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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by gaymer77 View Post
    10. Dev changes - Honestly I haven't heard anyone complain about imbalance or class changes in the game or that a certain class was drastically changed since the game was released. I may be wrong but I haven't heard anyone say this.
    I have to disagree with this one and it's basically why i don't play it full time.

    With elite specializations and balance changes, your best gear stats change. Their balance wasn't good, for example, just recently mirage was bugged and out of control and they ended up redesigning core mesmer mechanics. The raid buffs situation has also led to stacking of certain classes making it almost impossible for others. They have been working on it and it's getting better. But balance is not really as "tight" as in WoW and when they change your class/spec and you now need a whole new set of Ascended gear.. it's soul crushing.
    It can at least be traded between characters, but a balance patch can easily knock you off raid viability and into grinding for a new gear set for weeks. It's not a very good feeling and legendaries are horribly expensive and time consuming to make.

    There may be a way to change stats of ascended gear on the forge? I have no idea because another problem of the game is that it hardly explains how anything works and extensive out of game research is needed. And, i don't mean raid encounters, but just game design.
    Last edited by Nemmar; 2018-02-25 at 01:16 AM.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Nemmar View Post
    There may be a way to change stats of ascended gear on the forge?
    Actually yes, there is for armor and weapon. The hardest part are insignias/inscription, since they are account bound for expansion sets of stats.
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stat_changing#Ascended
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
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    They never found one though

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Nemmar View Post
    I have to disagree with this one and it's basically why i don't play it full time.

    With elite specializations and balance changes, your best gear stats change. Their balance wasn't good, for example, just recently mirage was bugged and out of control and they ended up redesigning core mesmer mechanics. The raid buffs situation has also led to stacking of certain classes making it almost impossible for others. They have been working on it and it's getting better. But balance is not really as "tight" as in WoW and when they change your class/spec and you know need a whole new set of Ascended gear.. it's soul crushing.
    It can at least be traded between characters, but a balance patch can easily knock you off raid viability and into grinding for a new gear set for weeks. It's not a very good feeling and legendaries are horribly expensive and time consuming to make.

    There may be a way to change stats of ascended gear on the forge? I have no idea because another problem of the game is that it hardly explains how anything works and extensive out of game research is needed. And, i don't mean raid encounters, but just game design.
    yea the games biggest issue is that Anet 100% has no idea what they are doing in terms of balance, especially without a test realm to actually test things. Just look at this last patch, they made confusion completely worthless in PvE and gave no compensation at all to make up the damage, mirage relied on confusion as it's main dot and it's dps tanked by half, making it complete garbage.

    It look a forum riot and a week for them to replace mirages confusion with torment - which nobody asked for they just wanted confusion to work in PvE again. So this torment fix "fixed" mirage dps but still left confusion in general complete garbage in PvE.

    They honestly have no idea how to balance the game, it's just darts with them.
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  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nemmar View Post
    I have to disagree with this one and it's basically why i don't play it full time.

    With elite specializations and balance changes, your best gear stats change. Their balance wasn't good, for example, just recently mirage was bugged and out of control and they ended up redesigning core mesmer mechanics. The raid buffs situation has also led to stacking of certain classes making it almost impossible for others. They have been working on it and it's getting better. But balance is not really as "tight" as in WoW and when they change your class/spec and you know need a whole new set of Ascended gear.. it's soul crushing.
    It can at least be traded between characters, but a balance patch can easily knock you off raid viability and into grinding for a new gear set for weeks. It's not a very good feeling and legendaries are horribly expensive and time consuming to make.

    There may be a way to change stats of ascended gear on the forge? I have no idea because another problem of the game is that it hardly explains how anything works and extensive out of game research is needed. And, i don't mean raid encounters, but just game design.
    There was definitly a time where PVE balance was a lot more annoying, classes hover around the same DPS now. There was a time where no one brought power builds to raids, now they are all over the place. Where you had to bring a mirror comp of 2 chronos, 2 PS banner condi warriors, 2 druids, and more than likely 4 eles or reapers (before reapers were nerfed). Even then, the "meta" is far from required to clear raid and most raiders aren't performing optimally anyway. A 32k benchmark translates into ~20k dps on a good day on most bosses.

