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  1. #21
    Field Marshal Jebiga's Avatar
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    Just want them to change vendetta to a self buff than I'm good

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by TheramoreIsTheBomb View Post
    remove roll the bones.
    remove roll the bones.
    remove roll the bones.
    How many people have to say it Blizzard?!
    seems like they removed rtb

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Master Guns View Post
    Where are you guys getting this info aside from virtually unreadable data mined info
    Wowhead is significantly more readable than MMO if that's your jam

  4. #24
    Scarab Lord Master Guns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feali View Post
    You just have to know how to read it.
    I don't doubt it, but looking at that mess gives me a migraine.

    Check out the directors cut of my project SCHISM, a festival winning short film
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiHNTS-vyHE

  5. #25
    The Patient
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    Expose Armor returns as well.
    Thread: Ranged vs Melee which is easier in PvE?
    'Originally Posted by Thelxi'
    Dragon farts stink so ranged

  6. #26
    The Insane Feali's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manthis View Post
    Expose Armor returns as well.
    It reads as a passively applied debuff though.

  7. #27
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feali View Post
    It reads as a passively applied debuff though.
    I don't think it's properly implemented yet.

    http://bfa.wowhead.com/class=4/rogue#spells:type=7

    If you read that list, it would say 'Passive' under it, like it does Safe Fall and Fleet Footed (other passive abilities). But it doesn't.
    Thread: Ranged vs Melee which is easier in PvE?
    'Originally Posted by Thelxi'
    Dragon farts stink so ranged

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Manthis View Post
    I don't think it's properly implemented yet.

    http://bfa.wowhead.com/class=4/rogue#spells:type=7

    If you read that list, it would say 'Passive' under it, like it does Safe Fall and Fleet Footed (other passive abilities). But it doesn't.
    true but it also says your damage exposes weaknesses which tells me its a passive from any damaging ability.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by scrappybristol View Post
    seems like they removed rtb
    No indication of that, and wowhead still has it as a spell and 2 talents referring to it.

  10. #30
    I just hope that someone other than us can see Poison Bomb next xpac if its the better talent.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by ro9ue View Post
    I personally like it, I just think Slice and Dice should be baseline and RTB should be a talent you can opt into if you like the RNG playstyle.


    At least with RTB you're always gettign some sort of bonus. The poison bomb RNG is either 100 or 0.
    I also enjoy RTB. I don't think swapping it with SnD will do anything. If one sims better people will do that one, whether it is the talent or the default. RTB is RNG so it either has to be better than the other things on its tier (in which case you go RTB and there is no difference between now and a version where it is a talent) or it is equal to or worse than the things on its tier, in which case most people take one of the other tier options because why risk RNG that at best performs equal to something consistent?

    Quote Originally Posted by Manthis View Post
    I don't think it's properly implemented yet.

    http://bfa.wowhead.com/class=4/rogue#spells:type=7

    If you read that list, it would say 'Passive' under it, like it does Safe Fall and Fleet Footed (other passive abilities). But it doesn't.
    It also has no cast time, range, or cooldown. As I recall it is the rogue version of a group "buff", which makes it unlikely to be rotational. It is probably a passive effect.
    Last edited by Hitei; 2018-01-27 at 05:37 AM.

  12. #32
    Deleted
    The only real change in 15 sec CD on Feint and its nerf to 40%, and do a lesser extent, continuing removal of CoS from our gameplay. Huge pander to the whiners, rest is pretty much fluff but you guys are all over it.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by trajandreps View Post
    The only real change in 15 sec CD on Feint and its nerf to 40%, and do a lesser extent, continuing removal of CoS from our gameplay. Huge pander to the whiners, rest is pretty much fluff but you guys are all over it.
    Good, maybe blizz can focus on making the three rogue specs more enjoyable, rather than holding them to the crutch of taking up the "soak bot" roll. And even with these nerfs, rogues still have very strong defensive utility. The nerf sucks but it was bound to happen especially with blizz making fights like KJ in Legion.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by elfporn View Post

    In WoD dispatch sped up the rotation significantly - at execute phase you could almost become gcd capped.
    you know that was due to the HFC setbonus right?

