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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Witchblade77 View Post

    P.S. whenever gun specific violence statistics get brought up, what I wonder about is.. was violence overall reduced? was death rate? and even though, controversial opinion and all, but I'm starting to think that majority of american public is neither mature, nor responsible enough to be allowed around any kind of dangerous tools. be it guns, power tools or cars. given our rates of deadly occurrences because someone did something they shouldn't have.
    Yes it has been in the US. Been on the decline since the 1990's. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_..._United_States
    Last edited by Ghostpanther; 2018-02-18 at 01:59 PM.

  2. #42
    Because when most of us are faced with reality of some things, it becomes less important what some statistic or graph tells us, because you are suddenly part of that statistic and that means you have an incentive to prevent others from joining it, because you know what the feelings are that said person will have to go through.
    I'm not racist, I merely have a tolerance deficiency

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Witchblade77 View Post
    for the same reason people go vehemently anti-vax after their child experiences negative side effects. no i'm not talking about autism. there is actual small chance for adverse reaction to vaccines that comes with variety of symptoms, that is listed by the manufacturer and all. its a smaller chance then negative side effects from common medications like pain killers, etc, but it DOES exist. and even though the chance is incredibly small compared to benefits? guess what? people STILL react emotionally becasue they were affected personaly.

    its human nature.

    sometimes.. those human reactions are for the better. like when someone who is vehemently anti lgbt, changes their stance due to a close relative or a child coming out. sometimes they are for the worse, and you get anti vax movement. and sometimes you get "ban all guns"

    P.S. whenever gun specific violence statistics get brought up, what I wonder about is.. was violence overall reduced? was death rate? and even though, controversial opinion and all, but I'm starting to think that majority of american public is neither mature, nor responsible enough to be allowed around any kind of dangerous tools. be it guns, power tools or cars. given our rates of deadly occurrences because someone did something they shouldn't have.
    Over all death rates from crime are reduced. People like to make comparisons to knives and how they can kill people too with is technically correct...however. Killing someone with a gun vs a knife is a VERY different crime. The statistics of gun deaths have little correlation with other types of killings. Comparing gun violence to knife violence is a little like comparing knife killings to poison killings. Besides the end result, the 2 have virtually nothing in common and not finding botulin is unlikely to make you grab a bread knife and go on a knifing spree.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Najnaj View Post
    Over all death rates from crime are reduced. People like to make comparisons to knives and how they can kill people too with is technically correct...however. Killing someone with a gun vs a knife is a VERY different crime. The statistics of gun deaths have little correlation with other types of killings. Comparing gun violence to knife violence is a little like comparing knife killings to poison killings. Besides the end result, the 2 have virtually nothing in common and not finding botulin is unlikely to make you grab a bread knife and go on a knifing spree.
    its an act of often deadly violence. at least some of the time against multiple people, with often the same motivations and the main difference being acess or lack of there of to other weapons. mass stabbings ARE actualy a thing that happens. the reason I bring it up is because i don't think we are fixing an underlying issue. also... biggest problem with gun control in US, is that existing measures are already not being enforced properly, and then there is a matter of fbi outright ignoring the reports. underlying issue. (that and trying to outright disarm the population of US is ... a daunting task to put it mildly). slightly less deadly violence is STILL deadly violence. when someone disgruntled drives into a crowd of people trying to hit as many as possible and killing at least several. does it honestly make their death any better, just becasue they didn't happen from a gun?

    as far as violence goes, I read a fantastic article the other day. https://www.rd.com/advice/parenting/...ying-strategy/ becasue what we DO need to do is work on fixing the causes. not merely symptoms.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by belfpala View Post
    How is that a biased argument?

    If someone originally thinks, "I like guns." Then realizes, "Oh shit, guns kill people." Then decide, "Maybe my original position was flawed."

    That's intellectual honesty.
    I like guns isn't an argument, it's an opinion. Oh shit, guns kill people isn't an argument, it's flawed logic or more accurately not a whole truth.

  6. #46
    Merely a Setback Hubcap's Avatar
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    Well if someone is pro-gun and their brother is murdered for no reason by someone with a gun and that changes their attitude, it's understandable, they got new information that changed their opinion, it happens all the time with some of us.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Gouky View Post
    Well that depends on your original argument and how come it suddenly changed only because it suddenly affects you personally.
    Isn't this is why family members can't testify in court?

    If I was against welfare, but suddenly change my mind because I became dependent on the goverment, isn't that irrational and biased?
    People who use this argumentation usually don't present their original or current argument just the fact they have changed their mind.
    Or maybe just maybe you were stupidly biased before and your exposure to new realities made you feel that hey maybe my original position was wrong.


    You have almost literally no idea what bias is apparently.

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    Quote Originally Posted by McFuu View Post
    I like guns isn't an argument, it's an opinion. Oh shit, guns kill people isn't an argument, it's flawed logic or more accurately not a whole truth.
    He didn't say it was an argument please learn to read.
    “Logic: The art of thinking and reasoning in strict accordance with the limitations and incapacities of the human misunderstanding.”
    "Conservative, n: A statesman who is enamored of existing evils, as distinguished from the Liberal who wishes to replace them with others."
    Ambrose Bierce
    The Bird of Hermes Is My Name, Eating My Wings To Make Me Tame.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by shimerra View Post
    Or maybe just maybe you were stupidly biased before and your exposure to new realities made you feel that hey maybe my original position was wrong.


    You have almost literally no idea what bias is apparently.

    - - - Updated - - -



    He didn't say it was an argument please learn to read.
    The whole thread is about arguments. He's making the insinuation that changing your opinion would change your argument.

    Learn to comprehend.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Gouky View Post
    Hello,

    Why do people think that if people suddenly support something because of bias makes their original argument invalid?

    For example people who change their opinion on Guns, because some one in their family gets killed and they make some emotional argument and change their mind.

    Why people are using this to support their argument, when it's clearly emotional and irrational?

    Thank you
    Because humans are crazy, untrustworthy, and emotional.

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