Funding for government lapses as short-term spending bill stalls in the Senate

[Skroe]

Your lack of concern is astounding.

I understand that the shutdown hardly affects a grand majority of the population of the US. Many probably don't understand what the big deal is. Mail still works, social security and medicare still work.

But for us military it is an entirely different conversation. We don't get paid all that much as it is. The rate that I get paid for the job I do is pennys at best. But I am here, stuck for another 5 years, so I have no choice but to work, whether I get paid or not. But due to military life, the constant moving, deployments, ect, there are more families who live paycheck to paycheck than who live comfortably with their military paychecks.

A lose in pay, for any of us, has the ability to almost certainly put us close to financial ruin, and yet we are still have to work.

On the contrary, perhaps you're not understanding my point. The current problem so the military can get paid (in Feburary) must be resolved.

But unless there is a larger deal - one that has failed to take shape for over 10 years - there will be sequels.

And sequels.

And sequels.

The boat's already sailed on this shut down. You need to get paid no doubt. But we can't ignore preventing the next happenstance of this situation either. This was entirely avoidable, back in 2012.

[Warning]

IDK looking at the list its the same club of wannabe republicans

Rand paul
Mcconnel
Linsey graham

all seem to always be on the wrong side of hurting their own party lately so idk... time to vote them and Flake out

wonder how many voted just to hurt trump regardless of what helps the country.

What you want is not democracy, what you want is a group of nodding heads with slavish deference to the party line or its leader. The faults you see do not lie with these men, they lie squarely with whatever politician is pushing for public votes on a plan for which they KNOW there exists no consensus within the party. In other words, if you want to pass legislation make sure you have the support that'll get you the votes you need. Pushing through plans that the population largely does not support is a great way to get your seats in congress voted out and politicians tend to try to avoid being voted out.

The truth is Trump is in very difficult territory right now, which is entirely his own fault, he has leaned too heavily on a base of extremists and nutjobs and will now pay the price for it. To get anything, he will need to pass some kind of acceptable solution for DACA. He simply cannot get around it without getting opposed on literally everything in the future. But doing so will offend his hardcore base immensely, it is the one thing their considerable mental gymnastic skills seem incapable of squaring with their vision of their lord and savior Donald T (stable be his genius). That means this is going to either be the end of the Trump government doing anything, or he's going to bite the bullet and insert a knife into the back of the Trump cult. Either way what's about to happen is going to be as far from winning as you've ever been. My guess is that it'd be wise to start doing your stretches because you're gonna have to put on a hell of a show.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Well, I guess Trump is getting that "good shutdown" he wanted back in September.

Too bad he'll miss partying with his "special people" on the anniversary of his inauguration as a result. I can only imagine the fits of rage he's been throwing all night over that.

You really think a small thing like a government shut down is going to stop the party of the millennium?

[Xeones]

Republicans are evil and they have made no efforts to hide this fact.

https://twitter.com/SenateMajLdr/sta...09393507876864

There is no stretch they can blame this on democrats, when they make deals with republicans and Trump still shoots them down it's not getting turned around.

[Machismo]

IDK looking at the list its the same club of wannabe republicans

Rand paul
Mcconnel
Linsey graham

all seem to always be on the wrong side of hurting their own party lately so idk... time to vote them and Flake out

wonder how many voted just to hurt trump regardless of what helps the country.

You listed two textbook Republicans and a libertarian-leaning conservative Republican.

Who are the "real" Republicans in your eyes?

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In case you're as blind as any democrat who thought cash for clunkers wouldn't work (Lord I would love to trade in my vehicle for $3,500 right now and it still runs well) this will definitely make the democrats look bad.

I understand this is the fault of the gop, but all I can think when I read this is "They're fucking over everyone to try and give legal status to children brought to this country illegally?" And I don't feel hatred towards them and I don't think it's safe to send them back but they shouldn't ruin our fiscal dealings to promote such a lame humanitarian cause.

It doesn't matter that what I think reading this is asinine; It's what people WILL think about this, since most people are asinine. Like me.

And then fuck everybody to death, fuck them all to death muwuahahahahah!

