't really classify Portal Keeper as AoE, and you're not AoEing at Argus unless the secret mythic phase has adds, so it's more like 5 fights are ST

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