Why are the game devs oblivious to the fact mercy is a required hero

[Onikaroshi]

Correction, the DPS bitched about the mega rez because "it negated my kills boohoo and I can't be assed to kill her" and demanded she get a rework and Blizzard being Blizzard caved into the crying just like they do in WoW.

Literally if you listen to any dev interview or update from back then, they did not like the playstyle of "hide to res", sure it wasn't fun to have your 5 man ult undone but that was not at the core of why they changed it.

[bash the fash]

Correction, the DPS bitched about the mega rez because "it negated my kills boohoo and I can't be assed to kill her" and demanded she get a rework and Blizzard being Blizzard caved into the crying just like they do in WoW.

They were right, too; the idea of a reactive instead of proactive anti-ultimate ult is phenomenally stupid and rewards suiciding/poor play instead of rewarding an exceptional healer (read: a smart Lucio or Zen ult).

This is why people are complaining. Mercy is the easiest hero to play by miles but she has a game-breaking ability and is incredible hard to kill during her ult unless you deadeye or aimbot her down. And using her ult requires no specific skill.

This is also why nobody is impressed by seeing Grandmaster Mercy's. Everyone who can reach GM by using different characters can reach it with Mercy. Nobody is impressed by it and actually spectating higher ranked Mercy's is boring as fuck.

I would've been fine if they simply kept the insta res during valkyrie but lowered her ult duration to 12 seconds or so. If you have 6 people being healed by a valk Mercy, you might aswell hold back for 20 seconds cuz it's pointless.

This post is also right. It's one reason I had absolutely zero interest in actual competitive TF2; because Medic is boring as all hell to play and to watch but absolutely necessary to any team, which dictates the flow of the gameplay. It's silly.

Mercy's ult and rez are both part of the problem; combined, they create a situation that's untenable. I think rez having a cast during ult is a little overboard, but the rest of the changes are fine; the ultimate is honestly the biggest problem.

[Jessicka]

Literally if you listen to any dev interview or update from back then, they did not like the playstyle of "hide to res", sure it wasn't fun to have your 5 man ult undone but that was not at the core of why they changed it.

That's their own fault because she sucked, and each time they buffed her, rather than actually listen to what Mercy players wanted, which was a new ability on E, they doubled down on making her a res bot.

[Ninjavitis]

With the new round of nerfs to mercy, I would say they are pretty aware. At least I manage to touch diamond this season before this nonsense.

[Jester Joe]

This is why people are complaining. Mercy is the easiest hero to play by miles but she has a game-breaking ability and is incredible hard to kill during her ult unless you deadeye or aimbot her down. And using her ult requires no specific skill.

"By miles" is just an exaggeration. Lucio is also extremely simple to play, yet no one complains about that just because he has a high skill ceiling, but to actually just play him? He's stupidly simple. Disgustingly so even.

It's just a silly claim to want a hero nerfed because "they're good but they're also easy to learn".

This is also why nobody is impressed by seeing Grandmaster Mercy's. Everyone who can reach GM by using different characters can reach it with Mercy. Nobody is impressed by it and actually spectating higher ranked Mercy's is boring as fuck.

The game should never be balanced around "What's interesting to watch". Ever.

[Woobels]

"By miles" is just an exaggeration. Lucio is also extremely simple to play, yet no one complains about that just because he has a high skill ceiling, but to actually just play him? He's stupidly simple. Disgustingly so even.

It's just a silly claim to want a hero nerfed because "they're good but they're also easy to learn".



The game should never be balanced around "What's interesting to watch". Ever.

Nah, by miles is pretty accurate.

And Lucio actually having a skill ceiling is plenty of reason not to complain? Mercy's skill floor and skill ceiling are basically one and the same.

[Jester Joe]

Nah, by miles is pretty accurate.

And Lucio actually having a skill ceiling is plenty of reason not to complain? Mercy's skill floor and skill ceiling are basically one and the same.

It's not at all.

And then that's just being hypocritical, you should nerf what's easy about Lucio and make him more harder to play then.

If you want to say it's bad to have an easier character to play, then nerf everything that's easy.

[Woobels]

It's not at all.

And then that's just being hypocritical, you should nerf what's easy about Lucio and make him more harder to play then.

If you want to say it's bad to have an easier character to play, then nerf everything that's easy.

They've done that already.

And till some extent, they have to the second as well, with Junkrat's current PTR nerf making him less spammy and with D.Va's earlier DM nerf.

[Jessicka]

Mercy's skill floor and skill ceiling are basically one and the same.

That's so much bullshit.

[Jester Joe]

They've done that already.

And till some extent, they have to the second as well, with Junkrat's current PTR nerf making him less spammy and with D.Va's earlier DM nerf.

They actually gave him a buff along with his "nerf".

The Junkrat nerf doesn't make him less spammy at all, it just means people aren't going to get kills as often with him. They'll still play him the exact same way though.