Holy shit... I just left this thread to see the thread about democrats shutting down our government for the interest of foreigners. Holy shit I didn't see that it's 24 pages already what can I say fucking called it, I know it looks like I might have known before hand but I'll know the truth I'm fucking good at this!

Most people are either going to blame Trump or the GOP, since that's what multiple polls showed.

[Mormolyce]

That thread never explained who Democrates was.

For a minute I thought he came up with the theory of atoms. But no, that was Democritus.

Anyways, is Mitch McConnell really a serious politician?
First he make a fake promise to Sen. Susan Collins to get her vote on the tax bill. Sorry kids, healthcare will have to wait.

Jeff Flake was promised a DACA vote this month. Then GOP leadership switched it up on him. Here are his thoughts tonight, hours before the shutdown deadline:


I need to check McConnell's poll numbers, are they at Trumpian levels? The shutdown seems to be laying with those two the most.

MAking Paul Ryan look like the adult of the Party.

As far as I can tell, Trump went into the room actually intending to make a deal, and because he's an absolute blithering fuckwit his contributions to the discussion made it sound like he was going to straight up accept the Democrats' demands. So then the hardliners took him into a backroom and tactfully informed him that everything he was doing was wrong and he came out with the exact opposite position he'd had previously.

This shutdown is a failure of leadership, plain and simple.

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Republicans are evil and they have made no efforts to hide this fact.

https://twitter.com/SenateMajLdr/sta...09393507876864

There is no stretch they can blame this on democrats, when they make deals with republicans and Trump still shoots them down it's not getting turned around.

The tweets complaining about "obstructionists". Oh, my sides.

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You listed two textbook Republicans and a libertarian-leaning conservative Republican.

Who are the "real" Republicans in your eyes?

Presumably the ones who wear pointy white hats on weekends kek.

[Thekri]

For a minute I thought he came up with the theory of atoms. But no, that was Democritus.

Here is the Wikipedia article to Democrates Apparently he was a Pythagorean Philosopher best known for a list of maxims that he may of may not have written, and also shutting down the US Government in January 2018.

[Mormolyce]

Here is the Wikipedia article to Democrates Apparently he was a Pythagorean Philosopher best known for a list of maxims that he may of may not have written, and also shutting down the US Government in January 2018.

Well I guess those maxims weren't page-turners.

[Breccia]

GOP strategist: Shutdown is on Trump and GOP

Republican strategist John Weaver said Saturday that blame for the government shutdown falls on President Trump and the GOP.

“Trump created the [Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals] DACA crisis. The congressional wing of the GOP refused to fund CHIP. Trump & GOP ignored the pleas of the Pentagon for a fully funded budget. All of this is on them,” Weaver said.

The strategist, who previously worked for Gov. John Kasich (R-Ohio) and Sen. John McCain’s (R-Ariz.) 2008 presidential campaign, has often been critical of Trump.
The government shut down at midnight on Friday after the Senate failed to pass a continuing resolution to fund the government. Democrats and Republicans are scrambling to place blame on the other side for the failure.

Trump and Republicans have blamed Democrats for the shutdown. But Democrats fired back, saying it was the GOP’s fault for refusing to attach a measure extending protections for recipients of the DACA program to the bill.

Trump has since tweeted, because of course he did, that this is somehow the fault of the Democrats.

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That FOX News cover page, lol. Such tryhards, sooooo desperate to paint this as anything other than a GOP-led failure.

[draynay]

How did this thread end up with more shit talk than the bait thread?

[Skroe]

That FOX News cover page, lol. Such tryhards, sooooo desperate to paint this as anything other than a GOP-led failure.

State Media is really just the worst at this. Like that's not even good.

By the way, catch the bonus for State Media's racist base?



Nothing says "happy saturday" more than pissing on Democrats and Angry Black Women cliches.

This is what Jeanette Epps actually looks like.




And her bio:
https://www.nasa.gov/astronauts/biog...epps/biography

.

Why was she removed? NASA isn't saying. It's either:
1: Health related. Something came up that would make a 6 month stay unwise, for example a lump in her breast or something of that nature.

2: This would be her first spaceflight, and with Commercial Crew and SLS delays to 2019/2020, and only a handful of Soyuz flights left on contract to the aging Space Station, NASA may prefer to fly someone with more flight experience until Commercial Crew flies regularly.


