Page 5 of 8 FirstFirst ...
3
4
5
6
7
... LastLast
  1. #81
    I originally went PvP back in vanilla because it made more sense lore-wise and felt right (also my brother was on a PvP server). However, I have since realised that actual world PvP is rare. It's mostly just trolling and ganking. People taking advantage of having safety in numbers or killing another player that is otherwise occupied with something else. 85% of player vs player action out in the world is just ganking and camping.

  2. #82
    Stood in the Fire Alkizon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Strasbourg
    Posts
    466

    Question

    This isn't easy to explain, but I will try...

    There is difference between being able to fight and wanting to fight and it's exactly PvP+PvE (servers)vs(toggle) issue.

    They annihilate element of moral choice by their decision. All were on the same server with the same rules and legal (not material/not complicated/"not hardcore") escape didn't exest back then - ie meeting of two characters of opposing factions led both owners to this choose. There won't be any moral choice now - "You can always go back to the city, push the button for leave any fight activity, and since you didn't do this, that means that you're the one who should be blamed for the fact that I'm killing you and there is no problem with my moral choice. You always have very easy solution to this". Moreover, new mode won't only "not condemn", but rather encourage decision to attack. Which'll lead community to an even more embittered state. There is also second negative psychological consequence/experience: easier to avoid, means less reasons for resistance/mutual assistance (group activity)/progression (learning, finding solutions)/confrontation (meetings) (it's very funny considering what they tried to achieve by this change). Ie this all is completely different condition and shape than PvP-server, and has nothing to do with it. Lets go ahead...

    In fact, 2 options for idea development here (in this thread) have already been approximately explained, and none of them is interesting from the point of view of old-school WPvP:
    1) everyone walks around without touching anyone, getting bonuses and laughing at silly Blizzard and their stupid ideas;
    2) PvP is populated by organized groups that cut out singles (now already without any remorse on their part and public condemnation/compassion).

    In other words, when they give such technical "dynamic"/easy-access/fast/"casual" (it's more sarcasm, but still I'll add it) choice, in fact they just deprive players from such real choice (which was healthy enough when there was 2 server types). No, it's not a good idea.

    Will this save (w)PvP? No, of course not! They need normal class design, and not something been cut into specializations/PvE/PvP non-working pieces. This should be the whole working system, not the pieces of *** on the fan. ...loot progression system, social(group)/guild system and other stuff. There is no way to avoid this, game doesn't consist of pieces, it's a whole solid system of dependencies. The way they behave now is more like trying to imitate little monkeys "team likes this and team likes that...", but, in fact, wisdom isn't the thing that being feeling in them.

    ps. I guarantee that flexible-option systems are always easy to exploit (literally, it's the main task of "smart person" to bring system into similar state for easy breaking it), just give it a little time. Such ideas are foolish and ineffective by definition. The less significant consequences of choice, the less person entrust own responsibility for it.
    Quote Originally Posted by aluser View Post
    Which was given up when we gained shards because our server choice suddenly didn't matter just a play style choice made when we had different circumstances and switching chars.
    From your argument i guess that you also consider it fair game to have sex with a person that is too drunk as well as other forms of "Victim blaming".

    I see it as difference of opinion on how you build communities because i am sure that i am not alone in having moderate interest in pvp/wpvp 10+ years ago when my time wasn't very limited while today i have no desire for it but i don't wanna leave my guild to go to a pveserver because several of them still enjoy being on a pvpserver.

    Toggle isn't a problem but participation bonuses is.
    Don't compare soft with warm, it's (what you're talking about) unlawfull mean incomparable with something what is free choice. That's why this was an exclusively moral choice, and now it will be a banal provocation. These things (your ex.) can't be compared in any possible way, you are apparently too weak in analogy Will you condemn someone for attacking those who are engaged in their own affairs on battleground (av? =toggle="new-way" open world)? And now the same question for "old-way" open world... - That's what is called a true analogy. War mode isn't fraction/resources (old true wPvP) fight, but just exactly "killing-for-killing mode" (ganking/BG - instance mode pvp). For completeness the picture remains to add Arena rule into it (no fractions - all against all except those in the group).

    Conclusion: No choice or spontaneity of situation, only monotonous methodical murdering = bored and depressingly sad.

    Did you like Ashran? But this is exactly what this toggle is and this is what you are going to get on a global scale. I won't be surprised if this idea was left as last will to the team by Holinka himself before leaving.

    By the way, even you could understand at least {one true thing} from my message - division of solid server into anything is wrong decision (shards/phasing/CRZ/whatever else sh*t). Solid should stay solid for every person - this is how world in MMORPG should be designed. So, any change that goes against this rule shouldn't even be considered (and, for your information, scaling goes to the same trash bin, for not only frustrate progress and rewards system, but also makes open world adjust to the player, when everything should happen exact opposite).

    People saying that dev-s tried something like this before and this didn't work as intended (well, at least it didn't violate design and was implemented according to game world rules back then), so what's changed since?

    The end.
    Last edited by Alkizon; 2018-11-27 at 10:18 AM.
    __---=== IMHO and MORE ===---__

  3. #83
    Herald of the Titans Lazuli's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Your Moms House
    Posts
    2,821
    Quote Originally Posted by Eliessa View Post
    you do realise that there was a patch and that doesnt happen anymore, except in some rare cases.
    This is what tells me you're on a pve server. It still happens, the only thing still noticeable from that hotfix is the kiljaeden trinket damage is pitiful. Anyone can still 1shot you are simply uninformed, I would be happy to show you in game, hell I'll 1shot you in any tank spec if you got one. You can choose between my sub rogue or fury war lol.
    The greatest ever thread on MMO-Champion

    I work a lot, fuck my life.

