[Comics/TV/Movies] Harley Quinn, Anti-Hero or Bad Guy?

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Well I watch The Animated Series, I am not really interested in her as a character, because she mostly seems like a ripoff female version of the joker. She is about an uncomplex and interesting of a character DC has made, and that saying a lot.

Maybe the Animated Series isn't canon or her role has been rebooted, but near as i can tell nah she wasn't driven anywhere, she was a mental healthcare expert, she knew what to expect she acted, she is culpable, and she is far worse than just a bad guy, she is evil.

The Animated series is where she was created...but her origin was done in comics. She was a psychiatrist, yes. She became fascinated with the Joker and,in her hubris, decided she could "fix" him. Instead he drove her insane and he keeps her around as kind of a trophy of that accomplishment.

[Doctor Amadeus]

The Animated series is where she was created...but her origin was done in comics. She was a psychiatrist, yes. She became fascinated with the Joker and,in her hubris, decided she could "fix" him. Instead he drove her insane and he keeps her around as kind of a trophy of that accomplishment.

Yes, thus she made a decision she shouldn't have, unlike joker she knew what was at stake, she was trained, she might be attractive, but honestly she is one of the few I think Batman would be justified in killing on the spot.

All of her crimes especially murder are premeditated. Can't blame joker for that, IF she wasn't a psychiatrist, I would say she gets a pass, but she knew better.

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Depends. Maybe sympathetic anti-villain at best. You certainly tend to sympathize more with her than Joker, which makes her look like an abused puppy by comparison.

Nope it's the other way around she is a willing participant, if anything in this, Joker is more of her victim than the other way around. Harley is no sympathetic character.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Yes, thus she made a decision she shouldn't have, unlike joker she knew what was at stake, she was trained, she might be attractive, but honestly she is one of the few I think Batman would be justified in killing on the spot.

All of her crimes especially murder are premeditated. Can't blame joker for that, IF she wasn't a psychiatrist, I would say she gets a pass, but she knew better.

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Nope it's the other way around she is a willing participant, if anything in this, Joker is more of her victim than the other way around. Harley is no sympathetic character.

You clearly don't understand what "She was driven insane by the Joker" means. Being a psychiatrist doesn't make you immune to insanity. If insanity gives joker a "pass" then the same applies to Harley.

She didn't make a decision to go bad. She made a decision that she could be the one to restore sanity to The Joker. She didn't realize that while she was working on him...he was working on her.

[Tabrotar]

Yes, thus she made a decision she shouldn't have, unlike joker she knew what was at stake, she was trained, she might be attractive, but honestly she is one of the few I think Batman would be justified in killing on the spot.

All of her crimes especially murder are premeditated. Can't blame joker for that, IF she wasn't a psychiatrist, I would say she gets a pass, but she knew better.

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Nope it's the other way around she is a willing participant, if anything in this, Joker is more of her victim than the other way around. Harley is no sympathetic character.

For someone who is all high and mighty in the Junkie thread about we have to have sympathie for them and feel sorry for them because they made a "bad" decision (which is the fucking same thing that Harley did) you shurly are a nice hippocrat in her regard.

[Doctor Amadeus]

You clearly don't understand what "She was driven insane by the Joker" means. Being a psychiatrist doesn't make you immune to insanity. If insanity gives joker a "pass" then the same applies to Harley.

True being a psychiatrist doesn't make her immune, but there are systems and safeties in place to prevent someone like her from ever coming anywhere near Joker, it could be argued however that was allowed to happen bares serious responsibility if you go with what you said, in that Joker made the type of impression on her, but that really doesn't change the fact she knew.

Joker is certified insane, he can not and should not be accountable or responsible for his own actions, which is why he was locked up to begin with. The only thing that makes Joker any different than someone with say any other deficiency is the fact he is more animated as a character.

Joker is actually the Victim Not Harley Quinn!

She is of her own making, she is exactly the worst kind of evil and a villain.

