Free market liberalism should be considered a religion

[veehro]

- No proof it actually works

- Uses vaguely defined esoteric entities ("the invisible hand of the market")

- Has caused countless deaths and suffering around the world

- Is ferociously defended by a fanatical clergy of economists who treat is as the Only True Faith™

- Use prophetic figures as appeals to authority (friedmann,..)

- Fierce opposition to national governments


I see no reason as to why neoliberalism shouldnt be considered like some sort of weird sect given how fanatical people behave about it

I honestly do not understand why comunists are not treated exactly like nazis because both are opressive and violent ideologies

While the nazis also called national socialists want complete control over how the population thinks, the economy, the destruction of capitalism and the killing and opression of miniorities
The comunists , in reality socialists since comunism is an unachiavable utopia, want complete control over how the population thinks, the economy, the destruction of capitalism and the killing and opression of "the rich" and the "anti revolutionaries" and "Enemy of the people". This is why the genocide of the kulaks happened in the USSR for example. And if you go on comunist forums or anarcho comunist forums like antifa they do openly advocate for a violent bloody revolution where murdering people is justified because "how can you have a revolution without victims?"

Capitalism works the nations with the most economic freedom overlap with the most sucesful ones

http://www.heritage.org/index/images...-map-web-E.jpg

Also the capitalism we have today is not the one marx criticized as there have been plenty of advances in workers rights, 8 hr work, guaranteed minimum wage, social saftey nets etc.

You also don't have to "indoctrinate people" into capitalism as its self intuitive. A merchant would realize people arent buying anymore so he will simply have to improve his goods or lower prices

The invisible hand of the market is explained very well here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiuQhD27Cfc

[cparle87]

In what way?

In the early Lenin days the prevailing theory was that the existing Communist countries would facility Communist overthrows of other nations, eventually resulting in a worldwide Communist "utopia." After the failures of every other Communist revolution save Russia, Stalin gave up the idea.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism_in_One_Country

Fascinating reading.

[Deleted]

Good thing OP your opinion is just that. Nothing more. Has about as much counter force for change as a fart in a hurricane.

wew that was such a sick and witty burn

im really doubting myself now

[Deletedaccount1]

What prophetic figures do free market advocates use?

[Vynny]

I think you mean anarcho-capitalism, not free market liberalism. Or you're at least conflating the two since there has not been a truly anarcho-capitalist society in known history thus it could not be responsible for the deaths of millions. Liberals are by definition statists and do not oppose a national government. So please sort out which you mean and clarify that because otherwise you're talking nonsense with half of these points being applicable to liberalism and half of them being applicable to anarcho-capitalism.

P.S. Friedmann was a Soviet physicist, Friedman was the American economist.

[Daddotron]

Communism has failed every single time................. DROPS THE MIC!

[Sunseeker]

In the early Lenin days the prevailing theory was that the existing Communist countries would facility Communist overthrows of other nations, eventually resulting in a worldwide Communist "utopia." After the failures of every other Communist revolution save Russia, Stalin gave up the idea.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism_in_One_Country

Fascinating reading.

Yes I am aware of that.

I don't see the issue though, nor do I see this as somehow unique or noteworthy or derogatory about Communism. Don't all political ideologies seek to replicate themselves? It's a fairly central element to capitalism that the more capitalists you have the better the capitalist system functions. It's pretty much the foundation of neo-liberalism. Non-tribalist political systems don't function well in isolation.

[Deleted]

I think you mean anarcho-capitalism, not free market liberalism. Or you're at least conflating the two since there has not been a truly anarcho-capitalist society in known history thus it could not be responsible for the deaths of millions. Liberals are by definition statists and do not oppose a national government. So please sort out which you mean and clarify that because otherwise you're talking nonsense with half of these points being applicable to liberalism and half of them being applicable to anarcho-capitalism.