    What armor builds changed though? I know Chrono got freed up, just about everything else stayed the same. Berseker and Viper with grieving being a luxury for some specs.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by zito View Post
    yea the games biggest issue is that Anet 100% has no idea what they are doing in terms of balance, especially without a test realm to actually test things. Just look at this last patch, they made confusion completely worthless in PvE and gave no compensation at all to make up the damage, mirage relied on confusion as it's main dot and it's dps tanked by half, making it complete garbage.

    It look a forum riot and a week for them to replace mirages confusion with torment - which nobody asked for they just wanted confusion to work in PvE again. So this torment fix "fixed" mirage dps but still left confusion in general complete garbage in PvE.

    They honestly have no idea how to balance the game, it's just darts with them.
    I'm an altaholic, when Mirage dropped I spec'd one of my mesmers for it and was having a ton of fun with it, though I'm sure I wasn't built right. I've had Runes of Perplexity since they were new, I'm not changing now! So yeah, the changes screwed stuff up, but it just means I move to an alt. I've mostly been wandering around with my Holosmith anyway.

    My friend that pvp's though, the balance stuff is driving her insane. She's half left the game due to it. Big exploit builds flood the matches until GW2 finally fixes that, but the fix breaks something else and that becomes the build of the moment.


    Compared to WoW, I like GW2 better for melee, but I do like a good caster rotation from WoW/ TOR.

    As far as no redeeming qualities, WoW has nabbed so many features from GW2, obviously THEY think so. Not sure why folks can't like more than one thing at a time...
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  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Svifnymr View Post
    I'm an altaholic, when Mirage dropped I spec'd one of my mesmers for it and was having a ton of fun with it, though I'm sure I wasn't built right. I've had Runes of Perplexity since they were new, I'm not changing now! So yeah, the changes screwed stuff up, but it just means I move to an alt. I've mostly been wandering around with my Holosmith anyway.

    My friend that pvp's though, the balance stuff is driving her insane. She's half left the game due to it. Big exploit builds flood the matches until GW2 finally fixes that, but the fix breaks something else and that becomes the build of the moment.


    Compared to WoW, I like GW2 better for melee, but I do like a good caster rotation from WoW/ TOR.

    As far as no redeeming qualities, WoW has nabbed so many features from GW2, obviously THEY think so. Not sure why folks can't like more than one thing at a time...
    funny enough after the torment changes to mirage with the confusion nerf mirage became even more hated in PvP because they are even more ridiculous with high torment than high confusion. With confusion there was still some counter play but with torment the only counter play is to not move which in return..... you'll just stand and die by being tunneled.

    The PvE confusion change fucked everything up for no reason other than Anet can't admit their mistakes (they never do) and now mirage is even more of a monster than before (I think their number 2 for highest dps too don't quote but it's near the top)
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  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by zito View Post
    funny enough after the torment changes to mirage with the confusion nerf mirage became even more hated in PvP because they are even more ridiculous with high torment than high confusion. With confusion there was still some counter play but with torment the only counter play is to not move which in return..... you'll just stand and die by being tunneled.

    The PvE confusion change fucked everything up for no reason other than Anet can't admit their mistakes (they never do) and now mirage is even more of a monster than before (I think their number 2 for highest dps too don't quote but it's near the top)
    According to the benchmarks on reddit they're 3rd in terms of small hitboxes, only slightly above Spellbreaker. Weavers, DHs, and Spellbreakers tend to beat Mirage in most fractal fights. Realistically the classes do about the same amount of DPS.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    There was definitly a time where PVE balance was a lot more annoying, classes hover around the same DPS now. There was a time where no one brought power builds to raids, now they are all over the place. Where you had to bring a mirror comp of 2 chronos, 2 PS banner condi warriors, 2 druids, and more than likely 4 eles or reapers (before reapers were nerfed). Even then, the "meta" is far from required to clear raid and most raiders aren't performing optimally anyway. A 32k benchmark translates into ~20k dps on a good day on most bosses.