    I'm kinda disappointed a bit that dispatch is back, i'd rather them give us the bracer effect instead if they want an execute option for assa. that's a more elegant solution imo.


    as for sub, I'm excited about find weakness, It just seems kinda weird that it's basically anti synergy with the new shadowblade.
    but the new shadowblade is great, this is exactly what I wanted sub to have. our entire theme was "shadow damage" and we barely did any.

    the only thing that bothers me about find weakness, is it seems to promote the enveloping shadows dance every ~10 seconds to maximize it's uptime, instead of the burst window playstyle we have now which I absolutely love. I dont want to go back to the shadow dance spam build we had before 7.2


    Quote Originally Posted by Jebiga View Post
    Just want them to change vendetta to a self buff than I'm good
    do you know what the word "vendetta" means?:P

    I think it's fine for a debuff centric spec to have their main cooldown be a debuff too.

    it can be annoying sure, but specs need drawbacks.
    Last edited by shaunika123; 2018-01-27 at 08:06 AM.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by elfporn View Post
    Of course, you could just come across all ignorant and just yell “but it’s just 1+1=2”. Yes, it’s a button you press instead of another button at a specific point in an encounter; so fucking what, atleast it’s not so useless that no one ever chooses it as a talent ever.
    Isn't that exactly what a rotation or priority implies? pressing a different button for different circumstances? Dispatch is more exciting then HfB.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ro9ue View Post
    Only thing I'm a little disappointed about is the Poison Bomb basically only have a 20% chance to proc at 5cps. Just reduce the damage and make it 20% chance per CP so we have more control over our AOE damage. I'm sick of just having to get lucky. I hope I get into the beta because I'll be writing essays on some of these class changes (not just rogue)..
    They need to make it a proper activated ability. Like assassins Cannonball Barrage that does not suck.
    A witty saying proves nothing.
    -Voltaire
    winning
    plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Varolyn View Post
    Good, maybe blizz can focus on making the three rogue specs more enjoyable, rather than holding them to the crutch of taking up the "soak bot" roll. And even with these nerfs, rogues still have very strong defensive utility. The nerf sucks but it was bound to happen especially with blizz making fights like KJ in Legion.
    i honestly expected we'd lose cloak to being on the talent row with cheat and elusiveness. it could have been worse.

  17. #37
    Deleted
    - The return of Dispatch is great but I would never have replaced Hemorrhage by it. Hemorrhage needs a slight buff instead. Maybe the correct location of Dispatch is in place of Venom Rush.
    - Venom Rush is plain garbage : a fully passive talent that brings less on the table than Allacrity was. It should be base line as Assassination is already energy starved (see the waiting time on simC).
    - The Poison Bomb mechanic is still the same garbage. I would replace it by the Forgefiend's Fabricator mechanism (see http://www.wowhead.com/item=151963/f...onus=3610:1472) and of course still deal poison damage which scales with Mastery.
    - Mark for Death is a dead talent that should propably be merged with Anticipation (another dead talent).
    - The Venomous Wounds bonus should be reduced to 5 energy points but Instant Poison damage should trigger it.
    - Crimson Tempest should maybe trigger Venomous Wounds.
    - I would replace Anticipation by Poisoned Wound (Your bleed damage effects now splash Instant Poison on all other targets standing in an 8 yard area).
    Last edited by mmoc972a289242; 2018-01-27 at 09:28 AM.

