Mythic + and why you shouldn't expect to get invited with low score

[Wondercrab]

Regardless, you can't base anything off the score itself really.

B) It values running all dungeons on lower keys over running certain dungeons on higher keys

This is the biggest issue I have with the reliance a lot of people have on the overall score number. I'm currently breezing through +13-14s on my main, but unless I focus on my own key it's near impossible to do any +15s because at that point a lot of players just start looking at overall M+ score. There are a bunch of Mythic+ dungeons I never run just because I don't find them particularly fun, and the idea of going through all of them on lower keys every season isn't something I have any interest in doing.

I understand why people use M+ score as a way to filter players, but I wish wowprogress didn't use such a terrible metric to measure it. Scores should be evaluated on a dungeon-by-dungeon basis, and if there has to be any kind of overall score then it should be based on the number of dungeons run overall, not a checklist that ticks off every unique mythic+ for a huge chunk of score even if it's done at a low level.

[david0925]

What it bothers me is seeing same posts about m+ score/wowprogress/curve every other day, who cares, mindlessly farming "score" and nothing else wont make your penis any bigger. Sure i get if someone wants something specific and farms specific dungons, but farming m+ just for sake of a score that people are doing is stupid.

And yes 940 base is appealing to some degree, but its still not worth of pain of puging things and you DONT need 2.2k+ score to farm +15 keys. Sure if you wanna push keys and are doing +18-20 and more, fine demand high score, however +15s are a joke.

I agree to an extend. I push high keys for the challenge and fun, but I do respect people that care about their score. I do also avoid pure pugs for 15 keys despite how easy they are because most pugs are just really bad (which you probably agree with the way you use "pain"), but that also explains why people would rather go with people with higher score. 2K isn't super unreasonable since that's roughly the score you get for completing 15 on time for every instance?

[Shakou]

I don't expect to get into groups with 2,6k players when I’m only at 2,3k.

Ya cuz people really need that high seat key or w.e to get into a less high NL key than the one they already multi-chested.

Like sure I suggest most players just run their own keys but Mythic+ score is in and of itself cancer. Pain in the neck finding 15's for my alts. I have 5 tanks and they are all just as capable of tanking the dungeon, I don't always have time to push all of those keys and I don't always get keys that I really particularly want to deal with. So if it's bad enough finding a group on those I absolutely will hop on my main, and if you are still listed and looking for a tank there are very strong odds that you will probably insta invite it (I know because it happens all the time, but not my paladin for whatever reason, nevermind that it's exceptionally well suited for m+, it will mostly outdps you on trash and it's I lvl is not really significantly lower than my Monk main) and I will absolutely leave your group as soon as you pop your key in.

Because if you're going to waste my time in the queue pretending like you're actually carefully screening people, but then you just insta inv my main but reject my perfectly suitable alts who if you were actually screening careful you would know are the same player, then I'm gonna take a tax out on you in the form of making you push your key again.

More people should get in the habit of doing this.

You absolutely do have the right to invite whoever you want, but that doesn't make other people subject to your stupid whims. And frankly if all you're looking at is a mythic+ score and not any details, you're probably not worth queueing up with anyways.

I find that groups like this are actually not very experienced, are usually inflexible (which is 100% anti-thetical to actually being good at m+) and typically are only able to do keys at all with a group of friends and with voice chat. Some of us were actually doing 15's before tier gear was a thing, and we were pugging them and we might not all have a high score due to our friends always taking us on their keys or something but we are actually better at the game and especially better at managing our time than you.

Thanks for reading.

[SoLoR1]

2K isn't super unreasonable since that's roughly the score you get for completing 15 on time for every instance?

Sure but issue becomes that they are not tracked. Im on high pop server, this week i did +16 and +17, both with +2 on timer. None of them got to top100 weekly runs so they dont show on my progress. So if i look this way i can do every single dungeon +17 with +2 without being noted for wowprogress. My 7.3.2 score on 2 chars is some ~190ish from doing one +17 last week (one / char that is for weekly). But this week when everyone is doing +15 keys you dont even get registred unless you do +17/18/19 (depends on dungeon).