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For someone who is all high and mighty in the Junkie thread about we have to have sympathie for them and feel sorry for them because they made a "bad" decision (which is the fucking same thing that Harley did) you shurly are a nice hippocrat in her regard.

No No Harley is not a junkie she isn't an addict she made a clear choice to facilitate evil, and not only harm someone already vulnerable, to kill other innocent people.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

True being a psychiatrist doesn't make her immune, but there are systems and safeties in place to prevent someone like her from ever coming anywhere near Joker, it could be argued however that was allowed to happen bares serious responsibility if you go with what you said, in that Joker made the type of impression on her, but that really doesn't change the fact she knew.

Yes, there should have been safeguards to keep her away from him. But that would be on the people that put a talented but inexperienced Psychiatrist in a room with The Joker.

Joker is certified insane, he can not and should not be accountable or responsible for his own actions, which is why he was locked up to begin with. The only thing that makes Joker any different than someone with say any other deficiency is the fact he is more animated as a character.

Joker is actually the Victim Not Harley Quinn!

She is of her own making, she is exactly the worst kind of evil and a villain.

Harley is also certified insane. This is what you are not understanding. She is not of her own making. He broke her down and twisted her.

[Elba]

Didn't she murder a whole bunch of children with bomb presents?

Villain. She deserves to die.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Yes, there should have been safeguards to keep her away from him. But that would be on the people that put a talented but inexperienced Psychiatrist in a room with The Joker.

Well we agree on that then.

Harley is also certified insane. This is what you are not understanding. She is not of her own making. He broke her down and twisted her.

Well She wasn't certifiably insane, and I also understand she seems cute and an attractive character, I won't deny that. But that is no defense, she is of her own making unless you can show me some canon where maybe there something I missed.

But understand, there are people who totally 100% sane are ok with and commit to do violence, they aren't suddenly sorry because others think they are cute or feel sympathy for them.

Nothing wrong with sympathy, but Sympathy can also run out especially for the conditions I just mentioned, she has near as everything I can tell decided to wantonly murder innocent people.

The fact she has a love sickness for Joker is also not an excuse, I can sympathize she also has a blindspot, that is not what I am condemning her for. But she knew better and made a choice.

[Powerogue]

Didn't she murder a whole bunch of children with bomb presents?

Villain. She deserves to die.

The great thing is we're all sitting here talking about "Harley Quinn" and none of us are even talking about the same canon. It'd be like if we all tried to argue about who Batman is. Hilarity inevitably ensues.

[Tabrotar]

True being a psychiatrist doesn't make her immune, but there are systems and safeties in place to prevent someone like her from ever coming anywhere near Joker, it could be argued however that was allowed to happen bares serious responsibility if you go with what you said, in that Joker made the type of impression on her, but that really doesn't change the fact she knew.

Joker is certified insane, he can not and should not be accountable or responsible for his own actions, which is why he was locked up to begin with. The only thing that makes Joker any different than someone with say any other deficiency is the fact he is more animated as a character.

Joker is actually the Victim Not Harley Quinn!

She is of her own making, she is exactly the worst kind of evil and a villain.

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No No Harley is not a junkie she isn't an addict she made a clear choice to facilitate evil, and not only harm someone already vulnerable, to kill other innocent people.

As Evil Midnight Bomber already said she was the therapist who was responsible for the Joker it was her job to try and reform him but it seems like it was realativly early in his "career" and nobody knowed that he was so insane that he can infect others with it.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

She's neither shes fucking insane. She could do anything and everything, for a reason or for no reason. Even Anti-Heroes follow some sort of internal logic... Harley does not.

Harly still has some sort of morals most of the time she’s not computly nuts and does have lines though thoses lines change depending where in her time like she is and if she’s with the joker or not.

[Doctor Amadeus]

The great thing is we're all sitting here talking about "Harley Quinn" and none of us are even talking about the same canon. It'd be like if we all tried to argue about who Batman is. Hilarity inevitably ensues.

Well I am open to that and to be real honest Batman really isn't all that innocent either, I mean hopefully all of this is in good fun.