If it was disciplinary, she'd probably be removed outright.

But nothing like State Media to make it as horrible as possible.

[Sunseeker]

Yeah, those are great negotiating tactics. Just not when by doing so you shutdown the government, and possibly place thousands of the men and women (and their families), who sacrifice alot to protect this country, in danger of financial ruin.

If this isn't fixed before the 1st, military no longer gets paid.

Sorry, but the "think of the military!" argument isn't going to fly with me.

[Cts53]

Sorry, but the "think of the military!" argument isn't going to fly with me.

It's not think of the military, it's a statement of fact.

Fact is, military members are still required to work, as they fall under the "exception" category when it comes to government shutdowns. However, it is also against the law to pay military and federal employees during a government shutdown.

So, basically, after 1st Feb, all military members will be working without pay, to protect the rights of the rest of the USA.

That doesn't change how we still have rent to pay, food to buy, loans and bills to pay for, and all other expenses that come along with normal life. Yet, even though we will have those bills to pay, and we will continue to work and stand our posts, we wont get paid.

Either they get this shutdown fixed, pass another emergency bill like they did back in 2013, or thousands of men and women and their families could face financial ruin.

[Poopymonster]

It's not think of the military, it's a statement of fact.

Fact is, military members are still required to work, as they fall under the "exception" category when it comes to government shutdowns. However, it is also against the law to pay military and federal employees during a government shutdown.

So, basically, after 1st Feb, all military members will be working without pay, to protect the rights of the rest of the USA.

That doesn't change how we still have rent to pay, food to buy, loans and bills to pay for, and all other expenses that come along with normal life. Yet, even though we will have those bills to pay, and we will continue to work and stand our posts, we wont get paid.

Either they get this shutdown fixed, pass another emergency bill like they did back in 2013, or thousands of men and women and their families could face financial ruin.

Given the extreme partisanship that's been bubbling to the forefront the last few decades, with now 3 shutdowns in recent memory, you chose to go into a job knowing this type of bullshit might happen. You chose the job. If they don't pay you, you could potentially sue them for breach of contract. To my knowledge you do sign a contract for your employment, which should spell out the terms of your employment. If they broke the contract, why would you stay? You can always use the skills you gained at your current job to find another one.

[Cts53]

Given the extreme partisanship that's been bubbling to the forefront the last few decades, with now 3 shutdowns in recent memory, you chose to go into a job knowing this type of bullshit might happen. You chose the job. If they don't pay you, you could potentially sue them for breach of contract. To my knowledge you do sign a contract for your employment, which should spell out the terms of your employment. If they broke the contract, why would you stay? You can always use the skills you gained at your current job to find another one.

Your under contract with the military, the DOD. The only way out is to either wait out your contract, discharged due to medical reasons, or be dishonorably discharged.

Good luck getting a decent job after a dishonorable discharge.

The last gov shutdown happened in 2013, which I was ALREADY in the military. Before that, the last one was in 1996. I had just started grade school.

Yes I chose to join the military, nobody stuck a gun to my head. However I don't think you really understand what is going on to the military member here.

We actually work, we do our jobs that we are trained to do and then some, we deploy, we sacrifice, so that our country can stay safe. Of course there are other, personal reasons one joins the military.

Our families sacrifice alot just to support us, so that we can continue to do our job.

None of this takes away that we still have obligations at home. Mortgages/rent, bills and loans, food and household goods, cars and gas, clothes. If we stop getting paid, you can potentially lose your house, lose your insurance, take a hard hit on your credit score which, depending on your job in the military, cause you to no longer be fit for your job. All of this is completely outside of your control.

Yet, you still work. Many military members would love to have a 2nd job, outside the military. However, given our shifts and deployments, that's not possible. And not all of our spouses can get jobs either with the constant moving around, single parenting while we are on deployment.

None of the extremes that we see today were evident back in the 1990s, or even the early 2000s. Most young adults had never heard of a gov shutdown prior to 2013, and of course nobody talked about the possibility of military members NOT getting paid. I joined with the most knowledge that I could get at the time, to become independent, provide and establish my family, and to gain skills that could transfer to a well paying job in the civilian sector. I also joined to secure funding for college and further education. I did not join to work for no pay, while I watch my family suffer.