[Shakou]

Sure but issue becomes that they are not tracked. Im on high pop server, this week i did +16 and +17, both with +2 on timer. None of them got to top100 weekly runs so they dont show on my progress. So if i look this way i can do every single dungeon +17 with +2 without being noted for wowprogress. My 7.3.2 score on 2 chars is some ~190ish from doing one +17 last week (one / char that is for weekly). But this week when everyone is doing +15 keys you dont even get registred unless you do +17/18/19 (depends on dungeon).

There are plenty of realms where 15's are still in the top 100.

If wowprogress isn't tracking your 16's and 17's, chances are that is just wowprogress being a poorly coded website that honestly needs to be rebuilt.

That said, typically if you run your keys earlier in the week they will end up on the top 100 and get tracked. They don't have to remain on the top 100 throughout the week, you just have to be mindful of all that and update your profile.

[SoLoR1]

If wowprogress isn't tracking your 16's and 17's, chances are that is just wowprogress being a poorly coded website that honestly needs to be rebuilt.

That said, typically if you run your keys earlier in the week they will end up on the top 100 and get tracked. They don't have to remain on the top 100 throughout the week, you just have to be mindful of all that and update your profile.

Nah wowprogress is using blizzard api and blizzard ladder (and wowprogress) is updated daily, and whole ladder is pulled daily (during night) without need to update char on your own, they cant fix that on their own. I do fully agreee that most of realms +15 and more will get you on that ladder, however if you dont have anyone from other realms in that group and your group is fully from some high pop realm like Kazzak or Silvermoon you wont get tracked.

Like i said personally i dont care since i only do m+ inside guild, just pointing out obvious flaws in the system.

[Spotnick]

Mythic+ score is only a good metric for people actually caring about mythic+ and pushing for higher keys.

For your weekly chest, not really. I think my score is 319 because I've only done 2 mythic dungeons in this "season", and I usually only queue for fast dungeons to get it done ASAP (Maw of Soul mostly) so I'll never get a high score.

Doesn't mean I can't do it, it just means I don't care about it, my goal in this game is mythic raiding, not 5 mans.

On the other hand, unless you check my armory there is no real way to know that.. so... /shrug

[Achilles55]

Hello people on MMO, I have been reading a lot about this lately, and thought i'd give my input.
As a player who run a lot with guild i have obtained a high enough mythic score, that i get accepted into most pugs that want to farm 15-18 keys. I see a lot of complaining about "why are people not taking me into their groups?? I know i am good enough even though i only have 1,3k m+ score and 5 failed +15's on my wowprogress"
If you look from the point of view, from a player that has high mythic+ score, who has been farming a lot to get his mythic+ score up, why should he pick you?

1st of all there is a million dps in queue to pick between, so if you are playing dps without high m+ score you must face that you're never going to get picked for high keys
2nd Why is it you think you are entitled to a spot in a group with people, far superior to you in terms of experience and the amount of work they have put into mythic+? Would you expect to get into master tier games in league, when you are only at silver MMR?
my 3rd and last point, gear is so easily available now, heroic + normal Antorus is a joke, so looking at your 950 ilvl doesn't say much about what we can expect from you. I just now pugged a EoA +15 and it was so painful to get through, even with everyone at 945+, we had a DK who died on every boss because he failed mechanics, tank was squishy as fuck, died multiple times on small thrash pulls, and the warrior was awfull as well.
We barely killed last boss and I think we 1 chested it. With a group of players with high mythic+ score, we will usually 3 chest a key like this.
So yes, in my opinion we do need some way to measure mythic + skill.

I suggest if you got low score, but think you are good at the game, go find a guild or some friends with your own key, and work your skill + experience up this way, that’s how most of us have done it.
I don't expect to get into groups with 2,6k players when I’m only at 2,3k.
Instead I will go play with players who also has around 2,3k and work my way up.
I apologize for bad gramma, but English is not my first language

I agree 100%. I don't understand how people can be so lazy, and entitled. They are just salty because they're bad and want to get carried. The idea of some cry baby on the forums dictating how I make my own groups is hilarious.

[Jastall]

I run M+ with guildies that are ten times better than the shitters wanting 2K score for a freaking +12. I couldn't care less about my score. It's even more stupid than the idiots asking for Curve on Normal.

