Missing the 10 man Raids

[MisterBigglez]

10 man raids wouldn't work anymore except as casual content. Even in 20 man you have class stacking and useless specs that never get brought. None of the raids released in Legion would work well in a 10 man mythic setting. Its obvious Blizz has completely moved away from that design.

Yup, every year someone asks for 10 man to come back and they just straight up say no. It's easier for them to balance. While I would like 10 man to come back, I know it isn't, so i'll have to settle for 20.

[Dangg]

High end content shouldn't be easily reachable tbh. 20 geared players or don't do it

Why not? It worked fine for 2 expansions. It should have a skill and not number of players requirment.

[Crackleslap]

Just find a server and pick the faction with low pop and recruit all the people on that server! (What my guild does) We have over 20 people every raid night (3 nights, have to sit some for mythic). :P Obviously not a solution; but I do miss 10 & 25 man lockouts? :/

[potis]

Stop looking to goof around in Mythic. Go goof in LFR/Normal or Heroic lmao

Just because you find Mythic hard, doesnt mean we all do, there is a massive difference having 10 people that want to goof around in Mythic, than having 15 delusional bads that dont belong in Mythic, and 5 people that should change guild.

[Deleted]

10 man raiding was great because you took the best 10 players of your 25 man roster and smashed face.

And that was the problem.

Indeed. Because other 15 were screwed.

When 10=25 format was introduced in Cataclysm, it devastated many guilds. On most realms that used to have healthy raiding population only 1 or 2 25man guilds remained. Guilds disbanded left and right. Many quit WoW.

10 man high end raiding was the worst thing ever happen to WoW. No need to repeat Cataclysm to please vocal minority who confuse words "raid" and "group", they have m+ now for small group content.

[MrKnowItAll]

High end content shouldn't be easily reachable tbh. 20 geared players or don't do it

so im guessing you are in favor of the old raid attunements also then since it would make it harder to reach? that would prolly make you the only person in the world with that mindset.and why do you think blizzard introduced 10-man mythic back in the day?certainly not to make it harder to reach and in fact,quite the opposite.Unlike you i'd like to get the difficulty from somewhere else than from the process of getting 20 guys to be able to even try the mythic content.

[Blackmist]

If you could raid Mythic with 10-15 people, how do you think Blizzard could get away with charging all of you £19 a time to transfer to a server that's alive (for another expansion or two)?

Think, people. It's not about you.

[Kakera]

Delete this thread. Please.

[Carnedge]

Do I miss difficult raiding in a 10-man setup? Sure. Even when I was pushing hardcore 25-man HM/heroic raiding, I always enjoyed 10-man HM/heroics on off-nights to push achievements. But that team was really a selection of the best 10 people from our 25 man roster, so that also made a difference.

Do I want it back? Not really. Nostalgia aside, 10-man raiding brings with it a set of challenges that I don't relish reliving. If the devs tune encounters with 20 people in mind, and then dial it down to 10, you're inevitably going to have fights that are exponentially more difficult in 10-man. It boils down to resources, cooldowns, and bodies at that point. The alternative then is the devs need to design mythic encounters to change radically between 10 and 20 man. It's possible, sure. But I have a feeling the identity of the fight would be lost rather frequently, as the devs account for less people.

And to those that would tell me "if you don't want it, don't do it": you're absolutely right, I wouldn't have to do 10-man mythic. But, as we saw when 10-man raiding became a thing, the larger raid teams became less and less common. Ultimately many people will be subjected to 10-man raiding just because that's what the community will take a shift towards, even if they don't necessarily want to.

This is where Blizzard screwed up though. They should have just balanced around 10m and then adjusted to 25m so that 25m was technically "easier", since getting 25 people together is a challenge in itself.

It's a very fair trade off, and low pop server friendly.

But noooooo, we can't have anything nice.

[HyperJay]

so im guessing you are in favor of the old raid attunements also then since it would make it harder to reach? that would prolly make you the only person in the world with that mindset.and why do you think blizzard introduced 10-man mythic back in the day?certainly not to make it harder to reach and in fact,quite the opposite.Unlike you i'd like to get the difficulty from somewhere else than from the process of getting 20 guys to be able to even try the mythic content.

Unlike you I'd rather have Blizzard not waste time "scaling" Mythic by making Mythic Mechanics like Heroic Mechanics that don't require specific amounts of people, and instead use their time to make new content

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Just because you find Mythic hard, doesnt mean we all do, there is a massive difference having 10 people that want to goof around in Mythic, than having 15 delusional bads that dont belong in Mythic, and 5 people that should change guild.