    What armor builds changed though? I know Chrono got freed up, just about everything else stayed the same. Berseker and Viper with grieving being a luxury for some specs.
    I meant like for example warriors went from power to viper. Engineers went from vipers to power with holosmith.

    Guardian kind of went power to something viperish with Firebrand. It's all very annoying hecause ascended gear requires alot of work to get and you ain't raiding without it.

  9. #29
    GW2 has much of the cool shit WoW has, but your shit never becomes useless. If you get a legendary now it will still be good two expansions from now. Honestly it is free to play now I would say try it out, just remember unlike WoW there is no real dedicated spec for healing (though it can be beefed up for many classes) and everyone kind of does a bit of healing and your health regenerates quite quickly after taking no damage for a small period of time. GW2 is more about group buffing to reduce/reflect incoming damage while everyone kicks the shit out of mobs. I could go on but trying the game out is the best way to experience it.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nemmar View Post
    I meant like for example warriors went from power to viper. Engineers went from vipers to power with holosmith.

    Guardian kind of went power to something viperish with Firebrand. It's all very annoying hecause ascended gear requires alot of work to get and you ain't raiding without it.
    In the most recent patch power and viper warriors are about even, power warriors dominate in fractals, yeah but in Heart of Thorns the balance was trash. Actually the same for guardians too. Or did you mean when they introduced new elite specs that a that usually went power gained and option for condi or whatever?


    https://snowcrows.com/benchmarks/


    I forgot to add that changing your stats on ascended gear is fairly simple.

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stat_changing#Ascended

    <The item you're changing> + insignia/inscription of the stats you want + 5 ectos + Anthology of Heroes (found at the mystic forge vendor for some spirit shards)

    The only drawback it that it eats your runes/sigils.

  11. #31
    Herald of the Titans gaymer77's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nemmar View Post
    I meant like for example warriors went from power to viper. Engineers went from vipers to power with holosmith.

    Guardian kind of went power to something viperish with Firebrand. It's all very annoying hecause ascended gear requires alot of work to get and you ain't raiding without it.
    There have been plenty of times that WoW has done some tweaks to classes and it literally change every stat weight for your spec. That means you'd have to get different pieces of gear just because a patch changed what you want to have compared to what you previously wanted to have. Add in the whole legendary items in Legion and you have some classes that want a certain stat up until they get that specific legendary and then it completely changes once you get it. But with WoW, there's no changing the stats on gear anymore unlike GW2 where you can change the stats on gear the same day a patch changes what stats you want for your profession.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    In the most recent patch power and viper warriors are about even, power warriors dominate in fractals, yeah but in Heart of Thorns the balance was trash. Actually the same for guardians too. Or did you mean when they introduced new elite specs that a that usually went power gained and option for condi or whatever?


    https://snowcrows.com/benchmarks/


    I forgot to add that changing your stats on ascended gear is fairly simple.

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stat_changing#Ascended

    <The item you're changing> + insignia/inscription of the stats you want + 5 ectos + Anthology of Heroes (found at the mystic forge vendor for some spirit shards)

    The only drawback it that it eats your runes/sigils.
    Yes, another poster already linked that. Keep up with the convo.

    It's still annoying having to doall those things everytime balance changes. It could be worse, but it isn't great.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by gaymer77 View Post
    There have been plenty of times that WoW has done some tweaks to classes and it literally change every stat weight for your spec. That means you'd have to get different pieces of gear just because a patch changed what you want to have compared to what you previously wanted to have. Add in the whole legendary items in Legion and you have some classes that want a certain stat up until they get that specific legendary and then it completely changes once you get it. But with WoW, there's no changing the stats on gear anymore unlike GW2 where you can change the stats on gear the same day a patch changes what stats you want for your profession.
    Getting a piece of gear in wow doesnt take 3 days and alot of mat grinding per piece. It's not comparable. Everything is more expensive in GW2, even if you are just changing stats, you are gonna have to do that in multiple pieces and will probably have to grind a new set of jewelry, not to mention the huge gold cost to get the best sigils. It is only ok if you play the game constantly and grind that gold.