  4. #84
    Fluffy Kitten Millennía's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Northern Ireland
    Posts
    3,695
    Will I miss people killing other players 50+ levels lower than them? No, definitely not!

  5. #85
    I know for a fact Stormrage is probably going to be fucking crazy after people hit max level. The FFA world quest zones already have guilds that go and shit on all the lone wolfs out there so I’m going to assume there will be a lot of guilds/people turning it on at max level.

    I don’t think anyone would turn it on while leveling but I could be wrong. Maybe people who level in a group with guildies will. However I know I’m definitely not the only one on Stormrage that’s gonna run around pvping at max level.

    This gives us the option to do it whenever we want. You’re going to see people out there pvping especially on popular realms.
    Last edited by Taeldorian; 2018-01-08 at 11:23 PM.

  6. #86
    Too much mobility and get away mechanics as well as flying, give no chance to world pvp.

    People would world pvp because of the thrill to make someone's life miserable and be memorable on the server, make their own reputation as a ganker etc.

    It's not the rewards in terms of loot you get out of it.

    That stuff just doesn't exist anymore.

    Maybe we see some of that stuff back with classic. Waiting to see how blizzard is going to address certain bugs and imbalances classic wow had though.

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by Alkizon View Post
    This isn't easy to explain, but I will try...

    There is difference between being able to fight and wanting to fight and it's exactly PvP+PvE (servers)vs(toggle) issue.

    They annihilate element of moral choice by their decision. All were on the same server with the same rules and legal (not material/not complicated/"not hardcore")
    Which was given up when we gained shards because our server choice suddenly didn't matter just a play style choice made when we had different circumstances in life.
    From your argument i guess that you also consider it fair game to have sex with a person that is too drunk as well as other forms of "Victim blaming".

    I see it as difference of opinion on how you build communities because i am sure that i am not alone in having moderate interest in pvp/wpvp 10+ years ago when my time wasn't very limited while today i have no desire for it but i don't wanna leave my guild to go to a pveserver because several of them still enjoy being on a pvpserver.

    Toggle isn't a problem but participation bonuses is.
    Last edited by aluser; 2018-01-09 at 01:50 PM.

  8. #88
    I am Murloc! Anjerith's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    The apotheosis of all Deserts
    Posts
    5,543
    If you enjoy killing players, there are surely enough people that will toggle to do the same to you -- assuming the playstyle is actually interesting outside of a "I'm on a Horde PVP server so I can look forward to 50 of my mates helping me gang up on Alliance 30+ levels lower than me or vice versa".

    So it will be interesting to see a truly healthy version of the world pvp environment.
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    Gold and the 'need' for it in-game is easily one of the most overblown mindsets in this community.

  9. #89
    I'll keep my pvp enabled, I run with a squad in open world anyway. I'm not bad in pvp or anything, but strength in numbers.

  10. #90
    Repeat after me. THEY WONT TAKE AWAY PVP SERVERS! there will still be world pvp, it will just be optional. My friend who when started the game wanted to play with me, but hate PVP can now stay on the server, and just opt out of it. Me who likes it, i can stay in it. Hell they said there will be some bonus or objectives to stay in PVP, so if anything they will just add to PVP servers.

  11. #91
    I definitely won't miss Legion world pvp. Since BfA will likely be the same I plan on playing with pvp off all the time (up until wod I actually prefered playing on PvP).

  12. #92
    Immortal Orby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Essex, England
    Posts
    7,491
    World flying killed World PvP long ago.
    Internet Goals: Try and be a better poster.

  13. #93
    with how they plan to roll it out, you wont really see a difference right? you can basically choose if you'll be on a pvp or pve realm

  14. #94
    nope not atall

  15. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by Eliessa View Post
    my favourite are people like you who want the world to adapt to their liking without any regards what other players think or want. peak selfishness and self-centred.
    This is insane comment and so much hyperbole.
    This game is a free market product, people want different things, people express what they want in the product that they are using. So logically they ignore "other people" while expressing their own comment. To "people like you" this turns into a hyperbole of "peak selfishness and self-centred", WTF. The person you reply to did not remotely saying he will use physical force, or real life threat, or use government power (if he has any) to force BLIZZARD to do what he wants.

    Who is at the "peak of selfishness and self-centred" anyway? Look at the mirror perhaps?
    Last edited by gobio; 2018-01-10 at 02:12 AM.

  16. #96
    Herald of the Titans Putin-Chan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Кремлевский секс-подземелье
    Posts
    2,965
    Nope, not at all.
    Dear liberals, if the deep state isn't behind Infowars being banned from social media, why do I believe that (((they))) are? Checkmate.

  17. #97
    I am Murloc! Zuben's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Finland
    Posts
    5,167
    No. The toggle is a much better way to handle PVP. It may even spark more interest in World PVP, since you know people are there for that exact reason. Life on my PVP server has been a whole lot of ignoring enemy players while questing; you don't bother their questing in order to ensure they won't bother yours. PVP switched on it is assumed you and everyone you see want to be bothered.
    Now you see it. Now you don't.

  18. #98
    Eh, servers stopped having an identity a long time ago when the new tech kicked in like LFG, grouping with players from other servers, CRZ and sharding.
    The only things left that are server specific are what? Guilds, trades and entering in the current mythic raid (not even sure if this still applies).

    As to missing the PVP servers ... what is there to miss? World PVP has been dead for a veeery long time.

  19. #99
    PvP servers aren't going away.

    If you wanna play on a PvP server so badly, just go to a home city and toggle it on. Boom, PvP server.

  20. #100
    I am Murloc! Flarelaine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Hungary
    Posts
    5,766
    Quote Originally Posted by gsfgsjjkg View Post
    Will you miss PVP Servers?
    No.

    /10chars

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •