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  1. #161
    These addons try to mean well in solving elitist attitudes to ilvl, but they always end up resulting in higher levels of toxic attitude by the community when wannabe elitists try to hold people to a standard they can't reach. Like gearscore
    Last edited by Shammyrock; 2017-12-05 at 05:51 PM.

  2. #162
    Level your own keystone and make your own groups then. They can't kick you out when you're the leader with the key.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    Having the authority to do a thing doesn't make it just, moral, or even correct.

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by yolock View Post
    I have been playing M+ here and there, usually with friends and too high keystones knowing that we may not actually not be able to complete the dungeon but who cares it was for fun.
    Congratulations, you've unlocked the hidden "this is the fucking point of playing in the first place" achievement. Anything else is a waste of time, including the cancer-ridden group finder.

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by Protean View Post
    Is it hard to understand that his data is his data, while also being Blizzard's data? I don't follow why I can't say "his data" without you thinking I mean his literal property and not just a collection he produced.

    Again, I don't see why my play history is anyone's business. Or experience, or achievements. I don't understand why this information needs to be accessible to anyone to begin with or why you think it's your right to look me up. I have nothing to be ashamed of, but I also don't think it's your right to snoop.

    Please understand that I have a right to disagree with a decision Blizzard made, without having to quit over it.
    so you think the armory, wowprogress, warcraftlogs, worldoflogs and raider io are all equally unfair, right?

  5. #165
    They should absolutely ban this imo. There is a reason they deleted Gearscore from the game.

  6. #166
    I don't see how it's any different than ilvl requirements or "link curve".

  7. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by Dizzeeyooo View Post
    so you think the armory, wowprogress, warcraftlogs, worldoflogs and raider io are all equally unfair, right?
    No, use them all you want. I just don't care and don't want to be part of the insanity. Part of that opinion is that I don't want to support it, by providing data that you don't in any way or shape need.

    If it were possible to elect out of armory I would, and I wouldn't for a second complain about people not bringing me because they can't look me up.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Antiganon View Post
    You are playing a multiplayer game. You are talking about taking part in a group based, highly competitive aspect of this multiplayer game.

    Naturally, competitive players want to make sure they have every advantage possible - including skilled teammates. People are going to want you to provide some sort of proof that you are as skilled as you say you are. If you don't want to do that, that is your decision, just as it is their decision not to invite you.

    The only way that Blizzard could make things like this addon go away would be to remove publicly displayed achievements (which most players won't want - people like to show off their accomplishments), remove the ability to inspect other players (again, they probably won't, it has been in since Classic), or remove the ability for players to do math (obviously they can't remove math).

    People will always find a way to make their group more exclusive. You can either adjust yourself so that you fit the exclusive criteria being requested, or you can start your own group with your own requirements.
    I think you're overestimating the competitive nature of snoozefest m+15.

  8. #168
    Mechagnome Xenyatta's Avatar
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    And this is one of the many reasons I hardly ever do M+ and the sole reason I will never pug. If I want to do a 15, I just check with who is running what in my guild and jump in. SO much easier with way less angst.

  9. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by Protean View Post
    It's not a right to look up people's accounts. It's no different than saying you have a right to know which one of your friends is online and they don't have a right to appear offline.
    You literally just proved my point. They have the right to appear offline like we have the right to know the skill and experience of a player before inviting them. Fine ill meet you halfway. Everyone has the option to share there data or not.

    So obviously only the good people will more then likely show theres and that bad people wont. Awsome.

  10. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by Scornedfury View Post
    You literally just proved my point. They have the right to appear offline like we have the right to know the skill and experience of a player before inviting them. Fine ill meet you halfway. Everyone has the option to share there data or not.

    So obviously only the good people will more then likely show theres and that bad people wont. Awsome.
    I didn't prove your point, you cannot have more right to information than someone has a right to hide same information, as long as it is benign like in a videogame. I never advocated removal of armory. Just being able to opt out of it so there is no halfway for my side.

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by micwini View Post
    They should absolutely ban this imo. There is a reason they deleted Gearscore from the game.
    They deleted GS because they basically incorporated it via visible ilvl. Exorsus raid tool (and similiar addons) still do that sort of thing + much more in terms of gear checking.

