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  1. #41
    Scarab Lord bungeebungee's Avatar
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    @Crissi Please close this. A day for remembrance has been turned into a soapbox for "edgy" nation bashing
    "No one -- however smart, however well-educated, however experienced -- is the suppository of all wisdom"
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    a century and a half isn't nearly enough time for say English to become intelligible
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  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by AeneasBK View Post
    I dunno. Some Americans bleat about how they saved everyone and won WW2; it gets tiresome (not least because it was mostly Russia), you're gonna get some pushback.


    Yea, I totally misremember Russia surviving because Germany had to send troops to the western front to stop the Americans after they saved England on the ropes. It’s not like Western Europe owes its status to America and the Marshall Plan. I mean, Eastern Europe is totally awesome and Communism really was successful there leaving a vibrant legacy. It’s not like the Germans ran from the Russians to be captured by Americans. And the Russians certainly didn’t kill many more than the Germans did in the holocaust.

    Europe would have been so much better off had America just focused on the pacific. It totally would have stopped the Reich on its own. Just like the Finnish could totally defend a modern Russian invasion without NATO or how Canada could defend itself from America. What college do you teach at so I can become a student?

  3. #43
    Banned Kurata's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheWalkinDude View Post
    Yea, I totally misremember Russia surviving because Germany had to send troops to the western front to stop the Americans after they saved England on the ropes. It’s not like Western Europe owes its status to America and the Marshall Plan. I mean, Eastern Europe is totally awesome and Communism really was successful there leaving a vibrant legacy. It’s not like the Germans ran from the Russians to be captured by Americans. And the Russians certainly didn’t kill many more than the Germans did in the holocaust.

    Europe would have been so much better off had America just focused on the pacific. It totally would have stopped the Reich on its own. Just like the Finnish could totally defend a modern Russian invasion without NATO or how Canada could defend itself from America. What college do you teach at so I can become a student?
    America would so totally exist if France didn't support its rebellion to get back at the English crown!

    I love this game too


    Let me add that if you guys didn't have your pet nazis to build your space program the soviets would have been the only competitors in the space race and without a pro us Europe the Cold War would have turned in their favor

    So please calm down you largely benefited from this war
    Last edited by Kurata; 2017-12-07 at 03:43 PM.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurata View Post
    America would so totally exist if France didn't support its rebellion to get back at the English crown!

    I love this game too


    Let me add that if you guys didn't have your pet nazis to build your space program the soviets would have been the only competitors in the space race and without a pro us Europe the Cold War would have turned in their favor

    So please calm down you largely benefited from this war
    Ah look, a bitter cunt who got fucked in the ass by American. Im sorry you lost your anal virginity but like it or not, America is the worlds only superpower and will continue to be for next 50+ years, so pipe down and shut up you irrelevant cunt.

    If you hate america so much, why are you using their technology?, like intel/windows etc that your using to talk shit on??. I hope America bombs your worthless country, then ill step in, piss on your corpse and dance on it.

    Answer me this, where do you come from and why not state if your such a tough guy?? you just came to this thread to talk shit, nothing else, enjoy your ban you cocksucker
    Last edited by smellybrits; 2017-12-07 at 03:58 PM.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Kurata View Post
    America would so totally exist if France didn't support its rebellion to get back at the English crown!

    I love this game too


    Let me add that if you guys didn't have your pet nazis to build your space program the soviets would have been the only competitors in the space race and without a pro us Europe the Cold War would have turned in their favor

    So please calm down you largely benefited from this war
    Then you realize the US invented the atom bomb and your argument about the US being unable to compete with the soviets falls flat on its face. Using German Rocket Scientist was a short cut. Not espionage like the soviets who were incapable of not only developing the bomb on their own, but developing any kind of successful space program. I don’t claim credit or pride in any of it because I had nothing to do with it. But to pretend America hasn’t objectively made the world a better place in the 20th century is just dishonest. There is no perfect action, but America’s as close to the good guys as any nation has ever been.

  6. #46
    The Insane
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurata View Post
    Remember Hiroshima too
    I mean...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_raids_on_Japan
    Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia
    Allied forces conducted many air raids on Japan during World War II, causing extensive destruction to the country's cities and killing between 241,000 and 900,000 people.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_ra...mbing_campaign
    Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia
    The Tokyo police force and fire department estimated that 83,793 people were killed during the air raid, another 40,918 were injured and just over a million lost their homes; postwar estimates of deaths in this attack have ranged from 80,000 to 100,000.
    The attack on the military base of Pearl Harbor resulted in 2403 American casualties, most of whom were military personnel. This lead to the Americans killing a million Japanese, most of whom were civilians, including tens, if not hundreds of thousands of women and children, and interning over a hundred thousand Japanese Americans.

    Measured response?
    things worked out better than we had planned • now everything's ruined, yeah

  7. #47
    Merely a Setback Hubcap's Avatar
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    All the major powers in WWII had a nuke program and since it was top secret in all countries during a time of war nobody knew how far along each nation was.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by 8bithamster View Post
    but how dare you! Americans were the true victims, throwing nukes unto civilians was 100% justified. That's the way these people think. It's adorable really, yes pearl harbor was horrible, but pales in comparison to what the US did later and in later wars.