Also, nothing about this Mercy nerf is making her a more "skill dependent hero" that you want. She'll never be like that. That doesn't mean she should be nerfed to the ground repeatedly after Blizzard kept buffing her for so long to try to make her compete with Ana.

That's so much bullshit.

What do you mean, you instalock Mercy and instantly get Grandmaster! That's how it works, right?

[Woobels]

They actually gave him a buff along with his "nerf".

The Junkrat nerf doesn't make him less spammy at all, it just means people aren't going to get kills as often with him. They'll still play him the exact same way though.

Also, nothing about this Mercy nerf is making her a more "skill dependent hero" that you want. She'll never be like that. That doesn't mean she should be nerfed to the ground repeatedly after Blizzard kept buffing her for so long to try to make her compete with Ana.



What do you mean, you instalock Mercy and instantly get Grandmaster! That's how it works, right?

I'm aware they buffed him, but they nerfed what made him so easy for beginners? Aka they made him more difficult?

And I'm aware this doesn't make Mercy more skill dependent, that's why I said earlier in this thread I'd be happy if she's no longer viable in higher MMR brackets with these nerfs, I don't want her there.

Also I'm pretty confident I could get one of my alts to GM just by playing Mercy with a controller or some other silly handicap, if you can play any hero at GM level you can also play Mercy at that level, the same really can't be said about many other heroes.

Anyways I'm just gonna wait and see what happens to the hero and not bitch about it here, people endlessly complained and even insulted me for defending the D.va (((nerfs))) and she's a fantastic hero now.

[Jester Joe]

I'm aware they buffed him, but they nerfed what made him so easy for beginners? Aka they made him more difficult?

Not really, he's the same hero as before, just requires being a bit closer to people. There's still a big indicator right in the middle of the screen to tell you. And they made him a better choice since his healing output was increased so people don't have to worry as much about when to amp it up since his healing was so low.

And I'm aware this doesn't make Mercy more skill dependent, that's why I said earlier in this thread I'd be happy if she's no longer viable in higher MMR brackets with these nerfs, I don't want her there.

You basically just invalidated yourself. The game should never be balanced around "I don't want her viable".

Also I'm pretty confident I could get one of my alts to GM just by playing Mercy with a controller or some other silly handicap, if you can play any hero at GM level you can also play Mercy at that level, the same really can't be said about many other heroes.

Then you go do that, I'm sure glad you're thinking using a controller on a hero that doesn't require as much aiming as other characters a "handicap", since you can just adjust sensitivity to make up for that, and it's not like McCree where you have to aim carefully.

[McFuu]

There has never been a real problem with Mercy, the problem is every other "healer" is garbage (with Ana being a situational exception). If the game had another healer with a rez and dedicated tool kit, it would balance Mercy.
But they've changed her so much it's becoming ridiculous, my only issue with her now is how long people who have been rez'd have immunity. They can keep the immunity if they come back with half health and maybe a slight shield for low health heroes. Or make the immune about .25 of a second. If you've been rez'd and you don't have your bearings, that's on you, it's stupid to punish the enemy team by allowing them to get situated.

[Jessicka]

There has never been a real problem with Mercy, the problem is every other "healer" is garbage (with Ana being a situational exception). If the game had another healer with a rez and dedicated tool kit, it would balance Mercy.
But they've changed her so much it's becoming ridiculous, my only issue with her now is how long people who have been rez'd have immunity. They can keep the immunity if they come back with half health and maybe a slight shield for low health heroes. Or make the immune about .25 of a second. If you've been rez'd and you don't have your bearings, that's on you, it's stupid to punish the enemy team by allowing them to get situated.

Lucio and Zen are good, but they're very much secondary healers both with very good utility. Moira is outstanding though and Ana has her place but is a little weak I think still. I don't think another healer with a res is needed, or a good idea since it's not like they're exclusive picks.

Res itself I think can be balanced against the rest of a hero's kit, it has been before, it's even been considered bad for most of the game...

[Woobels]

Not really, he's the same hero as before, just requires being a bit closer to people. There's still a big indicator right in the middle of the screen to tell you. And they made him a better choice since his healing output was increased so people don't have to worry as much about when to amp it up since his healing was so low.



You basically just invalidated yourself. The game should never be balanced around "I don't want her viable".



Then you go do that, I'm sure glad you're thinking using a controller on a hero that doesn't require as much aiming as other characters a "handicap", since you can just adjust sensitivity to make up for that, and it's not like McCree where you have to aim carefully.

The point is that I'm confident that anyone that's like Diamond or above can get there just using Mercy too if they've done it before using different heroes.

She just doesn't have any decent mechanical skill requirements whatsoever, it's not just about aiming.

[Jester Joe]

The point is that I'm confident that anyone that's like Diamond or above can get there just using Mercy too if they've done it before using different heroes.