  12. #172
    Quote Originally Posted by Alphatorg View Post
    Again failing to grasp the point. Even a "good" player who doesn't know the instances, pulls, how hard stuff hits is still a burden most of the time. And if you don't care about M+ why does M+ score bother you?
    YOU fail to grasp the point. Someone who doesn't care about timers isn't picky about what groups they join. Meaning their score is completely untied to how well they know the dungeon.
    This whole M+ scene is nothing but tryhards who can't raid. The addon is nothing but people joining a clique, THAT'S IT.

    At the least the addon shouldn't collect the score of people who aren't using it, and tbh it shouldn't be usable on keys below 16.
    Last edited by Dormie; 2017-12-05 at 08:29 PM.

  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by Protean View Post
    That's not what he's asking though. The point is he wants the ability to opt out of retarded elitism by having his data hidden. Who owns said data and who has the right doesn't change the argument, that opting out is desired by some people. Myself included.
    Exactly! The point is that there are a MILLION times to present data, and some ways can make you look DECEPTIVELY bad.

  14. #174
    Quote Originally Posted by Phumbles View Post
    YOU fail to grasp the point. Someone who doesn't care about timers isn't picky about what groups they join. Meaning their score is completely untied to how well they know the dungeon.
    This whole M+ scene is nothing but tryhards who can't raid. The addon is nothing but people joining a clique, THAT'S IT.

    At the least the addon shouldn't collect the score of people who aren't using it, and tbh it shouldn't be usable on keys below 16.
    If you don't care about "timers", don't care about M+, don't care about what group you join how does M+ score even affect you?
    I'm also not sure if you understand how M+ score works. To know a high level dungeon you have to actually run it and if you run it your M+ score goes up, so it's actually the opposite of what you think. M+Score is directly tied to your level of knowledge/experience.

    I'd also suggest you clear a mythic raid, because you tell people that they "can't raid".

  15. #175
    Quote Originally Posted by Alphatorg View Post
    If you don't care about "timers", don't care about M+, don't care about what group you join how does M+ score even affect you?
    I'm also not sure if you understand how M+ score works. To know a high level dungeon you have to actually run it and if you run it your M+ score goes up, so it's actually the opposite of what you think. M+Score is directly tied to your level of knowledge/experience.

    I'd also suggest you clear a mythic raid, because you tell people that they "can't raid".
    There's a significant difference between "making it on time" and "OMG WE WERE 1 MINUTE SLOWER THAN THE AVERAGE TIME FOR BADASS PLAYERS WTF YOU SUCK GUYS". Not caring about beating arbitrary timers does not exclude caring about succeeding on time.

  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by Protean View Post
    There's a significant difference between "making it on time" and "OMG WE WERE 1 MINUTE SLOWER THAN THE AVERAGE TIME FOR BADASS PLAYERS WTF YOU SUCK GUYS". Not caring about beating arbitrary timers does not exclude caring about succeeding on time.
    What are you even talking about.

  17. #177
    Quote Originally Posted by Alphatorg View Post
    What are you even talking about.
    You said people who don't care about timers shouldn't care about m+. I'm saying it isn't binary and there's a whole spectrum in between being happy you made it in time to not be punished, and wanting to be cutting edge.

  18. #178
    Quote Originally Posted by Protean View Post
    You said people who don't care about timers shouldn't care about m+. I'm saying it isn't binary and there's a whole spectrum in between being happy you made it in time to not be punished, and wanting to be cutting edge.
    I was talking to one specific user.
    Last edited by Alphatorg; 2017-12-05 at 10:06 PM.

  19. #179
    Quote Originally Posted by Alphatorg View Post
    What are you even talking about.
    It means someone can still try to complete the dungeon as fast as possible if the opportunity is there, but if you join a group that won't then it's w/e.

    I join groups based on the Dungeon and M+ level. That's IT. So if I happen to get with a bad group my score goes down. And just because my score goes down because I decided to do the group anyways, M+ tryhards might decline me.

  20. #180
    Quote Originally Posted by Phumbles View Post
    It means someone can still try to complete the dungeon as fast as possible if the opportunity is there, but if you join a group that won't then it's w/e.

    I join groups based on the Dungeon and M+ level. That's IT. So if I happen to get with a bad group my score goes down. And just because my score goes down because I decided to do the group anyways, M+ tryhards might decline me.

    That is not how M+ score works. It simply tracks your highest scoring run for each instance. How nice of you to have such a strong opinion without even knowing what you're talking about.

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