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  1. #61
    Pit Lord Detheavn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rarhyx View Post
    isn'T that almost the same as blade of justice with blade of wrath talent now?
    I'm talking from a visuals perspective. The blades coming from the ground have always been weird to me :|

  2. #62
    I wish they would "Fix" all the specs to where they played really good and then just let the chips fall where they may. This whole new class every expansion isn't really what people look forward to.
    Me thinks Chromie has a whole lot of splaining to do!

  3. #63
    I really love the Legion retri.... it's my favourite so far and I've been playing Ret since 3.2 :3

    It just feels so smooth and also powerful at the same time.
    Quote Originally Posted by Duravian View Post
    You say humble, I say beaten. These guys used to make games and then show us. If we liked it or not, they were still in control. Now we've got them beaten at every corner - Twitter, MMO-C, the wow forums, the infinite mmo news sites, etc. Blizzard has nowhere left to turn, they have been properly subdued by the ravenous consumers that we've become.
    Quote Originally Posted by Axcel View Post
    Oh the titans, the Forums are leaking again.

  4. #64
    Scarab Lord Schattenlied's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    I prefer the missile version honestly, it's just a visually improved Hammer of Wrath though.
    I honestly dislike the graphic... Feels like a worse HoW to me... I feel like I'm throwing a fluffy hammer at people, it's much slower moving, overly spinny, overly "poofy" with the spell effects coming off of it. The HoW animation from WoD felt final, it was fast, it looked like it hit hard and the sound was just so much better.
    A gun is like a parachute. If you need one, and don’t have one, you’ll probably never need one again.

  5. #65
    Only thing I really miss from previous Ret is ranged spells and instant nuke heals that heal for like 50% of someone's health.

    Otherwise I don't miss it. I hated that I couldn't do anything outside of cooldowns outside of being a poor man's healer. This is coming from someone who mained Ret from Cata through WoD. Only reason I don't main it now is because I discovered Mage and Warrior.
    "If I don't understand it, it's wrong."

  6. #66
    Scarab Lord Schattenlied's Avatar
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    I honestly can't look at this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmbZmbklSkY and say we have it better now than we did back then... We have no more defensives now than we did then, we have less mobility, no HP generation from range, less self/off healing, lost Hammer of Wrath... no way in high heaven someone would live through what he does at the start of this video on Legion Ret.

    I would take WoD Ret back in a god damn heartbeat over this steaming pile of crap we have now... Of all the classes that got massive revamps in Legion (that's pretty much all of them), we were probly one of the ones least in need of it, if at all... a couple tweaks could have fixed any problems we had.
    Last edited by Schattenlied; 2017-12-07 at 07:51 AM.
    A gun is like a parachute. If you need one, and don’t have one, you’ll probably never need one again.

  7. #67
    While HoW was nice and cool it created a big problem when paired with Wings, as Wings is a very very big dmg increase which gave you access to a very high dmg, HoPo range generator. Add the haste from Crusade .. and it will be a nightmare to balance.

    Do you want to go back to the times when you were god with Wings up and hit like a wet noodle outside it?? DH had this issue with the CD stacking build, Fury warrs have this issue

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Detheavn View Post
    The blades coming from the ground have always been weird to me :|
    from a paladin perspective it should be blade coming from above..."from the heaven" so to call imo
    When scum rules the world only more scum are born...

  9. #69
    Herald of the Titans Thyr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ashgaan View Post
    Do you want to go back to the times when you were god with Wings up and hit like a wet noodle outside it??
    This is happening already....
    It's high noon.
    Personality: INTJ

  10. #70
    My paladin has been my main since I rolled it in BC, and at this point I'm having to force myself to play him. I got so fed up with it I started bouncing around to my never played 110 alts, which only made it that much worse. Besides our low damage, we are this crappy combination between Arms and a rogue. My arms warrior was one of the alts I bounced over to playing, and the gameplay felt miles better. I bounce over to my Outlaw rogue, and while my damage is shit on that toon, even it was more enjoyable that playing Ret in it's current state. I don't understand why blizzard can't figure out that you can't design a spec as a slow building combo point and have a short duration debuff window as well. Then you throw in the fact that until you reach a certain haste point, the playstyle is clunky and just annoying. And when you do reach that haste point, nearly every drop you get comes with a huge decision if you want to gain dps and lose the somewhat smoother gameplay you currently have.

    Such a sad state to be in.

  11. #71
    I miss seals and auras

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by ONCHEhap View Post
    I miss seals and auras
    and the buffs , WoW paladin is for me all about, seals, auras and blessings(buffs and not the infight things)
    When scum rules the world only more scum are born...

  13. #73
    Scarab Lord Schattenlied's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ashgaan View Post
    While HoW was nice and cool it created a big problem when paired with Wings, as Wings is a very very big dmg increase which gave you access to a very high dmg, HoPo range generator. Add the haste from Crusade .. and it will be a nightmare to balance.

    Do you want to go back to the times when you were god with Wings up and hit like a wet noodle outside it?? DH had this issue with the CD stacking build, Fury warrs have this issue
    HoW doesn't automatically need to be paired with wings, that didn't start until Cataclysm... HoW existed as a pure execute perfectly fine until then, it could do so again.