    Don't pass this as something as trivial as queing for a dungeon or raid in WoW. One takes many days on grinding, the other you can do in one. But, given gold is so valuable in GW2, having to do that kind of investment with each balance patch and/or expansion when more optimal gear stats come is something that feels pointless to me and kinda pushes me away from high level content in the game.
    Last edited by Nemmar; 2018-02-26 at 11:55 PM.

  13. #33
    Herald of the Titans gaymer77's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nemmar View Post
    Getting a piece of gear in wow doesnt take 3 days and alot of mat grinding per piece. It's not comparable. Everything is more expensive in GW2, even if you are just changing stats, you are gonna have to do that in multiple pieces and will probably have to grind a new set of jewelry, not to mention the huge gold cost to get the best sigils. It is only ok if you play the game constantly and grind that gold.

    Don't pass this as something as trivial as queing for a dungeon or raid in WoW. One takes many days on grinding, the other you can do in one. But, given gold is so valuable in GW2, having to do that kind of investment with each balance patch and/or expansion when more optimal gear stats come is something that feels pointless to me and kinda pushes me away from high level content in the game.
    LMFAO did you seriously just imply that getting replacement gear in WoW takes less than 1 day and that it's easy to do because you can just queue for a dungeon or raid? Seriously ONE day max? And then you say it takes 3 days minimum + tons of gold to get replacement gear in GW2? Dude that is some rather good crack you're smoking if you honestly believe that dribble. In the month since my boyfriend hit 110 on his monk, he's acquired ZERO pieces of gear himself that wasn't crafted or given to him from me on my druid that didn't need the gear or from another member in the raid who didn't need the gear but got it in his personal loot for a boss. ZERO PIECES! Compare that with GW2 which allows you to literally change the stats on gear into what your profession & specialization needs the same day a patch goes live and changes what you want for stats (assuming you have the gold for it the mats). When WoW removed reforging they forced players to have to get a whole new set of gear if changes were made to what their spec wants. Like I said, there have been multiple times WoW has changed stuff and made one stat crappy for a spec that it previously used as it's main stat. And every expansion changes stat weights for nearly every single class since classes get redesigned nearly every expansion so your argument that GW2 changing desired stats on an expansion is pretty invalid.
    Last edited by gaymer77; 2018-02-27 at 12:30 AM.

  14. #34
    The Insane Eleccybubb's Avatar
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    If I had to say which game had the easier time gearing from personal experience would be WoW. I mean I can be Antorus Normal ready in a day or two at most.

    GW2 has quite a few variables however working on the ascended pieces for my Viper Necro build/pet build was actually quite fun. It took a bit of time and effort to obtain the mats. Although admittedly I did slack a bit and haven't done my jewelry yet hehehe.

    To be honest I don't pay much attention to the strongest builds in GW2 because I don't raid and I'm not too fussed about high end fractals. It's a game I play just to chill with.

    I think both games have their own way of gearing up and that's fine. GW2 is a bit more grindy because once you are geared other than changing stats that's it. Which is one of my criticisms of the system. I like that it does it's own thing with no new level cap so no new big gear treadmill but I prefer the treadmill personally. I like working towards a new level and set of gear and Masteries just didn't hit that spot for me.
    Last edited by Eleccybubb; 2018-02-27 at 03:41 AM.
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  15. #35
    BTW has the game finally got the proper cutscenes?

  16. #36
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    I think the whole "which game is easier to gear up in" depends on tne one you know/like more.

    I have more than enough ascended sets in gw2. The handful of my toons who dont have ascended sets are ones I go months without playing.

    Every once in awhile Ill sub to WoW and have no idea how to catch back up and usually get bored before my month is up.