I mean if we are also being super duper serious I hope Batman has a lot of fucking bat insurance for all the fucking property damage and people injured or murdered on his escapades too.

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As Evil Midnight Bomber already said she was the therapist who was responsible for the Joker it was her job to try and reform him but it seems like it was realativly early in his "career" and nobody knowed that he was so insane that he can infect others with it.

She was much more than a therapist, Joker was and I am going to assume a high level fucking criminal psychotic, you don't get to have so much as sit down with someone like that unless you are checked out.

Her job was to reform him which I am not foggy on, and yes in reality it would have been known what Joker was capable even to Harley. She made a choice.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Well we agree on that then.





Well She wasn't certifiably insane, and I also understand she seems cute and an attractive character, I won't deny that. But that is no defense, she is of her own making unless you can show me some canon where maybe there something I missed.

Skip to about the 2:30 mark





Or you could just read mad love:


https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B00BCTFWL0/...ng=UTF8&btkr=1


And the only person bringing up her being attractive is you. No one is using that as an excuse for her.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Harly still has some sort of morals most of the time she’s not computly nuts and does have lines though thoses lines change depending where in her time like she is and if she’s with the joker or not.

No she has Zero Moral compass sorry! She might not kill everyone she crosses paths with, that does not mean she it's for any other reason than it simply doesn't facilitate any function for her.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Her job was to reform him which I am not foggy on, and yes in reality it would have been known what Joker was capable even to Harley. She made a choice.

She made a choice to do her job and try to help an insane person. The cost of doing so was her own sanity.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Or you could just read mad love:

https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B00BCTFWL0/...ng=UTF8&btkr=1

I'll check out the book, I have seen the animated series and No this doesn't fall on Jokers shoulders he is responsible for many things, but Harley did this to herself, as hard as it might be to accept HE is the victim not her.


Joker isn't a good guy, but he is not within the realm of a rational or well enough mind to make those kinds of choices Harley has, which is why he should never have been freed from Prison in the first place.

[Tabrotar]

Well I am open to that and to be real honest Batman really isn't all that innocent either, I mean hopefully all of this is in good fun.


I mean if we are also being super duper serious I hope Batman has a lot of fucking bat insurance for all the fucking property damage and people injured or murdered on his escapades too.

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She was much more than a therapist, Joker was and I am going to assume a high level fucking criminal psychotic, you don't get to have so much as sit down with someone like that unless you are checked out.

Her job was to reform him which I am not foggy on, and yes in reality it would have been known what Joker was capable even to Harley. She made a choice.

Regarding that her wiki says she had full acess to the Joker because she said she was doing research for a book about serial killers.

[Doctor Amadeus]

She made a choice to do her job and try to help an insane person. The cost of doing so was her own sanity.

Yes and doing that psychiatrist actually have to be qualified, and to do what she was doing extremely qualified even for a mental health expert. That's why they take notes, that is why they are reviewed, it's also why she is culpable.


She didn't lose her sanity, she either didn't have it to begin with, or she made a choice, you can't have it both ways. If she already had an issue then whoever put here where she was to break is responsible.

If she wasn't insane before she went in there Joker didn't make her insane, that isn't how that works, sorry!

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Best Harley is post-Joker anti-hero non-heterosexual Harley.

If you disagree, you are wrong.

No she is just a murderer or highly functioning psychotic.

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Regarding that her wiki says she had full acess to the Joker because she said she was doing research for a book about serial killers.

Ok well if that's canon and she wasn't a psychiatrist then who evers bright fucking idea it was to allow her to be in a room alone with Joker should be held responsible.

[Gallahadd]

Initially she was a straight up villain, no question.

However in recent year it feels like they’re trying to place her in more of a grey area, morally.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

If she wasn't insane before she went in there Joker didn't make her insane, that isn't how that works, sorry!

Sane people can be driven insane by the right set of circumstances...which is exactly what happened to Harley. She's insane. And if Insanity makes Joker a "Victim" than Harley is just as much of a victim as he is.