P.S. Friedmann was a Soviet physicist, Friedman was the American economist.

yeah every time i point out it doesnt works its the same with you guys

"but...but... IT WASNT TRUE CAPITALISM" sure mate

[cparle87]

Yes I am aware of that.

I don't see the issue though, nor do I see this as somehow unique or noteworthy or derogatory about Communism. Don't all political ideologies seek to replicate themselves? It's a fairly central element to capitalism that the more capitalists you have the better the capitalist system functions. It's pretty much the foundation of neo-liberalism. Non-tribalist political systems don't function well in isolation.

Well, the guy you quoted said that true communism requires universal application, and you said 'in what way?'

- - - Updated - - -

yeah every time i point out it doesnt works its the same with you guys

"but...but... IT WASNT TRUE CAPITALISM" sure mate

You need to take a look at this.
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/YxnSCJo20yE/maxresdefault.jpg

Capitalism is all along the right hand side. Right hand means government keeps hands off the economy, which the US does to an extent. If you'll note Communists and Socialists are the far left side, signifying extensive government control of the economy. The up and down axis involves how authoritarian the government is. The kind of stuff you're talking about would be found under the libertarian- or anarch-capitalism section, far far away from Communism and Socialism. I'm not even sure what 'free market liberalism' means or how you're trying to inject it into this conversation.

[Sunseeker]

Well, the guy you quoted said that true communism requires universal application, and you said 'in what way?'

Actually, he said universal conformity. It was his word choice of "conformity" I was more curious about than the fact that ideally Communism wants to make everyone communists.

[cparle87]

Actually, he said universal conformity. It was his word choice of "conformity" I was more curious about than the fact that ideally Communism wants to make everyone communists.

Hoo boy, that's an entirely different kettle of fish. The Soviet leaderships got together lots of times and could never agree on anything at all. First China broke off and did their own thing, then Cuba. In the late days even Armenia (albania?) broke off from contact with the Soviet Union for allegedly not being communist enough.

[Gestopft]

Despite OP's bait, there's a certain truth to it. AnCaps (and those close to it) have unrealistically optimistic (read: delusional) expectations of how a truly "Free Market" would actually perform. When they can't philosophically justify the "coercion" of taxation/regulations, they seemingly convince themselves that their "voluntary society" would actually work at a country level, despite all the evidence to the contrary.

[Deleted]

- No proof it actually works

- Uses vaguely defined esoteric entities ("the invisible hand of the market")

- Has caused countless deaths and suffering around the world

- Is ferociously defended by a fanatical clergy of economists who treat is as the Only True Faith™

- Use prophetic figures as appeals to authority (friedmann,..)

- Fierce opposition to national governments


I see no reason as to why neoliberalism shouldnt be considered like some sort of weird sect given how fanatical people behave about it

Get a job.

[Vynny]

yeah every time i point out it doesnt works its the same with you guys

"but...but... IT WASNT TRUE CAPITALISM" sure mate

I'm not an anarcho-capitalist. I just wanna know which group you're criticizing since you're mashing together 2 distinct forms of capitalists.

[Linkedblade]

Ahhh, so the 'fuck it the world is shit, everyone is shit, everything is shit let it burn' mindset.

Sorry, but that isn't applicable or acceptable in the real world, come back when you have an ideology that doesn't involve mass genocide to maintain relevance.

Not my ideology, it's ops.

[Vorkreist]

- No proof it actually works

- Uses vaguely defined esoteric entities ("the invisible hand of the market")

- Has caused countless deaths and suffering around the world

- Is ferociously defended by a fanatical clergy of economists who treat is as the Only True Faith™

- Use prophetic figures as appeals to authority (friedmann,..)

- Fierce opposition to national governments


I see no reason as to why neoliberalism shouldnt be considered like some sort of weird sect given how fanatical people behave about it

Translation : I'm a stupid kid who skipped history class

[Kasierith]

Do not make threads just to bait reactions and instigate arguments from others.