  18. #38
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Djanco View Post
    i honestly expected we'd lose cloak to being on the talent row with cheat and elusiveness. it could have been worse.
    Remove this right now so blizz doenst get any weird ideas.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ithildine View Post
    - The return of Dispatch is great but I would never have replaced Hemorrhage by it. Hemorrhage needs a slight buff instead. Maybe the correct location of Dispatch is in place of Venom Rush.
    - Venom Rush is plain garbage : a fully passive talent that brings less on the table than Allacrity was. It should be base line as Assassination is already energy starved (see the waiting time on simC).
    - The Poison Bomb mechanic is still the same garbage. I would replace it by the Forgefiend's Fabricator mechanism (see http://www.wowhead.com/item=151963/f...onus=3610:1472) and of course still deal poison damage which scales with Mastery.
    - Mark for Death is a dead talent that should propably be merged with Anticipation (another dead talent).
    - The Venomous Wounds bonus should be reduced to 5 energy points but Instant Poison damage should trigger it.
    - Crimson Tempest should maybe trigger Venomous Wounds.
    - I would replace Anticipation by Poisoned Wound (Your bleed damage effects now splash Instant Poison on all other targets standing in an 8 yard area).
    That forefiend idea is actually really cool imo, but it should be with vials that would actually fit assa rogues imo. An on use aoe burst thing would be really good imo

  19. #39
    The Rogue changes in general are very conservative and not enough in the right direction. The nerfs to Feint and CloS are not going to last, because when you start to nerf key things like this of the Rogue class but don't compensate with better more consistent DPS mechanics or group utility the spec will be worse off overall.

    Venom Rush as a talent choice doesn't make sense given the spec relies on this. Speaking of talents that are too good to pass up how is Loaded Dice now a talent choice? RTB Outlaw doesn't work without Loaded Dice and that alone would drive even the few players using RTB on live currently to go SND.

    And since MFD is on the same talent tier as SND and Loaded Dice it implies Blizz made a purposeful choice to arrange the talents like this. This talent arrangement tells me that they do not know how to balance MFD and Outlaw's CDR via Restless Blades, so they are turning it into a dead talent for Outlaw. It is not like it is a common talent selected by Sub or Assassination on live, so I think they need to rethink the talent tiers, because MFD is very fun to use for questing, PVE and PVP in general as it has offensive and defensive applications.

    Sub having Find Weakness back is a welcomed change but it is hard to say how this will fit into how Sub is currently but I think Sub is going to see a lot more changes than anticipated. Disappointed with the Assassination and Outlaw changes as the specs need a fresh review of talents (eg base lining) like Sub had mid expansion of Legion. At least Assassination has Dispatch back which is welcomed, but other than that the Rogue community needs to be more vocal about additional changes, because on paper right now Rogues as a class isn't looking too great with what they have done.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafic View Post
    The Rogue changes in general are very conservative and not enough in the right direction. The nerfs to Feint and CloS are not going to last, because when you start to nerf key things like this of the Rogue class but don't compensate with better more consistent DPS mechanics or group utility the spec will be worse off overall.

    Venom Rush as a talent choice doesn't make sense given the spec relies on this. Speaking of talents that are too good to pass up how is Loaded Dice now a talent choice? RTB Outlaw doesn't work without Loaded Dice and that alone would drive even the few players using RTB on live currently to go SND.

    And since MFD is on the same talent tier as SND and Loaded Dice it implies Blizz made a purposeful choice to arrange the talents like this. This talent arrangement tells me that they do not know how to balance MFD and Outlaw's CDR via Restless Blades, so they are turning it into a dead talent for Outlaw. It is not like it is a common talent selected by Sub or Assassination on live, so I think they need to rethink the talent tiers, because MFD is very fun to use for questing, PVE and PVP in general as it has offensive and defensive applications.

    Sub having Find Weakness back is a welcomed change but it is hard to say how this will fit into how Sub is currently but I think Sub is going to see a lot more changes than anticipated. Disappointed with the Assassination and Outlaw changes as the specs need a fresh review of talents (eg base lining) like Sub had mid expansion of Legion. At least Assassination has Dispatch back which is welcomed, but other than that the Rogue community needs to be more vocal about additional changes, because on paper right now Rogues as a class isn't looking too great with what they have done.
    Assassination essentially gets the original Venom Rush baseline and not only that an improved version of it. Venomous Wounds refunds 12 energy per bleed baseline in BFA. Not only that, mut will also cost 5 less energy. Combine that with Sin mastery affecting bleeds now, and the changes for the spec look really promising.

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