[Tharkkun]

Yes 15's are piss easy, so this post is obviously not aimed at you. But i see so much crying on reddit and here from people who don't get invited, and i'm just trying to come up with reason and suggestions to what they can do :P

If that's the case then why isn't everyone clearing them? Its as if the raider crowd geared up with their set bonuses and trinkets and then jumped into the alternative progression called Mythic+ and called it easy.

[fiestatastic]

You say that, but a high score also doesn't mean fuck all. My guild pugged a resto druid for a DHT +16 last night. He had a M+ score of 2.2k as a healer. And he was fucking BAD. Facepulling like he'd never been in the dungeon. Getting oneshot by survivable mechanics (like the cat leap on first boss). Standing in shit he should move out of. Getting silenced on Xavius because he was constantly running away from me (I was the only ranged DPS). Not blowing a defensive CD on Xavius' channeled beam thing and dying to it, AFTER being brez'd for dying to it once already. We had like 30 deaths and about half of them were him specifically and the rest were us DPS dying because the healer was down (bear druid raid boss for a tank so he was invincible), but if we'd had a little patience and waited half an hour for a guild healer to free up we probably would have gotten 2-3 chests.

Our WW monk actually asked him who he bought his account from, it was so embarrassing.

Just means he was just a tryhard, like the op... instead of just being a smart player and just knocking out whatever key is the most time efficient. Funny how most mythic raiders have really low scores because who cares? Not many people are interested in diversifying their dungeon portfolio.

[Nefarious Tea]

Just means he was just a tryhard, like the op... instead of just being a smart player and just knocking out whatever key is the most time efficient. Funny how most mythic raiders have really low scores because who cares? Not many people are interested in diversifying their dungeon portfolio.

On the contrary, I'm such a raider and have no problems whatsoever doing whatever key is thrown at me. I find it's the people who do only dungeons who want do do only Eye or Maw. The point is, anecdotal evidence is anecdotal and you're going to find people who want the easy way out on both sides of the coin.

[Alvito]

my 957 (952 equipped) ilvl gets me invited to 15s so that's good enough for my weekly cache

My M+ score isn't too hot though... /shrug

I am pretty much in this same boat. I don't have free time to run a mythic + distraction free until the weekend on my server that means anything below a 14 or 15 for every dungeons isn't making the top 100. Some weeks depending on the affixes you need to be more in then 16 to 17 range. Mix in the random times sites just don't read the progress on armory and many mythics go untracked. This week is actually a good example my high key for the week on an alt is in the top 30 for my server, but after about a dozen refreshes still isn't showing up on wowprogress, raider.io does have it though.

[dacoolist]

Cool story bro. My m+ score is fucking terrible. I literally only do the same 3-4 dungeons because doing the more difficult ones are pointless. I'm at 953-955ish equipped and I never have a problem getting into groups ever. I run ONE m+ a week for the cache. I don't think I have ever looked at anyones M+ score ever and I still finish my +10 (previously) now +15, every week with no problems what so ever.

I kind of have to agree here... unless you're pushing for some phat loots (gear can go up to 985 now..) - running anything other than maybe 15/16 isn't really that big of a deal. I think Blizz stated if you run lets say a 19 IN TIME, you may get an extra piece of loot in your end of dungeon chest - but I mean... the difficulty between 15 to 19 is PRETTTTY huge, with insta wipes all over the place, and groups likely requiring 960+ just to even fathom attempting those things (Prydaz neck required so you don't die instantly to mechanics etc)

Running a single or a few mythic+ a week is kind of a thing now

[Shakou]

Nah wowprogress is using blizzard api and blizzard ladder (and wowprogress) is updated daily, and whole ladder is pulled daily (during night) without need to update char on your own, they cant fix that on their own. I do fully agreee that most of realms +15 and more will get you on that ladder, however if you dont have anyone from other realms in that group and your group is fully from some high pop realm like Kazzak or Silvermoon you wont get tracked.

Like i said personally i dont care since i only do m+ inside guild, just pointing out obvious flaws in the system.

Ah yeah that might happen if you're only running with your guild. Although I had thought Wowprogress takes data from another site too? I know there used to be some 3rd party ranking site that wowprogressed linked to for m+ data anyways, so I had though that some of my lower key runs that get listed were because of that.

But either way I think these type of sites serve a function that Blizzard could better produce in-game.

