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  1. #41
    Titan Charge me Doctor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    You are unable to use, e.g. frost spells as arcane (except frost nova), that's what I mean. In Vanilla you could; not as efficiently as a frost mage ofc, but you could nonetheless. Now you just can't - for all intents and purposes, frost mage could be another class, with a few utility spells in common.
    I can use frost spells, frost nova, frozen ring and ice block, so it's non-issue (if you want to continue this cherry picking you should go with "arcane can't use fire spells!" and i already tired of this argument, i've been talking about it for years - it just doesn't make any sense for someone heavily specialized into fire magic to use frost magic, if they can do same shit with their favorable element).

    It's a game, and for gameplay purposes we have an ability to respec (if you wouldn't be able to respec - a call for making specs - classes, actually would have at least some sense in it, but still it wouldn't matter), specializations went from "small tweaks to how your abilities work" to "you get a whole bunch of new tools that make your old tools obsolete or OP as fuck in combination with everything else, so we take it away and/or alter it to fit the theme more". Which is fine, and doesn't make specializations "new classes" or whatever

    Back in vanilla arcane wasn't a "spec" if you want to call it, it was an augmentation tree, you dump a lot of points into it and get better in both fire and frost.

    It couldn't be another class, because it's a spec of a class. If you imagine classes in games to be as bland and boring as singular specs - well, i have nothing to say, classes should be different both gameplay and fantasy-wise, having, basically, 3 similar classes is just stupid.
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  2. #42
    Scarab Lord Soon-TM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    I can use frost spells, frost nova, frozen ring and ice block
    It couldn't be another class, because it's a spec of a class. If you imagine classes in games to be as bland and boring as singular specs - well, i have nothing to say, classes should be different both gameplay and fantasy-wise, having, basically, 3 similar classes is just stupid.
    Yay you named utility spells, how witty m8, you know that's exactly what I meant, even if I forgot to mention them. The thing is, I prefer classes well differentiated from each other, each with strengths and weaknesses, rather than this BS "class fantasy" that they've feeding us as of late. If any spec can do anything, then they all must have roughly the same toolkit and voilà homogeneization.

    That's where I simply disagree. "Bring the player, not the class" has been one of the worst things to happen to this game. Although it has certainly filled Kotick's pockets, so YMMV

  3. #43
    Titan Charge me Doctor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    Yay you named utility spells, how witty m8, you know that's exactly what I meant, even if I forgot to mention them. The thing is, I prefer classes well differentiated from each other, each with strengths and weaknesses, rather than this BS "class fantasy" that they've feeding us as of late. If any spec can do anything, then they all must have roughly the same toolkit and voilà homogeneization.

    That's where I simply disagree. "Bring the player, not the class" has been one of the worst things to happen to this game. Although it has certainly filled Kotick's pockets, so YMMV
    So utility spells aren't spells now?

    And classes are well differentiated from each other, you can't say that rogues "are basically warriors with one-handers", or that "warlocks are magi with dots".

    Any spec can't do anything, that's the whole point of specs, they excel at different things. Just look at mage representation in M+ vs Antorus and you'll get the point - different challenges require different tools, and classes aren't homogenized enough "to be able to do anything".

    Class fantasy is exactly what you are talking about, well differentiated classes require rich class fantasy, if you'll look at BfA alpha you'll see where it's heading, and i personally really like it.

    Disagree with what exactly? You just brought "bring the player, not the class" into discussion to disagree with it yourself?
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  4. #44
    The only real difference is classes were balanced and designed back then, but now specs are. That will need to change if classic is going to be successful for years instead of months.
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  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Hey There Guys its Metro View Post
    The only real difference is classes were balanced and designed back then, but now specs are. That will need to change if classic is going to be successful for years instead of months.
    I think a lot of people are going to disagree with you there. The game will be successful if it's literally a direct port from Vanilla... they don't NEED to change anything at all for it to be successful... some changes might make it better though, who knows

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