    Also what is there to do in WoW after you geared up? Rerun raids? GW2 has that. Achieves? GW2 has that. Transmogs? GW2 has that. PVP? GW2 has that.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Meat Rubbing Specialist View Post
    As I said none "over any other good MMO". Nothing GW2 does is better than any other popular MMO. Especially Combat lmfao. GW2 has the worst Combat of like the top 10 current MMO's.
    Subjective. I actually liked GW2s combat more than WoWs.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by gaymer77 View Post
    LMFAO did you seriously just imply that getting replacement gear in WoW takes less than 1 day and that it's easy to do because you can just queue for a dungeon or raid? Seriously ONE day max? And then you say it takes 3 days minimum + tons of gold to get replacement gear in GW2? Dude that is some rather good crack you're smoking if you honestly believe that dribble. In the month since my boyfriend hit 110 on his monk, he's acquired ZERO pieces of gear himself that wasn't crafted or given to him from me on my druid that didn't need the gear or from another member in the raid who didn't need the gear but got it in his personal loot for a boss. ZERO PIECES! Compare that with GW2 which allows you to literally change the stats on gear into what your profession & specialization needs the same day a patch goes live and changes what you want for stats (assuming you have the gold for it the mats). When WoW removed reforging they forced players to have to get a whole new set of gear if changes were made to what their spec wants. Like I said, there have been multiple times WoW has changed stuff and made one stat crappy for a spec that it previously used as it's main stat. And every expansion changes stat weights for nearly every single class since classes get redesigned nearly every expansion so your argument that GW2 changing desired stats on an expansion is pretty invalid.
    Ok, first... wall of text.

    Now to the arguments. Your boyfriend didn't try very hard. Get to Argus and kill the (not so) rares. You can get a full set of gear in less than a day. I don't recall the ilvl, but it's blue gear in the latest tier. On the way, he will get argunite wich he can use to get 910 gear to fill up wichever pieces he hasnt. He will easily get in ilvl range to do mythic dungeons and LFR. I have done this you know. People do that on their Alts. You can easily get to ilvl900+ in one day.

    In GW2, you can buy the exotics, really easy. But, they don't have ideal stats unless you craft them. Grind and gold again, but bearable. Nw the difference is that WoW has a progression curve, so as you get gear, you gain acess to higher difficulties and better gear. GW2 requires the best gear to get in the highest content and isn't a progressive system. To get ascended gear, you're gonna have to grind gold, mats and dailies for the jewelry. That is to be expected in an mmo, but you are gonna have to either luck out with rare drops from world bosses/fractals or you will have to craft them, wich takes a long ass time for mats and gold. Theres crafting CD's that garantee you will take weeks to get a full set. It took me about a month.

    Now once you've done all that, patch comes. You need to grind gold and mats to make those sigils and get grinding dailies for a new set of jewelry. This was all just in one catacter. As you know, gold is extremely valuable in GW2. Not the candy it is in WoW. Unless you want to buy gold, but that defeats the purpose. It's P2Win.
    Do try to look at things objectively. What you have to do in GW2 is grind alot of gold and dailies. It takes a long time depending on your crafting professions and gold. All the grinding isn't fun.

    In WoW, you kill some rares and you do dungeons and raids. You are having fun and getting rewarded.

    Now, i'm not saying one is better than the other. Theres alot i like in GW2. But, gearing is significantly easier on WoW. It's not even a contest.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    I think the whole "which game is easier to gear up in" depends on tne one you know/like more.

    I have more than enough ascended sets in gw2. The handful of my toons who dont have ascended sets are ones I go months without playing.

    Every once in awhile Ill sub to WoW and have no idea how to catch back up and usually get bored before my month is up.

    Also what is there to do in WoW after you geared up? Rerun raids? GW2 has that. Achieves? GW2 has that. Transmogs? GW2 has that. PVP? GW2 has that.
    The first set is the hardest one in GW2. It took me about a month to make it for my ranger. Raids are completely off-limits, as are high level fractals.
    In WoW, you can gear up a character for normal mode raids in a week.

    It's not wich one you like best, its how much effort you are willing to put into learning and into getting the gear.

    Honestly though, this whole argument just came about cause people got pissy about the fact that i find it more of a chore to gear up geared up in GW2 than in WoW. This should be clear as day. Things are alot harder to get in GW2. It as nothing to do with content. It has to do with fun while doing it.