So excuse me if I find your response rather condescending and insulting to my intelligence. It, to my shock, is perfectly within the law to not pay troops during a gov shutdown. Nobody talk's about it, and since there hadn't been a shutdown since 1996, nobody ever mentioned it.

Your statement only shows me how little you know about being in the military. The growing disconnect (the gap) between military and the civilians we protect is saddening and astonishing to say the least.

[Sunseeker]

It's not think of the military, it's a statement of fact.

Fact is, military members are still required to work, as they fall under the "exception" category when it comes to government shutdowns. However, it is also against the law to pay military and federal employees during a government shutdown.

So, basically, after 1st Feb, all military members will be working without pay, to protect the rights of the rest of the USA.

That doesn't change how we still have rent to pay, food to buy, loans and bills to pay for, and all other expenses that come along with normal life. Yet, even though we will have those bills to pay, and we will continue to work and stand our posts, we wont get paid.

Either they get this shutdown fixed, pass another emergency bill like they did back in 2013, or thousands of men and women and their families could face financial ruin.

And? Your argument is that the Democrats need to cave in order to pay the military. You're pulling the same bullshit as McConnell, "We can only feed X group or Y group, pick one!" which is complete false so it's a bullshit argument. I didn't buy it when McConnell said it, I'm not buying it when you say it.

Military members vote overwhelmingly Republican. Maybe they shouldn't (on average) have voted for fucking shit for leadership? You reap what you sow.

[Heladys]

Enjoying watching little bitch Ryan cry about how the mean Democrats stopped the party with control of congress senate and presidency from passing anything.

[Cts53]

Oh boo fucking hoo. The republican party and Trump has been shitting all over all sorts of people but now that it effects you, suddenly its a big deal? Oh, and spare me your little victim complex at the end.

Thank you for proving my point.

I find it funny, to use one word, that the very people who enjoy their rights such as free speech here in the USA, seem so perfectly fine screwing over the people who sacrifice to protect those right.

I'm not giving a victim complex, I am stating facts about the situation at hand.

Essentially, is a Pay Our Military Act is not passed, military members are working without pay. I assume that nobody on here would be okay with working for no pay. Then tact of that you will most likely work well over 40 hours a week, for no pay. You will still be required to show up to work, for no pay, or face legal disciplinary action.

I don't think I've talked on these forums about politics really, in fact I haven't logged on in a rather long time. So, exactly where do you get your assumption from that I never cared before?

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And? Your argument is that the Democrats need to cave in order to pay the military. You're pulling the same bullshit as McConnell, "We can only feed X group or Y group, pick one!" which is complete false so it's a bullshit argument. I didn't buy it when McConnell said it, I'm not buying it when you say it.

Military members vote overwhelmingly Republican. Maybe they shouldn't (on average) have voted for fucking shit for leadership? You reap what you sow.

Wow your reading comprehension is terrible.

I never stated any of those things. All I said was both sides need to work together to come up with a solution, or pass a Pay Our Military Act like they did in 2013, otherwise thousands of hard working men and women, and their families, who have scarified alot for the safety of the USA, could face financial ruin.

But please, show me where I stated that "the democrats need to cave!". I actually said BOTH sides need to make compromises.

Perhaps if the gap between civilians and military members wasn't so large in society today, you would understand why a majority of military members vote republican, or least have a better understanding of what military members go through.

Your lack of understanding is extremely clear in your responses though.

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Don't vote republican.

Way to make assumptions!

Not all military members vote republican, and when did I say that I voted republican? Don't believe I ever did.

[Skroe]

It's not think of the military, it's a statement of fact.

Fact is, military members are still required to work, as they fall under the "exception" category when it comes to government shutdowns. However, it is also against the law to pay military and federal employees during a government shutdown.

So, basically, after 1st Feb, all military members will be working without pay, to protect the rights of the rest of the USA.

That doesn't change how we still have rent to pay, food to buy, loans and bills to pay for, and all other expenses that come along with normal life. Yet, even though we will have those bills to pay, and we will continue to work and stand our posts, we wont get paid.