    And let's not forget how eager the americans were to employ nazi's completely wiping their criminal records because of the knowledge.
    You are aware the decision to drop the atomic bombs were to actually save the civillian population of Japan from being completely annihilated right? The estimated deaths of a land invasion were in the 10s of millions right? On top of that, it would have meant soviet and US occupation just like Europe, but you're right, fucking Muricans.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    I mean...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_raids_on_Japan


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_ra...mbing_campaign

    The attack on the military base of Pearl Harbor resulted in 2403 American casualties, most of whom were military personnel. This lead to the Americans killing a million Japanese, most of whom were civilians, including tens, if not hundreds of thousands of women and children, and interning over a hundred thousand Japanese Americans.

    Measured response?
    Welcome to total war? What options do you think people had back then? Japan and Germany would have never stopped, and would have done the same, and occupied the conquered countries indefinitely. If you think all problems can be solved by "peaceful negotiations" after they already attacked, you're completely clueless. Its actually insulting to the memories of everyone who fought, from all countries on the allied sides, to have such a ridiculously uneducated opinion on how war plays out.

    Next time you, or your kid gets bullied, go tell them to go to the bully and say "you're mean" and watch how fast you, or your kid, gets knocked the fuck out.

  9. #49
    Scarab Lord bungeebungee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö
    Measured response?
    Yes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japane...British_Empire

    Pearl Harbor was an act of war. The Japanese declared war. America also declared war. WWII was an actual, full out war in a sense that has not been seen since.

    No, it does not fit modern sensibilities, but those have been shaped by the desire to avoid past mistakes. Some day in the future, someone will look back at the wars of our time and condemn their barbarity too.
    "No one -- however smart, however well-educated, however experienced -- is the suppository of all wisdom"
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    a century and a half isn't nearly enough time for say English to become intelligible
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  10. #50
    The Insane
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toogoodman View Post
    Welcome to total war? What options do you think people had back then?
    Finland was invaded by Soviet Union in 1939. Invaded. I'm not talking about a handful of soldiers being killed in a surprise attack on some conquered island thousands of miles away in the middle of the ocean. I'm talking about a total invasion, trying to take our entire country over. However, I've never heard of Mannerheim planning on wiping out a million civilians as retaliation. I think options were there for the Americans, as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Toogoodman View Post
    If you think all problems can be solved by "peaceful negotiations" after they already attacked, you're completely clueless. Its actually insulting to the memories of everyone who fought, from all countries on the allied sides, to have such a ridiculously uneducated opinion on how war plays out.
    Again, Finland negotiated peace with the Soviet Union after the Winter War, and the Continuation War. After having been invaded. Not after just 2500 people died. Go figure.

    Quote Originally Posted by Toogoodman View Post
    Next time you, or your kid gets bullied, go tell them to go to the bully and say "you're mean" and watch how fast you, or your kid, gets knocked the fuck out.
    Right, because this is totally the same thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by bungeebungee View Post
    Pearl Harbor was an act of war. The Japanese declared war. America also declared war. WWII was an actual, full out war in a sense that has not been seen since.
    Yeah... Finland was already at war in 1939. In an actual, full out war, where the entire country was being invaded. By a force greater than that of Hitler's. By a monster worse than Hitler. Yet, peace was negotiated, and civilians weren't slaughtered. I feel like it's very well an option and a possibility.

    Hence my earlier question: measured response? Also, if you're going to have a "remembrance day", then it would do everyone good to remember all the facts.
    Last edited by Sydänyö; 2017-12-07 at 04:27 PM.
    things worked out better than we had planned • now everything's ruined, yeah

  11. #51
    Weeb Queen Video Games's Avatar
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    I wouldn't have pyra if they didn't attack us :3 thanks jaypoon

  12. #52
    Banned A dot Ham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    I mean...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_raids_on_Japan


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_ra...mbing_campaign

    The attack on the military base of Pearl Harbor resulted in 2403 American casualties, most of whom were military personnel. This lead to the Americans killing a million Japanese, most of whom were civilians, including tens, if not hundreds of thousands of women and children, and interning over a hundred thousand Japanese Americans.

    Measured response?
    Since you like Wikipedia so much.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_war_crimes
    Some historians and governments hold Japanese military forces, namely the Imperial Japanese Army, the Imperial Japanese Navy, and the Imperial Japanese family, especially under Emperor Hirohito, responsible for the deaths of millions, some estimate between 3 and 14 million civilians and prisoners of war through massacre, human experimentation, starvation, and forced labor that was either directly perpetrated or condoned by the Japanese military and government. Some Japanese soldiers have admitted to committing these crimes.
    Its war. Its messy. Japan doesn't get to play some victim card. The US doesn't get to play some moral superiority card either.