Mythic isn't hard but why bother going into Mythic to goof off. Just go Heroic

[potis]

Unlike you I'd rather have Blizzard not waste time "scaling" Mythic by making Mythic Mechanics like Heroic Mechanics that don't require specific amounts of people, and instead use their time to make new content

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Mythic isn't hard but why bother going into Mythic to goof off. Just go Heroic

Because HC gets cleared too fast usually and there are months remaining of nothing to do and Mythic 10man would be godly despite goofing around? And by goofing around i simply mean we do not raid seriously anymore, the 1.5h-5h/week is more than enough, HC gets tiring really fast, especially when its undertuned like this tier.

[HyperJay]

Because HC gets cleared too fast usually and there are months remaining of nothing to do and Mythic 10man would be godly despite goofing around? And by goofing around i simply mean we do not raid seriously anymore, the 1.5h-5h/week is more than enough, HC gets tiring really fast, especially when its undertuned like this tier.

an hour and a half is like Heroic Skip and First two on Mythic without goofing whats even the point.

[NomCarver]

I prefer 20 man. 10 man doesn't feel like a true raid to me. I have always enjoyed 25 man over 10 man for that reason.

[potis]

an hour and a half is like Heroic Skip and First two on Mythic without goofing whats even the point.

The point is the raids are supposed to 2-2.5h, aka max 5h/week, when the raid becomes 1.5h as it has been for a few weeks now, you get bored, and you either unsub till next expansion or go Mythic.

We cant go Mythic to goof around the same way and probably do something like 6/10 in the next months for the hell of it, only thing left is to either unsub, or alts to repeat the HC, but HC is mega boring, therefor,unsub.

[HyperJay]

The point is the raids are supposed to 2-2.5h, aka max 5h/week, when the raid becomes 1.5h as it has been for a few weeks now, you get bored, and you either unsub till next expansion or go Mythic.

We cant go Mythic to goof around the same way and probably do something like 6/10 in the next months for the hell of it, only thing left is to either unsub, or alts to repeat the HC, but HC is mega boring, therefor,unsub.

You legit can't expect to do much in Mythic if your guild can't get 20 or only plans to raid about 2 and a half hours.
Level alts and gear them, do other content who cares

[otro]

IMO preference has little to do with it. Unless you are in a major realm you WILL have a hard time getting a good roster of 20-22 players in the same or close enough skill gap.

I too prefere 20 and did prefer 25 back then but I'll have to transfer my 12 110s and completly abandon my server community if I want to be competitve or even get a cutting edge before the next tier... recruiting good enough players is not an option sadly.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

10 man allowed raiding to be challenging for a lot more people. Once it went to 20 it became a lot more exclusive. There is a reason most guilds went to 10 man raiding. Path of least resistance. Less resistance means more players able to raid at a less than droll level obviously. But some people felt that other people killing pixels was a problem even though they never meet or talk to those people. They wanted fewer people killing pixels because they need something to feel good about. Obviously life wasn't doing it for them so raiding had too.. thus.. here we are at a more exclusive spot for raiding and mythic+ pretty much ripping a ton of its audience away from it because.. wow.. a lot of people like smaller groups with challenging content that is rewarding. Oh.. by the way.. in a 20 man mythic guild sooooo.. right.. the whole "get a guild noob" or "you had 6 months to recruit after announcement idiot" type of classic replies fall pretty fucking short. Because of these mentalities Blizzard is going to move more and more to mythic+ and away from raiding. the raiding community is just to toxic and demands to much exclusiveness to something that really doesn't matter if it is exclusive or not because the only kill that matters is first, and if you aren't on a list of about 100-120 people in the WHOLE WORLD you aren't getting it.

Cheers.

[Deleted]

Yes they need bring back 10 man raid les people les stupidity more gameplay

[Gaidax]

If you could raid Mythic with 10-15 people, how do you think Blizzard could get away with charging all of you £19 a time to transfer to a server that's alive (for another expansion or two)?

Think, people. It's not about you.

What? I don't even...

The logic leaps... so huge.

[nocturnus]

Well, the good news is we won't be forced to raid for tiers anymore in the next xpac

I also prefer smaller groups; the smaller the better. Which is why I was happy with the mythic + implementation and why I stopped raiding when they removed 10 man Mythic.

I also think that with the disappearance of tier sets, people will eventually stop raiding. We'll see soon enough.