Either they get this shutdown fixed, pass another emergency bill like they did back in 2013, or thousands of men and women and their families could face financial ruin.

Millions of government employees face furlougs. Millions more contractors who work for the government in all forms, are going similarly unpaid.

We are not a military state. We are a civilian one. US Defense requirements are a major priority no doubt (and rightly so), but it exists in a constellation with other priorities. The military is functionary. In essence, it is an organ of government that provide "defense service" no different than the the IRS does "taxation service" and the people who work for the Smithsonian provide "museum service". All of them are equal. The second we put one above the other, we're a military state. You may think "what? how can a museum research or an IRS guy be as important as a service member". The military fights. THe IRS guy enables everything to be paid for for that guy to fight. The museum researcher, protecting our national heritage, is responsible for the inheritance that makes that fight worth fighting. Everyone does their part. Everyone is equal.

You say others are condescending? I'll tell you what's condescending. To forget that civilians in government, or connected to government are every bit in the shit as service member. Yes you work, they don't. But they have bills to pay all the same, just like you.

This sucks. But it is supposed to suck, equally for everybody connected to government. Nobody gets off the hook. The word for that is "fair".

And let's not forget, this is NOT how things are supposed to go. We're here, because instead of electing reasonable people who say "send me to Washington and I'll start a partnership with the other side and come to common solutions", we send people who evoke war imagery against the other side and promise to "fight" their fellow Americans, which is intrinsically ridiculous because we are all on the same team.

Or to put it another way, this is what happens when 220 million Americans collectively decide to treat politics like a game... like a blood sport, and not something that every single one of them is responsible war.

Tell them that though, the other American Superpower activates: our incredible ability to be excuse makers for our failures as a people.

A shut down is not an act of god. A damn did not break. A tornado did not crush a building. We are here, because of things people decided to do. So how in any sense is this not entirely fair?

Representative Government. It is not a spectator sport.

[Cts53]

Oh, please do explain the bold part.

I can only explain for myself. I can't read everybody else's mind, and simply being in the military certainly does not give somebody hive mind thinking.

I would like to ask this though, why focus on the one part I posted instead of addressing the entire thing? Or is it because you have nothing to say about it?

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Millions of government employees face furlougs. Millions more contractors who work for the government in all forms, are going similarly unpaid.

We are not a military state. We are a civilian one. US Defense requirements are a major priority no doubt (and rightly so), but it exists in a constellation with other priorities. The military is functionary. In essence, it is an organ of government that provide "defense service" no different than the the IRS does "taxation service" and the people who work for the Smithsonian provide "museum service". All of them are equal. The second we put one above the other, we're a military state. You may think "what? how can a museum research or an IRS guy be as important as a service member". The military fights. THe IRS guy enables everything to be paid for for that guy to fight. The museum researcher, protecting our national heritage, is responsible for the inheritance that makes that fight worth fighting. Everyone does their part. Everyone is equal.

You say others are condescending? I'll tell you what's condescending. To forget that civilians in government, or connected to government are every bit in the shit as service member. Yes you work, they don't. But they have bills to pay all the same, just like you.

This sucks. But it is supposed to suck, equally for everybody connected to government. Nobody gets off the hook. The word for that is "fair".

And let's not forget, this is NOT how things are supposed to go. We're here, because instead of electing reasonable people who say "send me to Washington and I'll start a partnership with the other side and come to common solutions", we send people who evoke war imagery against the other side and promise to "fight" their fellow Americans, which is intrinsically ridiculous because we are all on the same team.

Or to put it another way, this is what happens when 220 million Americans collectively decide to treat politics like a game... like a blood sport, and not something that every single one of them is responsible war.

Tell them that though, the other American Superpower activates: our incredible ability to be excuse makers for our failures as a people.

A shut down is not an act of god. A damn did not break. A tornado did not crush a building. We are here, because of things people decided to do. So how in any sense is this not entirely fair?

Representative Government. It is not a spectator sport.

I have not once forgot about the civilians who work for the government who are affected. And I completely get and understand everything that you posted.

The people I am talking too are people who seem to take their rights for granted, and then are perfectly fine giving the finger to those who fight for those rights.

Sorry if it irritates me.