    Gearing up a new character in WoW is a joy. Doing the same in GW2 is a chore. Unless you know, again, if you are a veteran player, you probably got the gold and marks or whatever to get things more easily. Those of us that aren't though... it's a big barrier.



    Though i wished you guys stopped making this about wich game is better cause it isn't. Both have strong points and weak points. I love GW2. But to play regularly, i prefer WoW. I play GW2 more casually and enjoy it that way, without the pressures of having to grind gold to perfect my gear.
    Last edited by Nemmar; 2018-02-27 at 04:17 AM.

  19. #39
    Mechagnome Mulled's Avatar
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    played wow for 10 years and gw when it released, took a break came back after i got bored of legion and i have been loving it since such a good game with nothing that feels like a "chore"

    there is nothing that immediately jumps out at you once you reach max level like say it is on wow, it's more go at your pace and do what you want, find something to do or commit to completing something/ world completion to 100% or farming ascended gear / prepping for going into raids or progressing in the fractals / farming gold , what ever you want to do it has but isn't necessary or compulsory it can be VERY accommodating to casuals even after the 4 year break my character really wasn't that behind at all, or you can go hardcore and just smash it up, i'm in between I play alot but i do what I enjoy doing.

    also guild wars is commonly referred to as fashion wars, because people care so much about their appearence and the difference between max level gear (exotic) and ascended which is a step above is minuscule but still something worth completing for other reasons.

    there are only 4 mounts but each have a wide variety of skins which you can get off the gem store for real money or converting gold to gems which is surprisingly efficient and cheap.

    guild war's end game is more about how you build your character's setup with skills and traits/talents, which can make say two different warrior's playing the same class completely different but retain the basic fundamentals of a warrior, elite specialization are really good too, if I was you id just jump in you sound like the type of person to enjoy just doing whatever and exploring which gw2 excels at, just "questing" to 80 is boring, exploring the beaten track and killing mobs on the way is quite quick leveling as mobs that have not been killed by other players for a while give increasing bonus exp, sometimes 2-3x the original xp of killing said mob.

    and no transmog is not hard to come by at all also you can dye things for freeeee outfits/skins you purchased for ur class or mount making something that is unique while keeping the skeleton of a mount that everyone can get with a lil bit of effort no doubt.
    Last edited by Mulled; 2018-02-27 at 04:54 AM.
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  20. #40
    Legendary! Mirishka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by benjaminandjen View Post
    I unsubbed from WoW a few months ago. Played off and on for ten years or so. I basically hate WoW but I have so much history and rare mounts that it's hard to walk away.

    First let me say I literally know nothing about GW2. So maybe I should list things I like and dislike about WoW and you guys can give me an idea if I'd like GW2.

    Things I like about WoW: mounts, also mounts, transmog, story, character development, cinemas and scenarios. I like having one character and one race/class and just developing that character. I like solo play. I used to raid A LOT, but guilds are so toxic and break up constantly now.

    Things I don't like about WoW: the devs change things constantly, there aren't enough mounts, the transmog system is limited, gear customization needs help, I avoid pvp almost entirely, people are evil in WoW - people will actually tell you to kill yourself if you ask a question, the graphics are ok but could be better.

    I also want to know how long it would take to catch up with other GW players? Will it take years to get the best mounts and transmog, like WoW?

    Anyway, just trying to get an idea if GW2 would offer a more gratifying experience than WoW. What was your experience like when you started playing GW2?
    I agree with a lot of your likes and dislikes (almost all of them, in fact) but there aren't enough mounts? Seriously?

    Also, not everyone in WoW is a douche that would tell you to kill yourself for asking a question. I know it feels that way sometimes (the pricks make the most noise so it seems like all there is are pricks playing) but it really isn't as bad as that.

    Every online game (yes, even GW2) has a huge number of lame-ass people who use being anonymous as an excuse to act like an edgy piece of shit. There is literally no MMO/online game you are going to play that is free of that.
    Last edited by Mirishka; 2018-02-27 at 04:21 AM.
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