    All they need to do if HoW is put back in is simply make it ONLY an execute, not enabled whenever wings are up. And surprise surprise, that was the only rotational change needed to make WoD Ret "more melee focused"... They should have just done that, and then rebalanced our damage around it, and we would have been perfect for Legion.
    Last edited by Schattenlied; 2017-12-07 at 06:37 PM.
    A gun is like a parachute. If you need one, and don’t have one, you’ll probably never need one again.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by rarhyx View Post
    isn'T that almost the same as blade of justice with blade of wrath talent now?
    The fact we have to talent into what was a baseline function of an objectively-better functioning ability (30 yard range before vs 12 now) is so stupid. Having to talent into Consecration is stupid, but they just couldn't "waste" anymore time giving Ret more real talents to choose from after they gave most of them to Holy, some to Prot and others just poofing out of existence.

  15. #75
    Scarab Lord Schattenlied's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reith View Post
    The fact we have to talent into what was a baseline function of an objectively-better functioning ability (30 yard range before vs 12 now) is so stupid. Having to talent into Consecration is stupid, but they just couldn't "waste" anymore time giving Ret more real talents to choose from after they gave most of them to Holy, some to Prot and others just poofing out of existence.
    all of this... They just took a bunch of stuff we should have had baseline and made them into talents, and then took talents we used to have that were good, like Execution Sentence, which people loved, and then made them into worse, one dimensional versions of themselves for no reason at all, instead of just leaving them alone..
    A gun is like a parachute. If you need one, and don’t have one, you’ll probably never need one again.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Ashgaan View Post
    While HoW was nice and cool it created a big problem when paired with Wings, as Wings is a very very big dmg increase which gave you access to a very high dmg, HoPo range generator. Add the haste from Crusade .. and it will be a nightmare to balance.

    Do you want to go back to the times when you were god with Wings up and hit like a wet noodle outside it?? DH had this issue with the CD stacking build, Fury warrs have this issue
    I'll take HoW over Crusade.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dextroden View Post
    You are a carbon copy of what you long so hard to fight in the streets. An extremist. Someone so desperate for strife to prove you are the ubermensch, err, Real American.

    Alt lite. Sounds like you're having an alt fright. Unable to sleep at alt night. Maybe you should relax and fly an alt kite. Go down to the diner for an alt bite. You shouldn't be treating people with alt spite. Eventually, everything will be alt right.

  17. #77
    I have played Mage (fire and arcane), Hunter (all 3), Warrior (Fury), Paladin (Ret/Holy) and Shaman (Enhance) and I have to agree.

    Mage is okay, not really worse gameplay wise.
    Hunter is total shit, all 3 specs feel worse than pre-Legion, Survival is the worst of the 3.
    Warrior Fury felt okay, but too reliant on the Artifact for AoE.
    Paladin Holy is decent fun wise. Ret is completely garbage and I even did WQ as Holy even though it was slower.
    Shaman Enhancement is the only specc I would rate as a big step up, it is just better overall and more fun to play. They should KEEP it. But I know they will kill it again, as tradition.

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Schattenlied View Post
    all of this... They just took a bunch of stuff we should have had baseline and made them into talents, and then took talents we used to have that were good, like Execution Sentence, which people loved, and then made them into worse, one dimensional versions of themselves for no reason at all, instead of just leaving them alone..
    They really wouldn't have to do much work. Bring back the talents they removed, re-buff the talents they made worse, bring back Seals, bring back some baseline abilities.. if they figure out a new thing to do and it works, cool, but the ideas are really all there in past expansions.

  19. #79
    I played Prot/Ret all the way from vanilla till Cataclysm, from the 1 button seal smashing, to the Divine Storm-rage with Shadowmourne of WotLK to the expansion where they introduced Holy Power. After I got used to the holy power I really liked it. But now that I'm playing Legion again, it's terrible. It just doesn't feel right. Sure, it's nice when you can chain some good spells within the Judgment window, but I really hate the playstyle based around this judgement-window and Crusade.

    Then I found out that they removed Holy Power for Holy and Prot Paladins, great. Prot is fun, and will do fine for questing. Tanking raids seems very dull now though, with the removal of many spells. However holy seems fun enough to be raiding with.

    So after putting billions of AP in ret, I found out that nothing has changed over the years: Ret paladins are just not required or desired in PvE content. It's always been like that. Sure, in WotLK the divine storm procs did some good DPS, but we were still behind other melee. I guess I'll just have to leave Ashbringer at home and gather AP for Holy and Prot.

    The good thing about ret which I found out, the spec will clearly separate the good players from the bad. They're either doing decent DPS, or they're barely able to keep up with the tank's DPS.

    Haven't tried PVP though, but I'm guessing Holy would also be more fun/wanted in than Ret, in battlegrounds for instance?
    Last edited by Revved; 2017-12-09 at 09:49 AM.

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Detheavn View Post
    I'm talking from a visuals perspective. The blades coming from the ground have always been weird to me :|
    I actually agree with this one. The animation has bothered me but i just kinda made peace with it.

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