I hope in the future they really needs flesh out and make Mythic+ come into it's own, put a legitimate rakings system in-game, allow us to make teams like we used to for Arenas and hand out end-of season awards.

- - - Updated - - -

I think Blizz stated if you run lets say a 19 IN TIME, you may get an extra piece of loot in your end of dungeon chest

This is false, it is 1 extra piece of loot guaranteed per key lvl above 15. Only requires a complete, timing it gives you no extra value except an even higher key you can run.

Besides all that mythic+ is the best source for a lot of upgrades rings, necks, relics and even some trinkets and other items.

If it's not your thing it's not your thing, but here's what you got to wake up and realize: it's 100% a core part of progressing your character now and it is not only not going away it will for sure be expanded.

So don't be surprised if you don't get invited for being lazy and having that shit attitude about mythic+ apart from the noted lack of experience. I run my 15 (if it even starts there) to push that 15. I am not going to invite some scrub with a major attitude that thinks he's as good as people who regularly push high keys even though he only does the "easiest 15's".

I mean to be honest, 15's in general are what I would call trivial. Trivial for ME and people that have similar experience with M+. I want the key to remain trivial so I get a good 2-3 chest out of it.

And fyi mythic+ score no matter how "dumb it is" is still a far better sign of skill without question than a person's fucking bag item level.

P.s. Maw of Souls is not even one of the easier Dungeons at all unless we're talking low lvl keys and especially not Tyrannical. Most unforgiving Timer and even 15's give less ap (assuming you still need it) than a reg mythic.

[Kazuchika]

Oh look it's another "I'm a complete nobody but I'm gonna make a thread acting like I matter" post

Edit: LOL you're a shadow priest. It's obvious you have to make your own groups because no one in their right mind would bring a shadow priest to M+

[Otimus]

It's the same rule that's always existed in WoW: The community is awful and hates you. If you want to deal with it, be prepared for a bad time. If you don't, find a guild. If you don't want to do that, you're probably screwed.

That's a big reason why these kind of games have become so offputting now a days. You pretty much can't have any form of so-called "advanced fun" (i.e. anything more than random dungeons or leveling), by design, without a manually formed group (especially good if you can have a stable, regular group) or a very lenient or warped view on what constitutes as fun.

(I'll never understand it, either. WoW isn't the hardest game on the planet. It's not even the hardest MMO on the planet. Yet most other games, even other MMOs, are way more lenient on grouping, both at the design level, and at the community level. I kind of think there's just something wrong with Blizzard fans. I swear, they have the most toxic fanbases in gaming)

[Artemol]

We're currently 2-3 chesting our +20 Keys in our team... M+ is not hard at all.. Score/Itemlvl means dogshit if you have no knowledge on the classes that you have in your team. Playing without voice coms is also painful as anything.

[Raziella]

And people wonder why there's no "community" in the game anymore...

[Hctaz]

Posted this in another thread:

So tired of people complaining about Mythic score. People need a way to quickly try and determine which stranger to pick for their group.

ilvl is useless so WP and raider io tells you a lot of vaulable information.

If you haven't got a high score then that's too bad. You need to build it up. I built my score to 2.1k from literally nothing in 7.3 (after returning to the game) and that allowed me to quickly get up to 2.6k today. Yes it was a slog but I now realize...why should I expect to get into high level keys when I don't have much experience?

As a side note you may say you already know all the tactics and you perform well even if you're 1.2k score. I'd highly doubt it, though. You pick up a lot of things over time and if you haven't got a decent score then you simply won't know these things.


TLDR; stop whining.

But doing all of the dungeons doesn't mean anything? Like... who the fuck cares if I can clear all of the dungeons on 15? I literally ONLY farm Upper Kara and Darkheart since those are the only two dungeons that give me ANYTHING worthwhile. Those are the only two I NEED to do, and those are the only two I queue up for. But, people look at my M+ score and laugh despite having Cutting Edge KJ or being 5/11 M after week one in a weekend 2 night raiding guild. -shrug-

Also I've server changed a LOT this expansion. Thrall--> Mal'ganis-->Sen'jin-->Zul'jin-->Tichondrius. So... you can't even go back to check my old score from when I actually used to do these things for fun instead of for BiS relics and trinkets.