Spoiler, they can't. Otherwise you'd have everyone picking Mercy for quick rank ups. Instead, you still have a game full of people hating on Mercy for reasons that make little to no sense, and refusing to touch any healers.

She just doesn't have any decent mechanical skill requirements whatsoever, it's not just about aiming.

And at your rate, it seems like all you define skill as is mechanical, nothing about positioning, knowing when to ult, knowing when to pull back, knowing when you're safe to jump in, etc.

There's far more to Mercy than you think.

[Woobels]

Spoiler, they can't. Otherwise you'd have everyone picking Mercy for quick rank ups. Instead, you still have a game full of people hating on Mercy for reasons that make little to no sense, and refusing to touch any healers.



And at your rate, it seems like all you define skill as is mechanical, nothing about positioning, knowing when to ult, knowing when to pull back, knowing when you're safe to jump in, etc.

There's far more to Mercy than you think.

I'm talking specifically about people who are that rank already, obviously not people trying to climb.

I play mostly Tracer/Dva/whatever right now and I'm confident that I could still fill Mercy every game and continue to climb or not impact games negatively enough that I'm going to drop rank, anyone who is good at Overwatch is also pretty much automatically good at Mercy because all the things you mentioned apply to every hero and are generally just basic required game sense, anyone has that, I hate when people pretend it's something unique to Mercy or something that's harder to her than other supports for example.

[micwini]

Why don't they just go back to her old ult and give that a cast time instead (no immune). Then she doesn't have to hide for it and makes it similar to most dps ults where you have a big impact but are also vulnerable.

[McFuu]

Lucio and Zen are good, but they're very much secondary healers both with very good utility. Moira is outstanding though and Ana has her place but is a little weak I think still. I don't think another healer with a res is needed, or a good idea since it's not like they're exclusive picks.

Res itself I think can be balanced against the rest of a hero's kit, it has been before, it's even been considered bad for most of the game...

Neither one can keep a hero alive like Mercy, other than Ana. I find Moira a bit weak on the healing side, although her ball is great. Zen can heal back health but his HPS is low, he pairs off with Roadhog well because of his booze ability. And Lucio can trickle the team health, but even when his boost is on he has issues keeping people alive from a focusing enemy team.
Mercy really is the only healer that can do what she does, her falling out of meta had a lot to do with buffs to other heroes, and when Ana was introduced she was the ST best for a season or so.
Mercy should have been left alone, I think Kaplan knows this, when he talked about the hero the game really needs it's going to be a pure healer like Mercy.

[Jester Joe]

I'm talking specifically about people who are that rank already, obviously not people trying to climb.

You said you can get one of your alt accounts to GM Mercy.
You also said anyone who can play at a certain rank should be able to play there as Mercy too. That would mean not only can they play her at that rank, but they can also obtain that rank with her.

I play mostly Tracer/Dva/whatever right now and I'm confident that I could still fill Mercy every game and continue to climb or not impact games negatively enough that I'm going to drop rank, anyone who is good at Overwatch is also pretty much automatically good at Mercy because all the things you mentioned apply to every hero and are generally just basic required game sense, anyone has that, I hate when people pretend it's something unique to Mercy or something that's harder to her than other supports for example.

You're punished harder as Mercy than you are as a Lucio if you're out of position. Lucio can just speed boost/self heal/wall ride away. Mercy has to hope there's someone she can jump to in a better spot, which isn't reliable, so you shouldn't be depending on that, unless you have a Pharah maybe.

There's only ONE healer I'd say who's punished harder than Mercy for position, and that's Zenyatta, but he's also able to rip through people with Discord.

The fact that you hate when people "pretend" something when it's just factual is odd to say the least. A vast majority of heroes in the game have abilities to escape that they can use on their own. Mercy's depends on knowing where all your teammates are at every point in time.

Meanwhile, Tracer/D.Va can just ignore that and screw around in the enemy's backlines, only caring about their own positioning and knowing when to retreat.

And even IF you refuse to accept that, it doesn't change the fact that I never said it was completely unique to her, the point was that it's still something she has to deal with and it does require skill. Making Mercy a healer that does require skill.

Neither one can keep a hero alive like Mercy, other than Ana. I find Moira a bit weak on the healing side, although her ball is great. Zen can heal back health but his HPS is low, he pairs off with Roadhog well because of his booze ability. And Lucio can trickle the team health, but even when his boost is on he has issues keeping people alive from a focusing enemy team.
Mercy really is the only healer that can do what she does, her falling out of meta had a lot to do with buffs to other heroes, and when Ana was introduced she was the ST best for a season or so.
Mercy should have been left alone, I think Kaplan knows this, when he talked about the hero the game really needs it's going to be a pure healer like Mercy.

Moira's spray does 80hps, while leaving a HoT that heals for an additional 50hp over 3 seconds. That doesn't include her healing orb.

Mercy's staff heals for 60hps.

Agree that she should have been left alone though, or maybe add the 1.5 second cast to her original ult even.