    Also if we're being truly honest, if the rest of the world was all in like the US was the lines between civilian and military become extremely blurred especially when you have things like the draft, because every "civilian" is a potential soldier. Women went to work in factories making bullets, grenades, tanks, machines of War... are they still civilians? Children collected scrap metal. We were all in. The Japanese believed the emperor was divine, giving your life for a god was a privilege. I imagine man, woman, and child were equally committed to the cause in Japan.
    Last edited by A dot Ham; 2017-12-07 at 04:24 PM.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by bungeebungee View Post
    @Crissi Please close this. A day for remembrance has been turned into a soapbox for "edgy" nation bashing
    As if your intention wasn't to bait.
    The message from Trump could not be clearer, "We do not have 'allies'. We do not have 'trade partners'. We do not have 'common ground' or 'common interests'. We do not have 'strategic alliances'. We do not honor 'agreements'."

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    I mean...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_raids_on_Japan


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_ra...mbing_campaign

    The attack on the military base of Pearl Harbor resulted in 2403 American casualties, most of whom were military personnel. This lead to the Americans killing a million Japanese, most of whom were civilians, including tens, if not hundreds of thousands of women and children, and interning over a hundred thousand Japanese Americans.

    Measured response?
    Don't start nothing, won't be nothing.

  15. #55
    Banned Kurata's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheWalkinDude View Post
    Then you realize the US invented the atom bomb and your argument about the US being unable to compete with the soviets falls flat on its face. Using German Rocket Scientist was a short cut. Not espionage like the soviets who were incapable of not only developing the bomb on their own, but developing any kind of successful space program. I don’t claim credit or pride in any of it because I had nothing to do with it. But to pretend America hasn’t objectively made the world a better place in the 20th century is just dishonest. There is no perfect action, but America’s as close to the good guys as any nation has ever been.
    You do know almost everyone involved in the atomic bomb emigrated from Europe right ? Just like pretty much it's entire scientific community at the time, and still a lot today (not solely from Europe thought)

    Also please enlighten me as to how the nation who sent the first man into space could possibly have done so by spying on the nation that hasn't ?
    America didn't do jack shit for the world. They made as much short terms profits as they could by completely fucking it for everyone else, including your own future generations. Ask yourself why your middle class is shrinking and all your infrastructure has been built in the 30 years following the war

  16. #56
    The Insane cubby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurata View Post
    Remember Hiroshima too
    No, thank you, I don't think I will.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by 8bithamster View Post
    but how dare you! Americans were the true victims, throwing nukes unto civilians was 100% justified. That's the way these people think. It's adorable really, yes pearl harbor was horrible, but pales in comparison to what the US did later and in later wars.

    And let's not forget how eager the americans were to employ nazi's completely wiping their criminal records because of the knowledge.
    Grow up - it's not a perfect and black/white world. Your naivety shines through with every ridiculous "American sucks" post.
    The less you know, the more you believe.

    Science has promised us nothing and given us everything, faith has promised us everything and given us nothing.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    Finland was invaded by Soviet Union in 1939. Invaded. I'm not talking about a handful of soldiers being killed in a surprise attack on some conquered island thousands of miles away in the middle of the ocean. I'm talking about a total invasion, trying to take our entire country over. However, I've never heard of Mannerheim planning on wiping out a million civilians as retaliation. I think options were there for the Americans, as well.

    Again, Finland negotiated peace with the Soviet Union after the Winter War, and the Continuation War. After having been invaded. Not after just 2500 people died. Go figure.

    Right, because this is totally the same thing.
    The Atomic bombs, with the added threat of the soviets encroaching from the north, were in fact, the best options, as opposed to a full scale invasion. If the US simply decided it would no longer be involved in the Pacific the Japanese would have pushed right back into the southern island chains. They would have also tried to get back to the US mainland, and think otherwise, is idiotic.

  18. #58
    The Insane
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toogoodman View Post
    The Atomic bombs, with the added threat of the soviets encroaching from the north, were in fact, the best options, as opposed to a full scale invasion. If the US simply decided it would no longer be involved in the Pacific the Japanese would have pushed right back into the southern island chains. They would have also tried to get back to the US mainland, and think otherwise, is idiotic.
    I've heard that story be told by some people. Others, however, disagree.
    things worked out better than we had planned • now everything's ruined, yeah

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    No, thank you, I don't think I will.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Grow up - it's not a perfect and black/white world. Your naivety shines through with every ridiculous "American sucks" post.
    This is typical of these fucking neck beards on this forum, they think any conflict can be solved with flowers and love, when in fact it cant. I think its also hilarious, that they blame the US for so many deaths, when we remained neutral as long as possible, until someone finally sucked us into the European shit show, but its our fault of course.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by bungeebungee View Post


    National Pearl Harbor Remembrance Day. Remember December 7, 1941
    Isn't that a well-known fact that the US government was aware of this attack and didn't do shit? Is the remembrance about that government lie aswell ? Or is it just swept under the carpet like the vietnam war defeat ?

    Anyhow, god bless soldiers of any kind who give their lifes for the greater good.

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